Draft talk:QC Terme

Autumn 2024 Educational Project Page

This page is part of an Educational Project by students of LIUC, Italy, with a course page at: [1]https://outreachdashboard.wmflabs.org/courses/LIUC_-_Universit%C3%A0_Cattaneo/Digital_Technology_(October_-_December,_2024) . The users of the group are new to the Wikipedia platform, have completed mandatory Training for Students, and are learning to edit following Wikipedia rules. They are open to any advice on improvements of the page in conformity to Wikipedia requirements and guidelines, and any help useful for the enhancement of the page will be gladly accepted. The student Usernames are:

• LIUCGaia03
• LiucMichela3
• LIUCstefano03
• LIUCSouad03
• LIUCLorenzo10
• LIUCFederico3
• DataExplorer4

Issues or questions can be referred direct to the users or to their tutor @Limelightangel

Limelightangel Limelightangel (talk) 14:06, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Feedback on draft 1/11/24

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4:

• note and use the guidelines and good practice on lead sections and look at good practice on other pages. See: Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section. See also Wikipedia:Writing_better_articles#Lead_section.
• note the guidelines on style. Statements using words like 'leading', 'success of' and 'fascinating' are inappropriate, subjective, biased and unsourced. See: Wikipedia:Manual of Style
• referencing: the reference for Maddalena, Roberta (2022-11-15) has been inserted incorrectly in the wrong place. It needs moving/creating where you wish the reference number to appear in the article, not below the References footer. See: Wikipedia:referencing for beginners
• grammar error in first sentence of History
• style: avoid unnecessary words like: 'In fact' (it should all be facts); 'draws inspiration'; 'crucial role'; etc. See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Vocabulary
• Needs an Infobox: find a relevant Infobox template from Wikipedia:List of infoboxes and , and use this templare correctly, or find a similar page with a relevant Infobox, and use this. Note that these are templates with rules on how they are used and for acceptable field content/format
• missing sources: paragraphs 2 and 3 in History
• Note the guidance on this type of topic at: Wikipedia:Why can't I advertise my company or product on Wikipedia?
• ref. 2 (the company website) is not normally an acceptable source but relevant as an External link. See: Wikipedia:External links
• note the addition of ref. 1, which has been reused using the 'named reference' tool in the toolcar to create a refname tag to permit reuse of the same source with only 1 final reference for it. See: Help:Referencing_for_beginners

Limelightangel (talk) 13:44, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

I've tried to correct my errors. Now I think that the reference for Maddalena, Roberta... is placed in the right section. In addition I've corrected the grammar error in the first line of history paragraph and I've added the source of the other 2 paragraphs of history. LIUCSouad03 (talk) 17:29, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

note guidelines on Talk pages:

• • they are not to state what has been done, which is available in the Page History
  • avoid the personal tense
  • see Wikipedia:talk

Limelightangel (talk) 21:19, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

• ref.3 is incorrect
• the External link is formated incorrectly. See Wikipedia:External links and how it is done better on other pages
• style/grammar: not 'a luxurious chain'
• do not link out to external sites from the text - use correct referencing. See Wikipedia:linking
• repetitive/duplicate content

Limelightangel (talk) 21:17, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

Feedback on draft 12/11/24

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4:

• given the extensive issues listed here and in the earlier post it is advised to discuss & correctly 'check off' issues where they are listed when completed to manage these tasks. See Help:Talk
• the External link is formated incorrectly. See Wikipedia:External links and how it is done better on other pages
• referencing:
  • inconsistencies in reference format related to use of upper case characters
  • non-English rsources are acceptable but need to be complimented and balanced with English sources accessible to the platform's audience. See Wikipedia:Verifiability#Non-English_sources. There are acceptable english sources via Google in news and books, and in Scholar.
  • ref. 8 incorrectly displays a page URL
  • there are several incorrect in-line citations in the text on the resorts. See Help:referencing for beginners and do not link out from text to external websites
  • several sections, including whole paragraphs, have no sources
• Needs an Infobox. See Help:Infobox. Understand what the Infobox is, find a relevant Infobox template from Wikipedia:List of infoboxes, or similar pages, and probably use Template:Infobox company. Use this template correctly. Note that these are templates with rules on how they are used and for acceptable field content/format
• note and use the guidelines and good practice on lead sections and look at good practice on other pages. Much of the current lead section content is in the wrong place or promotional in style. See: Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section. See also Wikipedia:Writing_better_articles#Lead_section.
• grammar issues e.g. 'the original plan was to transport thermal water by tank, since it was too complicated they opted to use the local water supply.'; 'that ,according to the "forest bathing",give energy to the human body. '; etc.
• duplicate content e.g. number of centers, treatments, etc.
• style: remove unnecessary and vague words e.g. 'Today,'; 'more precisely '; 'However'; etc. See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Vocabulary
• topics on commercial entities. Note the guidance on this type of topic at: Wikipedia:Why can't I advertise my company or product on Wikipedia?. There are fundamental issues with addressing the policy and guidelines on this type of topic:
  • style needs to be objective, unbiased and non-promotional. Examples failing this include: 'new era'; 'offer different comforts'; 'direct access to'; 'free Wi-Fi connection'; 'host exclusive business and private events'; 'panoramic gardens'; 'as well as discounts/benefits'; 'success draws heavily from its heritage.'; 'boasts features like'; 'offering views of Manhattan's skyline and the Statue of Liberty. '; 'not more than 1km away the ski slopes'; 'immersed among majestic marble staircases and frescoes'; '144 hectares of greenery'; 'situated at the foot of Mont Blanc.'; 'immersed in a Renaissance park'; 'gives a relaxing massage. '; 'a 5-minute ferry ride from downtown Manhattan.'; 'developed in synergy with local institutions:'; 'unique mountain landscapes in the famous french ski resort.'; etc. See Manual_of_Style#Vocabulary
  • much of the tabulated information on the specific resorts is promotional and needs a critical review offactual relevance, subjectivity and acceptability, including but not limited to extensive inappropriate style e.g. 'A secret garden'; 'A purifying experience'; 'A pool with the view of the Brembana valley. '; etc.
  • as an example of more objective factual content, authorative English sources and an acceptable source on resorts, see ref. 6 and the added text to the Chamonix resort sub-section
• content: look at good pages on commercial entities for indicative sections, content and acceptable sources. For example, an objective section on Finances is appropriate, as is data on corporate structure.
• there are no See Also links. See Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Layout#"See_also"_section
• needs adding to relevant Categories. See Help:Category
• the page needs relevant and acceptable images to support the relevant section text
• there is overlinking of several terms e.g. Zen, Orangery, etc. See Help:Linking and similar. Look at good practice on other pages.

Limelightangel (talk) 15:15, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

deleted commercial phrases, corrected punctuation and grammar mistakes, fixed overlinked words and rephrased a couple paragraphs. LIUCGaia03 (talk) 12:48, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

LIUCFederico3 (talk)Added the infobox with information taken from the chamber of commerce

Suggestions for QC Terme San Pellegrino

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4:

• it's better to add some photos
• the table contains commercial/promotional contents, so we need to make it more objective by listing only the services available
• missing sources citations for the wellness services table

LIUCSouad03 19:00, 13 November 2024 (UTC)

Finances

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and LIUCSouad03:

• Content must be added to the new section created

I have added more informations in that section, let me know if you like them. @LIUCstefano03:

Tables

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4: probably it's better to replace long tables with a bullet point list of the main services provided by QC Terme, eliminating the description if it's promotional and non-objective. What to you think about it? LIUCSouad03 12:11, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

@LIUCSouad03 we started with a bullet point structure for the services provided by QC Terme in each location but it was suggested to use a table structure instead. Maybe we can keep the main services and delete the least important ones. LIUCGaia03 (talk) 12:51, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

yes, that sounds good. The most important thing is to eliminate commercial/promotional content from the description of the services provided LIUCSouad03 (talk) 20:38, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4: Many information in the tables are still promotional, such as the descriptions regarding the City Sauna and the Panoramic Spa Pool (QC Terme NY) and the part about "Bain de la contemplation" in QC Terme Prè Saint Didier. Maybe it's better to remove the part that says "panoramic view on New York's skyscrapers" as well as "views on the Mont Blanc" because they aren't objective at all. If you agree with me, I'll remove them. LIUCSouad03 18:58, 15 November 2024 (UTC)

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, and LIUCLorenzo10: Overall table created, tell me what do you think and let's work on it to make it better.LIUCFederico3 (talk) 16:55, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Just saw the overall table, I think it can work. Let's add the right information and try to delete any commercial/promotional sentence. LIUCGaia03 (talk) 16:59, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

I think the table is good,should we delete all the others? LiucMichela3 (talk) 17:22, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCLorenzo10, and LIUCSouad03: Overall table modified by adding location and eliminating empty spaces LIUCFederico3 (talk) 17:42, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

Ok i think it's good,would you mind to check if the caption of the new images are correct? LiucMichela3 (talk) 17:58, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

I'll go look and work on the caption. I do believe the table is better now, without promotional/commercial content and with a clearer structure. LIUCGaia03 (talk) 18:03, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

I agree with you. the content of the table is more and the structure is perfect, making the table easy to be read and understood. However I think that there are some words that can be removed, such as "mountain views", "peaceful atmosphere by the lake", "views of the surrounding mountains" because they seem to be still promotional. If you agree with me, I'll remove themLIUCSouad03 (talk) 21:29, 28 November 2024 (UTC)

@LIUCGaia03, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4: I've tried to adjust the infobox by adding few images ,what do you think about it?

@LIUCGaia03, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4: Hi guys,let me know if you do like the infos i've added to Bagni Vecchi and Bagni Nuovi sections

Suggestions

@LiucMichela3, @LIUCstefano03, @LIUCLorenzo10, @LIUCFederico3, @DataExplorer4 and @LIUCSouad03: I think before our next workshop we can add information in the new section that was recently created ("Finance"), I fixed a couple punctuation mistakes and formatted the tables so they all present the same structure. I think we should focus on the main wellness services provided and remove a few ones so we still follow our tutor's advice about removing the bullet points. I also think there are a few sentences we can rephrase since they're too commercial/promotional because the style must be unbiased and objective if we want it to be accepted. I agree with the previous feedbacks about adding more pictures. Do you have any suggestion about new categories/topics we can add? LIUCGaia03 (talk) 13:01, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

I have added more informations in that section, let me know if you like them. LIUCstefano03 (talk) 16:35, 21 November 2024 (UTC)

yes, I think they're good LIUCSouad03 (talk) 14:38, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Feedback on draft 22/11/24

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4:

• there are still incorrect in-line citations in the text on the resorts. See Help:referencing for beginners and do not link out from text to external websites
  • several sections, including whole paragraphs, have no sources
• note and use the guidelines and good practice on lead sections and look at good practice on other pages. Much of the current lead section content is in the wrong place or promotional in style. See: Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Lead section. See also Wikipedia:Writing_better_articles#Lead_section.
• Enrich the opening paragraph: take inspiration from other Wikipedia pages dealing with the same topic.
• Organize images appropriately and find the right balance between images and tables. Many tables are inappropriate: assess which of these can be turned into text

Greentree97 (talk) 11:17, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

I looked at other wikipedia pages that deal with the same kind of topic and I enriched the opening paragraph. LIUCGaia03 (talk) 14:21, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Probably, we should read the paragraphs again and remove promotional content, starting from reducing the list of facilities LIUCSouad03 (talk) 14:41, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

I read half of the paragraphs yesterday and they didn't seem that promotional for me, but I agree with revising again the whole page and correct mistakes in case we find them. LIUCstefano03 (talk) 15:18, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4: The paragraph Spa & wellness centers should be changed because it only lists facilities and services provided by QC Terme and this is a bit promotional. We need to make an introduction to this topic before listing and describing the locations, so we can simply provide the number of wellness centers and where they are located . LIUCSouad03 15:58, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Feedback on draft 29/11/24

@LIUCGaia03, LiucMichela3, LIUCstefano03, LIUCSouad03, LIUCLorenzo10, LIUCFederico3, and DataExplorer4:

• General Comments
  • The draft provides an extensive and detailed account of QC Terme's history, locations, and services. However, it requires significant adjustments to align with Wikipedia’s guidelines.
  • It exhibits promotional language in several sections, which undermines neutrality. Focus on presenting verifiable facts supported by reliable, independent sources.
  • The structure is informative but overly detailed in places, making the draft hard to navigate. Condense repetitive content, particularly in descriptions of wellness centers.

• Lead Section
  • The lead provides a good summary of QC Terme’s operations, but it includes excessive details better suited for body sections.
  • Remove subjective phrasing such as "renowned for" or "exceptional wellness experiences." ** Example: Replace "renowned for its thermal baths and spa facilities" with "operates thermal baths and spa facilities across various locations."

• Structure
  • Headings:
    • Consolidate sections such as "Spa & Wellness Centers" and "Wellness Hotels" under broader categories for simplicity.
    • Rename vague or overly promotional headings like "QC Spa of Wonders" to a more neutral title such as "Rebranding Initiatives."
  • Organization:
    • Present historical and financial information before diving into descriptions of individual locations.
      • Move "History" and "Finances" sections to the top of the article.
    • Ensure each section contributes unique information to avoid redundancy.

• References
  • Completeness:
    • Several references lack publication dates or sufficient details to verify reliability. For example:
      • Ref 2: Add author and access date.
      • Ref 20: Ensure accuracy and include a publisher.
  • Balance:
    • The majority of sources are Italian. Incorporate more English-language references for accessibility.
  • Reliability:
    • Avoid over-reliance on the company’s website or promotional materials. Add more independent, secondary sources.

• Style and Tone
  • Neutrality:
    • Eliminate subjective and promotional language such as "breathtaking views," "unique experiences," and "unparalleled relaxation."
    • Focus on objective descriptions of services and facilities.
  • Conciseness:
    • Avoid excessive details about individual locations, such as architectural features or room descriptions, unless they are historically significant.
    • Condense repetitive phrases like "the wellness center spans X square meters" to streamline readability.
  • Terminology:
    • Explain specialized terms for a broader audience. For example:
      • Define "Kneipp treatments" for readers unfamiliar with spa terminology.

• Specific Section Feedback
  • History
    • The historical background is thorough but could be reorganized to improve flow.
      • Begin with the origins of QC Terme, highlighting its foundational vision and expansion milestones.
      • Avoid speculative or anecdotal phrases like "Saverio observed that many young people liked to visit."
  • Locations
    • Individual Descriptions:
      • The detailed descriptions of wellness centers are engaging but overly lengthy.
      • Condense content by focusing on unique or historically significant aspects of each location.
      • Example: Highlight the historical significance of Bagni Vecchi without reiterating general spa offerings.
    • Categorization:
      • Group locations by country or region for better readability.
  • Rebranding Initiatives
    • This section on "QC Spa of Wonders" is overly promotional and lacks citations for claims about brand philosophy.
      • Avoid subjective phrases like "balances the desire for retreat with the longing for enjoyment."
      • Focus on factual aspects, such as the timeline of the rebranding and its goals.
  • Finances
    • The financial section provides useful context but should include more consistent data points.
      • Compare QC Terme’s growth with industry benchmarks for a broader perspective. ** Avoid listing year-by-year revenue changes without contextual analysis.
  • Images
    • Relevance:
      • Include only images that directly illustrate significant aspects of the text (e.g., historical buildings or notable spa features). **** Replace overly generic images with those emphasizing the unique aspects of QC Terme.
  • Captions:
    • Improve clarity and conciseness. For example:
      • "Outside pool with view on Mont Blanc" → "Outdoor pool at QC Terme Chamonix with Mont Blanc views."
  • Licensing:
    • Verify compliance with Wikimedia Commons guidelines for image use and attribution.

• • Suggestions for Improvement
    • Neutralize Language:
      • Replace promotional phrases with objective descriptions. For example:
      • "A relaxing paradise for modern travelers" → "A wellness center featuring thermal baths and spa treatments."
    • Enhance Accessibility:
      • Translate technical terms like "hydrotherapy" and "thermal circuits" into simpler language or provide brief explanations.
    • Streamline Content:
      • Remove repetitive content about services offered at multiple locations. Focus on distinctive features.
    • Improve Citations:
      • Add independent, peer-reviewed sources to support historical claims, especially about the ancient baths and Roman heritage.

Greentree97 (talk) 14:07, 29 November 2024 (UTC)