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Battle of Britain (1985 video game)

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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch • Watch article reassessment page • Most recent review
Result: Issues seem resolved. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 11:17, 2 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

This article has had an orange "factual accuracy is disputed" banner at the top of the page since 2017. Since that remains unresolved, I am nominating it for GAR. Z1720 (talk) 22:43, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

(quick skimmed through it) It might need more details overall, especially about its development and modern-day reception; as for the dispute (and as someone that is unfamiliar with these C64 strategy games), the Gameplay section appears to be written as well as it could be, describing key aspects of the game's modes and presentation. Are you sure it could note more clearly that it's based on the actual battle? Overall, the article does appear to address the main aspects of the topic; perhaps a little trimming at Gameplay will suffice. 2601AC47 (talk|contribs) Isn't a IP anon 23:16, 21 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The talk page has a comment from the editor who added the disputed banner: Talk:Battle of Britain (1985 video game)#Disputed. I addressed the release date when I edited the article last year but I didn't touch the gameplay section. --Mika1h (talk) 00:15, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delist This one seems to have been a faulty initial review, as many of the claims in gameplay, even in the original approved version, are outright made up and not mentioned in the cited source. Without a complete once-over it should not be a GA by any stretch of the imagination. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 00:55, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment. I did the GA Assessment for this article over nine years ago under my old username, and as my assessment states I was concerned about the lack of production information at the time. As I also noted at the time, I eventually chose not to penalise the GA nomination on the grounds there were no available sources. While I did question the relevance of the generic background section, the nominator rebutted my concerns, and I decided not to challenge it further as they had considerably more experience editing video game articles than I did, but I do indeed agree with the bold edit made last year removing this section. You'd have to check in with WikiProject Video games about whether a lack of available information on production automatically renders the article ineligible for GA status. I honestly don't know, I'm not overly active with any Wiki projects these days, though I note standards have risen considerably in Project Video games in the last decade since I did this review. If the fact a production section simply cannot be created due to a lack of available sources makes this article ineligible for GA, by all means, delist it.
As my review notes, I went through the reception references in detail to verify things, but I did indeed assume good faith of the nominators descriptions of gameplay as they were an established editor in the relevant project. I probably presumed they obtained the uncited information from playing the game, had no reason at the time to think that such an established editor would have "outright made up" gameplay, and also thought non-controversial descriptions could be sourced to the game itself as per WP:PRIMARY, in the same way that plots are. I try not to assume bad faith.
Bultro made a dispute in 2017, though nobody acknowledged the dispute until last year. Not surprisingly, the article doesn't get many viewers or edits; I didn't add it to my watch-list after doing the GA review, so I never saw the tag or comments until today. If the gameplay is inaccurate, I would absolutely encourage Bultro to fix it. If they aren't able to do that for any reason, is there a way to play this game today, such as with emulation? If so, I'd encourage you to find someone who has the time to play it, weigh in on the accuracy allegations, and make any required changes. Unless the lack of production coverage makes this ineligible for GA, I'm not seeing why simply addressing the dispute one person has made wouldn't save this from being de-listed. Damien Linnane (talk) 01:33, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delist as perfectly said by Zxcvbnm.
    Sorry about not warning you in 2017 or not fixing (sort of rewriting) the article myself, I'm just not a regular contributor of en.wiki. If you want a correct description of the gameplay you can see the article I wrote on it.wiki, based on both written sources (manual and magazine reviews) and checking the real game in action. I don't know if fixing the errors would be enough to save from delisting, but certainly there are tons of better pages around to enlist. Bultro (talk) 08:53, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You definitely don't owe me an apology for not telling me about the dispute, or for not fixing it yourself. You don't have to fix anything you don't want to. But no one, including the original nominator, has raised a specific issue other than the alleged inaccuracy. In other words, no one has provided any specific reasoning for why fixing this lone issue wouldn't save it from delisting. Damien Linnane (talk) 13:27, 22 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, the "lone" issue is an entire section (half the page) with many errors, which doesn't make me trust very much in the other section too. And there was another issue, the "development" section which was actually chatter, now fixed by full deletion, so there's not much left--Bultro (talk) 10:29, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Damien Linnane: Would you be willing to fix up the article to address the concerns? Editors have brought up concerns about how the text of this article does not match the sources: this needs to be resolved before I can endorse a "keep", and the availability of a good version in another language is not enough for me to endorse a keep on English Wikipedia. Z1720 (talk) 03:57, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh my point being is that it's just a shame to delist when all the information needed to fix the issue is right there. My vote was originally neutral as I was aware of the effort playing the game in order to write an accurate section would take, but now that it's been pointed out to me that an accurate version has already been written, I've changed my vote to a keep. I'll try and see if I can find the time to give it a go in the coming days. I am time poor myself though so I absolutely will not judge anyone else for not wanting to do it. That being said, I do not speak any Italian so I will be reliant on online translation. So if Bultro doesn't have time to fix this issue themselves (which is fine), it would be appreciated if they could look over any changes I have the time to make, just to make sure something hasn't been lost in translation. Damien Linnane (talk) 23:43, 23 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Well, that ended up being a lot easier than I anticipated. Turns out, of the seven things that were disputed on the talk page, only two hadn't already been fixed. From there, I went through all the sources in the gameplay section manually. I found three statements that weren't backed up by the sources (or other sources I read either), so I removed those, and then I added coverage on the fact the dogfights were optional, since the article confusingly didn't mention that. If there's any remaining issues, you'll have to explicitly point them out. Damien Linnane (talk) 11:25, 24 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Z1720, Zxcvbnm, and Bultro: does the above address your concerns? ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:31, 27 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. My concerns have been addressed. Z1720 (talk) 13:18, 27 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Z1720. Unfortunately, after looking at the issues here I think someone needs to go through the other articles that were nominated for GA by this same user around the same time period as this one (some of which I also assessed), so you've done the right thing by nominating this for reassessment/discussion. Damien Linnane (talk) 00:27, 28 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Damien Linnane: I do not know if I have the time or patience to do that. I am happy to help anyone who wants to do this. Z1720 (talk) 01:23, 28 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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