Wikipedia:WikiProject Palaeontology/Paleoart review

Discontinued yearly archives: 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020 This page is mainly for reviewing the accuracy of non-dinosaur paleoart (usually by the artists themselves, but anyone who wants an image scrutinized is welcome to post them for review). Any other image, such as size comparisons or photos of skeletal mounts, can also be posted here to review their accuracy. If you want to submit paleoart images for accuracy review, place them here as well as links to what you used as references. If you want to participate as reviewer, you can put the page on your watchlist. New images of any type can also be requested by including "Request:" in the section title, and if submitted, such an image will thereafter be reviewed. Sections are archived automatically after some time when a discussion stalls, to encourage speedy responses from both artists and reviewers. It is allowed to revive sections if they have been archived before being resolved, unlike regular talk page archives. Modifications of previously uploaded amateur restorations to correct anatomical inaccuracies is encouraged (including by others than the original artists), but modifications of historical restorations are discouraged, as these should be used to show historical ideas. Drastic modifications to restorations published in peer-reviewed journals should be uploaded as separate files, so that both versions are available. Images that have been deemed inaccurate should be tagged with the Wikimedia Commons template "Inaccurate paleoart"[5] (which automatically adds the "Inaccurate paleoart" category[6]), so they can be prevented from being used and easily located for correction. User created images are not considered original research, per WP:OI and WP:PERTINENCE, but it is appreciated if sources used are listed in file descriptions (this is often requested during WP:Featured Article reviews). Guidelines for use of paleoart, adapted from WikiProject Dinosaurs' image review page: Criterion sufficient for using an image: If image is included for historical value. In these cases the image caption should explain that it is an outdated reconstruction. Historical interest images should not be used in the taxobox, but preferably in a section of the text discussing the history of a taxon. Criteria sufficient to remove an image: Images should not speculate unnecessarily beyond what has been indicated by reliable sources. Therefore, depicting overly speculative physical features, behaviors, and pathologies should be avoided, to prevent WP:OR issues. Restorations that show serious pathologies known from fossil evidence are welcome, but should not be used as the main representation of a given taxon. These should instead show healthy, typical individuals, and not focus on unknown areas of their anatomy. Since Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia rather than an art gallery, it is not the place for artistic experimentation, and we cannot include every piece of available artwork. Image differs appreciably from known skeletal elements. Example: If Lystrosaurus is reconstructed with four fingers. Image differs appreciably from implied skeletal elements (via phylogenetic bracketing). Example: If an hesperornithid bird known only from postcranial elements is reconstructed without teeth, a feature made highly improbable by its phylogenetic position. Image differs appreciably from known non-skeletal elements. Example: If a restoration of Castorocauda lacks hair. Image differs appreciably from implied non-skeletal elements. Example: Scaphognathus should not be depicted without pycnofibres, since phylogenetic bracketing implies that it had them. Image pose differs appreciably from known range of motion. Example: Plesiosaurs reconstructed with overly flexible necks. Exception: If the range of motion is debated in the scientific literature, as is the case with sauropod neck position. Image depicts a scene which is anachronistic or contradicts known geographic range. Example: Utahraptor hunting an Iguanodon, two animals which did not live together. Example: Dinosaurs from the Triassic or Jurassic depicted walking on grass, which did not exist at that time. Exception: Photographs of life-sized models taken in parks. It should be made clear in the caption that these are models. Click here to submit a new image for review

Images in review

Ornithoprion reconstructions

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Several skeletal reconstructions and diagrams done of Ornithoprion based on the figures provided in Zangerl's 1966 description. I've talked about this over in the Discord and these should be distinct enough to be Creative Commons, but let me know if they need to be differentiated further (and of course if there are any anatomical issues). No photos of the fossils are available on commons (Or anywhere but the description, for that matter) and even then they are quite severely crushed, so I'm not sure what can be done besides closely copying the figures in the paper to accurately represent them. I'm working on finishing up an extensive rewrite of the currently very barebones page for this guy, so I thought it could use some images besides the frankly horribly inaccurate life restoration I did a couple of years ago. Gasmasque (talk) 05:25, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

I don't know enough about Chondrichthyans to comment on anatomy, but the institutional abbreviation should be FMNH not CNHM. Skye McDavid (talk) 20:29, 14 July 2024 (UTC)

Will correct, good catch! The paper is from before the name change, so it must have just slipped my mind to adjust that while doing this. Gasmasque (talk) 06:54, 15 July 2024 (UTC)

Neither do I, but is there a reason for the gap between the rostrum and the Meckel's cartilage? Were they disconnected? Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 02:13, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

Zangerl's original figures show the two with a gap between them, and it is suggested that the rostrum was articulated and flexible and not fused to the Meckel's. If this illustration seems implausibly exaggerated or confusing then it can be changed, but I do want to emphasize that this was an apparently flexible structure. Gasmasque (talk) 22:12, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for clarifying, I think that's fine. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 16:29, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

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An additional fossil illustration and life reconstruction of another eugeneodont called Paredestus. There isn't a ton published on this guy, but the dentition described in the paper is extremely unique, and I thought it was worth doing a life reconstruction (based primarily off of other recons published for edestoids). Gasmasque (talk) 16:12, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

Yet another eugeneodont reconstruction/diagram, this time for Romerodus to coincide with another major page revision. Well preserved/described material depicted in white, preserved but uncertain material in gray and closely based on Caseodus, and body outline very closely based on known R. orodontus specimens. Any feedback at all on this or the previous Paredestus illustrations is greatly appreciated! Gasmasque (talk) 23:26, 6 October 2024 (UTC)

Ergilin Dzo Formation Size Chart?

Can someone please do a size chart for the fauna of the Ergilin Dzo formation? it would be really helpful and informative.

He who needs to be silenced’s reconstructions

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  Ianthodon
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  Barbclabornia
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  Glaucosaurus
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  Eohupehsuchus
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  Yixian Formation fish
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  Yixian Formation fish with labels
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  Telmatosaurus that was originally gonna be Qianjiangsaurus but then a skeletal came out
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  A little late reconstruction of Inabtanin alarabia
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  Qingtoushan Formation
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I’m not sure how this works, I have been told to share here so here I try

• Added other works from same user. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 10:18, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

  The fish from the Yixian Formation is excellent and sorely needed. Although I'm not sure about the big dark box on the left-hand side of the labeled version. A Cynical Idealist (talk) 23:26, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

  Big box Is lower half of Minecraft Steve for scale. 74.57.20.91 (talk) 15:52, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

That's not at all clear. A normal human silhouette should be used. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 15:55, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, did this a while ago, I’m gonna go back and change it. 74.57.20.91 (talk) 17:53, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

The premaxilla of Eohupehsuchus seems a little short relative to the fossil. I'm not sure the eyes would protrude from the skull like that? (Slate Weasel might be able to weigh in too) Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 15:55, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, the premaxilla is too short for what's preserved (which is not nearly the entire thing), causing the eyes to be too far back. The bulging eyes also don't seem very likely, especially considering that they depicted here as being larger than the orbits. Not sure about the external ear opening either. It is nice to see a hupehsuchian restored with normal-looking paddles though, some of our current reconstructions are really badly shrinkwrapped there. --Slate Weasel [Talk - Contribs] 17:48, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

The right limb seems too extremely folded on Telmatosaurus. Some of the stripes bleed through the outline. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 16:39, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

This one was a little less effort due to the fact that it was full of hiccups, so feel free to make edits. 74.57.20.91 (talk) 17:54, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

Telmatosaurus should be reviewed at WP:DINOART. IIRC early diverging hadrosauromorphs wouldn't have had the Edmontosaurus-like hands but not sure and don't have time to double-check at the moment. Skye McDavid (talk) 16:07, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I agree with the above points. The right arm seems out of the comfortable range of motion. I'll also add that the tail is much too long based on related taxa. -SlvrHwk (talk) 04:24, 30 August 2024 (UTC)

Inabtanin looks nice. I wonder if the 'finger' part of the wing should be longer, considering how long the first wing phalanx is. The background might also be distractingly saturated. Could it be lightened a little? -SlvrHwk (talk) 04:44, 13 September 2024 (UTC)

• Added new work representing Permian site. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 05:38, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Equus ovodovi

A sketch of Equus ovodovi using colored and mechanical pencils on paper

A colored-pencil sketch of Equus ovodovi, taking into account the general cranial proportions of Equus coliemensis (the only Sussemione with skull material) and the general body and limb proportions of zebras and wild asses, the clades most closely related to Sussemiones. Coloration primarily inspired by Asiatic and African wild asses. Dynamoterror1011 (talk) 17:32, 27 August 2024 (UTC)

A bit late, but perhaps PrimalMustelid has something to say? FunkMonk (talk) 13:26, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

Looks fine to me from quick research of the species and its diagnoses based on postcranial morphologies. PrimalMustelid (talk) 04:16, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

Tail of Tylosaurus

Hello everyone, if you know the subject of mosasaurs, you have most likely already come across this image of Dimitri Bogdanov reconstructing a Tylosaurus proriger, which was even used in certain studies. Although reconstitution seems good for the body, it is still very bad and obsolete for the tail. I therefore suggest that a user skilled in editing can correct this error, so that it can be used appropriately in an article. Amirani1746 (talk) 21:51, 31 August 2024 (UTC) Here's the file in question :

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Would the proximal tail even have been capable of bending in this serpentine manner? Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 22:48, 31 August 2024 (UTC)

For adults, possibly. But the dorsals should be rigid, and in this recon they are certainly not. Macrophyseter | talk 21:56, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

• I wonder if we even need it anymore, since there are many other accurate restorations of it here? Won't be easy to edit since the entire posture is outdated. FunkMonk (talk) 00:00, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

  Surprisingly, not that much ! There's only two reconstruction of T. proriger on Wikimedia : one which is slightly more recent (2015) than this one (2007). It doesn't appear to have ever been discussed here, but is probably, although a bit bendy, more on par with modern understanding of their anatomy. The second one is from 2022 and passed review, but presents the inconvenient of not using a white background. If somebody could correct that, that would be useful to replace the one from 2007. Both are from Bogdanov.

  

  2015

  

  2022

  Honestly, in the English wiki, the 2007 image is barely used anymore aside from the Mooreville Chalk and the Matanuska Formation, so we could just remove the earliest recon and substitute them the more recent ones. Tylosaurus has a substantial research history article, and (although a bit skinwrapped) the 2007 recon seems to be pretty accurate to the knowledge of the animal at the time, so it could maybe be used in that article as an historical interpretation, and as such it is probably better to keep it as it is currently. Larrayal (talk) 04:20, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

I imagine that i wrongly bad read the Tylosaurus article... Amirani1746 (talk) 12:34, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

2007 NT

There's also this NT one already with a white background that would be pretty easy to fix the tail of for use in cladograms:[7] Perhaps should also not show individual fingers and hide teeth? FunkMonk (talk) 05:25, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

Someone has other issues with NT's before I begin fixing it? FunkMonk (talk) 10:56, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

Head and flipper shapes look off. See the Bunker restoration... Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 15:45, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

Did some changes, not entirely sure what is meant with the head, as it's a different perspective, how does it look so far, Lythronaxargestes? FunkMonk (talk) 23:19, 21 September 2024 (UTC)

I don't see the difference? Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 04:54, 22 September 2024 (UTC)

Lol, I forgot to link it:[8] FunkMonk (talk) 11:16, 22 September 2024 (UTC)

Lythronaxargestes FunkMonk (talk) 16:13, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

Oh, I missed this. I'm not sure the flipper shape is quite right, especially the rear one. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 22:27, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

That should be perspective, as it's seen more head on from the front edge, if that makes sense? FunkMonk (talk) 07:58, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

I went and updated the Commons file since it's better than the original now either way. FunkMonk (talk) 21:28, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

Ptychodus illustration

A group of Ptychodus latissimus

This is an illustration of a group of Ptychodus. Bubblesorg (talk) 14:51, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Surely those gills are too large? Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 15:44, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Let me adjust that--Bubblesorg (talk) 16:09, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Now? --Bubblesorg (talk) 16:25, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

That seems better, although I'm sure it would benefit from comments by EvolutionIncarnate. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 03:31, 18 September 2024 (UTC)

I am sure it will be fine--Bubblesorg (talk) 00:21, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

Echovenator

Hello. It's been a while. If I may, can I ask for a review of my drawing? This time I tried to reconstruct an Echovenator... I mostly based the reconstruction from here for the skull [9] and this restoration on Wikipedia for the body Xenorophidae . I am aware that I am kind of playing safe and giving the head not much tissue? But I want to make the reconstruction a bit conservative since we dont know how big are the tissue especially the one that involve in echolocation in primitive toothed whale... So that is my reasoning for the reconstruction. Is my image good enough to be put at the Echovenator page? Thank you...

Echovenator sandersi

DD (talk) 05:07, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

I am sorry if I assume wrongly, but if there are no major issues, is it good enough to be use for the Echovenator page? DD (talk) 13:04, 23 September 2024 (UTC)

The torso seems overly elongated compared to the relatively complete Albertocetus (see here). Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 23:02, 23 September 2024 (UTC)

Ah you are right.. I just opened the Albertocetus and I am aware that it is not as elongated as my reconstruction... Thank you very much and I will have to fix that.. DD (talk) 12:29, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

Zhenghecaris

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  Zhenghecaris shankouensis

Hello. I made a quick reconstruction depicting Zhenghecaris as a peytoiid radiodont. This interpretation is backed by Zeng et al. (2017), Moysiuk and Caron (2019), and Moysiuk and Caron (2021). Specifically, Zeng et al. described additional elements of the cephalic complex in the form of isolated lateral elements similar in construction and overall form to Zhenghecaris. The appendages are based on Cambroraster, as is the body. The background elements of the reconstruction are Isoxys and Eoredlichia. Prehistorica CM (talk) 09:35, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

I think it is mostly good but the trunk section needs segments and setal blades Zhenghecaris (talk) 20:52, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

@Zhenghecaris Reconstruction of Cambroraster in original description have setal blades on bottom of body and segments are less visible, this one is probably based on that. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 14:21, 11 October 2024 (UTC)

Junnn11 reconstructed it with dorsal setal blades. Zhenghecaris (talk) 19:38, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Yeah that is true, but it is unclear and both interpretation is possible. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 12:55, 18 October 2024 (UTC)

Okay. Zhenghecaris (talk) 15:27, 18 October 2024 (UTC)

Unreviewed images by Paleo Miguel

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  Proscinetes
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  Calumma benovskyi
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  Inabtanin
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  Gondwanax
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  Vesperopterylus
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  Sutekhsuchus
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  Armatites

Found a couple nice-looking unreviewed images, already in use in their respective pages. -SlvrHwk (talk) 17:43, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

Inabtanin looks good and Calumma benovskyi seems to closely resemble its extant relatives. Skye McDavid (talk) 14:18, 23 September 2024 (UTC)

For me these reconstructions are good. Aventadoros (talk) 14:31, 23 September 2024 (UTC)

Added Gondwanax recon. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 12:19, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

How is this Sutekhsuchus @Armin Reindl:? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 09:50, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Ah sorry for the late reply, got a lot on my plate (including ironically a Sutekhsuchus size comparisson). The rostrum could be a little longer perhaps but I think its pretty good overall. Armin Reindl (talk) 12:28, 19 October 2024 (UTC)

Shucaris ankylosskelos

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  Shucaris and Erratus
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  Shucaris appendage by @Junnn11
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  Shucaris appendage by @Wawrow

Decided to make one more radidont that took longer than expected. To model the appendages I downloaded the raw CT data, put it into Blender, and modelled the podomeres and endites to follow the holotype, as well as referencing the description of course. I gave it 4 sets of GLS associated with reduced flaps, although reduced flaps are not preserved, and the GLS are incompletely known. I feel that this is reasonable speculation given the apparently elongate neck region. I put the setal blades on the dorsal surface of the flaps as well, which I believe better represents the fossil evidence, where in Shucaris they are seemingly only associated with the flaps, rather than the trunk. Something similar is also seen in Amplectobelua and Lyrarapax. Regarding the Erratus, I gave it generic, upward facing frontal appendages given its phylogenetic placement, even though this area is completely missing in the fossils.

Regarding the existing appendage illustrations, I wish to suggest (and if they choose to ignore these comments it does not bother me,) that the relative proportions of the podomeres be changed slightly to better reflect the holotype. I will admit that not every appendage presented in the description looks alike, but most commonly, and also in the holotype, there is a very distinct increase in podomere height, starting at the first DAR (distal articulated region, "claw") podomere, maxing out at the joint between the 3rd and 4th DAR podomere, and shallowing out until the 7th DAR podomere. Here, the podomeres are rectangular and tall - but towards the distal portion they are almost completely square in profile. Importantly, the shaft podomeres are shorter than the succeeding podomeres, and the second shaft podomere (BP1 in the description) is wider at the bottom then at the top, similar to amplectobeluids. The first shaft podomere (BP2) is even shorter and more elongate. Wawrow's model already presents this quite well. Altogether, this is what gives Shucaris appendages their very distinct crook-shape, which you can see in most fossils ascribed to it. This is what gives it the name "ankylosskelos" ("curved leg"). I think it would be best if the representative diagrams show this very important characteristic of the appendage. As far as I know, Wawrow is planning to make these adjustments to their model soon. Sorry for the paragraph Prehistorica CM (talk) 04:53, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

My only minor concern on the full body reconstruction is the amount of (at least for now, on the general understanding of radiodont anatomy) unusual speculative features. But since their plausibility was formally mentioned elsewhere I think It's Ok afterall.

Anyway thanks for the suggestions! I'll modifying my diagram within this week. Junnn11 (talk) 10:19, 25 September 2024 (UTC)

I think the reconstruction is accurate but the position of shucaris makes it look kinda like it has legs which may be misleading. Zhenghecaris (talk) 13:15, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Not really?, you can see in the piece that the GLS stop once you get to the larger trunk flaps, and the shadow below the radiodont indicates its above the seafloor. Fossiladder13 (talk) 15:20, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Hydrorion

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  DiBgd's one

Used in es wiki. Is this seem fine to use? Also this study[10] seems synonymized it to Microcleidus, should the article remain? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 09:00, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

This is not new, Hydrorion and Occitanosaurus were sunk into Microcleidus due to extreme similarity by Benson et al. (2012) [11]. Spindler et al. (2021) [12] consider it ?Microcleidus. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 20:27, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

Actually, Hydrorion is a valid genus. Occitanosaurus was dubious, it is a synonym of Microcleidus. Are you sure this is true? 2601:197:F00:330:8834:A57F:9221:30F3 (talk) 22:31, 28 September 2024 (UTC)

I linked you to the papers, I don't know what to tell you. Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 18:50, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Shuilingornis angelai

Requesting for uploading a skeletal drawing of Shuilingornis I made. It was revisioned by Andrea Cau (one of the authors of the paper describing the Holotype). Thanks in advice.

Skeletal diagram of Shuilingornis angelai

Iofry (talk) 18:55, 26 September 2024 (UTC)

Crassigyrinus Image

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  Crassigyrinus
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  Meiolania
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  Crossopholis
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  Parapsephurus

Requesting for Crassigyrinus image I made. I found some studies that say it had a flatter, less box shaped skull so I will be revisioning that.

Thank you in advance!

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Crassigyrinus_scoticus.png AraucariaHeterophylla (talk) 00:29, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Adding actual image here for simplicity.--Kevmin § 16:26, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Seems this user also added this Meiolania head without review. What do you think, especially @Armin Reindl:? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 12:23, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for adding this in here, apologies for not properly following reviewing protocol. Any image I make I will link into here first. I also have a Crossopholis image I could add in here (I can take it down from the pages for now). 2001:1970:546A:4400:2560:DF58:EF42:EC94 (talk) 18:42, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

What species is it? 2601:197:F00:330:E113:12F5:3401:2C8F (talk) 19:46, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Meiolania platyceps. AraucariaHeterophylla (talk) 00:07, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

I see now that I inaccurately represented the scale areas on my Meiolania illustration, so thank you for taking this down from the main page. AraucariaHeterophylla (talk) 00:15, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

Apologies for the late reply, I just came back from the UK. I see the artist has already taken notice of the scale areas (very well preserved in Meiolania) but I should highlight that this should extend to the "horns". As is they very much appear to be illustrated akin to bovid horns, i.e. clearly set apart from the rest of the skull, when chances are that they'd be similar in texture to the rest of the head given that its not that different in structure. Nothing against giving them a dash of colour of course (I did so for my reconstructions) given that they were likely used for display to some extent.

Tho a respectable effort, you might also want to reconsider the perspective and proportions of the drawing. The way the horn in the back protrudes from the skull, the placement of the eye and the overall top of the head don't add up.

I do hope this does not discourage you tho, just keep practicing.Armin Reindl (talk) 11:55, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

Not at all! Thank you :D AraucariaHeterophylla (talk) 15:31, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

• Crossopholis looks fine as it is known from complete skeletons. Hemiauchenia (talk) 20:42, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

  I'm about to add a photo of Parapsepherus here, let me know what you think of that one as well! Thank you :) AraucariaHeterophylla (talk) 00:03, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

  Personally it seems fine, maybe good to get review by users good at fish though. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 14:23, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

  While the coloration of extinct animals obviously deviates from living ones and this should not be counted as an inaccuracy, do note that the pink coloration seen on the underside in most photos of Psephurus is the result of bruising/stress, and not the animal's natural colors. If that is indeed the motivation for the pink snout and head here, I would suggest against including that. If that is included as a unique, speculative feature of Parasephurus then i see no issues whatsoever. It's great to see some interest to fossil paddlefish, especially Crossopholis. Gasmasque (talk) 00:38, 10 October 2024 (UTC)

LiterallyMiguel's new works

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  Arizonasaurus
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  Venaticosuchus
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  Riojasuchus
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  Ornithosuchus

Seems people don't see when it is put in thread above, so here is new thread for new unreviewed works. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 03:31, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Why do they have perforated nasal septa? Lythronaxargestes (talk | contribs) 20:03, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

Presumably an unfamiliarity with animal soft tissue nasal anatomy. @FunkMonk: would you be able to fix this? Hemiauchenia (talk) 18:39, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

It seems to becoming a trend for at least some dinosaur paleoart, I guess because some modern birds have it. Are we sure it would be unlikely in these cases? An easy fix either way, but I think @LiterallyMiguel: is active and reachable, so they should probably do it themselves. FunkMonk (talk) 23:11, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

Fair enough if this is not condition in birds. These are crocodile-line archosaurs though, rather than dinosaurs, thought given that the strong differences from modern crocidilians I'm not sure how useful they are as a guide. Hemiauchenia (talk) 23:21, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello, yes i speculated with partially open nostrils with some birds and reference, since the nostril holes on their skull are really big, and their separation is really thin, but if it's not the most plausible i can happily close it LiterallyMiguel (talk) 21:03, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

Elephants

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  Primelephas
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  Loxodonta cookei
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  Phanagoroloxodon
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  Valenictus
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  Glaucobalaena
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  Behemotops

Added by @UniverseScienceItaly: without review. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 03:32, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

• Looks like something for PrimalMustelid and Hemiauchenia. FunkMonk (talk) 13:00, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

@UniverseScienceItaly:, I told you that you should do a review before adding reconstructions. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 07:51, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

oh sorry, next time will ad theme there before. are them good or i gotta change something on the reconstructions? note that those are simple sketches just to put a reconstruction for these poorly known taxa, will do more of these in the future for extinct mysterious species. UniverseScienceItaly (talk) 13:09, 3 October 2024 (UTC)

The Phanagoroloxodon looks decent given that's only known from skull material, and seems to accurately reflect the known skull morphology. I'll need to consult a copy of Evolution and Fossil Record of African Proboscidea for the other two species, which I'll try to do in the next couple of days. Hemiauchenia (talk) 16:09, 4 October 2024 (UTC)

Just added a new rencostruction of a newly described genus of pliocene Gray whale from Italy. there is not a page for this taxon yet bu here a full reconstruction of the poorly known genus. UniverseScienceItaly (talk) 11:43, 5 October 2024 (UTC)

Added Behemotops for revision, hope the reconstruction is good, let me know UniverseScienceItaly (talk) 12:47, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

For proportion and soft tissue, maybe recent reports of palaeoparadoxiid specimen would be helpful.[13][14] Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 14:59, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

Sacabambaspis

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Yeah, I am aware this is inaccurate reconstruction, but more problem is that should this image exist in Commons? This reconstruction is based on model made by et:Elga Mark-Kurik, in exhibit of Natural History Museum of Helsinki. In the EU, copyright lasts 70 years after death. The skin color, face, and tail fin shape of this illustration are similar to the model in question, and there is a fear that copyright issues may arise due to this. Even in Japan, there are pros and cons to using this model of Sacabambaspis commercially. For products produced by companies, they have a licensing agreement with his son, Simo Mark-Kurik. Any opinions for that? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 15:09, 29 September 2024 (UTC)

Yuanotherium

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Added without review. I will put review of other works by same user in dinosaur art review. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 09:19, 6 October 2024 (UTC)

A lot of stuff

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  Rhynchosaurus articeps
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  Andescynodon mendozensis
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  Gobiatherium mirificum
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  Vetusodon elikhulu
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  Howesia browni
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  Mesosuchus browni
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  Diademodon tetragonus
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  Procynosuchus delaharpae
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  Palaeagama vielhaueri
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  Cynognathus crateronotus
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  Heliosus apophis
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  Exaeretodon argentinus
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  Dvinia prima

SeismicShrimp (talk) 17:37, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

They're all very good at a glance. My only comment is that its a bit difficult to tell which of these creatures should have fur. Obviously the unambiguous mammals and unambiguous reptiles are fine, but when it comes to stem-mammals, the drawings become difficult to interpret. A Cynical Idealist (talk) 23:39, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

none of the stem-mammals have fur, wanted to play it very safe with these earlier ones SeismicShrimp (talk) 01:12, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

That is not what Heliosuslooked like. It looked more like a pig or peccary. 73.186.196.43 (talk) 22:21, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

The description paper used a fossil peccary skeleton (can't remember which one) for the paper but it's an eocene whippomorph, it probably had the most work done out of any of the restorations in this post. SeismicShrimp (talk) 02:05, 10 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks, didnt know that till now. I always thought Heliosus was a pig-like animal. 73.186.196.43 (talk) 01:26, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

Helaletes

Hello all. Can I ask for another review for my reconstruction? This time i tried to reconstruct Helaletes that is mainly based on the skeleton image on its Wiki page. Also I used modern day tapirs for additional reference but making it skinnier based on the skeletal proportion difference. So if I may, is my reconstruction good enough to be put at Helaletes page? Thank you in advance...

Helaletes nanus

DD (talk) 04:28, 8 October 2024 (UTC)

I am sorry if I am assuming too soon, but are there no major or glaring issues? If there are none, can I add it to the Helaletes page? Thank you in advance.. DD (talk) 05:24, 15 October 2024 (UTC)

Deltaherpeton

A life reconstruction of Deltaherpeton hiemstrae, a colosteid from the Mississippian of the Carboniferous.

I am asking for a review of my artwork of Deltaherpeton, a Colosteid from the upper Viséan of Iowa. References used are as follows: The skull reconstruction was based on the figures and photographs of the linked paper [1]. Postcranial anatomy of the reconstruction was based on the linked paper [2] with the exception of the forelimb anatomy, which was based on paper [3]. Coloration, fat/skin placement, and musculature is roughly based on extant amphibians, such as general amphibian anatomy and Giant Salamanders (Andrias).

[1] Deltaherpeton hiemstrae, a New Colosteid Tetrapod from the Mississippian of Iowa - Bolt and Lombard 2010

[2] The postcranial skeletal anatomy of the carboniferous tetrapod Greererpeton burkemorani Romer, 1969 - Godfrey 1989

[3] The Devonian tetrapod Acanthostega gunnari Jarvik: postcranial anatomy, basal tetrapod interrelationships and patterns of skeletal evolution - Coates 2011 ACasualWalnut (talk) 16:45, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

• Tagging NGPezz and Fishboy86164577 who may have something to say. Also perhaps Ta-tea-two-te-to and DrawingDinosaurs. FunkMonk (talk) 18:13, 14 October 2024 (UTC)

Sorry it took me so long to get to this page. I think it looks great after the various refinements put in place. NGPezz (talk) 00:17, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Taurovenator life reconstructions

Both of these images were added to the Taurovenator page without review, both by @César Díaz Frías: since I intend to pick at the article over the next couple of days I figured it was worth checking in. They seem solid to my eye, outside of a bit of wonky perspective on the head reconstruction (although that's definitely a nitpick on my part!).

Borophagus (talk) 21:17, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

The illustrations were made with the advice of the paleontologists who wrote the article! Thank you very much for your opinion of my reconstructions! César Díaz Frías (talk) 05:48, 10 October 2024 (UTC)

I think it should move to dinosaur image review? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 09:01, 10 October 2024 (UTC)

Ah, my bad. I wasn't entirely sure where to put it. I'll move it there. Borophagus (talk) 09:13, 10 October 2024 (UTC)

Soturnia

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Seems excellent but probably needs review. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 14:02, 11 October 2024 (UTC)

Dire wolf National Park Service illustration

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  Smilodon
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  American lion

I know that Dire wolf already has a life restoration on its page, but I was wondering if this one might be better. It's an illustration published by the United States National Park Service. Do you think it might be worth replacing the one already there? Di (they-them) (talk) 19:37, 11 October 2024 (UTC)

It looks more like a gray wolf than what recent analyses would indicate? Also unusually short tail? FunkMonk (talk) 14:25, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

Looks way too wolfish, as if the artist hadn't been updated on its taxonomy Mariomassone (talk) 21:26, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Added two new arts from same source. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 09:48, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Mosasaurus lemonnieri size

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As this section of the Mosasaurus article says, the size of M. lemonnieri is estimated by its describer Louis Dollo to join around 7 to 10 m (23 to 33 ft) long. However the diagram showing the size of the largest known specimen shows it as reaching 12 m (39 ft) long, probably being based on the likely incorrect estimate of Paul (2022). I even doubt that the code name of the specimen (IRSNB R 3189) is correct, but that remains to be seen. I thank in advance anyone will solve this problem, best regards, Amirani1746 (talk) 11:23, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

The size estimate here is definitely not based on GSP (note that this chart was made prior to the publication of his book). The initial development of the chart was discussed here, which details what was used for scaling. Unfortunately, I do not have access to the redescription of M. lemonnieri; however, IRSNB 3189 has been mentioned in other literature (such as [15]), so I think it probably does exist, even if the number is incorrect. Macrophyseter, do you have any information on this specimen? --Slate Weasel [Talk - Contribs] 18:14, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

I think a good point is made that the code name might not be IRSNB "R" 3189, since all of the specimen's mentions in the literature don't have the "R." It's not impossible that IRSNB transferred the specimen to "R" in recent times but considering their online database remains incomplete I doubt there's any way to find out without contacting the museum curator. The best reference remains Lingham-Soliar (2000), which shows a photo[16] of the specimen. ~12.5 meters is the length I got when scaling that skull to Dollo's ratio in my old crude size diagram; since Slate Weasel referenced directly from the complete skeleton IRSNB 3119, their version should be more precise. I wouldn't be surprised if GSP simply used a similar method to reach his concurring estimate. Macrophyseter | talk 16:57, 14 October 2024 (UTC)

Also note that we can't really say the 12m estimate in the article itself due to wp:synth. Consensus agreed that diagrams are somewhat free from this as long as the methodology is clearly laid out, but this does not extend to text. Macrophyseter | talk 17:03, 14 October 2024 (UTC)

The 1/11 scale estimate of Dollo (1892) remains to be proven, because since Fanti et al. (2014), this scale is probably obsolete. However, I also doubt that this ratio can be applied to M. lemonnieri, given that the study by Fanti et al. only uses it for M. hoffmannii, and that no major study on M. lemonnieri has been done since Madzia (2019), and again that was only for its teeth. Amirani1746 (talk) 08:31, 15 October 2024 (UTC)

The 1/11 ratio for M. lemonnieri is actually based on a nearly complete, mostly articulated vertebral column and skull: File:Bulletin de la Société belge de géologie, de paléontologie et d'hydrologie (1892) (20248316020).jpg (although allometry admittedly could and probably did affect things to some degree, though I don't know how much this has been studied in mosasaurs). --Slate Weasel [Talk - Contribs] 00:39, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

Elasmotherium

With no brim

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Ddinodan (talk) 18:05, 14 October 2024 (UTC)

Sorry for only just getting around to this. Looks good to me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hemiauchenia (talk • contribs)

New DBogdanov works

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  Moschorhinus
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  Dinichthys
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  Dunkleosteus
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  Westralichthys
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  Macropetalichthys
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  Pseudopetalichthys
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  Diplognathus
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  Tafilalichthys

New works, not used for now. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 09:02, 18 October 2024 (UTC)

• I don't know anything about these, but many of them we don't have other restorations of, so could be nice with some stamp of approval or not before we use them. FunkMonk (talk) 09:48, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

  No qualms with any of the arthrodires. I would say that the Diplognathus and Dinichthys especially are improvements over what is currently used, and seem to be in accordance with both Engelmann's work and with the anatomy of Amazichthys. I can't speak for the others, unfortunately. Gasmasque (talk) 20:37, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

  Perhaps the Diplognathus reconstruction can be used to replace the one currently in the taxobox, if the anatomy is more up to date? The Morrison Man (talk) 14:59, 21 November 2024 (UTC)

  Returning to this to point out the Pseudopetalichthys reconstruction is far more accurate than any others used on the site. The other reconstructions, all provided by @Apokryltaros, seem to mistake the internal pectoral element for an external armored spur, which does not seem to be correct. A similar issue is present in the currently used reconstruction of Stensioella and several other genera of pseudopetalichthyids. It is an easy mistake to make considering these are placoderms, but these don't seem to have had external armor "plates". Gasmasque (talk) 13:40, 21 November 2024 (UTC)

Odd-toed Ungulates

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  Cambaytherium thewissi
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  Thuliadanta mayri
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  Paracolodon fissus
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  Rostriamynodon grangeri

SeismicShrimp (talk) 13:47, 18 October 2024 (UTC)

Sutekhsuchus, Chrysochampsa and Ahdeskatanka

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A simple size comparisson for Sutekhsuchus dowsoni based on the holotype skull and Gavialis proportions done with the input of Paul M. J. Burke. Armin Reindl (talk) 23:22, 19 October 2024 (UTC)

Also Chryochampsa size comparison based on the holotype skull.Armin Reindl (talk) 20:40, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

Alright Ahdeskatanka too, thats it for now tho. Armin Reindl (talk) 19:28, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

Mosasaurus lemonnieri (again) : New photos ?

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• 

While browsing photos from Wikimedia Commons, I came across two photos of the same mosasaur specimen that I immediately recognized: IRSNB R3211, one of the many specimens of M. lemonnieri. However, as the titles of the two images indicates, they are attributed to the species Plioplatecarpus houseaui (Dollo, 1889), while most other photos (like this) and descriptions (like Mulder et al., 2004 and Street (2016)) attribute it to M. lemonnieri. Knowing that in addition the accompanying panels behind it don't really help to know if this statement is true or not, I would like that Macrophyseter or even Slate Weasel help me resolve this ambiguity. Amirani1746 (talk) 14:31, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

It wouldn't be the first time that a label for something else nearby was misinterpreted as a label for another specimen by a photographer. FunkMonk (talk) 15:05, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

That time when the LACM Plotosaurus was mislabeled on Wikipedia as Plesiotylosaurus for over seven years... Macrophyseter | talk 22:58, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

There is a 3211 label on the support below the skull so I think this is fairly definitive provided IRSNB R3211 is a published lemmonieri specimen. IJReid ^{{{T - C - D - R}}} 18:36, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

TO IJReid and FunkMonk : After some research carried out, it would seem that, in the scientific literature conforming to the ICZN in any case, that the most recent attribution for this specimen was made by Lingham-Soliar (2000), in which he actually attributed it as a juvenile M. lemonnieri. However, in Street (2016), a PhD thesis rediagnosing M. hoffmannii, the specimen was found to be very different from other formal specimens of M. lemonnieri. Therefore, the author considered it as the holotype of a completely new proposed species of Moanasaurus (p. 276-277), but as the thesises do not follow the laws of the ICZN, it will be necessary to wait before that a real redescription will be carried out on the specimen. Thus, as its identification is currently doubtful, I propose to rename the pictures under the code name of the specimen. Furthermore, a description relating the identification history of this specimen would not be denied. Amirani1746 (talk) 19:01, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

2021 abstract affirms a moanasaur identity, though new genus [17]. Macrophyseter | talk 22:55, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for responding! Amirani1746 (talk) 07:06, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

hybodus skeletal

a 3d skeletal reconstruction of hybodus using updated methods and information on hybodus and its realtives to fill in gaps and fix certain elements EvolutionIncarnate (talk)

skeletala reconstruction of the extinct shark hybodus

Looks fine to me, but my knowledge of cartilaginous fish anatomy is limited. Maybe @NGPezz: and @Gasmasque: have some thoughts? Hemiauchenia (talk) 00:17, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

For reference, here are previous reconstructions of various elements of Hybodus skeletal anatomy from the literature, both from the 1980s, so quite old, [18], [19], though at least the skull anatomy is still widely reprinted. Hemiauchenia (talk) 01:03, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

I am already in full agreement with this reconstruction, and am updating my own Hybodus hauffianus life reconstruction to accommodate it. This conforms much closer to the known fossils of H. hauffianus and recent reconstructions of Asteracanthus. Most diagrams labeled "Hybodus" in both popular and academic works are generalized composites of several (now distinct) genera or are specifically based on Egertonodus. The atypical anatomy I think is more of a reflection of how poorly researched most shark paleoart is. Gasmasque (talk) 07:57, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

With that being the case (Gasmasque is way more familiar with Hybodus anatomy than anybody else on the noticeboard) I think the images are okay to use. The only change I would make is that I think there is too much lateral grayspace, which reduces the effective size and detail of the image in thumb view. I think cutting the lateral grayspace by about half would suffice. I would do it myself but I don't want to be seen to as rude to a creator who has obviously put a lot of effort into their reconstruction. Hemiauchenia (talk) 19:16, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

lateral gray space reduced! thank you for the input EvolutionIncarnate (talk) 22:14, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

A lot of what I know about hybodonts has come from resources provided to me by EvoIncarnate, and she is, in my opinion at least, very much the expert here. Recent work on hybodontiformes as a general group seems to suggest them to be benthic, with pronounced labial cartilage (similar to a wobbegong or horn shark) and, potentially, barbels. Even if the genus Hybodus itself did differ somewhat from other members of its family or order (suggested by Skumpf et al. solely based on a diet of belemnites, and not its body or tooth morphology?), I don't think that's all that good of a reason to continue aligning with mid-late 20th century research while our picture of related taxa has changed so much. I have very similar opinions regarding other understudied fossil sharks like Cobelodus, in the event those ever come up here. Gasmasque (talk) 20:55, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

This is obviously a response to my comments on Discord regarding your WIP restoration that I've sort of already walked back there anyway, rather than anything in this skeleton, but I may as well respond here. I don't think any hybodont sharks were probably ever truly pelagic in the same way that for instance modern lamniform sharks are, but the literature generally does suggest that Hybodus in particular did consume active prey like cephalopods and fish (see the refs in the Hybodus#Biology), rather than the obviously more benthic prey of for example durophagous hybodonts like Acrodus or Strophodus. I admit my knowledge of living sharks is limited, so I am not sure if living sharks with a similar diet and fin shape have barbels or not, and I would probably defer to your better knowledge of the topic. Hemiauchenia (talk) 21:56, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

I would be totally fine to give my reconstruction smaller/no barbels, the exact lifestyle of Hybodus is definitely noted to be pretty different from Asteracanthus and the barbels are based predominantly on unpublished specimens anyway. The published consensus regarding Hybodus hauffianus itself does lean towards it being less benthic (even if I personally find some of the reasoning weak), but I don't think I should let my personal leanings override creating a generally applicable, "uncontroversial" life reconstruction for the sake of the wiki. It is worth noting a benthic lifestyle does not at all restrict the animal from a diet of fish and belemnites, though. I really do appreciate genuine discussion on the topic, a lot of cartilaginous fish recons seem to pass through the review page without much of any discussion at all. Gasmasque (talk) 02:04, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Miodelphinus

Hello all. Can I ask for another review of my paleoart? This time I tried to reconstruct Miodelphinus based on the preserved skull that is shown in here https://novataxa.blogspot.com/2024/10/miodelphinus.html. I also using its modern closest relatives like ganges dan indus river dolphin for the color reference... Is my reconstruction good enough to be put for the Miodelphinus page? This is my first time using digital art so I am aware that it is crude and kind of messy... But alas it is what it is for now... Thank you in advance!

Miodelphinus miensis

DD (talk) 04:22, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

im not an expert on dolphin anatomy, it seems great to my untrained eyes - i was about to say the snout could maybe curve more upward, but looking at modern river dolphins this point seems probably irrelevant. my suggestions would be to crop out some of the unused space and remove the text label, assuming its to be used on the Miodelphinus page. could also maybe use a little bit more contrast in terms of lighting? Prehistorica CM (talk) 05:27, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

thank you for the reply and input.. Ah okay, I will crop the text then and the upper unused space. About the contrast, I am sorry becauase I really havent get the hang of lighting and coloring.. So should i dim the background or should I brighten the animal? DD (talk) 05:35, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Don't brighten the animal, but if whatever art program youre using has the option, modify the rgb curve so its not a straight line and that its concave maybe? or just like, increase the contrast with a photo editing program. the problem is that the whole image is rather bright and the dolphin blends in with the background too much. even just darkening the background would be sufficient. sorry i realize this is more artistic advice than anatomical. Prehistorica CM (talk) 05:40, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

No its fine, artistic also account..hahaha. Okay, I will try to dim the background then.. Oh and for the progran I am using ibis pro x. But I will try too look how deal with it.. DD (talk) 05:51, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello. Sorry for asking again. I have tried to alter and reduce unused space. Is it better now? DD (talk) 13:12, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Theres still a bit of empty space up top, but other than that it looks good Prehistorica CM (talk) 20:26, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Ah okay, I will cut the upper space again then. Once more, thank you very much for your input.. DD (talk) 03:23, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

also, just to make sure, you've not drawn the blowhole on the snout, have you? the bit of air coming from the base of the snout might be throwing me off. Prehistorica CM (talk) 05:43, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

about that, isn't it suppose to be not visible from total side view? I observed some picture like this https://www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-samsung-rvo1&sca_esv=b42237714339f3fb&source=android-browser&sxsrf=ADLYWIINawqD62aCK413-LUTwY0Gd-osHA:1730268325859&q=river+dolphin&udm=2&fbs=AEQNm0DJ7g6q1SUpTw4cD2HgLJVN-DyQln-PEBM_ZXBfF_rmPWjJ_V9ADsx_hReH0g80SYXzX3Us7ieV_Xb6-0rJH9SzVrVJYgsE099B1irWGH9tbuMgjEPzh3cSf9K-VLCYP5Dve6sTGJThiEVwkA4GReBUUh4VcLOpa30yru2UHSYakZMRcdLDEvc4R8kPPap7A2Njt8uIbAGaId5oRW3WLK_xaYv7rw&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiH-7bnt7WJAxXT1jgGHa-_GQEQtKgLegQIDhAB&biw=384&bih=675&dpr=2.81#vhid=wRg8VXWmhB8N9M&vssid=mosaic and the blowhole are not visible (although the position of these two species maybe different) DD (talk) 06:10, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Ninumbeehan dookoodukah

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  Ninumbeehan dookoodukah

SeismicShrimp (talk) 02:04, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Clementechiton

Clementechiton

I made a reconstruction of Clementechiton does it have any problems ？ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zhenghecaris (talk • contribs)

It is unneeded to have image of obscure taxa studied nobody but Mcmenamin. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 14:25, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Agreed, also the image is a bit dark and blurry. Fossiladder13 (talk) 17:08, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Mandageria

Hello all. May I ask for review of my drawing again? This time I tried to reconstruct Mandageria... The reference I am using are mainly from https://twitter.com/austmus/status/632789584619765760, artbyjrc, and the image that show Mandageria as blue/blackkish fish (I am sorry I dont know the name of the artist...). Is my version good enough to be upload as full body reconstruction in the Mandageria page? Thank you in advance...

Mandageria fairfexi

DD (talk) 13:12, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

First reconstruction is originally from this paper,[20] while there is skull revision later.[21] As I see it looks fine but probably needs more critiques from people good at fish. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 22:43, 4 November 2024 (UTC)

Ah I see, thank you for giving the paper source. And thank you for the opinion.. Yes, I would really appreciate input from others.. DD (talk) 02:39, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

The operculum (gill covering) should probably be more distinct from the rest of the head, as seen here for example. But otherwise it looks pretty good. —Trilletrollet [ Talk | Contribs ] 12:14, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

Aah I see. Okay. I will try to make the operculum especially the line more apparent.. DD (talk) 10:31, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

I have bolden the opercular region and the gill slit edge. Is this good enough? DD (talk) 10:48, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

Houcaris

Houcaris

I made a reconstruction of Houcaris it may have some inaccuracies in the frontal appendage or elsewhere. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Zhenghecaris (talk • contribs)

There seems some of gaps between segmentation and fins, and yeah frontal appendage have too low number of segments. Other animals and texts are hard to see due to lighting I think. Also as Maotianshan Shale is estimated to be shallow lagoon, it would be better to make it not look like deeper ocean. As it is only known from frontal appendages and affinity is unknown, I don't think this taxon needs full body reconstruction at the moment anyway. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 13:13, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

I agree, Houcaris is In a bit of a taxonomic limbo right now, so I don't think it should get a full body restoration until those issues are resolved. Also the Houcaris here seems to be lacking the lateral sclerites (P-elements), but that's probably not the biggest issue here (again because we lack everything other then the frontal appendages). Fossiladder13 (talk) 16:12, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

Who's that hyaenodiontid?

(?) Hyaenodon cayluxi

(?) Cynohyaenodon cayluxi

Hello all. I came across two photos of the same hyaenodontid skull on Wiki Commons, and I'm confused about its identity. They came from same author and they are taken on same location. First one (from January 2007) is labeled as Hyaenodon cayluxi (synonym of Hyaenodon leptorhynchus). Second one (from May 2013) is labeled as Cynohyaenodon cayluxi. Can someone solve this case? The Explaner (talk) 13:21, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

This is most likely Hyaenodon, since:

• It has 2 molars at the top instead of 3 like the dental formula of Hyaenodon and not the complete dental formula of Cynohyaenodon.
• It has a very high supraoccipital crest, which matches up more with Hyaenodon than Cynohyaenodon.

I'm guessing that either the museum labels at some point were misleading or incorrect, hence the skull being titled as belonging to Cynohyaenodon. PrimalMustelid (talk) 02:24, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Aren't Cynohyaenodon cayluxi and Hyaenodon cayluxi the same species? They share the same author, Filhol, 1873. The wiki page for Hyaenodon notes that cayluxi is a junior synonym of H. leptorhynchus, and apparently this claim originated from a single inaccessible schweizerbart paper (Lange-Badre 1995). Yet cayluxi is the type species of Cynohyaenodon, and from what I can tell that genus is still considered valid from the admittedly small sample of recent papers which discuss European hyaenodonts. Maybe the French paleontologists who made the label had some disagreements over the years. NGPezz (talk) 02:43, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Hyaenodon cayluxi and Cynohyaenodon cayluxi are actually separate and valid species names - both were recognized by Filhol, but the former was named in 1876 while the latter was recognized as a separate species in 1873. PrimalMustelid (talk) 02:54, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Also possible that the uploader himself made some inferences based on species names (and cross checking Wikipedia) and inaccurately named one of the files, assuming the two cayluxi were the same taxon? But wow, naming two related species the same is ridiculous... FunkMonk (talk) 02:59, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, I was mistaken (understandably so, I hope). Filhol is not the only person to have done this kind of thing but this is a great example of how obnoxious unstandardized early taxonomy could be. NGPezz (talk) 03:03, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Things from the past few weeks

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  Edingerella madagascariensis
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  Aphaurosuchus escharafacies
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  Stegomosuchus longipes
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  Tetraclaenodon puercensis
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  Siamotherium pondaungensis
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  Rastosuchus hammeri
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  Paenanthracotherium bergeri
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  Otacillus aumondi
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  Nshimbodon muchingaensis
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  Nannaroter mckinziei
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  Microbunodon sp
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  Microbrachis pelikani
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  Kosmodraco magnicornis
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  Konzhukovia sangabrielensis
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  Jaggermeryx naida
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  Hypisodus minimus
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  Floridameryx floridanus
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  Dongnanosuchus hsui
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  Dibothrosuchus elaphros
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  Coloradisuchus abelini
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  Champsosaurus laramiensis
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  Bothriogenys sp
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  Bageherpeton longignathus
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  Argochampsa krebsi
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  Arambourgia gaudryi

SeismicShrimp (talk) 18:16, 11 November 2024 (UTC)

Concavotectum

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  Paranogmius

Seems this image in use have issue, by lacking pelvic fins. Also according to @Orthocormus:, eye placement is wrong, same happening on Paranogmius reconstruction. (It is helpful if you can post reference where should its eyes be.) Probably someone can edit image? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 15:31, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

Plagiolophus

Hey folks, here with more European palaeotheres: Plagiolophus

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  P. huerzeleri
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  P. minor
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  P. annectens
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  Size Comp

Triloboii (talk) 01:42, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

• Any sign off on this and others, PrimalMustelid? For future reference, so we know they have been approved. FunkMonk (talk) 21:53, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

  Very well, pass. PrimalMustelid (talk) 22:44, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

  Agreed, pass. These are all very good reconstructions! Paleoaficionado (talk) 14:29, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

Artwork of the New Captorhinid

Currently working on placoderm art but thought I'd take a short break to work on something described today, Indosauriscus kuttyi.

SeismicShrimp (talk) 14:06, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

Andrewsarchus

Back again with a lateral portrait of Andrewsarchus mongoliensis

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  Andrewsarchus

Triloboii (talk) 00:41, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Approved. PrimalMustelid (talk) 00:58, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Should the posterior part of the mandible not be taller so the head tapers a little bit more? I know we don't have the mandible for this taxon, but that's fairly typical of mammals isn't it? A Cynical Idealist (talk) 01:13, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

I'm not exactly sure what you're referring to here. The jaw here is mostly from "Paratriisodon henanensis" which was later referred to A. mongoliensis. It only preserves a tiny bit of the angle of the jaw, so this portion is reconstructed here based on the shape of the angle in other whippomorph taxa. It could certainly be reconstructed a little larger, but I don't think what I have here rn is unreasonable. I'd be happy to show the bones underneath this recon if you want to see how it works Triloboii (talk) 04:44, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

I didn't realize there were referred remains. I suppose the length of the head just makes it look odd knowing what the holotype skull looks like. But if you used actual specimens for the scaling, then I don't think there's any issue. A Cynical Idealist (talk) 09:44, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Homotherium

I don't have an image to be reviewed, but I want to point out that a newly discovered Homotherium cub mummy may impact how the animal should be reconstructed. The paper is here, and the mummy has dark, reddish-brown fur. The reconstructions on the Homotherium Wikipedia page currently have whitish-grey fur, so they may need to be revised. Di (they-them) (talk) 04:18, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

There's multiple species of Homotherium and only this one juvenile is believed to have had brown fur, so theoretically only depictions of juveniles of H. latidens should be changed. A Cynical Idealist (talk) 06:38, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Our only restoration of H. latidens (which I'm not sure otherwise passed review) appears to have roughly the right colour:[22] But yeah, the rest we have are of H. serum, so we can't necessarily assume they had the same colour. FunkMonk (talk) 09:22, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

Unspecified tetrapod

This is simply labeled "Labyrinthodontia". Does anyone know what exactly this is supposed to be, how accurate it is and how it could be used (other than illustrating the page about "Labyrinthodontia")? Kiwi Rex (talk) 03:23, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

Kiwi Rex (talk) 03:23, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

That's unfortunately all the website said, so may not be of much use. But the author could be emailed. FunkMonk (talk) 08:57, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

Maybe it's meant to be Tulerpeton, based on the proportions of the six-toed hindlimbs. Even so, that's no guarantee, it could just as easily be an outdated salamander-style Ichthyostega based on the shape of the skull and long teeth. Or maybe it's not meant to be any one animal in particular. NGPezz (talk) 03:15, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

Nipponopterus skeletal + size

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  Skeletal (holotype)
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  Size comparison (estimated adult)

Skeletal reconstruction of the one holotypic vertebra of Nipponopterus, plus a size chart based on the paper's estimated adult wingspan. I'm a little hesitant about that size given the holotype (which is described as a "subadult") is much smaller... -SlvrHwk (talk) 23:09, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

Large bird sizes

I found this on commons. I'm planning on using it for a long-term project about the size of birds throughout their evolution. Any issues that some Cenozoic people can identify? A Cynical Idealist (talk) 07:52, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

This is surely oversized. Seemingly each square is 30 cm considering human's height, and that make Kelenken skull way oversized, which is actually 70 cm long but in this chart nearly 1.5 m. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 07:57, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Also Gastornis being labeled as "predatory" is pretty outdated. Honestly why is it here, this would work better as a strictly Phorusrhacid size chart. Fossiladder13 (talk) 17:05, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Definitely needs a scale bar. Could really use an entire overhaul—the silhouette detail is inconsistent (especially with the shaggy Gastornis) and the gradient background is unnecessary and distracting. -SlvrHwk (talk) 20:04, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

In addition to the inconsistent silhouettes as mentioned by SlvrHwk, I think its probably worth looking into the licensing around them. I can't say how much modification or difference would suffice but on first glance the Kelenken seems very much to be slightly repurposed from the artwork of Stephanie Abramowicz, while the Phorusrhacos appears like a slimmed down and slightly reposed derivative of the WWB depiction. There are some obvious differences I admitt (Abramowicz's art has less open jaws and a more raised leg), but for cautions sake its probably better to make an entirely new image.Armin Reindl (talk) 12:31, 24 November 2024 (UTC)

Anji Biota and Archopterus

Hello. Here is a reconstruction of the Anji Biota of Ordovician China, a deep sea glass sponge reef. Mainly featuring Archopterus, so I suggest it be added to that wiki page, seeing as the Anji Biota does not have one of its own. Prehistorica CM (talk) 09:36, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Seems nice to me. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 11:00, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Agreed, very nice recon as always. Fossiladder13 (talk) 13:35, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Unshowcased works

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  Haikouichthys
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  Allodelphis
• 

Found in Commons. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 14:17, 24 November 2024 (UTC)

Arthropleura

Hello. I finally got around to finishing my reconstruction of Arthropleura. I based it mostly on the new fossils of Arthropleura sp. from Montceau-les-Mines, although reduced the spines slightly, to represent an older individual, or a different species. I would have also made clean / orthographic renders, but the page is already short and cluttered as is, so first we would have to find a place to put this one. Prehistorica CM (talk) 11:44, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

It seems pretty nice for me! My concerns are, spine-like humps are known mostly from smaller specimens so not sure if it is also like that for adult one, and antennae segmentation being over 7, although yeah, MNHN.F.SOT002123 seems have more antennae segments than smaller specimen. (problem is not specified in the paper or supplementary material) Do you have opinions, @Junnn11:? Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 12:42, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

Placoderms and Chondrichthyans

My first set of placoderms along with a few other fish with a more updated look, I had help from Richard Carr for a few of the weirder placoderms like rolfosteus and gymnotrachelus. The general proportions are based on the equation from Engelman 2023 but with a bit of wiggle room since one or two were a little shorter than they probably would be.

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  Tubonasus lennardensis
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  Gymnotrachelus hydei
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  Rolfosteus canningensis
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  Pholidosteus friedeli
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  Mcnamaraspis kaprios
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  Latocamurus coulthardi
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  Kiangyousteus yohii
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  Heintzichthys gouldii
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  Harpagofututor volsellorhinus
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  Diademodus hydei
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  Bryantolepis brachycephala
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  Enseosteus marocanensis

SeismicShrimp (talk) 14:10, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

No complaints here, and really glad to see these represented. As stated before I especially like the Harpagofututor and Diademodus, and I appreciate the changes made to the latter prior to uploading. Great job as usual! Gasmasque (talk) 17:41, 25 November 2024 (UTC)