User talk:Tabletop/Archive03

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• User talk:Tabletop/Archive1
• User talk:Tabletop/Archive02 (01 Dec 2009)
• User talk:Tabletop/Archive03 (01 Apr 2012)

Proposed deletion of Violator (band)

The article Violator (band) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Doesn't meet notability requirements.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{dated prod}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{dated prod}} will stop the Proposed Deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The Speedy Deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and Articles for Deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. I dream of horses If you reply here, please leave me a {{Talkback}} message on my talk page. @ 03:20, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Tabletop. You have new messages at SchuminWeb's talk page.
Message added 05:26, 5 December 2009 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

SchuminWeb (Talk) 05:26, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

by-election

you know... you didn't actually fix it... Timeshift (talk) 13:17, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Some of it is fixed, but not the party colour.

Buenos Aires, Colombia

Hi, I just noticed that you created the article Buenos Aires, Colombia with no information or references about it. The one link you have is to some rain collection website where it says that Buenos Aires is an hacienda i.e. a farmhouse of no notability or importance. Furthermore is not a town as you indicated but a farm[1].

Please delete or submit this article for speedy deletion. mijotoba (talk) 05:41, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia articles should not be based in presumed notability. Furthermore, the cited article, and the sources in that article are from a chatroom on an Australian website. It has no clear notability or importance, Buenos Aires is merely a route. It is not in Santander as the geotag indicates, the naming of the article is elusive, the article cannot be extended further, and it is based on a future project of renovation. Just because it exists does not automatically make it of encyclopaedic value. See Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not and Wikipedia:Starting_an_article#Things_to_avoid, they say an article should not be "A single sentence or only a website link" which this article is, "directory" "guidebook" or "crystal ball", which this article aims to be. mijotoba (talk) 08:21, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Afd on Daniel S. Razón

Hi, as a previous contributor to the Daniel S. Razón article, it may interest you to know that it is currently being nominated for deletion due to unnotability. You can find the Afd on this page Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Daniel_S._Razón. Thank you and Happy New Year! – Shannon Rose ^Talk 18:45, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

Five Swedish feet

5 Swedish feet = 1435mm? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.102.47.215 (talk) 05:48, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Georg Stevnsen ? Tabletop (talk) 11:05, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

George Stephenson, an Englishman chose Swedish measurement. 121.102.47.215 (talk) 03:55, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

• 3 Swedish Feet = 891mm
• 1 Swedish Foot = 297mm
• 5 Swedish Feet = 1485mm not 1435mm !!!!!! Tabletop (talk) 23:28, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

Fallingrain Blacklisting

In the time since you were last active, Fallingrain has been added to the list of candidate sites for blacklisting from Wikipedia. As such, you should not be adding any new links to it at all, for any reason, as it increases the cleanup job before the blacklist entry is activated (this would make articles with fallingrain links uneditable). Orderinchaos 14:11, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

I honestly thought we have been through this before at some considerable length regarding Western Australian rail locations - they are problematic and unhelpful additions to anything to do with Australian railway locations - and the places exist and already have the info and you add a dubious external link? Please do not add SatuSuro 22:49, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

North America

• Alaska should convert from 1435 to 1524 and electrification 25 kV 50 Hz alternating current
• Canada and United States (except Alaska) should convert 1435 to 1676 and electrification 25 kV 60 Hz alternating current.
  • 1676 is a stupid choice of gauge for another reason, as it is too close to 1435 to allow "strong" 3-rail, dual gauge; 1828mm (6' 0") would be a better choice.
    • Spain has 1435 and 1676 dual gauge quite successfully. Tabletop (talk) 23:45, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
  • North America (and the Pilbara) uses very heavy and strong rails compared to other parts of the world, which makes it unnecessary to change the gauge.
    • Russia, Central Asia and Baltic States not North America uses very heavy and strong rails compared to other parts of the world, which makes it unnecessary to change the gauge. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.102.47.215 (talk) 03:35, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
• Russia - Alaska - Canada rail link should be built
• SUW 2000 (Variable Gauge Axle) should use between 1524 and 1676 at Alaska / Canada border and in Central Asia / Afghanistan area
• Standard gauge is too narrow for Canada and United States.
  • Trains in United States and Canada cannot run as fast as either in Russia or India.
    • Not so. Russia and India are not particuloarly fast. All the real fast lines are 1435 gauge.
    • The heaviest axle loads are in the Pilbara.
• Mexico should remain standard gauge
• Guatemala should convert to standard gauge

121.102.47.215 (talk) 03:50, 17 March 2010 (UTC)

4-rail dual gauge

possible 4-rail dual gauge pattern
gauge 1 - gauge 2 - gauge 3
1000 - 1067 - 1,267 mm
1000 - 1067 - 1435
1435 - 1524 (1520mm) - 1829 (1828mm)
1435 - 1524 (1520mm) - 1945
1524 (1520mm) - 1676 - 1945
1524 (1520mm) - 1676 - 2140 (2134mm)
121.102.47.215 (talk) 03:50, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

confused

On Simandou, you put an existing albeit possibly defunct IIRC standard gauge railway. What does IIRC stand for? I can think of one, but it doesn't sound right. Griffinofwales (talk) 16:19, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

IIRC = If I Remember Correctly. Tabletop (talk) 03:27, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

That's what I thought. That shouldn't be in an encyclopedic article. Could you check that, and make sure? WP can't cite your memory. Griffinofwales (talk) 15:39, 20 March 2010 (UTC)

Skelani

It's such a pleasure coming across people being helpful at Wikipedia! Thanks. Opbeith (talk) 22:40, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

And thanks again! Opbeith (talk) 23:00, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

Treadle (railway)

Hi. Could you have another look at the edit you made to Treadle (railway), please, 'cos it doesn't quite make sense.

Cheers -- EdJogg (talk) 12:50, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

Quite so! Fixed. Tabletop (talk) 13:22, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the fix, but having now read the other article, I'm not sure your fix was right, and I have adjusted it further! Also, purists might argue that the only similarity is that they are both flange-operated electrical switches, otherwise functionally and physically they are different. If I have got the wrong end of the stick, feel free to change it again. :o) -- EdJogg (talk) 13:50, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

Source of the list of railway stations in the Democratic Republic of the Congo

Could you mention the source(s) of the List of railway stations in the Democratic Republic of the Congo you wrote? I have some other information, but befor changing or deleting, I would like compare the different references.--195.28.224.59 (talk) 06:15, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

From the maps. Tabletop (talk) 11:23, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Leon train crash

I believe you amended the entry for the Leon train crash in Spain within List of rail accidents (pre-1950)#1944 to include a possible alternative date of 16th January, with this citation, I have looked around and all other references quote 3rd January (including those in Spanish) I therefore intend to remove reference to 16th January and stick with 3rd January; I trust this is OK, Thanks GrahamHardy (talk) 21:10, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

I don't remember making such change. Tabletop (talk) 03:44, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

Articles for deletion nomination of Cement in Africa

I have nominated Cement in Africa, an article that you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cement in Africa. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time.

Please contact me if you're unsure why you received this message. SnottyWong talk 18:49, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Articles for deletion nomination of Keith Smith (engineer)

I have nominated Keith Smith (engineer), an article that you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Keith Smith (engineer). Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time.

Please contact me if you're unsure why you received this message. Fæ (talk) 12:16, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer

Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

Reviewers can review edits made by users who are not autoconfirmed to articles placed under flagged protection. Flagged protection is applied to only a small number of articles, similarly to how semi-protection is applied but in a more controlled way for the trial.

When reviewing, edits should be accepted if they are not obvious vandalism or BLP violations, and not clearly problematic in light of the reason given for protection (see Wikipedia:Reviewing process). More detailed documentation and guidelines can be found here.

If you do not want this userright, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. Courcelles (talk) 21:03, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Sundance Resources Limited

I've done a bit of work on your Sundance Resources Limited article and nominated it for DYK, with your name of the creator, its listed under 23 June. Lets hope it gets through! Calistemon (talk) 09:28, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

DYK?? Tabletop (talk) 10:43, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Did You Know? is the little section on the bottom left of the Main Page for the newest articles on Wikipedia. See also: Template talk:Did you know. Calistemon (talk) 11:17, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Model rail project

See Model railways.

DYK for Sundance Resources Limited

— Rlevse • Talk • 18:03, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

AfD nomination of Metallurgical education

An article that you have been involved in editing, Metallurgical education, has been listed for deletion. If you are interested in the deletion discussion, please participate by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Metallurgical education. Thank you.

Please contact me if you're unsure why you received this message. Fiddle Faddle (talk) 17:59, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Stephen Angulalik

I notice that earlier you added a map to Stephen Angulalik, but the map you added would appear to be in Africa somewhere.

Whoops. These updates are not automatic or bot-driven. Tabletop (talk) 11:13, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Enter CBW, waits for audience applause, not a sausage. 07:55, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

Spelling corrections in quotes

With reference to Thomas Baltzar, please don't correct spelling to modern English unless you can verify that was the speling used inthe original, 17th century English spelling was not so fixed, both the words you corrected were spelt the "wrong" way in the source. David Underdown (talk) 16:34, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

You corrected the spelling in Protohistory of West Virginia [Spell peice => piece] taken from Wood's 1674 letter in quote. Now, no longer is it considered a direct quote. Some law officials question this practice of editing or modifying original quotes. You now have it as now a misquote. Because this website is not an academic environment nor a court of law, but, simply a Wiki article, I'll thank you for your assistance. Otherwise, I would have been reprimanded for letting one of my company clerks (secretaries) changing the spelling or teminology within a direct quote to be used in an official capacity. Thanks again for your enthusiasm and help, Conaughy (talk) 11:24, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

The following should of course not be corrected:

• http:// addresses
• Image addresses .jpg
• File addresses .doc
• proper names usually identified by initial capital letter. (Is Wahington DC correct?)
• foreign languages
• historical misspelling (but how many centuries does this go back?)
• more than one plausible correction (payed => paid) or (actor payed role = actor played role)
• words marked with "sic".

It is not possible to get this all correct all the time.

It would be helpful if there could be searchable keyword(s) such as:

• or (doubtful) (3964) or
• {{spellerr}} or (spellerr) (0000)

where by uncertain spellings can be marked for later attention, so the the observed misspelling is not lost.

• doubtful is a real word and will match distractions.
• spellerr is a contrived word and ought to only match the doubtful spellings.

Tabletop (talk) 23:51, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

Transport naming consistency

You moved at least one Transport page (Venezuela). Your move is mentioned at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2010_September_9#Category:Transportation_in_Venezuela. Maybe you like to vote on category consistency. TruckCard (talk) 13:23, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

Falling Rain

I noticed that you intentionally removed Falling Rain from external links on Kehar. It used to be used quite widely in Wikipedia; is it no longer considered reliable? - Fayenatic (talk) 09:03, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

The population figures in FR are apparently rubbish and Wiki should not access such stuff as it gives false credance. Personally, I think that the FR maps are useful, as they display three scales simultaneously. Tabletop (talk) 10:14, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Nomination of Steel in Africa for deletion

A discussion has begun about whether the article Steel in Africa, which you created or to which you contributed, should be deleted. While contributions are welcome, an article may be deleted if it is inconsistent with Wikipedia policies and guidelines for inclusion, explained in the deletion policy.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steel in Africa until a consensus is reached, and you are welcome to contribute to the discussion.

You may edit the article during the discussion, including to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 06:21, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Scool is spelled S-c-o-o-l.

Your attempts to correct the townland name Scool have been reverted. The name of the townland is Scool. Please check spellings before deciding they are wrong. Double-checking your assumptions is a simple thing to do online. You can see on this map that the correct spelling is Scool. Scool is not the English word school; it is an anglicisation of the original Irish name Cnoc an Scúmhail (pronounced scool) meaning "hill of the declivity". --O'Dea (talk) 23:09, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Most of the 20 odd scools were indeed misspelled schools. Also schoools. If scools is part of say a .svg it is not changed, if the .svg is spotted. Tabletop (talk) 11:31, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Your destruction of links in 23 many articles

You deleted citation links to fallingrain.com in 23 different a great many articles without explanation on the 24th and 25th of September 2010. I was about to begin repairing your vandalism but I ask you to do it; why should I do this work? You should not have deleted those links. Some merely need <ref> and </ref> fixes and others merely need the new links to be substituted, as the old ones have changed very slightly. Some of the deletions you performed were subsequently adjusted by a bot, but still need to be fixed, as in the case of Mizak where the link simply needed to be changed from http://www.fallingrain.com/world/AF/1/Mizak.html to http://www.fallingrain.com/world/AF/01/Mizak.html (I fixed that one). You could have found this out simply by following the link instead of destroying it. You make bad edits to articles because you dive in blindly without checking anything. I will look at these articles at a later point; if they have been left as they are, I will report you for vandalism. This is the list of articles you changed which need to have the FallingRain link fixed:

• Al Jabalayn
• Ashnam
• Clarendon Park, Jamaica
• Cossimbazar
• Jafarpur
• Kabrai
• Karlslunde
• Knapsack, Germany
• Langar, Badakhshan
• Mangochi
• Mayani Bird Sanctuary
• Mizak
• Namrup
• Nandurbar
• Narok
• Nkhotakota
• Peddathippasamudram
• Phaltan
• Roda, Portugal
• Stoccareddo
• Talaguppa
• Tikjda
• Yacharam

--O'Dea (talk) 23:34, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

I notice you have been deleting many FallingRain links at least as far back as July (I became tired of checking before that). Why do you not include meaningful edit summaries that explain your rationale, if you have one? del FR is insufficient and opaque. --O'Dea (talk) 23:47, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Fallingrain

Others have determined that Fallingrain links are unsuitable for use in Wiki due to incorrect population statistics, and should therefore be removed. I have been removing such links in accordance with this determination.

There used to be a topic Fallingrain which explained the advantages and disadvantages of this link, but this was deleted by yet others as something unsuitable as a topic on wiki.

Personally, I think that the 3 level maps of Fallingrain were useful, as explained in the deleted topic, however this is apparently overridden by the statistical issue.

If Fallingrain is useful, then the Fallingrain topic should be restored.

When Fallingrain was still an approved link, my edit summary was FRMap, which matches the more recent Del FR summary.

Tabletop (talk) 00:25, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

If it is thought that the source is unsuitable for some reason, you are still obliged by Wikipedia rules of good practice to make your edit summaries meaningful, particularly where another editor cannot infer your mindset. It is almost effortless to create this text: "Deleting FallingRain link deemed by some to contain inaccurate data, and thus unsuitable for Wikipedia", then copy that to your clipboard and paste it into every summary. It takes only seconds. Can you provide evidence of this unsuitability determination you mentioned? --O'Dea (talk) 00:37, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Orderinchaos says it is blacklisted.

I can only see him claiming it is inaccurate; he does not mention any blacklist. On another note, I request that you keep this discussion intact by keeping it all here on your talk page since this is where it began. You can alert me to your comments here by posting {{talkback|Tabletop}} at my talk page. I am deleting your comments on my talk page as unnecessary duplication. Thank you. --O'Dea (talk) 01:00, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

See: FR Blacklist].

The remarks at Orderinchaos's page are actually by Dr. Blofeld. I am going to read your link now, or at least I will scan it: it is horribly long. But please don't forget about the necessity of good edit summaries: they are vital. --O'Dea (talk) 01:06, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Chudleigh

(as found comment at Zeehan railway station) - Please - if you are going to adventure into the realm of proposed and crazy rail projects that existed between 1880's and the 1920's in Tasmania - either a separate list article about 'Proposed rail schemes' - and please do not pollute existing articles with all that - otherwise the good example of a separate article for a scheme would be http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Western_Railway_(Tasmania) - which is the quality required for each of what is probably about 40 separate proposals in that era to be anotable free standing article. Otherwise talk pages of railway stations are not the place for thje information - the number of really crazy proposals like the Chudleigh one do not in most cases deserve separate articles as they died a natural death - despite parliamentary approval SatuSuro 03:18, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Note that I did put the Chudleigh item in the talk pages rather than the main article, on the basis that it was tentative.

If you do create a stub or two - here is a category http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Proposed_railways_in_Tasmania - please - in WP:AGF if you do not have many WP:RS - alert me and I can offer you some help - if you ask for it - however if you create some stubs like some of the south australian and western australian ones from a year or so ago I am more likely to put them up for Afd - please if you find a few why dont we jointly create a list rather than scattered info? SatuSuro 03:56, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Railways on the West Coast of Tasmania has a sub-topic Proposed but not constructed for still-born proposals, and that could be a good place to also mention the Chudleigh Zeehan Railway. Currently only the ZGWRT is listed. Tabletop (talk) 05:11, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Excellent - I must try to find the lists I have - I know there were 10 or major proposed that never happend - and I think the rest (30 or more) go through country in Tasmania that even up to now have no roads even... - thanks for pointing out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railways_on_the_West_Coast_of_Tasmania#Proposed_but_not_constructed - probably will get some more into there soon... SatuSuro 09:57, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

International Racquetball Federation

I deleted that page (three years ago!) because the text was copied from another website in violation of copyright. There is absolutely nothing stopping you from writing a new page at that title. Hut 8.5 10:42, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Kisumu

I saw that you contributed to Kisumu, I was wondering whether we could work together to update the Kisumu page which currently reads like a travel brochure, which is very undeserving for a leading town in East Africa. If possible could you constructively help me make it better, I am hoping to get together a work group of contributers to help out so that it is something close to the Nairobi page. I will be working on this for the next week or two, if you have some spare time I will be glad if you could help me open up Kisumu to the world. Thanks!--Krator1 (talk) 22:29, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Some questions about rail articles

Hi,

• You recently added a "circle railway" and a list of breaks-of-gauge to Rail transport in Afghanistan: [2] Which was quite surprising. Do you have a source for that? Was something published recently?
  
• Similarly with a recent mention of FERISTSA offering high speed rail [3] - where did that come from?
  
• What source are you using for altitudes of railway stations?
• You seem to have created some articles for "Railway stations in country X" where country X does not actually have any railways, or has very little, and any content might reasonably go in the existing "Rail transport in country X" article which is often not even linked from the stations article. Why was this? In other cases, a stations-in-country-Y article has been created substantially overlaps any coverage of real stations in the main "rail transport in Y" article; in either case the duplication makes make it hard to keep articles up to date, especially if articles lack links to each other. Sometimes the sources for the actual lists of stations seem to be missing, too. I suppose there must have been a good reason for this; could you shed more light on the subject?
  

Thanks - bobrayner (talk) 01:56, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

The list of stations in AF comes from this map: It comes in this month's RGI.

The name of the "circle" line in AF is unclear. Note that it is referred to in lower case.

A say Railway stations in Afghanistan separate from say Transport in Afghanistan is desirable for:

keeping the files from growing too large.

keeping the edit summary from growing too large also.

The elevations mostly come from Fallingrain.

Sources for railway stations, and the lines between them, mostly come from maps, such as MSN which unhelpfully is not working at present.

Someone else said that FERISTSA would/could carry passengers.

A null entry for a country with no railways still makes some sense so that the Category mentions all countries.

The list of stations in Afghanistan can therefore be put back. Wouldn't it have been better to have queried this item before deleting it, rather than deleting it first?

Tabletop (talk) 03:36, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately:

These are not "null entries", and anybody wanting a category full of countries would not seek it out in a category of rail articles. There are railway-stations-in-X articles which give pages of strangely-laid-out content which bears little relation to the actual situation; and it is difficult for a reader to get the correct information this since the articles often do not link to overlapping articles which do have appropriate content. And so on. In what way is Railway stations in Burundi a "null entry" to you? To me it looks like a couple of pages of strangely-formatted stuff about cities and maps, but a reader would have to scroll all the way to the bottom and click on a link to another article before they discovered that there are no railway stations in Burundi. There are many such articles; intrinsically misleading and unmaintainable. Oddly, articles seem not to have been created for some countries that do have a lot of stations. Yemen and Bhutan get a listing, but China and Russia don't. (Even within Africa: There is a listing for Guinea-Bissau, which has no railways; but not for South Africa, which has a functioning rail network). I am struggling to see the reasoning behind several aspects of this system; can you explain?

Is there any risk that an article will grow too large when a country has little or no railway? The common layout of "Railway stations in country X" articles is not very space efficient, but with a more conventional article layout it would be very difficult for most countries to grow "too large".

Fallingrain is hardly a reliable source if used according to the label. I believe this has been pointed out repeatedly. However, simply using fallingrain's best guess of an altitude for some part of a settlement near a station will guarantee errors - it's unencyclopaedic, especially so if uncited. (Quick examples: fallingrain thinks the elevation of my home town is about 15% higher than the city centre and 30% higher than the station; it also thinks my office is at 0m even though the office is actually uphill from the nearest station...). Mapping in Africa is unreliable at the best of times; repeating distorted or dubiously-sourced information can only worsen the problem. Unless there's some compelling reason to believe that the elevations are accurate, somebody will have to remove them. How many articles have you added elevations to? If you could let me know what kind of articles (rail-related only? Or others?) then I could plan the work out.

If you use a source such as msn maps, it may be appropriate to mention that on the article so that people know its limitations - MSN has its own inaccuracies. The first example off the top of my head is the big highway built a few years ago, between Ayoun-el-Atrous and Bamako: one of the major roads in both countries, and easily seen on satellite. It simply doesn't appear on MSN maps or on the UN map. Treating a map as gospel will incubate more errors.

I think that copy & pasting false claims from one article to another can often be an unfortunate accident enabled by two problems: One is a lack of sourcing, and the other is having lots of articles that needlessly overlap each other. If we could address those two problems, then it would be easier to keep content updated to match reliable sources, and it would be harder for fiction to propagate. Do you think that would help?

Sorry about the harsh tone. I'm frustrated because I will have to spend many hours cleaning up unsourced / misleading / duplicated / unlinked stuff across hundreds of articles when I could have been making improvements elsewhere. bobrayner (talk) 23:43, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

The Bing (which replaces MSN Map) can access a town like say Nampula, Mozambique once you know its coordinates.

Now, elevations are important for railways and canals. Which maps show the elevation at a particular place? Elevations are of course located at a particular point, not an area so you cannot expect perfection. The Fallingrain elevations are reasonable in that if you follow a railway line, the elevations do not change excessively from station to station. What does Bing Map say the elevation of Nampula or Nacala port are?

There used to be a page for Fallingrain Map listing its pros and cons, but this was deleted by someone who couldn't see the point. Is there an MSN Map page, and similar pages for other maps?

A selection of maps is access by the coord function 14°32′34″S 40°40′22″E; There is no column for maps showing elevations or for maps showing railways. Mentions of rail was there at one time but was deleted by someone who couldn't see the point.

It has been established that fallingrain is not a reliable source; most of all when it comes to elevations. (See below) If the elevations cannot be trusted then they should not be put in an encylopaedia. You may feel that it's important to put elevations on all these lists, but that importance does not justify using unreliable numbers; quite the opposite. There is a lot of dubious content that somebody will have to clean up. How many articles have you added elevations to? If you could let me know what kind of articles (rail-related only? Or others?) then I could plan the work out. The same applies for "proposed" stations, fanciful lists of breaks-of-gauge, and so on.

I would also suggest that going through lots of rail articles adding a "maps" heading and then a bullet point saying "No UN map" wastes your time and more importantly wastes many readers' time. The same goes for "breaks of gauge" which are actually gauge differences between unconnected networks, &c. We don't need to fill pages with placeholders just to fit in a framework of your own creation; we don't need 2 page articles listing railway stations (and speculated elevations!) in a country that in reality has no railways; and so on.

I see that you have continued adding speculative elevations in the meantime. This is very unhelpful.

bobrayner (talk) 21:27, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

FallingRain was said to be unreliable in relation to populations, but not in relation to other characteristics. Tabletop (talk) 23:40, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Tabletop (talk) 00:37, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Nomination of Railway stations in the United States for deletion

A discussion has begun about whether the article Railway stations in the United States, which you created or to which you contributed, should be deleted. While contributions are welcome, an article may be deleted if it is inconsistent with Wikipedia policies and guidelines for inclusion, explained in the deletion policy.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Railway stations in the United States until a consensus is reached, and you are welcome to contribute to the discussion.

You may edit the article during the discussion, including to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 07:38, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Spelling corrections

Hi Tabletop, please do not correct spelling errors on talk pages as you did here. It's not necessary and can be seen as rude. Thanks! Franamax (talk) 16:24, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Spelling correction for pervious

Pervious may or may not need correction, depending on context.

Pervious => (1) opposite of (im)pervious, => (2) previous (the one before). Tabletop (talk) 00:06, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

List of steepest gradients on adhesion railways

I removed the "momentum" section that you added to List of steepest gradients on adhesion railways, because it had rather confused and misleading physics. If a train "lost all its momentum" that would mean it stopped. If you need a hand with anything like this, just shout. bobrayner (talk) 22:39, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Railways

Elevations are important for railways and canals because gradients are restricted, unlike roads. You have deleted a lot of elevations which you have deemed to be unsatisfactory, but you have not substituted improved or better values. This is going backwards.

Most countries have UN maps with a few exceptions. Saying that there are "no UN Maps" saves having to keep searching for one every time one looks at that page. This is something like the

{{empty section}}

{{coord missing}}

tags.

Should we set about deleting these because they are deemed to be useless and pointless? Tabletop (talk) 22:49, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Saying "no un map" is pointless because a random reader who ends up at a strangely-structured list of railway stations did not expect there to be a UN map anyway.

No doubt it's meaningful within your framework; every country must have a list of railway stations, so we have lots of lists even for countries with no railway stations. And every list must have particular headings that you've chosen; so if there's nothing to put under your heading, you add extra text saying that there's nothing to put under that heading. And every railway station must have an elevation; so you add numbers regardless of their source, most of which are probably false, and you consider it "going backwards" when unsourced cruft is removed because a gap has appeared in your framework. Strangely, wikilinks don't seem to be part of your framework, so there are lots of dead ends, and some of the misleading or pointless pages you created don't even link to other well-written articles on the subject which might set the record straight.

That is deeply unencyclopaedic system. It wastes readers' time, it wastes your time, and it wastes the time of whoever has to clear up the mess. Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia; additions to wikipedia must be verifiable and must not be original research.

You still seem not to have acknowledged that adding unsourced and inaccurate stuff to wikipedia articles is a bad thing. If content cannot be trusted, removing it is an improvement, it's not "going backwards".

The tags that you mention are a standard wikipedia system used to identify problems and fix them. An appropriate response to the empty section tag would be to either add meaningful content to the section, or to remove it. Your response is to create the same section on hundreds of articles regardless of whether each article needs them, and then deliberately add extra text to many of them saying that there's nothing to put in the section. That is very different. It is creating a problem, rather than solving it.

Lots of unsourced, inaccurate, misleading, or hard-to-read stuff has been added. This is a serious problem; I am trying to clean up the mess. Will you help, or will you complain and keep on doing what you were doing before?

If you would like to pursue some kind of dispute resolution or third opinion, I would be open to that.

bobrayner (talk) 23:29, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

More railways

You seem to have added this:

• Dostyk Kazakhstan - Gorgan, Iran standard gauge link China to Europe

in the "Progress" section of Trans-Asian Railway. Readers will believe that it's actually been built. In reality - according to the source you cite - it has not been built. Please don't do things like this. Wikipedia articles should be accurate. 4000km is a big gap.

Also: Please stop adding dubious elevations from unreliable sources. Please. bobrayner (talk) 14:23, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

You haven't indicated a reliable source of this information. Tabletop (talk) 08:22, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

If there's no reliable source, then don't add it, instead of pasting in information from an unreliable source. bobrayner (talk) 09:29, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

n authoritative reference was provided which you have chosed to ignore. Tabletop (talk) 00:52, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Metric Calendar

Hello Tabletop,

I saw that you made a comment about the metric calendar in the article Metrication opposition‎. Please add references and clarify the comments. Martinvl (talk) 06:34, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

There is of course a whole article on this subject, thus: French Republican Calendar.

Provincial

Did you mean to do this? 117Avenue (talk) 06:50, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

In hindsight, no. Tabletop (talk) 08:18, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Hindsight is 20/20. No problem, we all make mistakes. 117Avenue (talk) 08:40, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Ivela Falls

The article Ivela Falls has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

A search for references found one minor published (gBooks) reference to the subject, neither the article nor the reference make any claim of notability, fails WP:V and WP:N

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License tagging for File:Coupler AAR Indonesia 1067mm gauge.JPG

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Iceland

Currently, 1435mm gauge rail network is proposed for Iceland.

Details of mainline railway networks in Iceland:

• Track gauge: 1,435 mm (4 ft 8+1⁄2 in) standard gauge
• Minimum radius: 150m
• Loading gauge: small (slightly smaller than British W6a)
• Routes:

1. Reykjavík - Borgarnes - Blönduós - Akureyri - Egilsstaðir - Höfn - Selfoss - Reykjavík
2. Reykjavík - Keflavík

• Maximum speed: 100-120km/h
• Right-/left hand running: Left-hand running

• OHW Voltage: ?

See Rail transport in Iceland

121.102.122.122 (talk) 12:13, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

See 1435mm gauge is proposed for Iceland. 121.102.122.122 (talk) 05:00, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Brazil

In Brazil, all 1600mm (Irish gauge) lines got proposed to convert to 1435mm (standard gauge). 121.102.122.122 (talk) 07:38, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Any sources?

Brazil is apparently proposing that its high speed line be SG to use off the shelf equipment and presumably to make proposed links to adjacent countries easier. This would leave existing freight line aline. Tabletop (talk) 08:31, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Maps

Morecambe Branch Line
North Western Railway to Skipton Lancaster Green Ayre West Coast Main Line to Carlisle & Preston Lancaster Bare Lane Scale Hall Poulton Lane Morecambe Euston Road Middleton Road Bridge Halt Morecambe Heysham Power Station Northumberland Street Heysham Port Morecambe Harbour Morecambe Promenade

If the UN does not offer a map of a country, perhaps you might consider simply not including a map in the article; or if you do find a map from a different source which you know is not the UN, perhaps you shouldn't change the name to call it a UN map. This might give an impression that you've decided to have a UN map of each of the railway-stations-in-country-X pages that you created, and if all you can find is a CIA map, then you'll just call it a UN map. That would not be good.

Could I suggest an alternative? A lot of the lists of stations (which are actually lists of towns) seem to be split into lists of lines, and in a way, the article seems to be trying to be a map rendered into text. Would you consider creating map templates instead? For example, see the map to the right of this comment. As well as looking nicer and being much easier to read, putting a map like that into a parent article (ie. Railways in Country X) would solve a lot of the duplication & linking problems. Would you consider maps like that instead? I think they might be a better way to convey the information that you want to add to wikipedia. bobrayner (talk) 17:39, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Mozambique Railway

Dear Tabletop... seeking information on the performance of Vale in Mozambique, and on the transfer of locomotives EMD DDM45 from Brazil to Mozambique. Would have some information? Meloaraujo (talk) 00:39, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Firenze (organiser)

The article Firenze (organiser) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Not Notable. See Wikipedia:Notability#Self-promotion_and_indiscriminate_publicity. Also: No reliable sources.

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Blanche Charlet Article.

Tabletop,

Article: Blanche Charlet.

Would like to invite you to the discussion on Blanche Charlet. There has been a discussion started on her talkpage and would like your feedback. Adamdaley (talk) 00:09, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Never heard of her, except for minor spelling error correction. Tabletop (talk) 12:19, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Chandragupt Institute of Management

The article Chandragupt Institute of Management has been proposed for deletion. The proposed-deletion notice added to the article should explain why.

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Trivial edit

Hi, please don't make inconsequential edits like this especially when the edit summary is nothing to do with what you actually did. --Redrose64 (talk) 11:49, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Steam World

The article Steam World has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

This magazine fails Wikipedia:Notability (media)

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Everyone Dies In the End (talk) 08:33, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Hi, re the above notice - I'm afraid that this edit will have no bearing on the matter on its own. Proposed deletions (WP:PRODs) are not discussed: they are either contested, or they are left uncontested. To contest a PROD, you need to remove the {{Proposed deletion/dated}} from the top of the article; your post to the talk page is merely an optional action. Whilst this discussion won't affect the PROD, it could affect whether or not a subsequent WP:AFD is raised. If the {{Proposed deletion/dated}} is not removed, it counts as an uncontested PROD, so after seven days the article will be deleted, regardless of any discussion. --Redrose64 (talk) 13:43, 4 March 2011 (UTC)

Nomination of Steam World for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Steam World is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Steam World until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

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Nomination of Railway stations in Burundi for deletion

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Nomination of Railway stations in Niger for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Railway stations in Niger is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Railway stations in Niger until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

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Nomination of Railway stations in Yemen for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Railway stations in Yemen is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

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Nomination of Railway stations in the Central African Republic for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Railway stations in the Central African Republic is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Railway stations in the Central African Republic until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. bobrayner (talk) 09:40, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

Nomination of Railway stations in Guinea-Bissau for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Railway stations in Guinea-Bissau is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Railway stations in Guinea-Bissau until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. bobrayner (talk) 09:47, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

April 2011

Your addition to Railway stations in Yemen has been removed, as it appears to have added copyrighted material to Wikipedia without permission from the copyright holder. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other websites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. You may use external websites or publications as a source of information, but not as a source of article content such as sentences or images. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously and persistent violators will be blocked from editing.

Since it was last July, I'll remind you that it was this edit. Tim PF (talk) 14:46, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

Thank you for your contributions. Please remember to mark your edits, such as your recent edits to Railway station layout, as "minor" only if they truly are minor edits. In accordance with Help:Minor edit, a minor edit is one that the editor believes requires no review and could never be the subject of a dispute. Minor edits consist of things such as typographical corrections, formatting changes, or rearrangement of text without modification of content. Additionally, the reversion of clear-cut vandalism and test edits may be labeled "minor". Thank you. Tim PF (talk)

Constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, but a recent edit of yours to the article Railway station layout has an edit summary that appears to be inaccurate or inappropriate. Please use edit summaries that accurately tell other editors what you did, and feel free to use the sandbox for any tests you may want to do. Your unsourced edit has also been reverted. Tim PF (talk) 10:43, 9 April 2011 (UTC)

Loading gauges in Eritrea

Hi,
Do you have a source for the details of Loading Gauge Eritrea.jpg? According to the file description, you created the image by yourself; where did you get the dimensions from? bobrayner (talk) 11:38, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

From memory, the underlying loading gauge diagram is probably from Janes. The dimensions of the overlying containers are from the standard ISO containers.

or you may try [4]

or try Containters to Asmara - 8'0" or 9'6" height?

Tabletop (talk) 04:30, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Does external link infringe copyright?

The external link 8'0" containers at least do fit in tunnels.

• Does this link infringe copyright?

• Can one cut and paste just enough of one picture of this file to show the container fitting in the tunnel under the "fair dealing" rule? In one country at least the fair dealing rule allows you to copy 10% or one chapter (whichever is left) without infringing copyright. The suggested extract of the container going through a tunnel is only say 2% of the file.

Tabletop (talk) 06:45, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Railway stations in Mongolia

The article Railway stations in Mongolia has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Doesn't actually name any railway stations

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. bobrayner (talk) 11:45, 11 April 2011 (UTC)

Crawford Notch image

Hi - I notice that about once a year you correct the spelling of the word "Mountain" in the Crawford Notch article. I would like to correct it, too, but as used in the article it is the file name for an image showing a painting of the notch, and changing the spelling renders the image undisplayable. Do you know how to move an image file to a file with a different name? If so, you could fix the spelling error that way; otherwise, we need to leave it as it is. Thanks for keeping an eye on the article. --Ken Gallager (talk) 14:14, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Possibly unfree File:ERTMS logo.jpg

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:ERTMS logo.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree files because its copyright status is unclear or disputed. If the file's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the file description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. --bobrayner (talk) 15:44, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Spelling corrections in image names

Please do not spell-check image names as you did here, because the link becomes broken. Thanks. --Redrose64 (talk) 21:32, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

I normally don't, but occasionally one does not notice that it is an image or file. Tabletop (talk) 09:19, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Is there a way of correcting a mispelled image name or file name?? Tabletop (talk) 09:19, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Move the file - it's like moving a page but regular users (like me) can't do it, see WP:MOF. --Redrose64 (talk) 21:51, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Ouse Valley Railway

The Ouse Valley Railway was political. The idea was to keep the SER out of LBSC territory. If you look at the LBSC map, very few non-LBSC lines got built in their territory once you left the immediate outskirts of London. The financial side was secondary. Mjroots (talk) 13:36, 14 May 2011 (UTC)

Railway station layout

In this edit, you managed to add 3 links, two of which (St Ives and DMUs) lead to disambiguation pages, whilst the third (Top and Tail trains) pointed to a redirect page, due to its incorrect use of capital letters. I've fixed them, along with providing a link to Belmont, New South Wales.

I actually had a good look around for a Belmont railway station, but it lists none in NSW. As I'm sure others have pointed out to you, such links should really point to an article about the actual railway station if possible, and all additions should really be cited, unless obvious from the linked article(s).

As usual, please reply here if you wish. Tim PF (talk) 14:07, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

Break-of-gauge

I know that most of your recent edits are genuine minor edits for spelling changes, etc., but your two edits to Break-of-gauge were not; please take care to uncheck the minor edit box when switching edit modes. Tim PF (talk)

In addition, both your edits were uncited, and I cannot understand why Thailand has a problem with Break-of-gauge between neighbouring countries' meter gauge tracks and its own metre gauge tracks. Tim PF (talk) 12:26, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Thailand had two gauges in the say 1920s, and after a period of dual gauge, changed to metre gauge to be compatible with neighbouring countries. Tabletop (talk) 01:06, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

If you actually had a reference for that, it might help, but I fail to see the relevance of that now. Tim PF (talk) 07:15, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

Tabletop, I see that you have created a user page for Tim PF, rather than replying here (or replying at his talk page). Wikipedia did formerly have such a setting; it was in Special:Preferences → Editing → Advanced options → Mark all edits minor by default. However it was recently disabled because too many editors were marking major edits as minor, not having read Help:Minor edit (or ignoring it). See Help talk:Minor edit#Should we remove the Preference setting to "Mark all edits minor by default" ?, Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)/Archive 69#"Mark all edits as minor by default" should be disabled, and bugzilla:24313. --Redrose64 (talk) 14:15, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Since 99% of my edits are minor ones, I should be able to select MINOR edits as the default, and switch to MAJOR edits for the for the 1% that are indeed MAJOR. This would greatly reduce my workload.

Unfortunately, Wiki does not have such a selectable default setting.

If I occasionally forget to NOT select MINOR edit, this is bound to happen.

You could help by persuading Wiki to provide such a selection switch, that would be appreciated.

Tabletop (talk) 13:13, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I'm not happy that my user page was vandalised created; I have asked for it to be deleted with {{db-u1}}, and have moved your reply here, more-or-less in thread. Tim PF (talk) 16:05, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Could you set up an alternative account (eg User:Tabletop2) which is set up to be used for the minor tyop edits? I know you'd have to make it clear that they are both you, and for different purposes, and then be careful to use the right one, but that should be no more onerous than checking that you are editing the correct page, or that the typo does need to be corrected. Oh, yes, I see your point. Tim PF (talk) 16:11, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Switching between two similarly named accounts is not a bad idea, with a few flaws like growing you edit count at a slower rate. Tabletop (talk) 01:03, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

The phrase Never mind the quality, feel the width comes to mind here. Tim PF (talk) 07:15, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

I think a second account would be a very good idea. Other contributors would really like to be able to look through your rail-related edits and see if there's anything that would benefit from further improvement. When dealing with past issues I've found it very hard to separate rail-related edits from the surge of typo fixes in your contribution history. If edit count is really important, just add two numbers together... bobrayner (talk) 15:17, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Railpage.com.au

Hi,
I've noticed that you've made a lot of refs to forums on railpage.com.au. For instance, Railway stations in Iran references this thread. Now, a lot of the meat of those forum posts is just copy & pasted from other news articles, so it's more reliable than many other forums, but we should never link to copyright violations. It seems very unlikely that all these different forum threads have permission from rail news sources to copy & paste their articles. If it's on that forum, surely it's possible to find an original copy of the news article somewhere else... no? bobrayner (talk) 10:08, 22 May 2011 (UTC)

Gosford vs Gosford railway station

Hi Tabletop, I notice that you made an uncited addition to Loading gauge which said The narrow widths in NSW are mostly eliminated, except at Gosford., but you also made related changes to Gosford railway station. I note that Gosford redirects to Gosford, New South Wales, which you haven't changed. If the only loading gauge problem is at Gosford railway station, then the link should have pointed there (without any piping), otherwise you should have changed the Gosford, New South Wales article. Please take care to make the correct link, to save readers having to follow two links, instead of one. Tim PF (talk) 21:31, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

I have read about the loading gauge issue at Gosford in the hard copy and official Weekly Notice publication (which BTW is published every week) but do not have a link to any website. Hence it is cited. The structure gauge matter in Australia and even within NSW is messy and needs a rewrite. Tabletop (talk) 01:40, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

No, your edit to Loading gauge is clearly uncited, and neither does it add a link to an article where it is cited. You did partially cite it in Gosford railway station (weekly notices should include an issue or validity date), but that was not the article to which you linked your loading gauge addition. Tim PF (talk)

Of course the Weekly notice doesn't say everything that is important. For example the two north stabling were remodelled to increase the track centres which were dangerously narrow, but there was no mention of the track centre issue. Tabletop (talk) 02:07, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Ugh? I can see no mention of any remodelling; did I miss something? Tim PF (talk) 11:34, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

I have re-edited Gosford railway station to correct various spelling and WP:MOS errors from your 3 edits. In addition, your last two were marked as "minor", even though neither met the criteria for a minor edit.

You might also notice that I added a {{dead link}} template to a reference that you appear to have used. Since it has an accessdate from over 3 years ago, my guess is that the link was dead the other day, and that your addition of the south stabling yards was improperly cited. If not, could you try to find a live link, please? Tim PF (talk) 11:34, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

I have now also rewritten the "Australia" sub-section of Loading gauge to make the correct link, use metric and imperial units (per WP:UNITS), and try to get the correct historical context. I'm not in Australia, and could be wrong, but if CR was established in 1912, it was after NSWGR had adopted the wider loading gauge, which sounds very much to me that the two systems were set up to have the same width from the start. Tim PF (talk) 17:06, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

I notice that you further edited the Australia section of Loading gauge moving forward from my edit, but:

• You lost the link to double decker trains, by trying to pipe it to Bilevel rail car, which isn't needed (WP:PIPELINK: It is generally not good practice to pipe links simply to avoid redirects. The number of links to a redirect page can be a useful gauge of when it would be helpful to spin off a subtopic of an article into its own page.).
• You marked the edit as "m (spell all => allow)", which looks as if you had picked it up to sort out some occurrences of "allow", and then realised you needed to make more changes, without also revising the edit summary.

Do you happen to know if Victoria (or even the narrow gauge states) also adopted the national width, and what the respective heights are? Tim PF (talk) 22:07, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

There was a Commissioner's Conference in about 1910 to determine a national standard (mainland) loading gauge. That said I have never seen all the State's loading gauges compiled into a simple to read format. From what I have read, QLD, TAS and SA (NG) are smallish; while NSW, VIC, SA (BG), WA and CR are largish. The number of tunnels and overbridges has an effect, NSW having about 100 and QLD about perhaps 50.

So, if it's national, does that mean the 10 feet 6 inches (3.20 m) width applies to all states, or only to SG and BG? Was the height also set at some figure that NSW exceeds, or are there just a few low bridges or tunnels left around Melbourne, like the narrow point at Gosford railway station? Tim PF (talk) 13:09, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

The MURLA tunnels in Melbourne would take double-decker trains, but the Flinders Street overbridge at Flinders Street station is a bit too low and probably difficult to raise due to complicated trams tracks on top. Speaking generally, the diffence between bridges that are too low and those that are tall enough is so small, that only an insider can tell with any confidence. Tabletop (talk) 00:34, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

The loading gauge article currently reads: The height of the NSW loading gauge just happens to allow for double decker trains in Sydney, while the Victorian loading gauge (in this populous city) is not quite tall enough to allow for double deck trains in Melbourne (except for one experimental train). Without citations, both parts have problems:

• NSW may have mostly 14 ft 4+1⁄2 in (4,382 mm) high double decker commuter trains, but it still doesn't say what the loading gauge height (or profile) is, or if it is state wide (or just for some lines around Sydney). It really either needs some source to say that the NSW loading gauge is at least 14 ft 4+1⁄2 in (4,382 mm) high, or rewording to indicate that some lines around Sydney can accomodate such double deckers.
• You have no source to say that the Flinders Street overbridge is too low, nor can I see that there was a problem with the 4D's 4.27 metres (14 ft 0 in) height, either under the bridge or to allow passenger headroom (works are mentioned, but uncited).

I don't really see any reason for keeping that paragraph in loading gauge, but I'll give you a chance to reword it before I excise it. Tim PF (talk) 09:25, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

When all else fails it is time to consult a hard copy of Jane's World Railways. Under the heading "Australia", page 650 of the 1969-1970 edition gives a loading gauge cum structure gauge of the Commonwealth Railways, page 654 of the same edition gives two (2) similar diagrams for the NSW Railways with the one on the right governing "narrow electric stock" for the Sydney area, and page 667 of the same edition gives a loading gauge cum structure gauge diagram for the Victorian Railways. These diagrams indicate that none of the paragraphs need be deleted. Apart from that I have in my personal posession two drawings of 14 ft 4+1⁄2 in (4,382 mm) high narrow double decker electric rolling stock (one of the powered car and one of the trailer) that I asked for and subsequently received from the NSW Railways some 30 years ago. Last but not least, there is nothing wrong with E-mailing or snail mailing any given railway to ask for info about their loading and structure gauges and then filing the reply as a pdf image. Peter Horn User talk 14:11, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

PS The same edition of Jane's gives structure cum loading gauge or loading gauge diagrams only for all other Australian states. The gauges for the narrow gauge systems tend to be smallish. Peter Horn User talk 14:20, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

An answer

Hi Tabletop
Please see my post at Talk:Rail profile#Grooved rail. Peter Horn User talk 18:56, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

Eritrean Railway loading gauge

Hi Tabletop
You would not have the structure gauge to match the loading gauge (Eritrean Railway#Loading gauge)? Superimpose them on autoCAD and you'll see how a 9 ft 6 in (2,896 mm) intermodal container will fit. Peter Horn User talk 03:01, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

My autoCAD drawing tells me that an 8 ft 6 in (2,590.8 mm) high intermodal container will fit on the 790 mm (2 ft 7.1 in) high floor of a flatcar without exceeding the loading gauge. That is the beauty of autoCAD, there is no guessing or estimating necessary. If you have access to autoCAD I would be able to E-mail my drawing to you.Peter Horn User talk 01:21, 30 June 2011 (UTC)

Thank you!

I reference an awful lot of articles, but had not realized just how many times I'd misspelled Norwegian. Most appreciated! --joe decker^{talk to me} 02:56, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

If you copy one article as a template for another, any spelling errors get copied too. Tabletop (talk) 03:26, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

Oh, if only that was the reason.  :) Thank you in any case.  :) --joe decker^{talk to me} 14:48, 1 July 2011 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Barnstar of Diligence
	Thanks for your contributions! Bullmoosebell (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2011 (UTC)

Dennis Rader

Thank you very much for your spell-checking of Wikipedia articles. However, please do not "correct" misspellings in quotations, as you did here. The context of the quotation makes clear that the misspellings are present in the original source, and are reproduced as a matter of authenticity ("including spelling and grammatical errors"). Thanks. TJRC (talk) 21:31, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Sometimes you do not notice that it is a quotation, especially a long onee. Wiki might help by colouring text inside quotes say lightblue, while editing. Note lightblue since blue is hard to see. Tabletop (talk) 09:19, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

I know the feeling, I do misspelling patrols on "Julliard" (a common misspelling of "Juilliard", the performing arts school) and have nearly been caught one or two times the same way. I've put in a {{sic}} in a few of these cases so I don't fall prey again, but it's harder to do that in the Rader article, where a substantial piece of text, replete with misspellings, is quoted. You're not the first to conform the spelling in Rader's note; I'll look to see if there's some way to put in a prominent comment to ward off future similar edits. TJRC (talk) 21:10, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

East Perth railway station

1. the usage of the term runround is not local usage (nor is it found on wikipedia)
2. interstate terminal is not part of the local system - it is separate

I have reverted your edits and will come back to a better description later SatuSuro 10:03, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

G'day from Australia - considerable amounts of americanised or europeanised rail terminology does creep into the strangest of places - the cataloguers in the Western Australian State Library in the 1980's decided to take AACR (librarians cataloguing rules) beyond local usage to absurdity http://henrietta.liswa.wa.gov.au/search/?searchtype=X&SORT=D&searcharg=railroads&searchscope=2&submit.x=20&submit.y=20&submit=Submit even though local railways never used such terminology - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headshunt - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railway_terminology#R are all alien in western australian usage - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glossary_of_Australian_railway_terminology is disgustingly short of any effort to actually clarify any local usage - however the modellers at http://www.amra.asn.au/terms.htm are closer than any other source - and I suggest the triangle is a possible synonym - but there is no general usage of runround in any of the materials that I have on western australian railway history SatuSuro 10:51, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

Nomination of Railway stations in Bhutan for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Railway stations in Bhutan is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

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Nomination of Railway stations in Kuwait for deletion

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Speedy deletion nomination of Narrow Gauge Down Under

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Proposed deletion of North–South Corridor Project

The article North–South Corridor Project has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Non-notable infrastructure proposal (lots of them come and go, this one doesn't seem serious). Only source is the RailwaysAfrica blog.

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Washington Natinals

In the Pardon The Interrpution article, Washington Nationals are intentionally spelled Washington Natinals in that spot because that is part of the running gag. See here: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4087695 or many others.Racingstripes (talk) 13:58, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

99% of the time, "Natinals" is incorrect, so one might notice the 1% of the time that it is correct. Tabletop (talk) 22:18, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

Re: Rail Maps

Railways in Tanzania

Thanks for suggestions - as ShareMap.org project member I am creating maps to examine ShareMap.org capabilities as a tool that allows to create Creative Commons Licensed maps suitable for Wikipedia or other Wikimedia project.

You are right that on screen scale will useful, we are also thinking about adding legend. Rivers tracks you mentioned, are imported from free NaturalEarth dataset.

If you have any others suggestions or comments don't hesitate to add your post on my discussion page or directly ShareMap commons dicussion page.

--Jkan997 (talk) 22:37, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

One more thing - if you have some article, that you think it requires map similiar to Railway in Guinea map let me know - I can help with creation of such map. I am currently working on map of defunct Arkhangelsk Tram network, but after finishing I can focus on something else.

--Jkan997 (talk) 21:00, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Guinea has a strongly proposed line from Simandou to a port at Matakong, and also from Simandou to a port in Liberia near Buchanan. Tabletop (talk) 06:03, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Benin

Thanks about suggestion about Benin and Guiea - at early stage of creating railway map of countries I was trying to achieve effect that map labels can be red on thumbnail (like on maps from CIA World Factbook). This works well when railway lines and important junctions are equally distributed around country and there is not too many important points with labels.

But at some moment I realized it is impossible to create map with all information that have labels that can be red on thumbnail. It is better to create detailed map, even if user have to click it to read all information (like map on the right side ).

I will fix Benin map with your suggestions. It may will take some time - waiting for other proposals of improving/creating railway maps. --Jkan997 (talk) 22:17, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

List of companies and cities in Africa that manufacture cement

I see that you are interested in the article, and that you fixed my mistaken left-behind reflist . You also added a ref to a forum which seems to carry copies of newspaper articles without attribution, as well as opinion. Such forums can't really be considered reliable sources, per WP:Identifying reliable sources. They are fine for the talk page, but not the article itself. --Lexein (talk) 07:45, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

I have put the disputed refs into the talk page, as suggested. Tabletop (talk) 07:53, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Disputed? Sorry. I do encourage your contributions to the article. It was interesting to expand the bare urls to full citations - important for WP:LINKROT. Some of the sources are great, some are okay (primary), and plenty of items could still use sources. It's not a particularly easy topic area to source. --Lexein (talk) 17:48, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Your opinion please

You recently edited List of deep-water ports, so I thought you might be interested in weighing in on a proposed renaming of that article.

Cheers! Geo Swan (talk) 16:21, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

New Page Patrol survey

New page patrol – Survey Invitation Hello Tabletop! The WMF is currently developing new tools to make new page patrolling much easier. Whether you  have patrolled many pages or only a few, we now need to  know about your experience. The survey takes only 6 minutes, and the information you provide will not be shared with third parties other than to assist us in analyzing the results of the survey; the WMF will not use the information to identify you. If this invitation  also appears on other accounts you  may  have, please complete the  survey  once only.  If this has been sent to you in error and you have never patrolled new pages, please ignore it. Please click HERE to take part. Many thanks in advance for providing this essential feedback. You are receiving this invitation because you  have patrolled new pages. For more information, please see NPP Survey. Global message delivery 13:29, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

Bint Allayl

Thanks for fixing my typo on this page. I still make way too many errors like this. Must be more careful.Tigerboy1966 (talk) 01:52, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Re: railways in Benin

Hello I updated map of railways in Benin, if you have any suggestions about route of Niger planned extension let me know

See: Railway stations in Benin

--Jkan997 (talk) 01:17, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Re: Angola Rail Map

Ad: Angola Rail Map

Hello, I added some features like you suggested to angola railway map, now I want to fix Guinea railway map so if you have informations about routes of planned routes send me link.

If you any suggestions related to my other african railway maps (list here) let me know.

Regards

--Jkan997 (talk) 12:34, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

st. david

St. David School (Richmond, California) an article that you have participated in editing has been nominated for deletion a second time, the first time in 2006 resulted in no consensus and, it can be reviewed here. The current discussion on the removal of the article is located here should you wish leave your comment.LuciferWildCat (talk) 05:14, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

Please stop

Please stop adding links to copyright violations on forums like this. This problem was already pointed out to you a year ago; I cannot fathom why you continue to do it. If somebody on your webforum has copy-pasted from a legitimate news source, can't you just cite the original news source? bobrayner (talk) 11:46, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

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Mutukula is a little complicated as there are a pair of cross border towns.

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This is not quite right. The link was misspelled Champonship missing an i and I merely corrected the spelling. Tabletop (talk) 06:24, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

* World Endurance Champonship - goes nowhere

* World Endurance Championship - goes somewhere at least

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Thank you

Just dropping in to thank you for your contribution to KLM Meet&Seat. Ottawahitech (talk) 16:03, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

WikiThanks

WikiThanks

In recognition of all the work you’ve done lately! 66.87.0.48 (talk) 13:51, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Is that a sunflower? Tabletop (talk) 14:16, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

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A barnstar for you

		The Modest Barnstar
		Thanks for your recent contributions! 67.80.64.128 (talk) 01:18, 15 April 2012 (UTC)