User talk:W.carter/Archive 1

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

→

Archive 5

Welcome!

Hello, W.carter, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Unfortunately, one or more of the pages you created, such as Ann-Sophie Qvarnström, may not conform to some of Wikipedia's guidelines, and may not be retained.

There's a page about creating articles you may want to read called Your first article. If you are stuck, and looking for help, please come to the Teahouse, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type {{help me}} on this page, followed by your question, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Here are a few other good links for newcomers:

• Starting an article
• Your first article
• Biographies of living persons
• How to write a great article
• The five pillars of Wikipedia
• Help pages
• Tutorial

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Questions or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome! Piguy101 (talk) 00:21, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

Your contributions are appreciated and welcomed

I hope you don't mind that I edited your sandbox article, just this once. By the way, if you think there might be an English Wikipedia article Konstnärsförbundets skola some day, you can use ill template, {{ill}}, like this: {{ill|sv|Konstnärsförbundets skola}}, which results in: Konstnärsförbundets skola. The sv link will automatically stop displaying when the English article is created. —Anomalocaris (talk) 20:38, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

No, not at all! I am very grateful for your help and guidance. These are things I need to learn, and this is what sandboxes are for. I´ll just get on with it then.W.carter (talk) 08:48, 30 April 2014 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages!

Hello, W.carter/Archive 1. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived after 2-3 days of inactivity. Message added by Arthur goes shopping (talk) 09:37, 30 April 2014 (UTC). (You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template.

A Barnstar for you!

Moved to User:W.carter/things I have received

OH MY (almost inappropriate curse word)! Thank you! This was totally unexpected and I am floating on a little happy cloud right now. - W.carter (talk) 13:55, 8 May 2014 (UTC)

New things on Einar Jolin

Libraries are dangerous places! They contain way too much information. So, lots of new facts and heaps of references. I might have overdone it but it is easy to trim away. I was a bit unsure of how to do the references. It looked messy if I had every book page linked, so I settled for just the first. Some books were previously just additional reading but are now in the bibliography section.

Turns out that the picture of Jolin used in the artist box is from a data base at the Stockholm City Digital museum along with two other pictures. So I used the same template to upload them on Wiki Commons. It worked, but somehow they ended up at the Swedish section. Since they exist and can be used I put them in the article. They are of Jolin but also of his paintings, so I think it's ok.

The library resulted in some new paragraphs and a new section. Some of the facts are "extended facts" (is that what it's called?) and might not be 100% relevant to the article, but you get some insight into art life in Stockholm at the beginning of the 20th century through them. And they are referenced. And yes, I know that the ref about Lisbeth Salander is not exactly relevant to the article, but it's a fun fact and ties in with other articles. I'm open to objections...

The section about the quality of his work declining might seem cruel, but since it is a fact I think it should be mentioned. I was unsure of how to write about the daughters. Right now the text is repeating facts, but the facts seems valid in both places.

This has been a marathon edit so I'm sure I 've missed a lot of things... I will return to the article when I'm rested and see what I can find. - W.carter (talk) 23:09, 10 May 2014 (UTC)

Some explanation about why I included the Salander ref. I have not read the books, so to me it was just an address. I was looking at all the addresses online to see if I could scare up some useful information. On most I just got some dry old photos and some unexciting blueprints, but at Fiskargatan 9 I got over 200.000 hits! Turns out people are coming from all over the world to look at this house. There are several guided tours that includes a visit to this house etc. So, with this much interest I thought I could mention it in a note.

The language at Award sounds a bit stilted, but it is the exact wording used when the King of Sweden presents an award. Just look at any clip of the Nobel Prize ceremony and you will hear some scholar saying these words in a very "Swedish Chef" kind of way. In Sweden this phrase is actually a kind of joke-phrase that is said if you want to comment on someone's very bad English. - W.carter (talk) 10:15, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

Many thanks to Anomalocaris for the painstaking work of correcting my commas, dashes etc. There seems to be another character missing on my keyboard, or does the dash just exist in the Wiki markup? There seems to be two of them there (– & —). Is there somewhere I can look up when to use which? The dates are not written like that by me. I've tried to figure out what form to use, and I see that this is a frequent topic of discussion here on Wiki. Is there some kind of help page on this I should be studying?

Templates are still a mystery to me. Is there a kind of "template dictionary" somewhere, or does one learn them one by one by mistake? Doing searches for them in the search box does not work. - W.carter (talk) 18:59, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

There is no key on most keyboards for the en dash (–) or em dash(—). You can insert them from the Insert menu just below the main editing window, by using their HTML codes, – and —, or by various wiki templates. For use, see MOS:DASH.

When you create a new article, you are free to decide whether to use mdy dates or dmy dates, but if you are writing an article about someone from a country where one or the other strongly predominates, you should use that one. For more info, see MOS:DATEFORMAT.

Templates are categorized at [[Category:Wikipedia templates]], except for Wikipedia:List of infoboxes. Templates are also organized at Wikipedia:Template messages. My advice is not to spend time at the beginning of your Wikipedia career studying lists of templates. Ss you use and edit wikipedia, see what templates do things that would be useful, and keep a notebook of ones you want to remember. Some templates are almost indispensable; Here is a short list of "essential" templates I use a lot:

Maintenance tags, should be dated with |date=month year

• {{citation needed}}
• {{dead link}}
• {{not in citation}}
• {{use mdy dates}}, {{use dmy dates}}

Other

• {{cite book}}, {{cite journal}}, {{cite news}}, {{cite web}}, etc.
• {{about}}, {{for}}, {{redirect}}, {{other people}}, etc.
• {{italic title}}
• templates for tables and columns

Many of these have synonyms. — Anomalocaris (talk) 21:22, 11 May 2014 (UTC)

Making translations more like native English

Hi, I noticed on your userpage you mentioned that you wished it to be more common for translations from Swedish to be improved by native English speakers.

Possibly WP:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors/Requests might be useful for this. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 20:45, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

@Demiurge1000: Hi! Thanks for the link. I will look into it. It's all right to sound like "The Swedish chef" on a talk page, but in an article it is downright embarrassing. There are articles on Swedish things, that are probably written by Swedes, where the language is more like "Swedish clad in English" than real English, e.g. John Bauer (illustrator). The language is simple so it is passable English, but I'm really itching to do some editing there. Problem is that the artist has a very strong fan club, so if I made even the slightest mistake I would probable be drawn and quartered... So I'll just leave it to native English speakers. - W.carter (talk) 21:40, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Yes, GOCE requests would be ideal for this. Although, I think you can only submit two or three requests at a time, and they can take a week or three to be fulfilled. You might not see that as a problem, though. Most GOCE editors are very experienced, so their linguistic improvements will carry some weight. On the other hand, they won't necessarily watchlist or war to defend their own changes, so you might have to do that! Nothing is ever simple... --Demiurge1000 (talk) 22:29, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Don't I know it... I also know about the huge workload for many experienced editors so I will not add to it. I'll just take another approach: Write and edit many well written articles about artists so I can someday go back to articles like that when I have acquired some authority. - W.carter (talk) 22:38, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

@Demiurge1000:Well I did some edits on John Bauer (illustrator), they were well received and I'm still alive, so maybe there is hope after all. :) - W.carter (talk) 11:49, 12 May 2014 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages!

Hello, W.carter/Archive 1. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived after 2-3 days of inactivity. Message added by —Anne Delong (talk) 11:41, 15 May 2014 (UTC). (You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template.

Disambiguation link notification for May 19

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Erik Boheman, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Augustana College (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 08:58, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Misunderstanding

@Philg88: Sorry about the confusion! I had already put a box with {{Translated|sv|Einar Jolin}} on the talk page the same way I was instructed to do by the info box at Erik Boheman. But Einar does not contain anything from the Boheman translation. Boheman is simply mentioned in the new facts I put in at Einar, and that's how I found the article and just translated it for fun.

So, you had put a Boheman box on Einar, a bot moved it to Einar talk page and I removed it since it does not belong there.

The question at the Teahouse was where I should put the date of the complete translation (i.e. the version before you and I started to edit it and put all of our stuff there) as suggested by Rich Farmbrough in the sentences above. Do you have any idea were such information should be placed? - W.carter (talk) 08:16, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

No problem, it was my fault for not looking at the issue more closely, but it was very early!. The date should be that of the last sv wiki diff on which you based the translation.  Philg88 ^♦talk 12:41, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

What? You mean you DO sleep sometimes? :) It was the 22:11‎ 19 januari 2014 diff in the Swe version, and my translation in Eng was done with the 08:08 2 May 2014 diff. Should I just write it in a new section on the talk page or is there some specific place to put it? Best - W.carter (talk) 12:54, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Emellanåt ;) See the parameters for {{Translated page}} and add the diffs for the version/insertversion parameters. As for positioning, it's fine where it is. Cheers,  Philg88 ^♦talk 15:40, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: Thanks a lot! I will try it out. And, I'm not even going to try to say something in Chinese.^^ I will use it on other articles as well. Today I'm home with a busted knee (I will get my crutches tomorrow and be mobile once again), and it hurts too much to be able to concentrate on the new big article. So to keep me from going nuts I've just translated some minor stub articles from the Swedish portal. Maybe I'll revisit them some day, but right now I'm just expanding them with the Swedish articles as per the notice at the portal. Best, - W.carter (talk) 18:32, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Have a good rest (and it's crutches, not churches) :)  Philg88 ^♦talk 19:13, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

¤#%&***&%¤ spelling program. - W.carter (talk) 19:18, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for May 31

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that you've added some links pointing to disambiguation pages. Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

10132 Lummelunda (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)

added a link pointing to Lummelunda

10813 Mästerby (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)

added a link pointing to Mästerby

9267 Lokrume (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)

added a link pointing to Lokrume

9359 Fleringe (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)

added a link pointing to Fleringe

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 08:58, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

I am currently sorting out these pages. - W.carter (talk) 09:06, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

 Done - W.carter (talk) 10:22, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages!

Hello, W.carter/Archive 1. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived after 2-3 days of inactivity. Message added by PrimeHunter (talk) 08:50, 1 June 2014 (UTC). (You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template.

I have posted again. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:49, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

Congrats... You helped keep Teahouse an awesome, welcoming, safe, and helpful place!

Moved to User:W.carter/things I have received

@Mz7:WOW! Overwhelming! - W.carter (talk) 14:07, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
	From a Teahouse host, to you. Thank you so much for the kind and thoughtful comment you left on the Q&A page! Schoolskater (talk) 12:13, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

@Schoolskater:Aw... This makes me feel warm and fuzzy all over. - W.carter (talk) 14:14, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Review for Einar Jolin

Hey Kompis, I'm just checking after you left a message mentioning me on another editor's talk page re the review for Einar. What he is talking about is the New Page Patrol thing that I mentioned on my talk page a while ago, not the GA review. I thought I'd mention it in case you thought the latter was in progress - it isn't as far as I can see and sadly I can't do it because I'm too involved. Best,  Philg88 ^♦talk 15:37, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

No problemo Pal! I'm beginning to get the hang of some of the routines here at the Wiki, much tanks to you, and I understand that there are several separate reviews involved. I'm just grateful that Einar passed ONE of them! As for nominating Einar for GA... it's the scariest thing I've done so far on Wiki. I fully expect two very large men with sunglasses to show up at my doorstep and carry me of to some undisclosed location for my insolence in assuming that I could be part of a GA. But, nothing ventured nothing gained. And I really appreciate the system here on EngWiki regarding reviews. I looked at SweWiki and saw that "over there" it only takes four editors to review a featured article and one of them can be the user who wrote the thing!! <Horror!> I can not believe the Wiki org is not reprimanding SweWiki for having such low standards.

On another note: If you should feel so inclined, and have the time, I'm just finishing up Mästerby and it could use some CE. There is just the "Further Reading" section left to do. I have also written two sections, Economy and Tourism, in Gotland after a request on the talk page. The article itself leaves much to be desired, and I'll see what I can do about it in the future. - W.carter (talk) 16:01, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Apologies if above language is too frivolous and not as polite as usual, but I feel rather giddy today: I can use my knee again and I received some very kind and unexpected Wikilove. Best! - W.carter (talk) 17:27, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Hey, I've done some minor copyedits on Mästerby. That's a nice article, well done! Similarly, I have tweaked the new sections in Gotland. And don't worry about the language, it's fine with the possible exception of "pal". In some parts of England (no names mentioned), the expression "Are you looking at me, pal?" Actually means "I am about to punch you in the face. Very hard." I'm sure that there are similar nuances in Swedish. Cheers,  Philg88 ^♦talk 09:19, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello Philg88! Ooops! I really didn't know this. Thanks for correcting me! It will prevent me from making serious mistakes in the future. And thanks for the CE. I really appreciate it. Cheers, - W.carter (talk) 11:18, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

Barnstar

Moved to User:W.carter/things I have received

And like this you come to conquer the respect of your peers :) ! Krenakarore ^TK 22:50, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank You so much! :) Really nice! - W.carter (talk) 08:05, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Gryta Church

Hi Mr. Carter, I would like you to do me a great favor. I need to know if this Gryta Church is important, read notable, in your country and culture. Besides, I am translating the info from the Swedish Wikipedia to the English one, something which might be worth having your expertise in the subject, once Swedish is your language. Also, any other reference to the corresponding article would be appreciated. Thanks in advance for your efforts on this crucial matter. Your friend, Krenakarore ^TK 23:52, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello Krenakarore! Thank you for your query. While I am not an expert on churches I would say that any church having paintings by Albertus Pictor is of great importance since he is the most noted church painter in medieval Sweden. Also, the church is located in Uppsala, which is sort of the most important place when is comes to anything having to do with religion in Sweden. So I would say yes, it is notable.

I had a look around and I found some sites mentioning the church in a very favorable light, but it all has to do with the fact that the church has lots of activities in the present. Something I would say makes it more noteworthy than some old paintings. It has been going strong for about 1000 years! I do not have much time to Wiki today, but I will take a further look within a couple of days. Found these: [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]. I mean Wiki is not all about the past, it is also about the present and how the two are connected. Hope these answers are of some help. - W.carter (talk) 10:36, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello again Krenakarore! I had a quick read-through of Gryta Church comparing it with the Swedish text, and I see that you have made a couple of small errors when translating and that some parts needs a bit of clarifying. Would you like me to copyedit the article for you as soon as I have the time? - W.carter (talk) 11:11, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Do the honors my Carter, copy-editing just makes it better :) ! Ref #2 might help you once you will find more info about the structure of the church, the bell tower and the cemetery, which might be useful to the article. More, there are two sections which I could not translate from the Swedish article, "Främre valvet" and "Mellersta valvet", both describing the paintings. Like these we prepare a link for future articles. The refs you found are very good and they will all be used. Thank you once again. Krenakarore ^TK 13:21, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Very well Krenakarore, I will take a look later. But bear in mind that I'm not a real copyeditor. I can fix the facts, but after this I think it would be best if some real copyeditor took a look and checked my language. Maybe Philg88, he has had great patience with my language and shortcomings so far. Yes, I saw that the parts about the "valvets" were a little fuzzy, and I will do my best to clear it up. If I find any additional things about the church, I will be sure to send them your way. I will let you know as soon as I'm done. Best, - W.carter (talk) 13:35, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

@Krenakarore: I am so sorry, it seems I have given you some bad links above. I started to search for more information about the church, and things just didn't add up. It turns out there are two Gryta Kyrka! One in Önsta (the one with all the activity today), and one in Örsundsbro (the one in your article with the paintings). They are so similar to search engines that even the Swedish Church's website confuses them. I really apologize for not spotting this sooner. Just wanted to let you know as soon as I realized my mistake. Best, - W.carter (talk) 16:16, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I know there are two, but what you did was very good. You don't commit mistakes, you sum up to the best. Yakikaki is actually the creator of this article. She's a lovely person whom I know you will enjoy meeting. She likes architecture and Estonian history but she's also very fond of Swedish article and beautiful islands like yours ;) ! Krenakarore ^TK 18:19, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

@Krenakarore: Hello again! The translation of the Swedish article is done. It was really tricky in some parts, the language has very subtle nuances hard to spot if you are not a native Swede. Hence the confusion about the first wooden church and Albertus Pictor. The Swedish word "skola" can also mean "style" or "manner" when it comes to art. It means the style taught at a school or by someone influential, and passed on to others but not necessarily in a school house. The use of "valv" is also a trap. It literary means "arch" but it can also mean the entire ceiling that the arch is part of, or the space under that part of the ceiling or in a wider sense the entire room under the arch. I looked at how the Sistine Chapel ceiling was described. It is not half as technical as the Swedish version of Gryta church! The "valvkappa" mentioned in the text is simply the area of ceiling between arches where pictures can be painted. If the Sistine can call the whole thing "ceiling" I think it's alright here too. The pulpit is actually described as "doughy", I call it soft and smooth. Might be more appropriate. I added the passage about the steeple since it was in the reference, and seemed important to mention. Will you do the referencing yourself or do you want me to do it? Sorry about not getting more done tonight, but it was a long hard day at work. Please let me know if there are any more parts of the references or something that needs translation or clarifying. I will be happy to do it as soon as my work allows it. :) - W.carter (talk) 20:46, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

P.S. someone should take a look at my language and spelling. And I wrote "steeple", maybe it should be "bell tower"? - W.carter (talk) 20:51, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

Ok, I looked: one bell = steeple, more bells = bell tower. An error in the Swedish article. Will correct it. - W.carter (talk) 21:33, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

@Krenakarore: Just one more thing popped up in my mind. The bells. Maybe they should be written the Great Bell and the Small Bell. In Swedish bells are treated like "people" since they have "voices", and Storklockan and Lillklockan are acutally the names of the bells, something the Swedish editor overlooked. The prefix Lill- is a prefix used for young and beloved persons. Lill-Anna means "My little beloved Anna". It is the same use as the Japanese -chan (Kiki, Kiki-chan) or Spanish -ito, -ita (Carmen, Carmencita or Manuel, Manuelito). As far as I know English does not have this kind of addendum. Stor- (big, great, main) has the same meaning as "great" in Alexandre the Great. Just wanted to explain. Best, - W.carter (talk) 08:14, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, like Steve = Stev"ie" Wonder :) ! Alright, I'll make that change today. Well explained, thanks again. Krenakarore ^TK 09:13, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Hey Carter, thank you for helping out on this article, fantastic work! This little church should be one of the best covered in Sweden by now, I think :) Cheers, Yakikaki (talk) 16:53, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

@Yakikaki:No problem! It's fun to help out. Nice to know that it was saved from deletion. Just post a message here if I can be of some further assistance. Best, - W.carter (talk) 17:10, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

@Krenakarore: @Yakikaki: So it all worked out for the best. Like I said, I have no great knowledge of churches but I knew about the bells from a song. :) And since I understand that Krenakarore is music-minded I'll just mention it here. Storklockan and Lillklockan are rather common names for bells, and they are mentioned in the 18th century song by Carl Michael Bellman about a funeral, Fredmans epistel n:o 81 part 3, 1:st line. The Swedish group Imperiet has done the best version of it if you are interested. - W.carter (talk) 19:29, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for June 14

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Gotland Municipality, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Socken (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 08:53, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: Hello my friend! A new question in relation to the above bot message. Ok, I get that a link to a disambiguation page was a mistake. But the word "socken" keeps causing me a lot of problems. It is a traditional way of describing areas in Sweden (especially on Gotland) and is often confused with "parish". I corrected the disambiguation page, but apparently that was not enough. So I guess I have to create an article of sorts for it to avoid further trouble, for me and other editors dealing with Sweden. On SweWiki the word "socken" is actually a FA, so no trouble finding what to write in the Eng. version (but I will not translate it all right now). Problem is, what should I call the article? Just "Socken" and maybe put a "For other uses, see..." on it same as in Town or should I specify "Socken, area" or something? Best, - W.carter (talk) 09:50, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

Hey kompis. You can just create the page "Socken" over the current disambiguation page then add a hatnote using {{about}} - i.e for the Canadian academic and educator see Paul G. Socken. And vice versa for the Paul G. Socken article. Since there are only two terms, a disambiguation page is not necessary per WP:D. Cheers,  Philg88 ^♦talk 09:57, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: Hej Kompis! So, I made a small article for socken. It has (apparently) such a widespread use that I am really surprised that it's not been done before. The SweWiki even had a reference to China (!). I don't know if that is relevant or should be removed, that is more your area of expertise. I would really appreciate if you could take a look at it since it is my first try at such an article and way out of my area of expertise. I know that the pictures might be redundant, but it's such a "dry" article so it needed something to make it more readable. I have also been doing some "cleaning up" on Gotland (referencing, updating facts, links and pictures, and generally blowing away the cob webs from it). Check it out if you want to. Cheers, - W.carter (talk) 14:58, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

I've made a few tweaks to the article, which is absolutely fine - good job! As you know, my Swedish isn't up to much but I was able to work out what "Kina" meant :). The article sv:Socken (Kina) links indirectly back to Townships of the People's Republic of China, which are pretty much the same as socken, so the "see also" is valid and can stay where it is. Best,  Philg88 ^♦talk 15:50, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: Thank you so much for your help! Yes, Kina is Swedish for China. A word that might someday be useful for you.:) Sometimes I just get all cross eyed when translating! And I seem to have an alternative case of tourettes when it comes to the word "see". In Swedish it is the same word, but with just one "e". I have no problem handling long and complicated words, but "see" always gets me in trouble.(and to/too) Arrghh! Anyway, thanks a lot. Best, - W.carter (talk) 16:10, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

You're welcome as always. BTW Tourette's makes you swear a lot. What you have is e myopia I think, although you won't find any references to the condition on Wikipedia or elsewhere because I just made it up :) Cheers,  Philg88 ^♦talk 16:27, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

LOL! Philg88 Yes, I know what Tourette's is about. I said "an alternative case of" (rare horrible genetic mutation of) which in lay mans terms may very well be e myopia. Thanks for providing me with a name. =D I assume you know the The Meaning of Liff by heart as well. - W.carter (talk) 16:38, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Indeed, in a different life I once wrote a similar dictionary full of such nonsense :)  Philg88 ^♦talk 16:40, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: Yes we all have a past. It is nice to finally get the language flowing better. It's always easier when you feel more comfortable in your surroundings. I'm more used to translating from English to Swedish, but some of the English got stuck in my head along the way. (For more info see the User:Rhododendrites talk page, section Bunge if you are interested.) Enjoy your first week as Wikipedias #1 editor. Best, - W.carter (talk) 21:20, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks!  Philg88 ^♦talk 03:17, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Works by John Bauer

• Vad är vad (What is what.)
• 
  "In the Christmas night", 1913. I do not think this is from B t o t. I can't find it among the illustrations and it does not fit any tale in that years collection. + It is the wrong format for the collection.
• 
  "Now and then the gnome took hold of the reins."–1907. I do not think this is from B t o t. I can't find it among the illustrations and it does not fit any tale in that years collection.
• 
  Same picture as the one below. The other one is of a better quality.
• 
  "At dusk she often snuck out just to get a whiff of the good smell."–When Mother Troll did the laundry for the king, 1914.
• 
  Porträtt av elegant dam, Portrait of an elegant lady, oil canvas, size cm 104.5 76.5. Not "B t o t"
• 
  this is in already - ev - better? Yes, use this one instead, it is closer to the original picture.
• 
  "When she woke up again she was lying on the moss in the forest."–The Changeling, 1913.
• 
  "It was almost impossible to stand these barking, howling rascals."–When Mother Troll did the laundry for the king, 1914.
• 
  "Once upon a time a prince was out riding in the moonlight"–The ring, 1914.
• 
  "If someone else cries when you laugh then you will have your tears back."–The queens necklace, 1914.
• 
  "But what is that, moving in the forest?"–The story about the moose Hop and the little princess Cotton-grass, 1913.
• 
  "Tjovik crept up onto the old trolls lap and stroked his beard."–The trolls and the gnome boy, 1909.
• 
  Lappar i snöstorm, Laplanders in snowstorm, 1904-1905, published in: Lapland. The great Swedish country of the future. A story told in words and images of its nature and people by O. Bergqvist and Fredrik Svenonius, 1906. Not "B t o t"

Ok, skulle du vilja nu hjälpa mig att ta reda på vilken av de här har blivit publicerad i Bland tomtar och troll? I så fall, om det kan bli 4 till, kan vi lägga till en rad till till den delen av gallerian. Annars får vi lösa det på något annat sätt.. Hafspajen (talk) 15:00, 18 June 2014 (UTC) Enligt detta; Project RunebergHafspajen (talk) 15:07, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello Hafspajen! For prudence sake I think it is best if we keep this conversation in English, since it is the English part of Wikipedia. We do not want other users thinking that we are making "secret plans", do we.:) I will take a look at the pictures as soon as possible, and see what sort of information I can get hold of. I am at work now, and was only checking in on Wikipedia. I did don't know all this would be going on! I am quite busy these days before Midsummer, but I will make as much time as possible to help you and Krenakarore getting the article ship shape. Thank you for the Project Runeberg link. I also have a number of books on Bauer at home. Just be a bit patient. Best, - W.carter (talk) 15:13, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

They always have the google trans on... well, I would have been easyer for me, and yes, I do talk with Swedish with Swedish editors ... time to time. Ah, books - very good. Trevlig Midsommar! Hafspajen (talk) 15:16, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

@Krenakarore:@Hafspajen: Hello Hafspajen! Here are the captions you were looking for. I also found a neat list of all the stories in Bland tomtar och troll and put it in the article. You can move it, convert it or do what you think is best. I could not list all of the stories illustrated by Bauer with total certainty tonight, so it will be an ongoing project. I will revisit John Bauer (illustrator) and write the captions when all has been resolved about it. Best, - W.carter (talk) 22:05, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Swan maiden

I thought I'd post this here in case you miss it if I add it to my last reply on my talk page. There is no corresponding Swedish article for Swan maiden so maybe that might be a nice sub-project for you!  Philg88 ^♦talk 15:17, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88:Not to worry, I keep close tabs on the users I communicate with. When I got the notice I was already posting on your page. We'll see what the future brings. Right now I long to be back for a while among the not so conflict-filled articles about Gotland. Cheers, - W.carter (talk) 15:48, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88:@Krenakarore: ...and anyone else interested in this little project. I just wanted to check on the notability of JB, since that was also an issue. And also to see how "important" it might to really expand the article. I did some very un-scientific research, i.e. I Googled the names of some on some other (kind of) male artists who also died young ( "With Quotation Marks" ) and came away with this little list. And yes, there are of cause other people with the same names, but it gives some sort of guidance. The numbers are number of hits on Google. Cheers, - W.carter (talk) 19:23, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

• Kurt Cobain 4,310,000
• James Dean 3,910,000
• Jim Morrison 2,050,000
• Rudolph Valentino 1,080,000
• John Bauer 938,000
• Frederic Chopin 679,000
• Sid Vicious 632,000
• River Phoenix 461,000

@Philg88:Hello my friend, time to bug you again.^^ I knew that some of the tales had been translated into English, I have made gifts of the to my British friends and colleagues a number of time, but it turns out that they have actually been translated into no less than 10 languages. Which is probably why 33 Wikipedias have articles on JB. Anyway this got me thinking (I think it's called hubris), is there any chance that an article like this could be developed into a FA? Or is this classification reserved for bigger, better, more noted, whatever subjects? One would have thought that the Swe Wiki would have an FA on JB, but that Wikipedia is, as you by now know, very, very different from the class act of Eng Wiki. (Sidebar: I recently checked out the community there, since I have never been active there, and the Teahouse and the Village pump is used to discuss spelling and grammar! The Horror!) I would really appreciate your honest opinion. Best, - W.carter (talk) 14:02, 23 June 2014 (UTC) Btw, I put the English books topmost in the Further reading section rather than the Swedish. - W.carter (talk) 14:03, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

No problem. Your thoughts certainly aren't hubris, more like rehetoric. Any article can theoretically become "Good" or "Featured" providing that it meets the relevant guidelines. There is no requirement that it comes from a specific discipline or that non-English speaking cultures are excluded. It's been a while since I did a GA review so if you want to go for it, I'll do that for you. Bear in mind that means that I can't do the copyediting, since that would be like reviewing my own work. It might take us a while but why don't we have a go. First off, read the GA guidelines and take it from there. Best,  Philg88 ^♦talk 14:45, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for believing in the article. And me. As with any work it's always great fun to strive for excellence now and then. This article is my first chance to try it since there is so much good material on the subject and by now I have most of the information in my head. I have been checking out many of the GA and FA articles to see what makes them tick (such as the no-use of expressions like that) and I have read the guidelines for them. I totally understand that if you do the review you can't do anything on the article, that would be like having the referee playing for one of the teams. It will be a challenge for me since it is your brilliant language that have carried my articles so far. But by all means, let's get started! It is also good karma to take something that started with an ugly dispute and turn it into something nice. (Joss!) Just note that during the next week I will be AFK most of the time since we then have the Almedalen Week. It is an election year and 3,281 political events are scheduled for our tiny town. The population density of Visby will then rival that of Shanghai or even Kolkata. But it is democracy at it's best so we cherish it. - W.carter (talk) 15:41, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

I'm all for democracy, so give me a shout when you're ready to make a start. Best,  Philg88 ^♦talk 16:40, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

If you are interested...

...there are still a lot of churches on Gotland without articles, as you probably have noticed, and several of them have nice Swedish articles, so if you feel like translating there's a nice idea! ;) I'm busy this weekend but I think it would be nice to be able to link all the entries on List of churches on Gotland eventually, and will go back to that next week, I think. A lot of them are very interesting and beautiful, and would make great DYKs. And eventually, it would be nice to try to make a featured list out of the list. Anyhow, just a perhaps wild idea! Now I have to run again... Cheers! Yakikaki (talk) 14:45, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello Yakikaki, thanks for the invite, but churches are not really my forte. Sorry. I can help you if you get stuck but otherwise I already have a task sorting out the places where the churches are. I'm sorting out, and in the first stage making stubs for, the places with churches with existing articles. After that I will monitor your List of churches on Gotland and when a new one comes along I will fix the article for the place. It's a HUGE project so you have to be patient. I have the Template:Gotland County as my guide and you can see that there is a lot to do... I am also sorting out all the miss-labeled articles that were created for asteroids named after places on Gotland. See Gotland the Astronomy section. If you look at my user page you see all of this listed as my "pet project". I will stay in touch with you during all of this, since I imagine it would be nice for you to have a proper place for your churches.

The next two months will be hell at work since we get the tourist invasion then, but I will try to relax with some editing from time to time. If you have some trouble with a Swedish text, don't hesitate to ask me. :) Best, - W.carter (talk) 16:29, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

Hi, OK, I'll stick to my churches then and they can then be added to the proper place :) I'm painfully aware of the greatness of both our undertakings, but it feels nice to know that the churches can now be linked up to a greater project. Let me know if you need any help with anything else! By the way, I today also had the idea to try to make articles about Katthamra and Stora Hästnäs manors/farms. They're not churches but I imagine you might find them interesting from a Gotland perspective, also. I'll let you know when (if) I find the time and info. Bye for now, Yakikaki (talk) 21:20, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello @Yakikaki:! They both sound like great places to make articles about. I know Stora Hästnäs quite well (by sight) since I drive by it every time I visit my storage unit. ^^ Stora Hästnäs on Guteinfo Excavation of Stora Hästnäs, tons of facts! Radio Gotland My storage. Katthamra gård I have only seen from a distance since I usually just go to the restaurant at Katthammarsvik. Some links for it: [7] [8] [9]. Nice to hear from you! Best, - W.carter (talk) 21:43, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Thank you very much for these links, they will be invaluable! How wonderful it must be to live on that magical island :) By the way, I did an article for Roma Abbey today, it might be of interest for you as it might fit into your template somewhere, possibly. Catch you later, Yakikaki (talk) 20:55, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

@Yakikaki: A very nice article.^^ And such a lovely place. If you are interested [10] [11] [12] [13] [14]. Here on the island we view all of these as one unit. Roma abbey is so much more than just the abbey. Bye for now, :) - W.carter (talk) 23:17, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

By the way, I realised I forgot to tell you, I've made Stora Hästnäs and Katthamra now also, in case they would fit in somewhere in a wider Gotland perspective :) Have a nice evening, Yakikaki (talk) 18:28, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

@Yakikaki: Hello my friend! Thank you for the articles they are very nice and I am very tempted to expand the later. Right now we are entering the most chaotic time of the year here on Gotland, and I will have very little time to edit on the Wikipedia until about 12–18 of August. I will be working long hours every day now. During the next week I will be AFK most of the time since we then have the Almedalen Week (you might have heard of it) in Visby which means work about 12 hours a day for me. It is an election year and 3,281 political events are scheduled for our tiny town. All of us who live here will have to help out to make the whole thing work. The population density of Visby will then rival that of Shanghai or even Kolkata. There are webcams all over town (they are always there) if you want to see what it look like the link is here. There are a number of other cams in Visby and on Gotland listed there as well. As soon as all this is over I will have to go back to finish John Bauer (illustrator). It was written rather hastily to get some peace with a troublesome editor. After that it is back to the Gotland articles again. :) I am very happy to see that Krenakarore is not gone, just busy. He's such a great guy. I will get back to you and The Wikipedia as soon as my regular work allows it. Be well, - W.carter (talk) 19:55, 25 June 2014 (UTC) P.S. The Almedalen week is sunday-sunday 29 June - 6 July. - W.carter (talk) 19:58, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Gryta Church

Gatoclass (talk) 00:03, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

Greetings From the Almedalen Week!

@Yakikaki:@Philg88:Hello my friends! Right now it's work, work, work, but I decided to do something "useful" as well. So I brought my camera along today and made a nuisance of myself. This resulted in a new category on the Wiki Commons. These are my pictures. I don't think anyone has beaten me to it. Best, - W.carter (talk) 23:13, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Looks like you've been busy, be careful you don't get a reputation as a paparazzo . Cheers,  Philg88 ^♦talk 04:26, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

Oh, very nice! You're a good photographer, I must say! And what a crowd in that beautiful little city :O Cheers, Yakikaki (talk) 14:10, 1 July 2014 (UTC)

Still Not Completely clear on the archive citing

Hey, it's me from the teahouse again. Thought it was better to continue this away from the general discussion as it's getting pretty detailed. So I want to add another reference to an archived site: https://web.archive.org/web/20120223011013/http://web1.eng.coventry.ac.uk/moka/ I see that in the cite web template there are two fields URL and Archive URL. But, and I'm sure I'm missing something obvious, it's still not completely clear to me what goes in each. I'll use this one as an example. My first thought would be to use "http://web1.eng.coventry.ac.uk/moka/" as the URL and "https://web.archive.org/web/20120223011013/http://web1.eng.coventry.ac.uk/moka/" as the archive URL. But my concern is that if I do that when a user goes to check out the ref they will first click on the non archived link and it won't work. It seems like what you did was to use the archived link for both the URL and the Archive URL (but I'm not sure I'm reading it correctly). That avoids the problem of having a dead link in the reference but then I don't see why we would use both to begin with. --MadScientistX11 (talk) 16:03, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

@MadScientistX11:Hello and welcome to my talk page! The archive links are really tricky. :( A archive link actually consists of two parts. As you can see there are two http's in the normal web link. The archive links in the Template:Cite web are designed to be used in two consecutive parts (you can see them in the two columns, one must be followed by the other) like this archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/ (this is the address to the archive) and url=http://web1.eng.coventry.ac.uk/moka/ (this is the url in the archive, the one you enter in the search box of the archive) as the second part.

You can try these two steps on your browser, it becomes somewhat clearer then. The numbers in between the two http's are just so you come to the exact page when using the whole link and not to all the pages archived from that site. But that does not always work with all archives or with all browsers so the correct way would be to write url=https://web.archive.org/web/20120223011013/http://web1.eng.coventry.ac.uk/moka/ and archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/ but that it is confusing as heck for the reader. I spent hours trying to figure it out the first time I encountered it. In the end I settled for using both parts (that is the whole long url) in both places and it works well, and it eliminates the wrong-click for the user. The most important part is to include the "deadlink=" and the "archive-date=" since these tell whoever comes next what has happened, the url's are just addresses to find the page so if it works: use it.

Hope that you are not completely confused by now... If you just copy the things I made in the example, in that order, and check so no part turns red, then it's ok. And if something does not work, just holler here. :) Best, - W.carter (talk) 17:06, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

That was completely clear and I totally get it. No not really but that definitely helped a lot. I really do think I've mostly got it. As always, best way is to try and do it and make sure nothing turns red and it works. I'll let you know if I need more help. Thanks again! --MadScientistX11 (talk) 17:24, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

JB for GA?

@Philg88: Hej Kompis! By now I have cramped all the facts I can find at the moment into John Bauer (illustrator). I've searched the Internet for anything useful and read all the available books. There is one biography from 1935 that eludes me, but I've placed requests at several online antiquarian shops, so it might turn up later in time for the article to be reviewed for FA :). (That is still my dream and we will want to have something new to present to the readers then, won't we.^^) I have copy edited the article as much as I can, but there are some things in the style I use that I am unsure of if they are "allowed" in an encyclopedia. The refs have been made more specific. One of them might not meet the standards since it is a blog. It is the main museum for JB's art, the Jömköpings museum, which is trying to be "modern" and publish some of the research in a blog rather than on the normal website. (Good Greif!) There are also some refs to some facts that were in the article before I started working on it. I cannot vouch for them 100%, but they seems valid so I've kept them. The Wikipedia:Good article criteria have been read and I hope I understood them correctly. There are a couple of passages where the text might be tainted by the exuberant language in some of the books. I've tried to tone it down and factyfied (is that even a word?) it as much as I can without loosing the inherent meaning of the text. In the middle of all this, another editor found out that the title About Gnomes and Trolls is written with capitals in the English translation and moved that article to a new place. I hope I've found and corrected all the places where the title is mentioned. All in all I'm ready to let go of the text for now and turn it over to some more able editors. So, where do we go from here? Do I start with placing it in line at the Copy Writhers Guild? Best, - W.carter (talk) 08:57, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

This creates a bit of a dilemma in that if I do the copyediting then I can't do the GA review. Conversely, if you request a copyedit from GOCE it might not get picked up for a couple of months (there are still requests outstanding from May). The same (or worse) delay would probably occur after requesting a GA review. It's a shame I can't do both really, but those are the rules. So, it's up to you my friend to decide what to do. Best,  Philg88 ^♦talk 09:09, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: I know, you've told me this before.:) It's a no-brainer for me. I would really want you to do the GA review, and besides I already got Einar Jolin waiting in line at the GA page, so it would be bad manners to put another one there. I'll just see if I can't ask someone else to do the CE, and if that does not work I'll just put it in line at the CE Guild. I don't mind the waiting. Standing in line is a Grand National Sport here in Sweden and we are all champions.:) And I do have some other things to do in the mean time. I'll let you know how it goes. Best, - W.carter (talk) 09:24, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

Cool, standing by :)  Philg88 ^♦talk 09:38, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: On second thought, never mind. If you read something here before, forget about it! I was just being insecure and silly. You have far better things to do. Sorry for bothering you. Cheers, - W.carter (talk) 17:44, 7 July 2014 (UTC)

No bother, and I read what you posted. There could undoubtedly be improvements made to the structure and flow of that article, but it's by no means a train wreck. Copyediting is to a degree subjective and different editors have different preferences and abilities. Bear in mind that English Wikipedia now has millions of articles and it would be impossible to polish every one of them to perfection. As time passes, that will change and maybe in one or two hundred years time the encyclopedia will be perfect in every respect. Best,  Philg88 ^♦talk 05:43, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

@Philg88: Thank you for your patience. You are too kind answering.:) I did not mean to say that all articles must be written in perfect language, I only thought that maybe my skills were way of and that I was contributing to the deterioration of this eminent encyclopedia by writing here in a language that I do not fully comprehend. But I've decided put such thoughts aside and just concentrate on getting the facts right since that is what counts the most. Right now I'm off to the library to collect some books that will hopefully set the Götheborg (ship) right. Cheers, - W.carter (talk) 07:44, 8 July 2014 (UTC)