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Gyan

Just a note that if you want to give a reason for deletion, please don't cite your own page. If you want to assert that Gyan books are NEVER allowed, then please give appropriate sources, your own page is not an acceptable link for Wikipedia guidelines. Hzh (talk) 15:26, 26 January 2017 (UTC)

Nothing wrong with it. Sitush has taken the trouble to give detailed explanations and pointers to discussions. The policy being applied is clearly WP:RS. If you have an issue with it, please state it. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 23:14, 26 January 2017 (UTC)

I have already stated quite clearly what my problem is. Per WP:UP#NOT, a user page is not to be used to look like a project page that deals with policy and guidelines. If you think the page is good enough to be part of the project, then make it so, but don't use what is something personal to indicate that it is something official. Use proper links that address particular issues. Personal pages should not be offered to suggest that it is official Wikipedia guidelines or policy. There is also no link given that substantiates the assertion that Gyan book is NEVER allowed as source as a matter of policy, just links to discussion where people offered opinions. There is a big difference with some books being problematic and all books being problematic. You would actually need to show that any particular source given is a mirror or plagiarised material, rather than claiming because some are, then all are. If you think that a publisher should not be allowed, then by all means proposed that it be blacklisted. Hzh (talk) 00:49, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

Hzh, Sitush is not presenting his user page as a policy: he linking to it so that he does not have to keep retyping the same argument. That's all. There are serious issues with the reliability of Gyan publication sources, issues that have been brought up at WP:INB, and IIRC, at WP:RSN as well. Please read up on those discussions, and if you are still not convinced, start a discussion yourself at RSN. Right now you are making a mountain out of a molehill. Vanamonde (talk) 04:07, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

It is up to Sitush to explain properly when removing edits. I was confused for a while I clicked on the link, assuming that it is some kind of policy that has official status, especially given that the editor is making what appears to be a false claim that it is NEVER allowed. All I have read is that some people had expressed concerns about the publishers. If you want to make it a guideline that has community backing, then start a RfC proposal to have Gyan banned, then add the result to the project page, and use that as the link. Hzh (talk) 09:29, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

Hzh, deletion discussions are discussions. If an editor wishes to link to a user page that explains their reasons for deletion rather than having to repeat them for every similar deletion discussion, then they may do so. If that confuses you, then that's on you and not on Sitush. Now I suggest you just drop this stick and move on. --regentspark (comment) 14:29, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

Really, given that Sitush doesn't see fit to reply to question about his own edit and work, why do you feel the need to speak for Sitush and tell me to "drop the stick"? No editor should refuse to reply to any legitimate point raised, relying instead on others to answer for his or her work. And no one has address issue raised that personal pages are not to be used to suggest any official stance, using an apparently false claim. I'm an experienced user, trying to shift the blame onto me is simply wrong. I should imagine many inexperienced editors mistaking what's written as an official stance. Hzh (talk) 14:57, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

If there are indeed many people who supported Sitush, then there should not be any issue turning into this a guideline for your particular project. What is being done using user page is both unnecessary and wrong. Hzh (talk) 15:02, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

Hzh, we both started editing here in 2007. Although I have about three times as many edits as you, we're both experienced, not just you. So, too, are all of the people who have commented above, at least two of whom are admins. For some reason, however, you seem unable to grasp that (a) I am not obliged to reply immediately to any message left here; (b) I specifically said above that I would be away for 24 hours or so; (c) I work mostly in a rather controversial area of Wikipedia and have accumulated a lot of talk page stalkers who are willing to offer their opinion about matters because of that. They do not always agree with me.

You appear to be the first person not to have understood the purpose of that page in my userspace, despite it being heavily used in edit summaries and talk page discussions for some years. Further, you appear to have actually misread it. We routinely disregard the efforts of certain publishers, including Global Vision, General Books LLC etc - they have a certain notoriety. If you want another opinion regarding Gyan's widespread plagiarism etc, despite the obvious consensus, then perhaps Moonriddengirl would opine. - Sitush (talk) 19:17, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

The point is that when the person to whom the question was directed has not answered and addressed the issue raised, it is entirely inappropriate to tell others "drop the stick". If it is commonly used, then per WP:UP#NOT, merged it into a project's space (all the points in the page can then be discussed by the community and made into guidelines for the particular project you are interested in). It is irrelevant how many times it is used by other, it is not official, the occasional person who reads it won't keep count, and an inexperienced user would not know if it is an official guideline or not. Personal pages should not be used in such a way. Hzh (talk) 19:54, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

The point is, it has already been discussed. That's why there are some links there. I am sure I could find others. So drop the stick, please. - Sitush (talk) 20:22, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

The reluctance to submit what you said on the page to the scrutiny of the community is certainly interesting, so is the repeated demand to "drop the stick" (including by an admin, which is even more interesting) when the guideline on the use of user page is being ignored. Stick dropped, so did the penny. Hzh (talk) 10:42, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Always a pleasure to talk with a conspiracy theorist. You've been told that this is the wrong venue, so continuing to whine here is obviously not going to achieve anything, however snippy you get. - Sitush (talk) 10:45, 29 January 2017 (UTC)

Hiya!

Personally I would be surprised if that thread resulted in anything positive, but I don't mind getting reverted if you feel otherwise. (((The Quixotic Potato))) (talk) 00:52, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

We have cross-posted. Explanation on your talk page. You're probably right but, one way or another, I am going to see this through because it is plain bad manners, BITE-y, unnecessary and even, potentially, subversive. - Sitush (talk) 00:54, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

OK. (((The Quixotic Potato))) (talk) 00:56, 30 January 2017 (UTC)

One of the previous pings...

...was about Chishtian, which is frequently just being knocked about by IPs and might benefit from some form of protection, if only someone could determine a good version to then protect. Someone suggested asking you about this (don't remember who, was a few months ago). It's also been pointed out there might be many similar articles - I'm happy to look into more. Samsara 18:56, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

Stubbed it due to WP:V. Have added the thing to my watchlist but that is very long now, so don't count on me always spotting things in a timely manner. - Sitush (talk)

Thanks. I've given it some semi and PC, let me know if you have a different preference. Samsara 19:13, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

I am lost with the nuances of when PC is applicable but I did think that and semi were either/or situations, not both simultaneously. Obviously, I'm wrong! - Sitush (talk) 19:16, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

It's common now to enact semi for a limited period, followed by PC to give an opportunity to monitor what happens after unprotection, rather than unprotecting outright. I would like to limit semi here as I would prefer to be hopeful that general editorial standards for that region can improve over the coming years. Samsara 19:21, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

Ruthven Blackburn

Hmmm. I don't agree, but I'm not going to make a fuss about it. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:52, 1 February 2017 (UTC)

Sitush owns Joseph Crook?

My initial edits to the page were, I grant you, inelegant and I have (and had) no objection to their reversion. I then went on to look at matters of substance that might be embarked upon in an effort to improve the page. You stomped on them. You have now twice reverted plain positive contributions without any explanation. Perhaps you would care to expound upon why we should not attempt to make the connection between the subject's legislative endeavours and his constituency? sirlanz 15:27, 1 February 2017 (UTC)

(edit conflict) You looked for things to nit-pick about after my initial revert of your "inelegant" effort. You actually went away from and came back to the article after I reverted you then. And your next edit was seriously crap, too, because it introduced tautology. I posted on your talk page and you ignored me.

You've been around long enough that you should know about WP:BRD. What you should have done was take it to the article talk page. - Sitush (talk) 15:34, 1 February 2017 (UTC)

Yo Ho Ho

Doug Weller talk is wishing you Seasons Greetings! Whether you celebrate your hemisphere's Solstice or Christmas, Diwali, Hogmanay, Hanukkah, Lenaia, Festivus or even the Saturnalia, this is a special time of year for almost everyone!

Spread the holiday cheer by adding {{subst:User:WereSpielChequers/Dec16a}} to your friends' talk pages.

Balija Merging

Hi,Sitush please merge Balija and Balija dynasties since they have provided same matter in Dynasties section of Balija and Balija dynasties

Chattar

Dear Sitush

I have noticed that you have completely vandalised the page with credible resources and historic context. I kindly request you restore the page so that we can build the page satisfying your concerns.

regards

Request

Sir How You Delete and Change Page ,who edits by me.please told me about this and sorry for any mistake. (Jai Rajput (talk) 15:11, 2 February 2017 (UTC))

The article has not been deleted yet and is unlikely to be for at least a week. It may not ever be deleted - that depends on the outcome of the discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Banmata Ji. You are welcome to take part in that discussion and, really, there is no rush. I realise that English may not be your first language but the main thing is to keep calm and try your best to explain why the article does or could comply with Wikipedia's policies. In particular, I think the information at WP:GNG might be of use to you. - Sitush (talk) 15:17, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Sitush Illegal activities on wikidpedia

Dear sitush I am pasting the below talk page from "list of Indian Christians" your activities in the past have been highly questionable and Against the very spirit of Wikipedia. You have in the past impersonated as a wikipedia administrator/user and your name figures in the "wikepedians" who are nor wikepedians" therfore

Your recent editing history at List of Indian Christians shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war with biased motives which is against the Wikipedia spirit. Apart from that you have misusd and misquoted wikipedia rules to intimidate other users from contributing which is a offence. You have repeatedly engaged in edit war besides you have violated the the three-revert rule hence final notice failing which i shall take appropriate remedies available to me in law.

"below is the prelude to the this notice" copied from talk page of "list of indian christians" Arbitrary heading[edit source] After long research included 22 names of Indian origin Christians who participated in freedom struggle and 41 names of Army personals with references but on more than 5 occasions between 2015 to 2017 it has been deleted, it is very shocking and surprising . I wonder is it a deliberate ploy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 18:13, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

No, it is because you are not following our policies - in particular, the information at WP:V. Since yours is a new account but you claim to have been adding the info since 2015, I am curious regarding what other accounts you may have used. - Sitush (talk) 18:17, 2 February 2017 (UTC) i dont think you need an account to edit the page. I did create the account only to register my protest. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 18:36, 2 February 2017 (UTC) Nitish.massey You are correct that you do not need an account. However, you can't keep reinstating stuff that fails policies such as WP:V and WP:BLP, nor things such as WP:NLIST. It doesn't matter how many accounts and IP addresses you use, it is wrong and it will be reverted. If you persist then other actions can be taken to prevent your abuse of Wikipedia. - Sitush (talk) 18:43, 2 February 2017 (UTC) If you can reliably source these recent additions and, preferably, put them into alphabetical order, then that would be good. Please note that if any of them are living then the source must show that they self-identify as Christian. The citations need to be complete - author name (where available), title, year, page number etc. Thanks. - Sitush (talk) 18:57, 2 February 2017 (UTC) Dear sitush most of the wiki pages of persons included in the freedom fighter added by me , contain references that they were Christians. Are you implying that still i have to give the external reference to edit the article. Names like titusji amrit kaur madhusudan das . — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 19:06, 2 February 2017 (UTC) Yes, and if you take cites from those articles then they need to be checked. There is sometimes an allowance made for this, called "summary style", but experience has taught us that on articles related to India, and in particular to matters such as lists of people of X caste or Y religion, things rapidly get out of hand. It is far better to cite here, then there should be no arguments. - Sitush (talk) 19:11, 2 February 2017 (UTC) it is not so on other articles which include articles related to India and include matters such as lists of people of X caste or Y religion , why this exception. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey Nitish.massey • contribs) 19:29, 2 February 2017 (UTC) It isn't the exception - it is quite common. The WP:BURDEN is on the person adding the material. - Sitush (talk) 19:36, 2 February 2017 (UTC) let me add this is the message i received on my account from Sitush "

Stop icon Your recent editing history at List of Indian Christians shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection."

"Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly. Sitush (talk) 18:45, 2 February 2017 (UTC)"

"my response" Nitish.masseyI would say it is the other way round were my material contributions with genuine citations have been edited time and again. i agree that citations are required but most of the names added by me have their independent wikipages/articles with specific reference that they are Christians, I fail to understand then how is this non compliance with the policies.Nitish.massey

People I have seen Sitush activities on wikipedia, you have been sedulously editing a lot of articles/pages on a daily basis most of which are related to caste and religion in India. innuendo being that you are politically motivated. I won't be surprised if you continue in your campaign with a different pseudonym, — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 23:17, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

one question are you an authorized wikipedia representative ?? as you have been using the term "our policies" in our aforementioned interactions. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 23:41, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

people another example of this fake user Stush below is the message I recived on my wikipage

Sanctions alert[edit source] Commons-emblem-notice.svg This message contains important information about an administrative situation on Wikipedia. It does not imply any misconduct regarding your own contributions to date. Please carefully read this information:

The Arbitration Committee has authorised discretionary sanctions to be used for pages regarding India, Pakistan, and Afghanistan, a topic which you have edited. The Committee's decision is here.

Discretionary sanctions is a system of conduct regulation designed to minimize disruption to controversial topics. This means uninvolved administrators can impose sanctions for edits relating to the topic that do not adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, our standards of behavior, or relevant policies. Administrators may impose sanctions such as editing restrictions, bans, or blocks. This message is to notify you that sanctions are authorised for the topic you are editing. Before continuing to edit this topic, please familiarise yourself with the discretionary sanctions system. Don't hesitate to contact me or another editor if you have any questions. - Sitush (talk) 17:31, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

"My response"thanks Sitush you fake, i thought you were gone, btw your name figures on the 'wikipedia users who are not wikipedians' better explain that to the arbitration committee and dont ever brandish me these threats in future . Am a qualified lawyer with years of practice, you are functioning of Wikipedia with ill and oblique motives which are biased and past activities qualify for your dismissal besides other legal action after tracing your true identity and IP address. Probably this is the reason you did not dare to post this of the talk page of "list of Indian Christians" Your activities are highly doubtfull and against the very spirit of wikipedia. I have seen your activities in the past however have restrained from taking any action. I call upon you to cease and desist with immediate effect from continuing in such activities in future, failing which i shall be constrained to intimate appropriate remedies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 20:34, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Btw in your past conduct you have been impersonating as an wikipedia administrator/representaive which is enough to take legal actions against you. Therefore treat this as a Serious Matter( a piece of advice) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nitish.massey (talk • contribs) 21:00, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Not that I am massively scared etc but please see WP:NLT. - Sitush (talk) 01:41, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Hang in there!

It's good to see you back again. I thought you might enjoy this clip, thought to be the first animated film, of the "Humorous Phases of Funny Faces" (1906).—CaroleHenson (talk) 02:00, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, Carole. I will watch it tomorrow - my alerts doo-dah at the top is flashing like Blackpool Illuminations on speed. It's time for bed! - Sitush (talk) 02:03, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Crook

This (p15) is probably of use to you. Glad to see you editing again, it's very quiet around GM these days. J3Mrs (talk) 18:49, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. Saw it a few days ago, then lost it! I did Betty Tebbs last week but, yes, the GM project seems pretty moribund. - Sitush (talk) 18:55, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

I'm glad I found that article, it was useful to me too. I think Crook Street in Bolton may be named after them but that may just be me. He also lived at Whitebank, now Haslam Park. J3Mrs (talk) 21:11, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Yeah, saw that, too! The problem is that I am spreading myself across too much stuff at the moment. - Sitush (talk) 21:17, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

That's pretty good for someone who is thinly spread :-) J3Mrs (talk) 21:52, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

Deletion of Naroo

I was messaged about the deletion of the page Naroo on my User Talk page, but I have never edited that page. Was this an error? noktulo (talk) 18:36, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Hm. Looks like you created the page as a redirect in 2007. Twinkle notifies the first contributor - see the oldest entry here. - Sitush (talk) 18:41, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

DYK for Betty Tebbs

On 8 February 2017, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Betty Tebbs, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the English peace campaigner Betty Tebbs was arrested at the age of 89 for participating in anti-Trident protests? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Betty Tebbs. You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, Betty Tebbs), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Coffee // have a cup // beans // 12:02, 8 February 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for the Info

I forgot i am topic banned.

Ok, no worries. If you can spend some time on other stuff and show that you are abiding by our policies etc then the ban may be lifted. It won't happen soon but it can happen. I think you were misguided when it came to caste stuff etc, rather than malicious. Ask first if in doubt about whether an article might be affected by the ban. - Sitush (talk) 16:20, 8 February 2017 (UTC)

Reference errors on 8 February

Hello, I'm ReferenceBot. I have automatically detected that an edit performed by you may have introduced errors in referencing. It is as follows:

• On the Tristão de Bragança Cunha page, your edit caused an unsupported parameter error (help). (Fix | Ask for help)

Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can report it to my operator. Thanks, ReferenceBot (talk) 00:40, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

Illathu nair

hey stop reverting my edits. I was born and bought up in an aristocratic illathu nair family i know much abt their history what i write are facts illathu nairs are kshatriyas of nagavanshi clan and i have sited source for it also. all nair sub group wikipedia pages doesnt have that much source reference also

(akshaypillai 15:29, 11 February 2017 (UTC))

I gave you my reasons on your talk page earlier today. Among other things, you seemed to be faking sources. What I didn't mention then but will now is that your personal knowledge counts for nothing - please see the information at this page. Thanks. - Sitush (talk) 15:41, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Sringeri Sharada peetham edits

Hey,

You reverted my edit on the page of Sringeri Sharadapeetham page claiming Sanskrit is only official language of Uttarkhand. But mind that Sanskrit it the language of Sharadapeetham. I have been connected to the Peetham from more than 25 years and I feel you're unnecessarily reverting the changes, which could be useful on the wiki community. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KGSHoysala (talk • contribs) 12:51, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

References

I am afraid it doesn't work like that. The consensus of contributors to Wikipedia who took part in some prolonged discussions at the India project was that only the official language(s) of the state in which a place exists should be used. I understand that Sanskrit might be the liturgical language, or even more, at this particular place but it is not one of the languages accepted by the state as being official.

To give you a couple of (perhaps rather absurd) analogies, imagine if there was a convention of Star Trek fans in India and they decided that Klingon would be the official language for the convention, or imagine one of the Syriac churches in South India using the Latin-rite Mass and claiming that Latin was the official language because of that usage. We wouldn't make exceptions for them and we won't make an exception here or, at least, not unless the consensus changes. Sorry. - Sitush (talk) 13:56, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

Genetics of Gond

Hi Sitush,

Please read the peer reviewed article on Gond, before making any changes in the Genetics section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Evolbiol07 (talk • contribs) 17:52, 16 February 2017 (UTC)

Arattupuzha Velayudha Panicker

I have made changes to the page with citation from a mainstream Malayalam daily, Malayala Manorama, the Malayalam Magazine published by the New Indian Express and, also quoted from the book of the famous Marxist thinker and historian P. Govinda Pillai whose book was distributed by the Deshabhimani Book House.Check out www.chinthapublishers.com

Type in Google and see the New Indian Express, which is one of the biggest newspaper firms of India. Malayala Manorama is the newspaper with the highest daily distribution in Kerala, India.

Can you tell me what else would you consider a "decent" source? What is so "obscure" about the publishers, that you have developed "grave" doubts about them?

Are you someone from India who knows anything about the newspaper dailies published here?

I find you being deliberately obstructive when I am trying to provide authentic information published by mainstream newspapers and prominent publishers and distributors.

I have seen your name coming up for deliberately revising authentic data recurringly related to the "Ezhava" community, which is either out of spite or out of ignorance.

You have to give me information on what you "consider" as a "decent" source.

Otherwise I will take this issue up with Wikipedia themselves as you are deliberately attempting to withhold information and data, painstakingly researched, typed out and provided by the contributor, which is a complete waste of the contributor's time and energy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Komalezhathu Chekavar (talk • contribs) 20:36, 16 February 2017 (UTC)

See the article talk page. I think I am going to need to see copies of some of those sources, sorry. It's not that I don't believe they say something about it but rather that I'm unsure (a) how they say it and (b) why. It is very odd that this stuff is not in a mainstream book and it is a fact that Chekavar people have been making exaggerated claims about their caste for many years. - Sitush (talk) 21:34, 16 February 2017 (UTC)

The citations given here and the information uploaded is the information obtained from published mainstream newspapers and books in India. Therefore I do not understand when you say "It is very odd that this stuff is not in a mainstream book and it is a fact that Chekavar people have been making exaggerated claims about their caste for many years".

Kindly see below some citations on Chekavar from mainstream newspaper links I am going to add as reference.

If you have any problem or issues with the sources or article on Arattupuzha Velayudha Panicker, you need to clearly state what they are and what is the solution you are seeking. I have given newspaper links and citation from the Hindu, the Malayala Manorama(the newspaper daily which has the highest circulation in Kerala), The Malayalam Magazine published by the New Indian Express group. Please give clear answers to my questions below.

1) Which citations are you saying is incorrect? 2) Which are the facts that you disagree with in the article, as dodgy/exaggeration, about Arattupuzha Velayudha Panicker? 3) If I provide scanned copies of mainstream newspaper articles and books published by Malayala Manorama, The Malayalam Magazine published by The New Indian Express Group and Deshabhimani, by using the upload file option in Wikipedia Menu, would that be sufficient to put your mind at rest and accept it as genuine facts and information that can be published in Wikipedia?

The references used here by me are

M R Madhavan (talk) 14:45, 18 February 2017 (UTC)

References

NB: author blocked as sock. - Sitush (talk) 00:12, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Request for Comment on the guidelines regarding "joke" categories

This is a notice that a discussion you participated in, either at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents or at Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 February 8 has resulted in a Request for comment at Wikipedia talk:User categories#Request for Comment on the guidelines regarding "joke" categories. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 20:37, 18 February 2017 (UTC)

I am posting to complain about this edit My complaint is, you 'stole' my joke " if you can remember them, you weren't there". Unforgivable! Pincrete (talk) 15:31, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

My apologies, Pincrete. I must be dense but I don't understand your message. My post was an oblique reference to Ginsberg or someone like that. Whoever it was, it is an old 'un and long predates Wikipedia. - Sitush (talk) 00:17, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

No my apologies, I wanted to use the joke, then saw you already had (forgiven). … … ps I can't remember who first coined it either, possibly I WAS there? Pincrete (talk) 08:35, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Dalel Benbabaali

Impressive lady: Dominant caste and territory in South India: The case of the Kammas of Andhra Pradesh and her Academia page. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 23:16, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

I can't hear YT videos etc, sorry, and the so-called subtitling is useless. Is this related to the umpteen accounts that have been reported to SPI regarding Kamma/Naidu and related material? I know that some have turned out not to be socks even though they were following a trend, so picking up on some viral trend or whatever makes sense in that respect. - Sitush (talk) 00:21, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Ooh, ohh. Got it now, I think, based on your revert at Sikh Rajputs. See Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Rajesh rao kumar. Sorry about that. Excuse my denseness. - Sitush (talk) 00:31, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi Sitush, I really meant Dalel Benbabaali is truly impressive. The first link above gives you a transcript of her talk. No need to watch the video. And, of course, all the citations you see here for the talk are bogus. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 16:21, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

The Citizen

Yes, please let us by all means see the people involved in the Citizen. What is wrong with them exactly that they are unfit journalists / media persons and not upto your standard that you can revert their media's citation in a Wikipedia article ?

1. Seema Mustafa Chief Editor
2. Inder Malhotra
3. John Dayal
4. Kuldip Nayar
5. S Nihal Singh - 'doyen of Ink Street'
6. Prem Shankar Jha
7. Shastri Ramachandaran
8. Sukumar Murlidharan - ex-Bureau Chief 'The Hindu'

Inlinetext (talk) 17:00, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

Don't bring it here. The behavioural aspect is being discussed on your talk page. The rest belongs at the article talk page. - Sitush (talk) 17:03, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

In that verisame way I am questioning your behavor on your talk page. You made this remark aside from The Hindu, the media sources in that country (India) are mostly plagiarists, clickbait, sensationalists when it comes to stories such as this. And that includes the once-respected The Times of India., so then I am asking you to back it up (like the Daily Mail RfC precedent) and which has nothing to do with that article specificlly that I should discuss it on the article talk page since it is already at the AFD. And OVERCITE can be used to discuss and obtain consensus, it can never be use to overawe to revert another editor work. Why cannnot you instead improve Wikipedia to remove the 1 million Daily Mail references instead of 1 small link from Delta Meghwal's page ? Inlinetext (talk) 17:19, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

The Citizen also exposed the Tarun Tejpal RAPE case See the Hindu.Inlinetext (talk) 17:27, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

As others have done before me, I am getting a bit fed up of you misrepresenting things, badgering and generally being a nuisance. I am trying to improve the bloody article and you will note how long I sat on the fence at the AfD. I am not bothered about the Daily Mail at the moment - see WP:OSE and note that, by your logic, you too could be removing those DM references instead of carping on as you are doing about "1 small link from Delta Meghwal's page". - Sitush (talk) 17:30, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

hello, can you please add a picture to this page?

hello, can you please add sir chhotu ram's picture on his page Chhotu Ram ? he was a very famous leader of farmers in india, and a very active politician in united punjab, i added a photo of him yesterday but you removed it, can you please help me adding his picture because it would be an insult to a dominant leader without his photo on wikipedia, thanks Chhotu Ram ~~manish~~ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Manishshokeen (talk • contribs) 18:57, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi, I removed it because it was a copyright violation. I have no idea whether there are any pictures of him that could be used, sorry. - Sitush (talk) 19:01, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

Mazhabi wiki

Hi sitush ..there is wrong information about the mazhabi community in the page cause i am born in this community and there are some racist and hateful words aused in the page .do you work in Wikipedia or the creator of the page ?.. Rangreta mazhabi (talk) 04:31, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

As I explained on your talk page yesterday, the information is reliably sourced and Wikipedia is not censored. I neither created the page nor am an employee of anyone, either on Wikipedia or in the real world. - Sitush (talk) 10:46, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Erasmus Smith

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Erasmus Smith you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Shearonink -- Shearonink (talk) 22:41, 24 February 2017 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Sitush. You have new messages at Talk:Erasmus Smith/GA1.
Message added 05:25, 25 February 2017 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Shearonink (talk) 05:25, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

February 2017

@JJbers: I told you not to come here again. Now go away. - Sitush (talk) 19:07, 26 February 2017 (UTC) Hello, I noticed that you reverted a notice [1] in which you were informed not to use inappropriate words, in edit summary.Junosoon (talk) 04:27, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) Junosson, the notice you noticed has been noticed. Your noticing it has been noticed too. – Uanfala (talk) 04:34, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Erasmus Smith

The article Erasmus Smith you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Erasmus Smith for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Shearonink -- Shearonink (talk) 22:21, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

User:Inlinetext

This user is clearly ant-hindu/anti-India. He's defiled the Nithyananda article the same way he is slowly tainting numerous other India-based pages. He cites media sources then uses his cunning knowledge of wikipedia policies to WP:GAME the system. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DocTox (talk • contribs) 03:03, 2 March 2017 (UTC)

Erasmus Smith

	Congratulations, it's a...
	...Wikipedia Good Article!! Shearonink (talk) 22:06, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

• I placed Smith in the "Educators" section of the WP:GAs, even though he wasn't strictly a teacher that seemed to be the best fit. (The only other choice was "Education miscellanea" and that didn't seem quite right either.) Feel free to adjust if you differ with my placement. Cheers, Shearonink (talk) 22:16, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

• Thanks very much, Shearonink. I am not fussed where it is placed because I know that he is awkward to categorise. Coincidentally, it is because of the behaviour of people who spend most of their time categorising here that I am backing away from this project, so your GA assessment is a nice way for me to sign off. - Sitush (talk) 11:13, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

• Wait, what was it this time? Be that as it may, you'll be missed, and I hope to see you back sometime. Vanamonde (talk) 11:16, 28 February 2017 (UTC)

• I am tired of fighting. Fighting the idiots trying to game the system (socks etc), the regulars trying to game it (most recently, those heavily involved with categorisation), the software issues or whatever it is that enables such things, and the repeated reverts of good faith but ill-informed material. The crowdsourcing model seems to be doomed to failure precisely because it is too easy for anyone to edit and too hard/time-consuming to keep things within policy/guidelines (whether one agrees with the consensus or not).

  In addition, I've realised that there is a conflict between what I can do and what this project can do. Specifically, I have a research project in mind that, while tangentially piqued by the crap articles on Wikipedia about that subject, cannot easily be advanced without potential claims of me plagiarising my own writings here. Yet our policies etc prevent me from advancing that project here because of OR, PRIMARY etc. I am better off (mentally, emotionally and perhaps even financially) just ploughing my own furrow with that thing and maybe getting it published. I'm good at research, I'm good at history and, while not the greatest writer, I can get my thoughts across in writing. This is not a place where I can do so - too much politics, too much lawyering, too many restrictions that prevent me from passing on what I know, for others to accept or malign as they feel appropriate. And don't get me started on how we're all feeding the weirdness that is JW, financially, socially via high-level networking and otherwise.

  I probably won't be completely absent but, honestly, I wonder why I bother. Every day, everywhere, regardless of topic area, all I find is a shedload of shit, a lot of which seems to have gone on for years. The model doesn't reward experience even regarding its own consensus; instead, simply by dint of numbers and crazy WMF promotions, it encourages the lack of it. The model assumes the triumph of a small group of versed people over the masses who are not so well versed and, frankly, who in many cases probably do not give a crap that they are divergent. It is Utopian and Utopia is a concept, not a product specification.

  My watchlist (yes, I know I can prune it) just lights up every day with bollocks. Hidden amongst that long list are usernames for some people for whom I have the greatest respect and whose advice I would hope I can call on if necessary in the future. Those people will probably know who they are but, for the avoidance of doubt, you're one of them. And another - surely one of the best writers WP has ever had - is pretty much gone, driven out by issues that at least in part mirror my own.

  Feel free to email or to post here. Very probably, I will also be found in the archive sections of Liverpool Central Library and Manchester Central Library. Just maybe, something I write might eventually surface here as a secondary source. - Sitush (talk) 01:26, 2 March 2017 (UTC)

• Ah well, that's understandable. I can't claim to deal with the amount of nonsense you do, but even I find it necessary to do work outside the Indic space to keep my sanity; indeed more than half my work these days is on non-South Asian topics. Be that as it may, your work is appreciated, and best of luck. Vanamonde (talk) 08:17, 2 March 2017 (UTC)

Opinion at an AFD...

Saw you actively participating in India and Indian-politics related discussions.Maybe Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Gurmehar Kaur will be of some interest to you.Cheers!Winged Blades ^Godric 05:22, 6 March 2017 (UTC)

Buffalo Crime Family Deletions While I was Adding References

SItush, Can you please undo the delation of the vast majority of this article. I was working on adding material and references when the content was deleted. Most information in this article is true and can be sourced. If you allow me, I will slowly work on adding these sources. I am a bit frustrated as I was working on the early history of the crime family anding content and references then went hit save and it wouldn't let me because the content was gone. Thank you!BuffCity (talk) 00:27, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

I didn't remove anything that you had sourced. Feel free to add information back as you do source it but that article had been unsourced for years, included WP:BLP violations etc. That someone reverted my initial removal of the material was not helpful.

A tip for you: the material existed for a long time and the chances are quite high that other people have copied it elsewhere etc. You will probably have to be very careful in selecting your sources now as there are likely to be mirrors and other forms of plagiarism etc out there, including in news media. - Sitush (talk) 07:04, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

And another tip. You will find it much easier if you use meaningful names for citations, eg: ref name="smith" than your ref name=":0" scheme. - Sitush (talk) 07:08, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Sitush why not just delete the whole page since you do not agree with the content? You should stick to editing subjects you know about such as (Redacted)

I am not Indian. - Sitush (talk) 15:27, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Sitush. You have new messages at Yunshui's talk page.
Message added 16:38, 13 March 2017 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Yunshui ^雲_水 16:38, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

New Wikipedia logo

See this. I wish it were CC-BY-SA etc. Frances D'Souza, Baroness D'Souza showed a beermat with this logo on TV this week and, of course, Stephen Fry has long since proudly displayed it. - Sitush (talk) 00:39, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) - Or you can get the tee-shirt [2] - Arjayay (talk) 09:05, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

Re-initiating INCOTM

It's been almost an year since "Indian collaboration of the month" was active. Firstly we need to restart this as soon as possible for development of India-related articles to greater heights. The members page was blanked, where many of them are inactive. This mass message is to all the members of WikiProject India, about this and interested editors interested will sign up. After this message gets delivered, we'll wait for 7 days before we start a discussion under a thread on the collaboration's talk page, among the members. The discussion will include what to clean-up of sub-pages, a new set of guidelines for smooth and uninterrupted functioning of the collaboration etc. Please keep all the discussions under this thread only, so that it will easier for future reference. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 00:19, 23 March 2017 (UTC)

Re-initiating INCOTM

It's been almost an year since "Indian collaboration of the month" was active. Firstly we need to restart this as soon as possible for development of India-related articles to greater heights. The members page was blanked, where many of them are inactive. This mass message is to all the members of WikiProject India, about this and interested editors interested will sign up. After this message gets delivered, we'll wait for 7 days before we start a discussion under a thread on the collaboration's talk page, among the members. The discussion will include what to clean-up of sub-pages, a new set of guidelines for smooth and uninterrupted functioning of the collaboration etc. Please keep all the discussions under this thread only, so that it will easier for future reference. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 00:19, 23 March 2017 (UTC)

Invitation to join the Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Incubator/Indian military history

You are invited to join the Indian military history work-group, an initiative of the Military history WikiProject. This group is to exclusively deal with the topics related to Indian military. If you're interested, please add you name to the participants list. Ignore if you are already a member. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:06, 23 March 2017 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Indian defence services

You are requested to participate in the discussion of Wiki Loves Indian defence services on the talk page of WikiProject India. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 04:44, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

Vishwakarma isn't common in South India

In South India Vishwabrahmin is the most common name for Vishwakarma Descendants... And It's not just a community of 5 craft works.. it's also a community of Priests.... and there are many Notables not Just Veerabrahmedra swamy.. u have reverted all those edits.. You could have simply reverted the page name — Preceding unsigned comment added by Santhoshlee1 (talk • contribs) 09:49, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

You were acting contrary to WP:LEAD, WP:RS, WP:NPOV, WP:CIRCULAR, WP:RM and other policies and guidelines. Take it to the talk page, please. - Sitush (talk) 11:15, 30 March 2017 (UTC). I.

Ihave a question to sitush on veerabrhamendra Swamy page I had changed the information correctly why did you edit it sitush. The page had mentioned that paripurnacharyas wife is prakrutamba ok that's true it's acceptable and even veerabhojacharyas wife was also prakrutamba (originally it was Veerapapamamba) sitush you even deleted this right information. Can you give justification for this. So you want to make paripurnacharyas wife and veerabhojacharyas wife both as prakrutamba. So what's your justification for this . Can you and will you give this as in appropriate information. The book can't be taken as a proof and then who was Veerabrhamendra Swamy (from where did you take the information may be not from book) just from some imagination right. And even the information of Vishwakarma . Vishwakarma refer themselves as the Vishwabrahmin so who is Vishwakarma. Did you take it from puranas or court readings because it's inappropriate and we should delete the information. Please provide proper information as you have only said it's primary information. So how are you keeping the page sir delete the page itself. . Provide the information from WP:RS as you have mentioned sir.

Needs rewriting

Hi. Thanks for all the help. These days I am little inactive. Help is needed in rewriting the Aricle Yogi Adityanath , where few editors donot allow smallest changes by other editors, thus defeating the very purpose of wikipedia. Also,I feel the article is written in violation of BLP. Can you kindly look into? Regards. Rayabhari (talk) 05:34, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

Hi Rayabhari, good to see you are not completely inactive. Like you, I'm not doing much at the moment but I will see if I can spare some time and gain some interest. - Sitush (talk) 11:16, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. I am much engaged in real life activities. :) Rayabhari (talk) 17:17, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) Happy to have you look in, Sitush, as always; but you should probably know that what happened here was the usual surge of fandrones objecting to language taken from RS, which necessitated EC protection on two occasions (and I think the article is still EC protected for this reason). Vanamonde (talk) 17:36, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

I've noticed. I'm not going to be around long enough to get involved anyway. Already fed up of the place. - Sitush (talk) 17:37, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for keeping watch over those darned Indian castes and subcastes. RileyBugz (p)^Yell | _Edits 17:32, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, although I am probably only back for the day. We need more experienced eyes - the core group is probably no more than 10 people, many of whom are absent for long periods. - Sitush (talk) 17:34, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

After I get back from my vacation I plan to put more than just Jangid on my watchlist. RileyBugz (p)^Yell | _Edits 17:37, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

That's good news. Although you may find yourself wanting to take more frequent vacations thereafter. - Sitush (talk) 17:41, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Raj sources

I have mentioned you in the correct venue. Muvendar (talk) 19:23, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Update: Muvendar has been banhammered due to using another account under his wing. SportsLair (talk) 22:23, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Plus ca change, plus ca meme chose. - Sitush (talk) 23:33, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Sakaldwipiya

Hello. Ref to your revert Will not use Yagnavalkya Smriti the primary source. Instead of that, is this source acceptable -- "Kamal+Shankar+Srivastava"&dq=inauthor:"Kamal+Shankar+Srivastava"&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiAiaHs6P7SAhXLPo8KHdm_CroQ6AEILDAE Origin and development of class and caste in India (1998), by Kamal Shankar Srivastava.

It states what the Yagnavalkya Smriti states. The content is also available from this cached link As foreigners like Scythian, Kushanas and Hunas were getting Indianised they needed priests. So the author Srivastava says in the context of Manu law giver:

"The people engaged in priestly duties with the invaders were incorporated as Vratya or low grade Brahmanas. Magas were one such people about whom we have already discussed. But, Magas gradually improved their position in the society as Brhatsamhita represents them as respectable Brahmanas. At a later date, they are even met with conducting matrimonial alliance with the native peoples. Indian rulers patronised them as astrologers and physicians. The traces of the Magas in Indian society are still visible. As Sevaka or Bhojaka in Jodhpur region, Pandas round about Delhi and Agra calls themselves as Sakadvipe and worship the Surya image...The Srimali Brahmanas are associated with the Kushinas. Gandhara Brahmanas of Mlecchavamsa acted as priests to the Mihiresvar — 54 temple, founded by Mihirakula the Huna ruler. The largest number of foreigners probably joined the Kshatriya fold as it suited most to their profession. The Manumriti, the Vayu Purana, the Epics and the Vishnu Purana, all report them in like manner"

If the above is acceptable, you can help add content from above to the article in your words. The only difference from above is the YagnaValkya Smriti is more direct in saying the devalaka (devalakan) are born to bhojaka mothers and brahmana fathers; while the bhojakas themselves are born to brahmana fathers and pushpa-sekhara mothers; but are neither anuloma nor pratiloma and to be considered true brahmanas though vratya.--Anon=us (talk) 18:26, 30 March 2017 (UTC)anon=us

To be honest, I don't know. I can't see the source here. Pinging @Kautilya3 and Utcursch: just on the off-chance that they can. - Sitush (talk) 23:32, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, can't view the source either. Seems like a decent source, though. utcursch | talk 23:55, 30 March 2017 (UTC)

I can see the page, and the paragraph above seems to be an accurate rendering. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 00:12, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

Thank you. I shall work on the Sakaldwipiya article later. Was hoping to find historical links between the Sakaldwipiya vratyas who became shudras on account of taking to the sword and yet fully involved in ritualism in southern india. Unfortunately there are none. Anyways, will work with whatever sources are available or acceptable. This article needs sprucing anyways. Thanks. --Anon=us (talk) 00:51, 31 March 2017 (UTC)anon=us

Korakkar

I reverted your edits to Korakkar . I admit that I don't know what has been going on with the editing history, or what you are referring to when you reverted because of socking. Removal of all sources completely seems a bit much though. --Ronz (talk) 16:04, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

@Ronz: Not when the sources are crap and/or when the contributor is known to misrepresent them. I've more or less undone your revert, leaving a couple of sources for the basic points. You'll see why from my edit summaries. - Sitush (talk) 16:27, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. I was going over the sources, and the one that you left was the only one I thought should be kept. Has the socking been taken care of? --Ronz (talk) 16:34, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

Yes. Muvendar (talk · contribs) and Jameskane82 (talk · contribs) were blocked. - Sitush (talk) 16:38, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

Removal of ref

What does it mean? --AntanO 12:16, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

If you click on the link in my edit summary it takes you to User:Sitush/Common#Gyan, which summarises the consensus of the Wikipedia community regarding use of books published by Gyan Publishing. Basically, that company is known to produce books that, in various ways, are not acceptable as sources. And it does so on a scale that means we pretty much avoid using them entirely. There appears to be another source cited for the point anyway, so removal in this specific case doesn't create a problem. - Sitush (talk) 13:23, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Balija / Gavara

Hello. Ref to your revert. Are you saying this source of Subrahmanyam and Shulman is unacceptable? The source (p.74) says --- "These left-Sudra groups — often referred to by the cover-title 'Balija', but also including Boyas, left-hand Gollas, Gavaras, and others — were first mobilized politically by Krishnadevaraya in the Vijayanagara heyday" --- which obviously means the Gavaras became part of the Balija social group, is it not? Can you explain your revert? How is it possible to say all Balijas in Tamilnadu are from Gavara group? That is factually wrong. Please ask Rajakambalar Balija if they marry Gavara Balija. Obviously no.

FYI, the separate Gavara caste group exists till date; besides being part of other groups, one of which is Komati social group. Neither of these marry the other. Example, The Gavara-Komati (vegetarian) do not marry Gavara-Balija (meat eaters). In Tamilnadu, the majority Gavara are Gavara-Komati (like Vummidi Bangaru Chetty). Also, FYI, more than half, if not the whole, of Thirupati town is Balija (for majority of them Thirumala Srinivasa is their Kuladev), but none of those balijas are Gavara. Similarly, if you went to rajmundry, you will not meet one gavara-balija there. When something is documented as a "left-hand sudra group" gathering within their fold fighters mobilized from other castes, how are you going to say the source is unacceptable, considering these are documented by historians of repute?--Anon=us (talk) 23:34, 31 March 2017 (UTC)anon=us

BTW, every Kamma (whether andhra, karnataka or tamilnadu) knows the above. Therefore it is not possible to believe the pretensions of Madurai_nayak_vamsa with his pattern of edits. Such people are obviously not Kamma at all, but intent on something else (something which has been going on for quite long now). Hope you and Kautilya3 take that into consideration when changing content or reverting certain articles; because it seems Kautilya3 wrote balijas in tamilnadu are called kavara. His sources are not wrong. But they refer only to the Gavara-Balija subcaste; not to the whole balija social group. Thanks. --Anon=us (talk) 23:56, 31 March 2017 (UTC)anon=us

Yes, I think the Tamilians called them Kavarai just because it was a term they were used to. It doesn't mean that these people were Gavaras.

The Gavaras are quite a mysterious group. But they are a very small group, concentrated in the northeast of Andhra Pradesh. We shouldn't make them appear more prominent than they really are.

Anon=us had previously asked me for help in reviewing his content. I didn't have time, and I still don't. This small, marginal group shouldn't waste too much energey on our part. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 10:56, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

@Kautilya3: If you acknowledge so, can I put your one sentence from the intro into branches? Because there is a branch of Gavara-Balija in Tamilnadu. They are considered a subcaste of Balija; and marry within themselves (and not with other Balija sub-castes). It is like Vadama do not marry Vathima. Thanks.--Anon=us (talk) 11:39, 1 April 2017 (UTC)anon=us

My point was that just because a community bears the same name as one in another area does not mean the two are the same. Unless we have a source that says they are the same. There are definitely examples of completely different groups that use the same name. It looks like Kautilya3 agrees with me. - Sitush (talk) 11:46, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Then why do you both insist on having it in the intro? @Kautilya3: the Gavaras are not a mysterious group. The small group you mention in AP is the remnant which did not urbanize. The ones which moved into other social groups are well documented, including Gavara-Komatis (they are a fairly wealthy community in tamilnadu). There are enough sources on Gavara-Balijas and on Gavara-Komatis. Also, there is no need for tamilians to get used to a term like Kavarai (for what reason should they?) Again, would you say all Bengali Kayasthas in Bihar are Mathurs? Hope you get the difference. Either I can revert Sitush's change or you can revert it. Let me know. Thanks

This needs to be in the lead. The Balijas were a significant presence in Tamilnadu to the extent of ruling vast portions of it for almost a hundred years. But they were called by a different name. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 12:35, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

How do you know they were called by a different name?--Anon=us (talk) 12:42, 1 April 2017 (UTC)anon=us

your sources

(1) Mukund says merchant communities like Kavarai are mentioned in inscriptions after fifteenth century. Then writes in brackets (Kavarai is the Tamil word for Balija). His should be considered Primary Source. He gives no reference for his claim.
(2) Francis says "The Kavarai and the Balija are equivalent and occupied low positions" - did he say Balijas in Tamilnadu are called Gavara?

Many sources mention Gavara and Balijas as separate communities, including Sanjay Subrahmanyam. Yet, you both are insisting on something that is factually incorrect. Why?

Are you saying Balija subcastes like Gollas, Gajulus, Mahendravaram, Kambalar are ALL called Gavara in Tamilnadu? Sorry, you are wrong. --Anon=us (talk) 12:57, 1 April 2017 (UTC)anon=us

I am becoming very confused regarding what it is you are objecting to. If various reliable sources say different things then we show them all. However, if a source is ambiguous or does not make a direct connection then it would be misleading to show it. I've not looked at Mukund for years but if that source is reliable and secondary then the comment is fine for inclusion. - Sitush (talk) 13:19, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

BTW, you probably should have raised this at the relevant article talk page, not here. - Sitush (talk) 13:20, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

If you are confused, perhaps you can stay out of this. Since you reverted, it is on your talk page. You could copy-paste this to the article talk page, to move this discussion there. The person who put in the sentence should explain his sources and take the call. Hence pinging Kautilya3 @Kautilya3: -- please take the call. You cannot say Balija subcastes like Gollas, Gajulus, Mahendravaram, Kambalar are ALL called Gavara in Tamilnadu. Delete it or revert it to branches.--Anon=us (talk) 13:32, 1 April 2017 (UTC)Mayasutra

Now you are being rude. You brought the bloody thing here; you got me involved in it. Go away. - Sitush (talk) 13:34, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

???? You said you are confused. Hence, suggested something. If not acceptable, that's fine. Why are you being rude? What do you mean Go away??? --Anon=us (talk) 13:39, 1 April 2017 (UTC)anon=us

I mean take it somewhere else and don't post about it here again. - Sitush (talk) 13:42, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Alright. Am taking it to Kautilya's page. Hope you will not revert again after he takes the call. Friendly suggestion for a brother - if you have not looked at mukund source for years, please do not suggest anything. When i say this, am not being rude. Please. Cheers bro, Thanks.--Anon=us (talk) 13:47, 1 April 2017 (UTC)anon=us

Please see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard#Talk:Balija.23Kavarai

--Anon=us (talk) 07:42, 2 April 2017 (UTC)anon=us

regarding Vishwakarma page

I have added the reliable sources which are documented and proofed not by adding some sort of my own imagination or others imagination. The sources are from texts from Hindu dharamagranthas (holy books of Hinduism) and the judgement given by courts nor the information provided is a imagination or unwanted phraces or sentences Ajeyarudra (talk) 10:30, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

regarding Vishwakarma page

The sources are not only reliable but also given consent. As proof by the previous honorable courts of India. And I think nothing stands above the judgement given by courts. And judgement. Am I correct sir. Ajeyarudra (talk) 10:35, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

regarding K. C. Yadav page

Necessary changes have been made regarding the page on Dr. K. C. Yadav to be without biases and with reliable citations. Please review the page for discrepancies. I apologize for the previous mistakes as I am still learning. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K._C._Yadav#cite_note-4 User:Rishika Yadav - comment added 18:49, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

Hello, from a DR/N volunteer

This is a friendly reminder to involved parties that there is a current Dispute Resolution Noticeboard case still awaiting comments and replies. If this dispute has been resolved to the satisfaction of the filing editor and all involved parties, please take a moment to add a note about this at the discussion so that a volunteer may close the case as "Resolved". If the dispute is still ongoing, please add your input. Yashovardhan (talk) 03:45, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

• Additional comment : this is regarding the thread Talk:Balija#Kavarai. Your reply is being awaited.

I have already replied. Since I don't have an understanding of what the problem may be, I can't comment further. I literally cannot make sense of it. - Sitush (talk) 09:28, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

@Yashovardhan Dhanania: - see my reply above. - Sitush (talk) 09:30, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. I'll consider this as a sign that you wish to withdraw from this DRN. No problem! It would've been better had you written this at the DRN but I'll mention this and continue with the discussion. Regards, Yashovardhan (talk) 09:37, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

regarding Vishwakarma page

The upagotra taken from Vishwakarma puranas Sanskrit written by suktha and Vishwabrahmama kulohtsaha and the additional information provided are the judgement of courts and letter of affirmation given by holy monetary. And adding up the reliable information to the page is a must and the ones to object the reliable information can lodge an issue on our community in honour of judgements given by consent. And the page needs right information give with proofs not a imagination. As I can see I have not depleted any added information. Ajeyarudra veerabhogavasantaraya. (From vss group leader of South India.) Please if you have any issues on the subject please feel free to share the issue sir. Ajeyarudra (talk) 10:48, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

Hi, puranas and court rulings are usually not acceptable as sources on Wikipedia. They are primary documents. - Sitush (talk) 10:58, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

so sir what proofs do you need sir to legaly proove the statements — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ajeyarudra (talk • contribs) 17:05, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

Anything that complies with the guidance given at WP:RS. However, since you seem to be associated with VSS, you probably should not be editing the article at all and should instead make proposals for changes at its talk page. See WP:COI for our attitude to conflicts of interest. - Sitush (talk) 09:57, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

regarding Vishwakarma info edit

Sir do you work for Wikipedia. Ajeyarudra (talk) 11:47, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

No, and nor does anyone else. The Wikimedia Foundation employs people in various roles (technical, legal etc) but contributors to this Wikipedia project (and to others) are all volunteers. - Sitush (talk) 11:48, 3 April 2017 (UTC)e

Ezhava

Dear Sitush, in ezhava, I have been editing the legend part of the Origin of ezhavas and it is to be considered as legends only. It is not biased on unidirectional and I have cited sources to substantiate it. I would soon add historical aspect of it with absolute quotes from Texts. --Challiyan (talk) 14:00, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

So do it using modern sources. Raj sources are useless for this, as I said on your talk page. They often misidentified people and they were misguided by biassed Brahmin advisers etc. We don't use them, period. - Sitush (talk) 14:04, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

I am sorry. but I dont' get how wikipedia should be edited. My knowledge in english is limited and I may not be able to entirely rewrite a sentence i read. I was thinking that I was doing a reasonably good job on where there has been no adequate information available for online references. . Thanks --Challiyan (talk) 15:43, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

I understand the difficulties but if you are uncomfortable with writing in English then there are Wikipedia projects in many other languages, including Tamil, Malayalam etc. You can't just copy stuff into Wikipedia from elsewhere because there are legal issues. - Sitush (talk) 18:22, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

SPI input

Hi Sitush, would you have any comments for this SPI case? -- Kautilya3 (talk) 22:28, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

Bahun

Why did you remove sourced content?? Why don't you just delete the article ?? There are no more sources in Google now I can collect. Airkeeper (talk) 01:41, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

The way in which you cited those sources led me to believe that you may have copied the material from some other article. In addition, we do not usually bother with lists of surnames in caste-related articles. - Sitush (talk) 07:18, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

You appear to be misrepresenting sources across a variety of articles anyway. The latest example I've just noticed is using this to support the statement Khas Thapas are Aryan Chhetri people of Kshatriya varna whose origin lies in Karnali region of Khas Kingdom. They were powerful and prominent family at Jumla of Karnali Khas Kingdom at Bagale Thapa. - Sitush (talk) 07:34, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, that was casual at Bagale Thapa. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Airkeeper (talk • contribs) 10:15, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Right Information

Sir I have added detailed information , if u really think that I'm adding inappropriate or useless information than please read the history of Rajputs again and if u really think I'm wrong than you have all right the right to block me infinitely and please don't try to black mail me I'm a Chalukya Solanki Rajput . I'm from a lineage that defeated Kings like Ghori and Ghaznavi . Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 11:57, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

And I come from a lineage well-known for their skill at conkers. Honestly, if your stuff is reliably sourced and complies, if appropriate, with WP:BLP then there is no problem. The difficulty has been that it wasn't. And I suspect it still isn't. - Sitush (talk) 12:06, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Ezhava

Regarding my Ezhava edits, you are warning me of blocking me without proper reason. You have reverted a sourced content from Edgar thurston and an image from 1906, while similar images are shown in many other articles. I would be thankful if you point out the policies that govern your reasoning behind warning me and reverting my last edits. thank you. --Challiyan (talk) 07:12, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

You have been told that Raj sources should be avoided. - Sitush (talk) 07:18, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Dear Sitush, Its not a Raj Sources. At least Edgar Thurston who wrote the text book. wasnt a raja. (hope you had checked the sources cited along with the content) And what about the image? is that also a raja related content? --Challiyan (talk) 07:27, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

British Raj, not Rajah - Sitush (talk) 07:31, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Can you show me the policies that says British Raj references should not be quoted in an ethnographic article like Ezhavas ? --Challiyan (talk) 12:47, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Umerkot is a Jagir not a princely state

http://www.indianrajputs.com/view/amarkot http://www.royalfamilyofindia.com/amarkot/ http://www.chiefacoins.com/Database/Countries/Umerkot.htm Umerkot is Jagir not a princely state sir and if you don't know the difference between a Jagir and princely state than please read about it ; Umerkot was a princely state (riyasat/rajya) once but it lost it's independence to Jaisalmer princely state somewhere around in 1700s and it was made a Jagir with some autonomy by Maharaval of Jaisalmer and it remained as a Jagir in Jaisalmer province till independence of India Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 12:13, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

I have no idea if it was or was not. I merely reverted your unsourced addition. I doubt that the sources you give above would suffice but I'll look into it. - Sitush (talk) 13:53, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Few books seem to mention it at all, whether as Umerkot, Umarkot or Amarkot. Does this help? I really don't care, so long as whatever you add is reliably sourced. - Sitush (talk) 14:02, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Hello Sitush

I forget the name of that 17th Century chap (Irish land deal shenanegans, sharp practice, arguably his dad's fault) whose article I had a little go at helping with, a considerable number of moons ago..whatever became of it? Did it achieve G.A? Regards, Simon. Irondome (talk) 14:59, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, I did mean to tell you. Erasmus Smith and, yes, it sailed through. - Sitush (talk) 15:04, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Oh good! Can I put one of those "assisted with" thingys on "my" page? Just indicates that I am not a complete loafer. Vanity, vanity..Simon Irondome (talk) 15:15, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Sure you can. That's why I meant to drop you a line. - Sitush (talk) 15:32, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Appreciated Sitush, and great to work with you, albeit briefly! Regards, Irondome (talk) 15:36, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Sanction

I am quite confused by your constant editing of articles and deleting sources by simply mentioning Raj era. Kindly assist me how can I put you on edit watch as seems like you have personal grudges against any research work done in that era which makes you quite biased. Kindly do not take anything personal and lets have a constructive talk mate.

Your recent editing history shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. To resolve the content dispute, please do not revert or change the edits of others when you are reverted. Instead of reverting, please use the talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. The best practice at this stage is to discuss, not edit-war. See BRD for how this is done. If discussions reach an impasse, you can then post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection.

Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rajarule (talk • contribs) 15:09, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

The conversation was already happening on your talk page. And yet still you reverted again. You're the problem, not me. - Sitush (talk) 15:35, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Dear, I already mentioned that I’m not as experienced on Wiki tools as it seems you are. Accept my apologies but I found it quite disturbing when you tag any of the book published before 1947 as Raj source. Plus you haven’t answered my concerns. It did not leave me with any option but to request for arbitration. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rajarule (talk • contribs) 15:58, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Dear Sitush I am requesting for dispute resolution. I am trying to find refrences after 1947 as per your advice. Please help me restore the article in original form.

Kulala

How can I add previous contents as like itwas before.will the page get deleted in few days ? Or ll it remain same with small information as now? Bunt56 (talk) 16:02, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Hi, I suspect that it will eventually be proposed for deletion unless you or someone else can find sources that are reliable. - Sitush (talk) 16:17, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Bal Bahadur KC

Please change the name to Bal Bahadur KC or Bal Bahadur Khatri Chhetri because there are many Bal Bahadurs like Minister Bal Bahadur Rai. K.C. was his official surname which is alternatively used as Khatri Chhetri in Nepal Government purposes. Locally, people also search KC and Khatri Chhetri alternatively. Airkeeper (talk) 12:20, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Ah, my mistake - I assumed it was a post-nominal. But what is he commonly called? See WP:COMMONNAME. We have disambiguation pages that handle situations where several people bear the same name. - Sitush (talk) 12:24, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

He is commonly called KC and all the leaders like Arjun Narasingha KC and Chitra Bahadur KC with KC surname please change their articles to KC. Airkeeper (talk) 12:39, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

They are officially and commonly known as KC and should be changed to KC. Airkeeper (talk) 12:41, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Really? Then the article should be titled "KC". Have you read WP:COMMONNAME yet? - Sitush (talk) 12:44, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

I am copying this to Talk:Bal Bahadur for further input. Best to continue the discussion there. - Sitush (talk) 12:49, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Hi. Same here, please stop removing KC from article titles. "KC" is a common family name in Nepal. --Soman (talk) 19:17, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Why have you delayed?? Please add back KC to Bal Bahadur, Arjun Narasingha and Chitra Bahadur. Airkeeper (talk) 10:06, 8 April 2017 (UTC)

Recheck

Can you please recheck my edits and contributions which I have made today Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 13:07, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

I will take a look tomorrow - I haven't been around much this last few days. - Sitush (talk) 20:31, 9 April 2017 (UTC)

Can we start our work on Solanki dynasty

If u r free n are ready to help me , then can we please change title of Chaulukya back to Solanki https://infogalactic.com/w/index.php?title=Solanki_dynasty&mobileaction=toggle_view_desktop Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 03:05, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

No, Kunal. You have been told that the consensus is for Chaulukya dynasty. I know that you disagree but you do not get your own way here. You will either have to accept the consensus or attempt to change it. While I doubt you will be able to change it because the discussion is so recent, if you really want to have another go then I think you will need to follow the procedure set out at WP:RM. And if that fails then you absolutely must stop pursuing the issue. - Sitush (talk) 06:52, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

Please share the above link in the discussion of move Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 07:41, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

I don't agree with it. - Sitush (talk) 07:44, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Asia_1200ad.jpg It is a map uploaded in Wikipedia , can you please see Gujarat in it , can you do me one more favor please upload this map on Chaulukya dynasty Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 18:24, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

It looks like original research to me. I know the creator says he based it on some other map but it doesn't sound great. Remember that Wikipedia is not a reliable source, nor is user-generated content. - Sitush (talk) 18:44, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

http://www.mapsofindia.com/history/ghurid-dynasty.html http://www.mapsofindia.com/history/ These maps are from India's no.1 map website , I'm thinking I'm going to win a debate war against a 10 year old wiki user , I hope I'm not irritating you and please notice the first link carefully , well the result is Rajputs never lose Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 04:32, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

Those maps appear to be copyrighted and have disclaimers saying "All efforts have been made to make this image accurate. However Compare Infobase Limited and its directors do not own any responsibility for the correctness or authencity of the same". We cannot use them on Wikipedia without getting permission from mapsofindia. And, by the way, mapsofindia are known sometimes to take content from Wikipedia, leading to circular referencing.

I've just realised that the reason you want the maps in the article is because they label a region as Solankis. Am I right? A couple of maps are unlikely to change the opinion of people regarding the name of the article. However, if you want to mention them in any discussion then there is nothing to stop you giving the links as you do above. - Sitush (talk) 07:56, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Sunalini Menon

The article Sunalini Menon has been proposed for deletion. The proposed deletion notice added to the article should explain why.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. (Heroeswithmetaphors) talk 15:52, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

Heroeswithmetaphors, Sitush didn't create this article. Did he possibly move it? That can perhaps confuse Twinkle. A user called HarikumarR created it in 2007, so they're the person you want to notify. Bishonen | talk 16:32, 12 April 2017 (UTC).

regarding change of actual and accurate information in page veerabrhamendra swmay

Ihave a question to sitush on veerabrhamendra Swamy page I had changed the information correctly why did you edit it sitush. The page had mentioned that paripurnacharyas wife is prakrutamba ok that's true it's acceptable and even veerabhojacharyas wife was also prakrutamba (originally it was Veerapapamamba) sitush you even deleted this right information. Can you give justification for this. So you want to make paripurnacharyas wife and veerabhojacharyas wife both as prakrutamba. So what's your justification for this . Can you and will you give this as in appropriate information. The book can't be taken as a proof and then who was Veerabrhamendra Swamy (from where did you take the information may be not from book) just from some imagination right. And even the information of Vishwakarma . Vishwakarma refer themselves as the Vishwabrahmin so who is Vishwakarma. Did you take it from puranas or court readings because it's inappropriate and we should delete the information. Please provide proper information as you have only said it's primary information. So how are you keeping the page sir delete the page itself. . Provide the information from WP:RS as you have mentioned sir. Ajeyarudra (talk) 18:32, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

Is this the edit you are referring to? I did leave an edit summary but I am very confused with your message. - Sitush (talk) 13:53, 13 April 2017 (UTC). Yes the topic referred as both veerabhojacharyas wife is prakrutamba and even paripurnacharyas wife is prakrutamba. And don't edit the mistakes let it be like that itself. It should be a example for future generations they should think how much illiterates our ancestor people were in knowledge. Please don't edit it let it be as it is. And don't worry I will look that no one edits this page and Vishwakarma page will be done and you say the every right information I write is a point of my own view or imagination. I can atleast try to explain who knows anything (nothing )about the topic. I have made other reputed websites edited. How can I give and realize someone who doesn't know anything about the topic and has been given the higher authority and page is created on topics which he says the topic can't be edited as the information can't be taken from scriptures and court hearings (ex : offothe topic you have said is don't edit Bible and when he says that he says that edit of Bible in wikipedia can't be done by taking the actual Bible and that person doesn't know even the basic that the wiki page itself is created from information taken from Bible history and book itself. And he says dont edit it. The bible and its history cant be taken as reliable source. And he doesnt even know the topic he istalking about bible itself . And what will this kind of person be called. ) . And nor he want to make others realize the topic. No worries I will not leave you nor me nor anyone to edit the topic further. It will be as it is no edits will be done further. (I had even tried to contact wiki in mail. But I got a reply from some volunteer I have forwarded this to wiki directly with no volunteer interfrence still no reply in mail I will wait. And does even anyone take the wiki seriously no every person even a kid knows that wiki information​ is not accurate it's a joke on wiki. Who wants wiki when there are so much accurate informations available if wiki was accurate than why would other websites would be created.

Weckkrum

Hello Sitush dis is Weckkrum, Weckkrum(Vikram). Im very new to Wikipedia and would like to improve my edits to be more reliable and to maintain neutrality of the wiki pages under experienced users like u. I would like to grow under the experienced users like u and to correct my mistakes. im from Kurnool town in Andhra Pradesh. Since 8-9 months im following wiki a lot and its edits by users especially pages related to telugu articles since i hail from telugu region. So i would like to improve my knowledge under experienced users like u.Thank u Weckkrum (talk)

@Weckkrum:, have you looked at WP:V, WP:RS and WP:NPOV? I know that is a lot to understand but they're at the core of all we do. Feel free to ask if you have any questions, although I am not likely to be editing Wikipedia much over the next few days. - Sitush (talk) 13:55, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

Khandayat

I think for the article Khandayat I had given sufficient reference to provide status of Khandayats in Odisha .. But Don't know why you want to write Khandayats are cultivating caste . Your contribution to Wikipedia is incredible but here you are misusing your rights . If . How can be a state government's website provide wrong information about its people & what about all the books from several author stating status of Khandayats ??? I request you to do a little more research before writing about sensitive articles like Caste & community . Your words are insult for Khandayats . Nayak sp (talk) 16:22, 10 April 2017 (UTC)

You are a POV-pushing caste warrior who routinely misrepresents sources. I am utterly fed up of it. - Sitush (talk) 16:39, 10 April 2017 (UTC)

Will someone please block or topic ban this person? They're an absolute timesink and are continuing in the same vein today. - Sitush (talk) 11:50, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

I've applied {{pp-30-500}} protection to Khandayat. You've already alerted User:Nayak sp to the discretionary sanctions under ARBIPA. EdJohnston (talk) 18:51, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, EdJohnston. The alert was issued yesterday but they continued on their merry way today, making exactly the same edit to the article and adopting WP:IDHT on its talk page and indeed other talk pages, including their own. - Sitush (talk) 21:04, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

I've topic banned the user. Bishonen | talk 10:58, 12 April 2017 (UTC).

Thanks, Bishonen. - Sitush (talk) 13:56, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

ok sitush i am also tired about giving rightful topic who doesnt know anything about the topic

Yes the topic referred as both veerabhojacharyas wife is prakrutamba and even paripurnacharyas wife is prakrutamba. And don't edit the mistakes let it be like that itself. It should be a example for future generations they should think how much illiterates our ancestor people were in knowledge. Please don't edit it let it be as it is. And don't worry I will look that no one edits this page and Vishwakarma page will be done and you say the every right information I write is a point of my own view or imagination. I can atleast try to explain who knows anything (nothing )about the topic. I have made other reputed websites edited the rightful and correct info . How can I give and realize someone who doesn't know anything about the topic and has been given the higher authority and page is created on topics which he says the topic can't be edited as the information can't be taken from scriptures and court hearings (ex : (off the topic )you have said is don't edit Bible and when he says that he says that edit of Bible in wikipedia can't be done by taking the actual Bible and that person doesn't know even the basic that the wiki page itself is created from information taken from Bible history and book itself. And he says dont edit it. The bible and its history cant be taken as reliable source. And he doesnt even know the topic he is talking about bible page and about its content itself . And what will this kind of person be called. ) . And nor he want to make others realize the topic. No worries I will not nor me nor anyone to edit the topic on this pages further it will reamin the inforamtion that as it si now. It will be as it is no edits will be done further nor i will be edit i will respect your stand i will look into it noone changes this unaccurate and unrelaible page so dont worry there will be no communications or disputes with us further. (I had even tried to contact wiki in mail. But I got a reply from some volunteer I have forwarded this to wiki directly with no volunteer interfrence still no reply in mail I will wait. And does even anyone take the wiki seriously no every person even a kid knows that wiki information​ is not accurate it's a joke on wiki. Who wants wiki when there are so much accurate informations available if wiki was accurate than why would other websites would be created. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ajeyarudra (talk • contribs) 15:34, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

Help me, please

Which liceses are recomanded for:

• My own photos (private camera),
• Copies of the photos from my collection, and
• Transformed images?

Thanks in advance! Yahadzija (talk) 13:42, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

You can upload photographs that you have taken yourself using a CC-BY-SA license. It gets more messy for photos that you may possess but did not take - there are issues relating to copyright - and the same can apply with derived images. I am far from being knowledgeable about this sort of thing and you would get better advice from the Help desk. - Sitush (talk) 13:50, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, with best regards!Yahadzija (talk) 16:27, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

Madhesi people

Please check the relaibility of sources at Madhesi people; section :History, subsection: Some Theories. Since I couldn't see any source, I found that theory as a part of CK Raut's artificial theory for secession of Madhesh. Please also check Raj Darbhanga that contains same theory whose source is unavailable to view. Also as a part of artificial theories. Airkeeper (talk) 03:20, 16 April 2017 (UTC)

Outside my interests, sorry. - Sitush (talk) 17:15, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

Raheja

Hi Sitush, thanks for advice i have gone through COI as well as the page after reading the entire page comments and links i have write my point of view... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rmsingh2000 (talk • contribs) 17:11, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

@Rmsingh2000: you are entitled to your opinion, of course, but Wikipedia has policies and guidelines. You are expected to comply with them. Some leeway is given for new contributors and even experienced contributors make mistakes. However, if nothing else, you must try to remain neutral and if you have a strong point of view then you must support it with evidence that could be used to improve the article - see WP:RS and WP:NPOV, for starters. Furthermore, my messages on your talk page related to a possible conflict of interest situation. If you are in fact paid by Raheja or a representative of them, or you otherwise have some potential conflict then you need to declare it. Given the history on that article, you'll hopefully understand that I am extremely cynical when newly registered contributors turn up, despite the fact that we are supposed to assume good faith. - Sitush (talk) 00:14, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

YOU ARE MY SOCK

OK, so I got pinged after this edit. How is that supposed to work, Sitush? Zzuuzz, if my phone can geolocate to Georgia, can a ping for Sitush make it across the Atlantic? Drmies (talk) 00:45, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

Drmies, when someone fails at pinging they sometimes transclude a whole userpage. That's what happened here - you're in a barnstar on Sitush's user page, which was included in the message :) -- zzuuzz ^(talk) 07:05, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

Wow. God Zzuuzz, you are SMART! Drmies (talk) 18:17, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

List of Rajput

Why did you remove Varcha dada he is not a mythological diety , please read article of 'Varcha dada' his existence is proved by many localites of Kutch and historians own and and sir please stop spying on me , I can bet that no other Wikipedia user knows more about Rajput history then me and you removed every Solanki Rajput , if u want to take something personal then please contact me , don't insult my clan/dynasty . I'm adding some more information to list of rajput with source And what happened to Move of Chaulukya dynasty , I have collected slot of information in my favor and I will be soon changing the article heading Kunal Singh Solanki Nathawat (talk) 07:30, 20 April 2017 (UTC)

You are going to be topic banned soon. The conflict of interest you have is causing lots of problems. - 07:32, 20 April 2017 (UTC)

Topic banned today. Bishonen | talk 23:52, 22 April 2017 (UTC).

Ok, Bishonen. It was going to happen sometime. - Sitush (talk) 00:31, 23 April 2017 (UTC)

Ushara

Any chance you could have a quick look at this? It looks like it should be in your area of expertise. Does it mean anything? Or is it just nonsense? Don't worry if someone's deleted it by the time you get there. Thanks. GoldenRing (talk) 13:10, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

GoldenRing, the creator is pushing a silly POV across numerous articles and seems unable to comprehend V, RS etc. It is possible that Ushara is some Meena subcaste but I've never heard of it. - Sitush (talk) 13:18, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

I too tried but got none of the sources mentioning this, neither the contents given in the article are cited.--MahenSingha (Talk) 22:46, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

Also look Sattavan, one more article created by the same user for pushing same POV. The user is intended to create many such articles, whereas he has been engaged in making changes to Meena too for the same promotional purpose. All his best sources are Blogs and meenawiki created for the same purpose of caste promotion.--MahenSingha (Talk) 22:55, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

New Page Creation

Dear Sir , Please create a wikipedia page for me. NMNMX (talk) 12:26, 25 April 2017 (UTC)

Assistance

Could you look at this for me and see if you can explain what is wrong, I do not understand a user message I received. "a source cited as Kay (1966) in this edit but it is still throwing up an error because the Kay work is not in fact named." I cannot see an error, hence request for assistance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Pennine_rambler/sandbox

--Pennine rambler (talk) 16:48, 22 April 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) - Pennine rambler - you are trying to use a "harv" reference (<ref>{{harvnb|Kay|1966|p=156}}</ref>) when the citation is set out as an "sfn" reference - all other uses of Kay on that page are in sfn format as in ({{sfn|Kay|1966|p=160}}).
Please see Help:Referencing for beginners#Footnotes for an explanation of the subtle difference in the way the two citations work. - Arjayay (talk) 17:35, 22 April 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for that, I asked after getting a message from the user here --Pennine rambler (talk) 17:50, 22 April 2017 (UTC)

See User:Ucucha/HarvErrors for a tool that can assist in identifying such errors. - Sitush (talk) 00:33, 23 April 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for your advise. Rmsingh2000 (talk) 18:08, 25 April 2017 (UTC)

Category:List of Notable Brahmins

I'm not well acquainted enough with convention with regard to India, could you put this up at CfD? Alcherin (talk) 11:42, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

@Alcherin: see User:Sitush/Common#Castecats. There are links to old discussions there. - Sitush (talk) 11:44, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

Tadvi Bhil

Hi Sitush, I have made some changes on tadvi bhils but I have to change some already posted topics with reference kindly can you help me please. Tantyamama ka Bhil (talk) 02:17, 26 April 2017 (UTC)

@Tantyamama ka Bhil: I can help you with citations, no problem, but there are a couple of things you must understand first. One is that the Wikipedia community believes that sources from the British Raj era and earlier are generally not suitable for citations, so we should not usually use them. The second is that Wikipedia has a policy that articles must be neutral (just click on that blue link). This requirement for neutrality means that if we have reliable sources that say different things then we must show all of the various opinions, not replace one we do not like with one whose opinion we prefer. - Sitush (talk) 07:45, 26 April 2017 (UTC)

I have referred the changes i made to Tadvi Bhil, then what about the references I mentioned arent they valid?? I belong to this tribe and all the stuff is wrong..please guide Tantyamama ka Bhil (talk) 05:13, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

I have referred the changes i made to Tadvi Bhil, then what about the references I mentioned arent they valid?? I belong to this tribe and all the stuff is wrong..please guide Tantyamama ka Bhil (talk) 05:13, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

You can't use sources from the British Raj era, nor caste-affiliated sources. They're not considered to be reliable. - Sitush (talk) 09:08, 1 May 2017 (UTC)

Susta

Hi Sitush, can you please take a look at Susta article. Before getting blocked a sock made this edit to claim that it is currently being administered by India. Thanks. Ind akash (talk) 16:58, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

I don't get involved in much relating to Indian geography and borders etc, sorry. Perhaps ask for help at WT:INB? - Sitush (talk) 17:34, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestion. Ind akash (talk) 01:03, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

If you want...

...semi-protection here, just say the word. Vanamonde (talk) 17:37, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. All they have to do is reply in the newest section at Talk:Reservation in India, preferably in a less verbose style etc. They have been pushing a serious POV but, I think, so too has their opposite number. - Sitush (talk) 17:44, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

Took a quick look. It's a bloody mess, and I'm afraid I haven't the time or the inclination to dip my toes in there at the moment. Serious issues with scope and NPOV...even the title is a problem. Since "reservation" is, AFAIK, used to mean affirmative action only in India (and perhaps other south Asian countries; though I haven't heard the term used in the Sri Lankan context, for instance...) "reservation in India" is odd. We could say "affirmative action in India", or "caste-based reservation in India". Vanamonde (talk) 17:54, 6 May 2017 (UTC)

cross-posting

Sitush,

I probably should have pinged you as well when I posted on RegentsPark.  Lingzhi ♦ (talk) 21:53, 8 May 2017 (UTC)

@Lingzhi: whatever the outcome of this farrago, and I suppose there never is a definite outcome on Wikipedia, it has to be said that you efforts are a remarkable piece of research and writing, done with dedication and the best of intentions. So I say it. - Sitush (talk) 23:10, 8 May 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for the kind words. I really did devote a major effort to the task. I have at least 200 sources (didn't really count) on my computer at home. I converted almost all of them to text files and wrote a (very crappy, but workable) program to generate quotes on key words. I skimmed every source at least once, and read many of them in full{{snd))sometimes over and over and over again... I won't say it has no flaws. I rewrote and reorganized it many times. But I do think it covers the topic pretty well and is probably as balanced as any imperfect document generated from incomplete (and often biased) information could reasonably be.  Lingzhi ♦ (talk) 07:41, 9 May 2017 (UTC)

Regarding Talk:Chattar

Quote from revision 778778911:

I recommend that you consider formulating a section within the page that includes the previously deleted information and helps to explain its historical relevance. At the very least, take that information to an article titled British colonisation of India and the Indies or whatever, and link that here somehow.

Mentioning unreliable sources is done on many pages — so long as the unreliability of the source is clearly explained and demonstrated. If you have any useful input as to how you thought that I was supporting use of sources which are deemed unreliable, please let me know.
I don't know your life story, or what reasons you have for thinking that I was pro–Rajput or whatever, but I genuinely implore you to reconsider what seems like prejudice to me. — JamesEG (talk) 22:13, 9 May 2017 (UTC)

I have never said you are pro-Rajput. You have come up with numerous pseudo-allegations in your musings - related to similarities with Soviet revisionism, colonialist stances etc - but they're all in your head, carefully framed so it appears that you are not casting aspersions when in fact you are. I am more that weary of wikilawyers of that type.

There are inherent difficulties in proclaiming in an article that a source is unreliable and, in any event, we simply do not use unreliable sources, so it is an irrelevance. Now read WP:IDHT and please stop this nonsense. Keep it up and it becomes tendentious and I will act. - Sitush (talk)

Admin help?

Can any passing admin take care of this topic ban breach, please. The two admins who have dealt with the contributor in the past are both inactive at present. Thanks. - Sitush (talk) 13:51, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

Ponyo got there a few minutes before I did. Vanamonde (talk) 18:14, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks, both to you and Ponyo. - Sitush (talk) 18:16, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

Article on Persecution of Hindus

I just copied some references from the article on Hinduism into the article on Persecution of Hindus, but got that cite error again. Can you please fix it? Thanks in advance for the help! -Dona-Hue (talk) 22:13, 14 May 2017 (UTC)

I changed that note to a reference citing a website, but while that cite error has gone, there is a gap/space between the sources used as references. Can you remove that gap/space please? Thank you!-Dona-Hue (talk) 00:11, 15 May 2017 (UTC) Dona-Hue (talk) 00:11, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

......I tried a lot, but failed to do so!-Dona-Hue (talk) 00:13, 15 May 2017 (UTC) Dona-Hue (talk) 00:13, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

I think the problem was the <br/><br/> I removed in this edit. Those add line breaks. However, there are some other issues:

• When you copied the information, you didn't actually say which article you had copied from. Your edit summary should have been something like "copying information from Aurangzeb"
• Copying information that cites a British Raj era source is perpetuating a problem because we do not accept stuff written at that time as being reliable sources. That's why I actually removed the reference to Smith completely, although I notice there are others that need fixing by finding more recent sources to replace them.
• The references you copied were mostly using the {{sfn}} citation template. Thus, the reader now sees "Ayalon 1986, p. 271" in the list of citations but has no idea what the Ayalon source actually is because the book or article has not been added to the list in the "References" section. I can probably fix that if you tell me where you were copying from.

I think the problem you fixed by changing a note to a reference would have been because the stuff you copied used the {{efn}} template, which adds footnotes at the bottom of the article but only works if there is a {{notelist}} there, usually placed just above {{reflist}}. The copied text was quite a complex piece of citing - you're not likely to see anything more complicated while editing here! - Sitush (talk) 08:36, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

Thanks Sitush! I originally copied the references from the article on Hinduism (where Aurangzeb was mentioned).-Dona-Hue (talk) 12:09, 15 May 2017 (UTC) Dona-Hue (talk) 12:09, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

Query

Hey, I am thinking if this could be used as a solution to prevent vandals on pages of Indian monarchs (in infoboxes). What is your comment on the same? -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 18:57, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

No. I want nothing to do with importing crap from Wikidata to this project. - Sitush (talk) 18:59, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

"Crap"? I am talking about sourced content here. -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 19:04, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

Sourced to what? A lot of it ends up being circular, and the vandalism spreads from one project to two. I hope this is not some sort of mechanism to get scripts back into infoboxes. In any case, I thought there'd been some consensus recently that we didn't import stuff from Wikidata into boxes - weren't you told that in the recent RfC about scripts? Maybe I got that bit wrong but, no, I will not support that template. - Sitush (talk) 19:17, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

See sources in wikidata item for Chandragupta Maurya. The Module:WikidataIB has addressed circular referencing and it is being used on {{Infobox person/Wikidata}}. As far as consensus goes, it is actually the opposite, see Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Wikidata Phase 2. -- Pankaj Jain Capankajsmilyo (talk · contribs · count) 19:23, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

Hardly the opposite: the consensus is to modify existing infoboxes to permit Wikidata inclusion when there is no existing English Wikipedia data for a specific field in the infobo (my emphasis). I'm not supporting this idea of yours, period. It doesn't fix a thing. - Sitush (talk) 19:27, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

Oh, by the way, since infoboxes are supposed to summarise the article even more drastically than the lead section, how do we know that the imported stuff in the box is even in the article? Someone then has to monitor all that, too. It doesn't make life easier, it just creates a cross-project mess. Things are complicated enough without having that added into the mix. - Sitush (talk) 19:31, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

Wikidata is no better than Commons, which we all know is broken. The idea that we should import stuff from another user-editable project just defies common sense. I've no idea why WikiData needs Wikipedia but I sure as hell know that 'Pedia doesn't need 'Data. - Sitush (talk) 19:44, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

William Andrew Oddy

If you accept that his own website is an acceptable source (you: "these are not acceptable sources (except perhaps his own website for his own date of birth)"), then why remove it? At the very least you could have just changed it to an external link. --Usernameunique (talk) 18:34, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

And as the deletions continue, how is this site either a primary source or original research? --Usernameunique (talk) 18:37, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

This is not the place to discuss the matter. It was impossible to discern what source supported which statements anyway. I note from your own talk page that you've had some guidance about this sort of thing in the past. - Sitush (talk) 18:40, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

Edit reverted on Mahavanshi

Hi Sitush, the page you edited, it can also be linked to a list since the same problem exists on one more page too. -Jn045 (talk) 01:47, 14 May 2017 (UTC)

@Jn045: I'm not sure that I understand. I'm off to bed right now but if you could explain then maybe we could resolve it. I do recall not being happy with that generic link when I wrote it up but I couldn't think of a way round the issue. There were several East India Companies, the statement relates to all of them and the only way I could see to accomodate that was to link to the dab page. I'm not sure what the difference would be between a dab page and a list - they're fundamentally the same thing. - Sitush (talk) 01:56, 14 May 2017 (UTC)

I am really sorry for the repeated edit. I did not remember checking your previous reply. Actually linking the same with a list removes the page from a hidden category 'Pages with disambiguation links' while the same exists when a link/(s) exist on the page. -14:01, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

@Jn045: no problem. I figured it was probably unintentional. I'm quite happy for you to fix the issue in any way that seems appropriate, just so long as the target of the link doesn't go to some article about a specific EIC but rather to one that shows them all. - Sitush (talk) 15:49, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

@Sitush: Thanks for understanding. I searched for a list about the same, but unfortunately, could not find one. Let's keep the article in the present situation. In case, there are more pages requiring a list, we"ll make one. -Jn045 (talk) 17:01, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

Mail

You has some. Kafka Liz (talk) 15:55, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

You are obviously from India as evident by your name

I see you are again, as so often, from India as evident by your name.[3] Remind me why I deleted the old Clueless Complaints about Sitush Noticeboard. We need it! Bishonen | talk 21:26, 21 May 2017 (UTC).

We need something. Perhaps a topic ban in this case. They aren't showing any sign of understanding how we do things. - Sitush (talk) 23:38, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

There are of course, no people of Indian/subcontinental heritage outside of India. The 5 people sitting near me in the UK right now are clearly just pretending... Only in death does duty end (talk) 09:18, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

Update: the user in question has been CU-blocked as a sock. That works too. Bishonen | talk 10:28, 22 May 2017 (UTC).

And what were we discussing recently re: inability to spot socks? - Sitush (talk) 12:39, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

Yeah, you and I are both hopeless. This was Bbb23 on his ownsome. Bishonen | talk 13:20, 22 May 2017 (UTC).

Kennedy's mistake:Zwei Berliner

For those who don't like my local delicacy, you can always throw it down the street. Ich bin ein litterer.

OK, I have researched it, and know that the comment was innocent banter between friends- but using 'obviously' in the title and first sentence, rang warning bells as it the sort of sentence used off wiki, designed to patronise and thus denigrate the persons opinion. A better opening may have been to say- We share similar opinions-- could you remind me.... Greetings to both of you I look forward to seeing you at a wiki-meetup somewhere. ClemRutter (talk) 13:42, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

Wir sind all Berliner - or whatever identity one may prefer, for those trying to do a decent job here at Wikipedia. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 13:49, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

• Thank you, Clem, I agree I might have put it more clearly for the talkpage stalkers. Not as "We share similar opinions-- could you remind me....", though, as that wasn't what I meant, and it wouldn't have made any sense to Sitush. Did you notice I was quoting the comment I linked to? That was my purpose: to draw Sitush's attention to that comment, and its nonsense statement that Sitush is Indian. Just to amuse him, really. (He has been accused of being "obviously a Brahmin", too.) Those Berliners look delicious. Bishonen | talk 15:36, 22 May 2017 (UTC).

• Brahmin, Dalit, Muslim, Hindu, Indian, Pakistani, Rajput, Jat, Christian, Shaivite, Lingayat, Buddhist, imperialist, Nair, Ezhava, pro-BJP, pro-AAP, pro-INC ... And not to forget being one of the infamous paid associates of "Prince". The identities with which I have been associated are pretty endless and mightily contradictory. Add them all together in some sort of identity equivalent of algebra and they probably balance out. Or neutral, in Wikipedia terms. - Sitush (talk) 16:30, 22 May 2017 (UTC)

Ich bin prinsesstårta. Bishonen | talk 17:29, 22 May 2017 (UTC).

• "I'm a little stiff from polo" "I don't care where you're from- let's dance!" (trans. clay tablet, Ur) Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 10:41, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	Thanks for viewing my article and making desired corrections. Regards Yavarai (talk) 07:10, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

Robert Campbell Aitken

Please, in the future, if you're going to gut an article like that, make a note in the talk page. I was this close to making an ass of myself.  - Myk Streja (Talk to me) 23:06, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

@Myk Streja: I am not to blame for any sense in which you may have made an ass of yourself. I didn't "gut" anything; instead, I removed citations relating to a single source and left an explanation in the edit summary to that effect. - Sitush (talk) 04:45, 26 May 2017 (UTC)

@Sitush: All I intended to say was that you should have made a comment in the talk page. That last statement was meant to soften the tone. That's all.  - Myk Streja (Talk to me) 12:43, 26 May 2017 (UTC)

Why? The edit summary was self-explanatory. If we resort to the talk pages to explain every edit, a lot wouldn't get done and the talk pages would be cluttered with trivia explanations etc. Sometimes I do mention on such pages why it is I have removed sources but that is usually when people keep reinstating the same unreliable stuff time and time again, ie: it usually relates to caste warriors seeking to glorify their community - something that is subject to ArbCom sanctions etc. - Sitush (talk) 14:53, 26 May 2017 (UTC)

About revert

I had given reference in perfect format still why are u reverting that mr. Sitush ? Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 21:54, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

Like I said, just providing citations is not good enough. They're obscure, glorifying, potentially unreliable etc. Other people have raised similar concerns on your own talk page. You're going to have to go to the article talk page and raise your points in small doses, and you'll need to justify why your sources for each of those points meets our criteria.

We get a lot of "scholars" etc on caste articles who concentrate solely on their own caste etc. Almost invariably, they are not working for the good of the project but rather for the good of their vanity etc. I've no idea if you fall into that category but, even if not, you don't just get your own way here: you added stuff and were reverted on more than one occasion, and other people queried without actually reverting. You need to discuss, not keep reinstating the stuff. - Sitush (talk) 22:01, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

I have read the policy and there is no void of any asiatic sentimental issue.So will I revert that info? Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 22:02, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

No. I've already explained what you need to do. I am off to bed now and I am probably not going to be around much for a few days (because it is a public holiday weekend where I am) but I'll try to comment on the article talk page when I get a chance. - Sitush (talk) 22:05, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

I am open to discussion atleast keep my research there. If any objection come and incase it become irrelevant then deletion makes sense rite??Simply deletion means discouraging wiki user isn't it? Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 22:05, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

You are welcomed to ask justification,thanks Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 22:08, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

Shall I expect you to be there for completion of justification?? Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 07:12, 29 May 2017 (UTC)

@sitush still waiting for your response,better wind up that issue soon. Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 10:50, 29 May 2017 (UTC)

Sitush no objection received from others said now it's up to you to get clarified(Please do it soon ) Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 04:25, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Sitush no objection received from others now it's up to you to get clarified(Please do it soon ) Dr.Narasimha Prabhu (talk) 04:26, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker)Well, Sitush has surely heard you! And it's hardly of any use to repeat the same sentence over and over.See this.Cheers!Winged Blades ^Godric 17:48, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Question and Help needed: Eric Leach redirect

Hello, I am new to this and could use some advice. Someone made a lot of changes to the Eric Leach page and ultimately it was redirected. I have worked to updated accurately an older version of this page and then got the error "potentially unconstructive". Do you have some advice on how to fix this? Thank you for your time and efforts with Wiki. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thetruthtoo (talk • contribs) 06:19, 4 June 2017 (UTC)

Feedback

Hey there,

Someone recently told me to seek help from you regarding an article I'm developing in my userspace: User:Vice regent/CowVigilantism. Could you please leave some feedback? I'm particularly interested in knowing if you think it is neutral.VR _talk 01:59, 10 June 2017 (UTC)

Oversight..

Hi, in future whenever you come across such edits which grossly outs an user, you are requested to kindly shoot off a quick mail to oversight-en-wp@wikipedia.org .They are damn good in their job!Winged Blades ^Godric 11:02, 12 June 2017 (UTC)

Rajput Resistance

Hello, quick question: why did you remove this quote?

“ What nation on earth could have maintained the semblance of civilization, the spirit or the customs of their forefathers, during so many centuries of overwhelming depression, but one of such singular character as the Rajput? ... Rajasthan exhibits the sole example in the history of mankind, of a people withstanding every outrage barbarity could inflict, or human nature sustain, from a foe whose religion commands annihilation; and bent to the earth, yet rising buoyant from the pressure, and making calamity a whetstone to courage .... Not an iota of their religion or customs have they lost ... ”

Your explanation for removal was hollow. As such, I am requesting further explanation. (24.157.56.12 (talk) 18:26, 12 June 2017 (UTC))

WiR focus on Women from India: inform your friends

		Welcome to Women in Red's July 2017 worldwide online editathons.
		File:60C0074BA4FF-1 Джемма Халид.jpg "Women in dance" "Women in music" "Women from India"

(To subscribe: Women in Red/English language list and Women in Red/international list. Unsubscribe: Women in Red/Opt-out list) --Ipigott (talk) 11:51, 24 June 2017 (UTC)

Ramdasia

Sitush, there has been a lot of recent vandalism and deletion of sourced text. I have had to constantly revert to the last version by you. Can you request that the page be protected for a while. TimesGerman (talk) 18:09, 6 July 2017 (UTC)

Need your expertise, please?

I can't make heads nor tails of the article, 1941 Census of Jammu and Kashmir, and can't verify the charts based on the provided source. Would you give it a look, please? Oh, before I forget, the article creator has been indeffed so there hasn't been any interest in doing anything to improve the article. ^{Atsme📞📧} 05:31, 2 July 2017 (UTC)

Should be deleted. The 1941 census was never completed and all Raj era censuses were unreliable. Numerous other articles similar to this were disposed of via AfD. - Sitush (talk) 05:15, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Ambalavasi

Hi Sitush - hope you are well.
How much of Ambalavasi is worth saving? It seems to be based on "Description of Ambalavasis in Edgar Thurston's Book - Castes and Tribes of South India; First Published in 1909", clearly a Raj source, but I'm unclear whether the other sources are reliable and/or re-prints. Thanks - Arjayay (talk) 08:10, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

I am stripping it out now. - Sitush (talk) 05:16, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Talk:Swarna Bharat Party

Hi, it's me Joyson. I'd appreciate your review. Thanks! Liberal Humanist (talk) 08:08, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

July 2017

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on Chitpavan. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.

Please be particularly aware that Wikipedia's policy on edit warring states:

1. Edit warring is disruptive regardless of how many reverts you have made.
2. Do not edit war even if you believe you are right.

If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes; work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you engage in an edit war, you may be blocked from editing.

• Read the article talk page and think. You have a bit of history of pro-Mahar POV pushing and need to be careful here.Blueyarn (talk) 21:15, 16 July 2017 (UTC)

Waiting for your reply.Blueyarn (talk) 21:30, 16 July 2017 (UTC)

Editing tyagi

The information was s Tyagiland (talk) 02:11, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

The information was all right and don't edit my editing again in future. Tyagiland (talk) 02:12, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Wrong information of Nairs on Nair article in Wikipedia

First of all, Cyriac Pullapilly never wrote a book on Nair hierarchy and few are quoting his notes to validate the hierarchy of Nairs. The statement "... were given Kshatriya functions, but only Shudra status, Thus originated the Nairs" is ambiguous and never quote everywhere as reference to Nairs. Nairs had Ruling class, Kshatriya class and Shudra class. A cohesion of all these class happened during the formation of NSS that doesn't mean that all Nairs become Shudras. The cohesion of classes happen to unite all Nairs and strengthen the Nair community by increasing the percentage of Nair community for political and social influences. Few has taken the cohesion as a platform to picture all Nairs as Shudras. Such people should read books like Keralaolpathi, Malabar Manual etc to understand the fact that Nairs had been rulers like Samoothiri, Koyi Thampuran, Rajah etc.. These histories cannot be changed. so the statement must be removed from this page if the editor is not frustrated and stop finding inappropriate links to type caste other communities. And appreciate stop spreading wrong information though Wikipedia. Remove the wrong informations from Nair article then touch the article i wrote, i have given citation for what i wrote, you can refer. Add this information in Nair article and you can remove it from Illathu nair. Whoever wrote the Nair article is just trying to defame a whole community, they act like they have more information and records than Indian Government.

Please read WP:RS. You are now edit warring against the consensus that we do not use sources from the Raj era, as I had already said on your talk page. - Sitush (talk) 15:34, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

You are acting like a fascist, only you can edit and only your view are correct, others dont have any rights to to add any artcile. go ahead and block me. Wikipedia is appear to be the view of few set of people. Read my citation and delete if its irrelevant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aryavams (talk • contribs) 15:37, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Try blocking me in Quora as well. https://www.quora.com/How-reliable-is-Wikipedia-as-a-source-of-information-and-why/answer/Arya-Vams?prompt_topic_bio=1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aryavams (talk • contribs) 15:41, 17 July 2017 (UTC) vhttps://www.quora.com/How-reliable-is-Wikipedia-as-a-source-of-information-and-why/answer/Arya-Vams?prompt_topic_bio=1 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aryavams (talk • contribs) 15:53, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

I have read what other have written about you and content of Nair article. // Kathakali,velakali,thiruvathirakali were nair traditions, why is that there is no mention regarding them? What about the partial scythian origin of nairs?(polyandry, matrifocal family functioning and Snake mother/goddess worships were Scythic customs and further proven by genetic studies. Such large number of sources ( Sitush seems to have spent a lot of time searching them and scanning for negative POVs) ,all by British anthropologists who were treated as Avarnas(untouchables) by Nambudiris and nairs (until the rise of Syrian christians and Ezhava) seems to be a delibrate attempt to defame the community // — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aryavams (talk • contribs) 16:00, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Your Brianna Wu questions.

Just thought I should answer your questions but can't answer on that talk page, so I'll give you the answers here instead.

As for the defense fund, the article is in the first place incorrect and is misquoting the sources, because no defense fund was ever actually started, and the source isn't saying that either. The three articles used as sources for the claim, are all very clear that she was in the process of setting one up, and they go into varying degrees of specificity of how far they've gotten, but basically, all it ever got to was that she put out a call to lawyers and experts to contact her over how to do it. Nothing beyond that was ever filed and no fund was ever established.

Regarding the second part, what happened to the 11 grand, well as was pointed out by Strongjam, there have been no prosecutions so obviously no money of that would have been paid out, though it may be pertinent to point out that the only reason no prosecution was ever made, was because Wu herself declined to press charges. On a sidenote there, the sentence heavily implies that the threat in question comes from GG, something that is neither supported by the sources used, and is directly disproven by the FBI report who outright state that it's not related to GG.213.112.98.111 (talk) 17:20, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Dalit History Month

Hi. I believe that you patrol a lot of caste-related articles. FYI, I ran across a couple of new editors who were editing Nangeli and stumbled across the Dalit History Month meetup which might be worth a look into. They appear to become active once a month when they make a bunch of edits (some questionable), add a bunch of categories (many questionable), and generally suffer from POV issues. Then there are edits like this one.--Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 09:18, 5 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes, they are an absolute pain in the arse. I'd say most of their edits are questionable, not merely some, and they are clueless about categories. - Sitush (talk) 05:14, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

I'd like to post your recent edit history to r/oddlysatisfying on Reddit :) Cheers.--Cpt.a.haddock (talk) (please ping when replying) 09:16, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

I've posted a response here that you might be interested in - labeling folks a pain, questionable, and clueless doesn't seem as constructive as discussing and educating. It may feel easier for you to delete and revert in the short term, but I think we can do better. Cheers, Siko (talk) 21:38, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

@Seeeko:, parachuting a bunch of newbies to right great wrongs in a notoriously controversial topic area that is covered by two sanctions regimes strikes me as being particularly reckless and, yes, clueless. Even more so if the people co-ordinating it don't under the subject matter. You will also find that, other than dealing with the incessant flow of crap, I have my moments for which new editors thank me. I'm not alone in thinking this Dalit History Month collaboration does a lot of harm and needs to stop, believe me. It is easier to help the occasional newbie than to deal with an rapid influx of many into such a subject area. - Sitush (talk) 05:39, 18 July 2017 (UTC)

Sigh

I would let the RSN conversation die tbh. I am not sure they are capable of understanding. I have given up attempting to explain things more than 2 or 3 times on *multiple* subjects with that editor there. Only in death does duty end (talk) 15:23, 21 July 2017 (UTC)

I was just thinking the same thing, although I've not seen them around before this. Dispute resolution for a discussion at RSN is just one of the oddities. Unless someone else joins the thread, I'll do my own thing with the website when it is used as a source and take my chances. Thanks for trying. - Sitush (talk) 15:40, 21 July 2017 (UTC)

Anyone available to block?

See This and their talk page. They have literally just hours since come off a one-week block for exactly the disruptive edits that they've now repeated today. The block was for a topic ban violation - the ban still applies per the note on their talk page. - Sitush (talk) 13:15, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Please donot revert edits just randomly.

Hi, you have been reverting the edits , with some random news articles and some oyher writeups which are wrong. The Bhar Historian (talk) 06:42, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker)You are coming off a one week block and your edits are to an area from where you were specifically Tbanned.My experience says editor(s) intentionally violating a TBan usually crash-gates into longer blocks.Cheers! :)Winged Blades ^Godric 07:29, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

Harichand Thakur

The entire page have been on false facts . Sekhar Bandyopadhyay :Popular religion and social mobility : The Matua sect and the namsudras in R.K.Ray (ed) Mind Body and Society, Life and Mentality in colonial Bengal ( Calcutta) 1995

• Hitesh Ranjan Sanyal : Social Mobility in Bengal, Calcutta,1985

these two reference books do not contain anything like this . He was a man of chandal community not of Brahmin community . This is a deliberate lie being propagated by some casteist and Racist people .Wikipedia must be aware of this .

Plenty of sources available on Google Books. See especially Peter Robb's History of India. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 17:36, 15 July 2017 (UTC)

Has there been any objection in including Namassej in his community name ? These two persons are not bothered about the mythology of the community . And in general writers of Varna Hindu Samaj are very reluctant to mention the mythologies of Avarna Communities. Their religion is always occupying their subconscious mind . One person was rational .He is Dr Nihar Ranajan Ray. He never imposed anything . He never spelt the community name as Namasudra , he always wrote Namahshudra .প্রাকৃতনমঃস্বেজ (talk) 11:20, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

Discuss Nair disputed article

Dear Sitush, Would you be interested in having a discussion or talk on the ongoing dispute in Nair article. Please respond if you are willing to have an open and fair discussion. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slvarma (talk • contribs) 08:32, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

Assuming you are not a sock- or meat-puppet, there is nothing to stop you starting a discussion at Talk:Nair. It is not going to happen on my talk page and it probably would be best if you first try to familiarise yourself with the past discussions on the article talk page, especially regarding reliability of sources and issues of weight. If you have come here because of seeing something on one of the Nair-related web forums etc (eg: on Orkut) then you're most likely just going to be repeating what has already been argued unless, of course, some new source has materialised. - Sitush (talk) 14:52, 22 July 2017 (UTC)

Hi Sitush, many thanks for responding to me. I have no intension to edit the page. I have read few archived Talks of Nair page (its huge to be honest). I am a voracious reader on Wiki and I always refer Wiki for all my queries and doubts. I have few suggestions on this page, you can either consider it or discard it.

1.The page is incomplete, it’s a mix of Nair history and Nair contemporary.

2.Nair History- Polygamy, Hypergamy, Polyandry, Marumakathyam, Thalikettu Kalyanam, Mura Kalyanam, Sambandam are in the page, but all these were practiced before the British Raj in India. If you are including the prehistoric Nair customs, you should also mention about the Nair kingdoms, Feuds in Mamangham, Colachel war, Nedumkotta war with Tipu etc .

3.Nair Contemporary- Historical Nair subclasses were given in the page, but cannot find currently known subclasses like Menon, Pillai, Kurup, Kamal, Nambiar, Nayanar, Erdai, Mannadiar, Kartha etc etc. People looking for Nair details also would to know about these as well because Nairs are known by these surnames and subclass now. Even for marriages, Nairs consider these subcaste not Kiriyam, Illam etc, these subclasses no more exist.

4.Varna Distinction- In Kerala, Varna system was never followed compare to the north India. Just a vague distinction given to few castes. Nair is a highly diverse group, you must be knowing that, it has Kshatriya Subcaste and Shudra Subcaste (these classifications no more exists). Calicut Zamorin is a good example for Kshatriya subcaste, also Cheraman Perumal etc. The Shudra subcaste of Nairs are Vilakithala, Veluthedathu, Chekalla etc. Still the (Kshatriya) upper caste Nairs never marry the (Shudra) lower caste Nairs (very unfortunate), even though they carry the same Nair surname. The lower caste group has their own association or Sabha. All Nairs are generalized as Shudras because of the caste cohesion happen with the help of Mannathu Padmanabhan (who removed his title Pillai to stand unite will all class) to unite all Nairs to form a strong and secular group for political and social influence, the first name of Nair Service Society was Bharatiya Jana Sangam (Indian Worker Group) and after the strong opposition from the forward groups the name change to Nair Service Society. You can also see the emblem of NSS with a sword symbolizing the Kshatriya warrior class and a plough symbolizing the Shudra working class.

5.Diet- Nair main diet includes the general vegetarian, chicken, fish and beef. Pork is taken but not as a main diet as pork is not easily available in Kerala, mainly found in farms of Christian churches and seminaries.

Without these information, Nair page look handicapped. If you like histories, you may please refer on this, you will get more interesting information. All the rest look fine, if you can reconsider expanding the page you can use above information. If you would like discuss on any point above, please respond to me. Or you can discard it if you find it irrelevant. No worries, I will not trouble you for any discussion.

I said don't discuss it here. Also, you're going to have to find reliable sources to support your claims, otherwise you'll just be cluttering up Talk:Nair with more junk. And, like I said, much of this has been discussed there previously. - Sitush (talk) 08:30, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

I cant discuss the same in Nair page, its protected. Just ignore it. thank you for your time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slvarma (talk • contribs) 08:35, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

@Slvarma: ah, I didn't realise that, sorry. If you want to provide reliable sources for any of the above then feel free to do so here. - Sitush (talk) 08:41, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Thank you Sitush. For point 2 and 3, Wiki pages exist for Mamangham, Nedumkotta war, Zamorin of Calicut, Cheraman Perumal; a mentioning would be helpful, as readers can go detail into it on the actual pages. Same for Menon, Pillai, Kurup etc page exist for most of the subcaste. A mentioning of these subcaste in Nair page will help the reader to identify the present subcaste than the old subclasses.

For point 5, a rearrangement of the line will help, now it look the pork is the main diet, its consumed occasionally. main diet include chicken, fish and beef.

For point 4, i will provide more proof and reliable source to prove the coexistence of two varnas in Nair. The Manu smrithi says the varnas are decided by the activities and achievements in life of a person. So the Nairs were active in army as well as workmanship. Sage Vishwasmitra was born Kshatriya and become Brahmin by his way of life, same for sage Dronacharya become a Kshatriya from Brahmin by way of life. Just quoting few, i will provide you reliable information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 5.30.71.18 (talk) 09:16, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Mamankam festival is not terribly useful. We could link to it but not much more than that. I'll go through the rest later. - Sitush (talk) 09:29, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Actually, wouldn't a lot of that be better at Nair ceremonies and customs? The main article (which already lengthy) already has a link to that one. - Sitush (talk) 09:35, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

There is no mentioning of the currently followed subcaste. The historic subclasses are pointless now.Its not being used, referred or indicated. I believe without the current subcaste Nair page will not be comprehensive for most of the people who know Nairs. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slvarma (talk • contribs) 09:43, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Are they subcastes, though? Or just people using names? See Nair#Subgroups, which refers to some of them. And, by the way, we do not remove information just because it is historic. - Sitush (talk) 09:48, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

These are title given by the Kings of each kingdom and eventually turn out to be subcaste as people started classifying with the subcaste. Please do not remove the historic facts, my suggestion was to add new details as well. The current subgroup in Wikipedia are not used or referred in any context in Kerala. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slvarma (talk • contribs) 10:40, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes, I am aware that they were titles etc. But that is all a part of sanskritisation and we do not pander to people's vanity or social goals. Unless you can a reliable source that discusses this issue, it doesn't fit. (And it also means there may be problems with any articles that do cover the Nairs in relation to those titles). - Sitush (talk) 10:48, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Could you please check this document for subcaste details and in the origin you can find more details on the martial status of Nair. Varna based comparisons are baised, I need to do more researches. Varna's doesn't exist, if Nairs are Shudras and it may also mean that except Namboothiris all Hindus of Kerala are Dalits and it contradicts.

http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/679/8/08_chapter1.pdf http://shodhganga.inflibnet.ac.in/bitstream/10603/11188/8/08_chapter%202.pdf Citations are in the page.

Full details are here https://www.scribd.com/doc/248886410/A-History-of-the-Nayars-of-South-Travancore Details are taken from a History of the Nayars of South Travancore. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slvarma (talk • contribs) 11:56, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

That is a PhD thesis and is citing Raj sources. We should not use those sources directly and I'm not sure why a PhD thesis (which we do sometimes allow) trumps long-respected academics with multiple publications about South India etc to their name. That said, I will look at it when I have more time. There's a lot to read there and I already have a lot to read. What happened to the author/candidate, and have they been cited by other academics? - Sitush (talk) 12:13, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

What kind of source would be helpful? I am little confused because the history archives will be from Raj source because it happened during Raj era. Even the newer sources will take reference from Raj era. Even varna classification is pre Raj era, its a legend from Hindu scripts. The most reliable source of Kerala history and caste are found in Keralopathi by Shanhunny Menon but unfortunately its written in Malayalam and I have read it, it has legend and myths also included. Cyriac Pullapilly also taken Raj source for the comparison of Ezahava caste with other castes in Kerala.Please take you time and read the thesis. We have time to discuss much on this topic I am not bothering you now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slvarma (talk • contribs) 12:33, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, what I meant was we (Wikipedia) should avoid using the Raj sources directly. There is nothing wrong with us using modern sources that refer to them provided that the modern source is itself reliable. WP:RS has some guidance regarding what is or is not reliable. That is why I wondered whether you knew anything more about the author of the thesis.

I am spending a lot of time trying to knock the Dalit article into shape at the moment. That's what I need to concentrate on but I will definitely look at the thesis. - Sitush (talk) 13:10, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Hi Sitush, Finally I found the book to support the varna clasiification of Nair. Please find some time to read the book written by Vidya Prakash Tyagi "Marcial races of undivided India" from page 281-285, where the article Nair starts. You can find very comprehensive details on Nair and also other martial kshatriya community of India and its not a thesis. Thank you for your time.

Hi. That is actually a very notorious book on Wikipedia because it is one of the more blatant copies of our own articles, as they were at the time. It is useless, sorry. Please see User:Sitush/Common#Gyan. - Sitush (talk) 13:40, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

Koli

Reference Books on Koli Rajput

1. People of Rajasthan, Popular Prakashan 1998. 2. The Son Kolis of Bombay by Vinaja B. Puneker. 3. Molu Ram Thakur, Myths, rituals and beliefs in Himachal Pradesh 4. History of Andhra Pradesh, Chronology of Telangana and Andhra Pradesh 5. Santan Singh Negi, Madhya Himalaya ka Rajneteek Etehaas avam Sanskrit Itehas, pp.23-24 6. Adi Yug ka Etehaas, by Muni Ram Danda. 7. Dr, Rajbali Panday, Gorakhpur ka Kstriya Etehaas. 8. Hansang ka Bharat Bharman, Indian Press Prayag, Vol.I. pp.110,156,661,669. 9. History of Aurangjeb by J.N. Sarkar Vol. 5 p.8-13-39, Kolian or Koli Country. 10. Dr. B.C. Lai, Tribes of Ancient India, Pages, 90. 11. Mr. Abtson, History of Tribes and Casts of Punjab and North West Frontier provinces. 12. Heera Lal, Madhya Pradesh History, p. 65 13. Bhakdarshan ji, Garhwal ki Devangat Vibuteya. 14. Then Rajpur of Saurashtra, by Virbharda Singh, Popular Prakashan, 1994. 15. The bible of Aryan invasion- 1500-1000 AD by Prof. Uthaya Naidu. 16. Entkishan, The Himalaya Gazetter, Vo,. II, p. 277. 17. Raturi, Hari Karshan, Garhwal Ka Etehaas, p. 254. 2 18. D. N. Mazumdar, Ancient India, p.30. 19. Mazumdar. R.C. Vedic age, p. 152-54 20. Parri Ram, Garhwal- ancient and Modern, p.79. 21. Caste and Tribe in Central India. Rajneesh singh koli (talk) 07:13, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Hi, quite a few of those are not reliable sources, eg: Castes and Tribes in Central India, History of Tribes and Casts of Punjab and North West Frontier provinces and People of Rajasthan. Also, The Rajputs of Saurashtra (which is, I think, what you meant) and the book by Lai. Of the others, I've mostly never heard of them but, for example, the Uthaya Naidu book looks dodgy just on its title - The bible of the Aryan invasion suggests an old work promoting a theory that has been discredited.

Another problem with your edits at Koli people has been not actually specifying which source is being used for which statement. WP:Citing sources might be a useful read. - Sitush (talk) 07:54, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Infobox in Namasudra(Namassej)

Many pages are found with infobox and in this infobox , what I found is that there is no new information , then you should allow it. প্রাকৃতনমঃস্বেজ (talk) 04:52, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

I have explained why I am reluctant to see it in the article. Someone else also reverted your addition. I think perhaps you need to step back - you seem to be very invested in that article. - Sitush (talk) 12:37, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

O.K. Given Below is also after your edition

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aguri_(caste) , Just follow the page . 117.194.203.68 (talk) 10:49, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes there is Infobox of the page Aguri(Caste) and mythology as well. প্রাকৃতনমঃস্বেজ (talk) 11:04, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Completely irrelevant. There are infoboxes on lots of articles, and also lots of articles without them. I have explained at Talk:Namasudra why I object to introducing one there. Now please don't bother me about this here again - comment at that talk page so that other people who may have an interest can see it. Consensus at present seems to be against you. - Sitush (talk) 11:38, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Reply

I replied there--hopefully you can help. Thanks!Zigzig20s (talk) 06:10, 29 July 2017 (UTC)

RSN is on my watchlist. - Sitush (talk) 06:14, 29 July 2017 (UTC)

PUNJABI KHATRI FACTS

Bollywood They all are PUNJABI khatri's kapoor, khanna, malhotra, dhawan, chopra, bhatia, sanon,tandon( arora another branch of khatri), so sitush you can also add positive's to page , In army most generals produced by any caste, and gurugobindsingh ji said kshatriya da poot, baaman da nahi,that is shabad in gurugranthsahib,i hope that holy book seems reliable to you .Lots of reliable stuff to feed you.wikipidea is for correct information, not for misleading others.I hope you will let your ego aside — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabrug (talk • contribs) 20:58, 29 July 2017 (UTC)

You should be posting your comments on the article talk page. It would help everyone, also, if you wrote entirely in English and/or provided translations of quotations that are not in English. Please also note that religious texts such as the Granth Sahib are considered to be primary sources on Wikipedia and thus only have a very limited use both in discussions and in articles. - Sitush (talk) 01:41, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

kathi darbar

the breed is well-known but does the source mention the caste? yes it mention caste.you can verify it source is not unreliable, as colonial James tod in Mewar, James McMurdo in Kutch and Kathiawar are well-known for their authentic description of history. is it not reliable??

James Tod is definitely not reliable. I can't verify because I cannot see the source - that is why I tagged it as needing a quotation from the source. - Sitush (talk) 03:23, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

Thought you might be interested

...in this. :) CHRISSYMAD ❯❯❯¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 16:07, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. It comes as no surprise - I did suggest it a few days ago here. The Nair socks have been very active of late. - Sitush (talk) 16:09, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

Sitush It gets better... CHRISSYMAD ❯❯❯¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 16:14, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

COI

Yes i have because i have added the sources at the end of the page if you can refer to. Also, i have already reported the Conflict of interest and have also shared the edit template with the reliable source to the admin and other concerned team. Incase you still have an issue you can mail me directly and i can do the needful. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rijusikri (talk • contribs) 06:48, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

You've got mail

Hello, Sitush. Please check your email; you've got mail!
It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

Riju (talk) 06:31, 1 August 2017 (UTC) I have been repeatedly updating the content of HH Maharaja Padmanabh Singh on his instructions. I have also informed prior that i am his employee and have been doing so with his consent. Also, there is no profound language or anything wrong that has been updated. Moreover its just the basic details that we have been uploading about his achievements and his life, there is no need for your to remove that.

Request you to please DO NOT remove it again.

@Rijusikri: I have already explained this to you and, I think, so have others. See your own talk page and Talk:Padmanabh Singh, for example. No amount of edit warring by you is going to get that content into the article in its present form. Indeed, the way you are going about things is likely to earn you a block from contributing before much longer. - Sitush (talk) 06:32, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

And you've just done it again. Will some admin please intervene here? - Sitush (talk) 06:36, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Watchlisted the page. They've made some attempts at discussion, so going to just watch for now, but another revert and they are looking at a block. Vanamonde (talk) 07:34, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Some stroopwafels for you!

Basically heaven in a cookie. Enjoy. (((The Quixotic Potato))) (talk) 21:38, 7 August 2017 (UTC)

• Thanks, QP. I saw this yesterday and forgot to respond. I've actually never knowingly seen a stroopwafel - I need to get out more! - Sitush (talk) 07:53, 9 August 2017 (UTC)

On walled gardens

Responding to your comment at ANI. The walled gardens are created by threatening, blocking, and insulting the users who call out their policy violations. See my talk page for an example of what they do to an ordinary person who follows the rules and asks that the rules be followed: defamatory insults, blocks without any policy justification, non-policy excuses to ignore unblock requests, revocation of talk page access as punishment for appealing, and citing their own abuses of policy as grounds to further abuse a user.

It turns out that there is a paid PR organization linked directly to Democratic Party campaign operatives, the mattress hoax, Feminist Frequency, the transgender movement, and executives of several media companies whose reliability is not questioned on Wikipedia. They make up such a large chunk of the WMF that no one wants to deal with the problem. Not coincidentally, someone with a history of paid editing was involved in the creation of a vanity page for one of the Gamergate principals before Gamergate happened. This group has probably been responsible for all of the political fights on Wikipedia over the past several years. Remember the fight over the Frankfurt School? Some of this group's media executives graduated from the Frankfurt School. Can't have the encyclopedia say anything bad about it. And so on. 71.198.247.231 (talk) 23:17, 29 July 2017 (UTC)

The WMF, or at least a sizeable chunk of its current and recent past employees, do appear to have a socio-political agenda on Wikipedia and they engage in some dubious practises to that end, often under the guise of "education". However, I have looked at your talk page and cannot really fault the blocks, nor do wild claims of paid editing and shared educational background assist you. You may be right but without evidence ...

Further, while I am not massively familiar with all of the people who posted on your talk, I am familiar with some of them, can assure you that those people are not WMF acolytes, and indeed that some have expressed at times a rather jaundiced opinion regarding the on-wiki activities of WMF-associated people. For the avoidance of doubt, I will provide an example as evidence of my own claim about the activities of WMF associates here later today. People may disagree with it but it will contain links, diffs etc.. - Sitush (talk) 01:52, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

You say you don't see fault in my being blocked for calling for a topic ban of someone who said Wikipedia should actively keep out conservatives who read Breitbart, a Jewish news site which was wrongly slandered, and for saying that the site meets Wikipedia's RS standards. How long would someone last who says Wikipedia should keep out liberals who read the New York Times? How many Wikipedians have had their comments deleted, been called a troll, and been blocked for saying that the New York Times meets Wikipedia's RS standards? The partisan difference in standards is the problem. The taking of sides is the problem.

Most of the evidence of the PR ring is on sites that you're not allowed to link to from here and naming names would a BLP violation, but they have designed a pipeline to insert disinformation into Wikipedia by producing fake news and fake academic research and feeding it to Wikipedians who hype the "reliability" of their fringe academic and recently-sold establishment media sources. The team is full of top Clinton, Obama, Kerry, and Dean online campaign staff spread across several universities, includes several members of the WMF board or close relatives, includes a past employer of one of the core staff of Feminist Frequency, includes a member of the organization behind the university mattress hoax, includes members of the PR agency Open Society Institute which works for the Democratic Party and multiple governments, includes an executive of the Democratic Party activist group Color of Change, and so on. Take note of the contributions of one person who the offsite evidence accuses of being a member of this team. If you follow the drama boards, they have been caught repeatedly and the same group of longtime editors and admins come in to defend them and get rid of whoever was in their way. 71.198.247.231 (talk) 19:20, 9 August 2017 (UTC)

WMF involvement

Here is a start - I will be adding to it.

In 2015, there was an ANI thread regarding the dreadful unintended consequences of activity relating to "Dalit History Month", an event publicised by "Dalit History Matters Collective" at Round Table India (nothing to do with Round Table (club) or similarly-named stuff - it is an activists' website). Inter alia, that announcement mentions

we will also be hosting the first Dalit-led Wikipedia hackathon at Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT). We felt such an intervention was necessary as the status of Dalit History on Wikipedia is dismal. What little articles exist are often badly written and reflect Savarna or White supremacist cis-heteropatriarchal points of view that are presented as neutral perspectives. Our goal then is help address this gap through our historic push to raise the visibility of Dalit authored and Dalit written articles in Wikipedia as well begin to collect all of the various Dalit History articles into one easily accessible page.

It ended up as a mess, a real big mess.

Some time around the last quarter of 2016, Anasuyas and Seeko (aka Siko) began publicising their "Whose Knowledge" initiative - "a global campaign working with individuals, communities, organisations and movements worldwide to create, collect and curate knowledge from and with marginalised communities, particularly women, people of colour, LGBTQI communities, indigenous peoples and others from the global South." Anasuyas is a former Chief Grantmaking Officer of the WMF and she created and headed the Grantmaking department (now Community Engagement); Siko has been WMF Director of Community Resources and led the team of grantmakers and community organizers there (see here). The project is in part funded by the Shuttleworth Foundation, of which Anasuyas became a Fellow this year. It also seems to have funding from the WMF itself.

So to the 2017 incarnation of Dalit History Month as seen on Wikipedia. Just bear in mind that anything connected to Dalits is subject to not one but two sanctions regimes - WP:ARBIPA and WP:GS/Caste. It is not an ideal environment for new contributors.

On 20 March 2017, Siko created Wikipedia:Meetup/Dalit History Month 2017. Anasuyas began updating the page a week or so later, and then the next two contributions were sign-ups from Kaldari and Ocaasi. Zhengan began editing it in mid-April. All three of these additional contributors work for the WMF - there must've been lots of chatting going on around the water-cooler! The page says the projects were being organised by Equality Labs with support from Whose Knowledge. Despite the issues raised in 2015, there was no identified co-ordinator, nor was the India WikiProject informed. Apparently, the WMF are not involved in the "campaign" (Ocaasi) - could have fooled me.

Problems soon emerged - the same old problems, in fact. I didn't spot them for a while because I was pretty much absent from Wikipedia at the time. I think my first realisation of it came in this thread.

Categorising

• It may have been coincidence that one inexperienced user returned in April after a long break and concentrated heavily on Dalit matters in connection with Buddhism (many Dalits are Buddhist). They eventually created Category:Navayana Buddhists and populated it with many biographical articles about Dalits in violation of WP:V and/or WP:BLPCAT.
• Zhengan created Category:Dalit queer in April, which was then deleted via this discussion despite support from Anasuyas and Siko.
• Zhengan also created, more or less at the same time, Category:Dalit trans, which was deleted as a consequence of the same discussion.
• At that time, she also created Category:Dalit LGBTQIA, which survived that discussion (no consensus) but looks likely to go now. Perhaps fortunately, she did little else related to the campaign on en-WP.
• Category:Caste atrocities in India was created by a new contributor who joined in mid-March and straightaway went to thank Anasuyas. It has since been merged with a category that already existed, per this discussion. Another of their Dalit-focussed cat creations - Category:Institutional murder - was simply deleted. I don't hold out much hope for some of their other category efforts either, eg: Category:Dalit sportsperson and Category:Dalit art.
• Another Dalit-related category that is on dodgy ground, currently under discussion, is Category:Bahujan. You'll find Siko, Kaldari and Ocaasi involved there and none of them show any understanding of the issues in relation to Wikipedia or, indeed, what the thing is used for in the real world. That cat was created by another account registered in March, seemingly because of DHM..

One thing that seems not to have been understood is that we do not categorise people by caste anyway - see User:Sitush/Common#Castecats. A particularly stunning contribution in this regard is that of Ocaasi, who seems to want to run a steamroller through long-established consensus just to ensure that a great wrong is righted.

Of course, WP:BLPCAT was ignored also: the categories mentioned above have been applied to articles even where the Dalit status was unsourced, let alone not self-identified. And overcategorisation was rife, eg: here.

BLPs

• Before dealing with BLP issues other than the aforementioned BLPCAT, I'll just mention Kaldari's affront to an entire community - it wasn't sourced and was plain wrong, and their comments in the Bahujan cat discussion mentioned above suggest that they still do not understand the terminology. That sort of thing has been known to cause riots in India.

• Try this for size in an article created by one of the recruitees. Or Ocaasi's oversentimentalised guff at an article where they clearly do not understand numerous WP guidelines, such as WP:OVERCITE and WP:LEAD.

Copyvio

• Examples: [4], [5], [6]. These problems, like many of the others, have continued after DHM ended but the lesson should have been imparted at the time.

General

• Two or three months on, early recruitees were still doing things like this and this.
• Eshwari Bai developed a huge number of problems from April, caused by one of the recruitees. Eg: they had added some info that I had to remove as not in the source that they provided.
• Articles such as Death of Merit have been created but their notability is dubious.

Responsibility

It is no-one's responsibility, apparently. It's operated by a collective, has no co-ordinator (unlike most large-ish collaborations and school projects etc) and is all about "education". Apparently, if we adhere to policies etc, one WMF staffer thinks we are reinforcing the caste structure. All of this can be found at Wikipedia talk:Meetup/Dalit History Month 2017, along with a comment from a full-on WMF account, ie: acting in an official capacity. - Sitush (talk) 05:59, 30 July 2017 (UTC)