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Koreksi terjemahan

Crisco, sebagai penyunting pada versi en.wiki-nya, tolong donk Anda koreksi hasil terjemahan ini: id:Kampoeng Rawa What a joke (talk) 04:28, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Tayang bersamaan!

Bang, karena hari ini adalah tanggal 1 Oktober, jadi saya mengucapkan selamat Hari Kesaktian Nasional kepada abang. Saya menyampaikan hal yang unik karena artikel yang sama telah dipajang di dua Wikipedia yang berbeda pada hari yang sama pula. Kemarin, di HU Wikipedia bahasa Indonesia, artikel pilihan saat itu adalah Penumpasan Pengkhianatan G 30 S PKI (id:Wikipedia:Artikel pilihan/27 2014), sementara itu HU Wikipedia bahasa Inggris menayangkan Pengkhianatan G30S/PKI (Wikipedia:Today's featured article/September 30, 2014). Hal yang sama juga pernah terjadi sebelumnya di Wikipedia bahasa Indonesia dan Wikipedia bahasa Melayu di mana artikel id:Amir Hamzah dan ms:Amir Hamzah tayang bersama selama 6 hari, yaitu 1 September - 6 September (Wikipedia bahasa Indonesia - id:Wikipedia:Artikel pilihan/24 2014, Wikipedia bahasa Melayu - ms:Wikipedia:Calon rencana pilihan/September). Terima kasih. Hanamanteo (talk) 07:13, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK question

Hi. Hope you're well. I was wondering what the rules are for how many nominations you can have at DYK concurrently, do you have to wait for your previous nom to be reviewed before submitting a new one? Cowlibob (talk) 16:26, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Like Curly Turkey, only the opposite

Do you know Tsuguharu Foujita? Japaneses painter who lived in Paris, but nobody cares for him, it looks like to me, no pictures uploaded at all. Well, 1. Hafspajen (talk) 16:58, 30 September 2014 (UTC) http://www.wikiart.org/en/tsuguharu-foujita/self-portrait-1 http://www.wikiart.org/en/tsuguharu-foujita http://www.departures.com/articles/lost-art https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s8WbJ-zMOKg

Input on FAC?

Hi Crisco, I've got an FAC underway at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Carl Hans Lody/archive1 - I'm hoping to have the article ready for the Main Page by November 6, the centenary of Lody's death. I'd value your input on any issues that might exist with the article; would you be able to have a look at it? Prioryman (talk) 21:57, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

OK, that would be great if you could. Prioryman (talk) 22:30, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK for September Morn

—HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:02, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Frustrating...

This annoys me on many levels...--Godot13 (talk) 23:46, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

  • And that is roughly the level of "image-smarts" most editors have. They don't get that the CC-BY-SA license means we have to attribute the image's creator and also the restorationist, if applicable. The same goes to the prose on Wikipedia; a lot of people don't realize that attribution is necessary, even when copying within Wikipedia. How'd RAN take it? (I've fixed the attribution) — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:58, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

As of revert

Not going to edit war with on this but this is not what WP:As of is for. I would appreciate if you would not revert when we were still discussing that. You just blew of what I was saying and simply changed it as if what I am saying had no merit.--Mark Miller (talk) 07:24, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

  • I did not say it had no merit. I said "per WP:ASOF", which explicitly states that "currently" is not specific enough and thus can be inaccurate. I have offered an alternative, which you did not accept. Instead, you have accused me of OR for attributing statements or including years of access/publication. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 07:34, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
  • This may be a perception problem. I NEVER accused you of anything. I said the option of adding all that from the simple sentence would be OR. I can accept that "Currently is not acceptable but neither is a misuse of "As of" for an access dating of the source. Now if it sounds like an accusation that you are "misusing" a guideline I am sorry but for heavens sake lets not get wrapped up in such details as it is not what the guideline states we should be doing. And you did just revert in the middle of the discussion before it had advanced hardly at all and that is not per BRD. "While editing a particular page that many editors are discussing with little to no progress being made, or when an editor's concerns are not addressed on the talk page after a reasonable amount of effort." I am trying to work with you, not against you. That just makes it seem that you don't want discussion to find what works for both of us.--Mark Miller (talk) 07:43, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Can we centralize the discussion on your talk page? I may be being overly sensitive after dealing with the talk page issues there, and it would help to have everything in one place. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 07:48, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Main Page Talk

Hi Crisco, please accept my apologies for my ill-thought by well-meaning edit and my thanks for reverting to the latest correct version. I should have done exactly as you did but without thinking just deleted the spurious vandalism without replacing the Errors stuff. Sorry again. Careful With That Axe, Eugene Hello... 08:39, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Re-FPCs

paperwork

What's the etiquette on resubmitting pictures that weren't featured the first time (probably only due to lack of comments)? I was just looking at the Inupiat pic that's scheduled for October 12 and I saw there is another great portrait in the Inuit article, but you'd already nominated it once (the nomination got bogged down in discussing who she was and where she came from and what her ethnicity was and nobody but you ever voted definitively). Why don't you nominate her again if that is allowed (her lovely parka alone should qualify her for FP). Belle (talk) 09:53, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

How about bathing like this

this is a kind of September thing

Holy smoke, he really did painted bathing women. Anyone of those? (You can of course remove them - if you think they are offending)Hafspajen (talk) 16:02, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Yes, we have. And I think it is pretty sad what the above editor +1 accomplished - pretty Victorian and old fashioned. Hafspajen (talk) 14:02, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

Surely one of these could be (literally) brushed up to FP status...? - SchroCat (talk) 14:17, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

  • You know what, I think that Pauli might actually have a chance. Is it a detail or the full painting? I'd love to nominate a version of The Swimming Pool... even I know its a significant part of Eakins oeuvre. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 14:29, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Difficult to say on the Pauli: a quick Google search only pulls up our copy, so it would need a little deeper look to see if there is anything else to it. Yeah, the Eakins is a good one: it's in pretty good nick too, and could probably make it through...? - SchroCat (talk) 14:39, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
  • autumn paintings
Isn't it interesting (simply interesting, not a sly dig at anyone) how prudish the depiction of male nudity typically is? Thirteen naked men (excluding the five boys for obvious reasons) among these pictures, and only one penis visible. Oops, many more men as I preview, still only one more penis. Awien (talk) 20:48, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
I know – but it's still one more penis than they showed on the women's pictures... - SchroCat (talk) 20:48, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
I can show you that kind of pics too. I was only because of consideration for the elderly I chosed theseHafspajen (talk) 21:10, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
Hahaha both of you.
But in the great galleries of Europe, full frontal nudes of women outnumber full frontal nudes of men tens of times over. Hmmm . . . Awien (talk) 22:18, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
I'm not sure that's entirely correct: the National Gallery in London is heavily classical in approach and probably has equal numbers, if not a shade more men. And that's just the paintings: in statuary, there are certainly more gents, penises and all (although many of them shortened by breakages, the poor dears!) - SchroCat (talk) 22:27, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
Statuary is different, it's true. Awien (talk) 22:46, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
  • How is it possible that my comment above, "Isn't it interesting (simply interesting, not a sly dig at anyone) how prudish the depiction of male nudity typically is? Thirteen naked men (excluding the five boys for obvious reasons) among these pictures, and only one penis visible. Oops, many more men as I preview, still only one more penis" now bears SchroCat's signature??? Awien (talk) 13:41, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
    You'd put it inside the gallery tag, so SchroCat moved it and presumably mucked up (a technical term) the signing at the same time. Or Magic (that would be more exciting; 10 points to Griffinpoo!) Belle (talk) 13:55, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Probably because your comment was into the coding for the gallery, and when I replied I moved it out of the gallery and forgot to tweak the signature, which I've now done. - SchroCat (talk) 13:58, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
  • To be fair I do that a lot anyway... normally mumbling away at something on my computer until my wife starts throwing things at me to get me to stop... - SchroCat (talk) 14:04, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Mandala
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:Manjuvajramandala con 43 divinità - Unknown - Google Cultural Institute.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 02:30, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/Rucha Pujari

Crisco, I was wondering if you would please take a look at this DYK nomination, which is now one of our oldest. If it isn't adequately cited for DYK, which seems to be Miyagawa's view, then it's unlikely to get any further. If there are other serious issues, likewise. If the citations are sufficient, then we should probably call for a new reviewer. Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 00:34, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Thanks, Crisco. Under the circumstances, I've marked it for closure.
I was wondering whether you might take a look at Template:Did you know nominations/Maricopa County Courthouse, which is similarly stalled and nearly as old. The creator/nominator isn't able to do any further work, and there's an issue with the sources. Can you please decide whether this can continue, or whether it, too, will need to be closed? Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 17:41, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
  • You'll probably want to shoot me now, but Template:Did you know nominations/Mendelsohn house is another stalled nomination, but this one due to issues of neutrality, with mention of an ANI and enough back and forth to discourage most anyone, including me, from wading into a fraught situation. Seems like an admin might have adequate heft to weigh in. It hasn't been touched since August 25; I was hoping you might be willing to give it a look at some point. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 01:45, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

COI stuff

Still interested in the McKinsey & Company article? Getting so close to GAN-ready I can taste it. I'm probably pestering you way too much, but you seem to tolerate me so well ;-)

If you have a few minutes to spare, I've also been trying to find someone to trim some poorly-sourced contentious material from the Realplayer page ( see here) since the 17th. The top half of the "Controversies" section looks like it has legit content, but the bottom half is mostly garbage and there's a huge plug for "Real alternative" in its own section just using junk sources. I won't be bringing this up to GA or anything. I am just doing some much more basic stuff for them, getting high-quality logos in place and correcting infobox data sort of stuff, and a couple more substantial things like this. CorporateM (Talk) 19:34, 29 September 2014 (UTC)

No problem. Whenever you're available. Or I can try to find someone else if you're burnt out, given how much time you've spent on it already. The redundant and obviously non-neutral "Criticism of management advice" section is still there. CorporateM (Talk) 20:36, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Clarification...

Would mind terrible clarifying a statement I made here Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Presidents of the United States (1789–1909). The comment could have been made by any newbie. It's the person making the comment that threw me for a bit of a loop...--Godot13 (talk) 08:18, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Interesting, I've never seen that happen with engravings (although it does happen with halftoning) — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:33, 3 October 2014 (UTC)
    • Come to think of it, I have seen that happen, but only in the background field of portraits on currency when the image sizing or resolution is off. It wouldn't surprise me if it wasn't somehow intentional as the style of portraits did change somewhat (1850s - 1870s) during the early development/popularization of photography...--Godot13 (talk) 19:17, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Nominated

Her?

? Hafspajen (talk) 17:00, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

He's gone, this? Hafspajen (talk) 09:53, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

Back and front

Two nude youths carrying a young woman and a young man
On the case, Poor Luca Sigorelli, worst crap article illustrations. He was a truly good painter. Hafspajen (talk) 12:04, 4 October 2014 (UTC)


Nomination limit

Hi Crisco-

I just wanted to clarify that in one of the FP debate threads you mentioned that the limit for simultaneous nominations is 11? - Godot13 (talk) 19:08, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

  • No, there's no limit. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:04, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
    • Okay, thanks. Will not be abused, but perhaps slightly tested one time (come the third week of the month...) -- Godot13 (talk) 00:40, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
      • I'd be careful about the timing though. Reviewer fatigue is a very real threat, and I don't think morale over at FPC is too high right now. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:43, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
        • I've been worried about timing all year... With as small a pool of regular reviewers as we have (augmented by others), I feel very fortunate about how things have gone so far. Under "normal" circumstances, I would have put at least a few weeks between any sizable sets... --Godot13 (talk) 00:59, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
          • Indeed. Shame Diliff hasn't brought his eastern European churches to FPC yet; I'm sure that would drum up interest in the other noms as well. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:02, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
            • I've got a good 100 or so images ready upload (and potentially nominate) but my internet access has been down since Monday (big fault, they are digging up a main road a few doors away as an underground conduit is blocked preventing an ready repair). I'm writing from my phone at moment. They're suggesting it will be fixed by Tuesday 7th October. So maybe you'll see a few images by end of the week. I'm a bit wary too though, my last two nominations failed due to lack of votes. Ðiliff «» (Talk) 13:44, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

Java War

Has a huge absurd white space at bottom of article - and I a clueless oz strylian cannot work out why, any ideas? satusuro 13:52, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

well that sort of ties in with the numerous wardrobe malfunctions that seem to ocur on this page... surely they would all catch masuk angin if they were located in java? satusuro 14:00, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
Javanese women
Ooops - I used to know the phrase in Afrikaans, what a fool I have been, but have forgotten it - but as for the white space now I understand... navbox replacement , yes better than whitespace, few spare nudes as filler in Javanese history might not work satusuro 14:33, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
in fact most Indonesian articles about important events have these expansive white spaces due to the nature of the lowering down info blocks of gumph... satusuro 15:07, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 01 October 2014

And a bonus pic feel free to nom

DYK for Beauty Revealed

—HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 12:02, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Beauty Revealed

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Beauty Revealed you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of J Milburn -- J Milburn (talk) 15:03, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals) Media Viewer RfC

You are being notified because you have participated in previous discussions on the same topic. Alsee (talk) 16:27, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

How come Where Do We Come From

MY FAVOURITE
Parau Api. What News - Google Art Project

We ignore Paul Gauguin? ..Tahitian Women on the Beach. Hafspajen (talk) 16:31, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

Well, all artbooks say so... Hafspajen (talk) 17:09, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Paul Gauguin's works
  • Paul Gauguin's Google Works
  • (By the Sea)
    (By the Sea)
  • Ah, best google so far
    Ah, best google so far


Met's scan, Hafspajen

I seem to recall there's a Gauguin scan on, of all places, the Library of Congress. Adam Cuerden (talk) 20:55, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

A good looking one? Hafspajen (talk) 21:20, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
Not bad. It's one of his more stylized works. Adam Cuerden (talk) 21:57, 4 October 2014 (UTC)
Well, why not. Actually this gallery I made for you looks much better than the one in the article. Ia Orana Maria is a quite well known painting too. Ia Orana Maria . Here some refs, Fatata te Miti (By the Sea)I , (By the Sea)II; (By the Sea)III Hafspajen (talk) 10:36, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Yes, quite so, better! Hafspajen (talk) 10:41, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Ah, the Simple wiki has an article on it! - Fatata_Te_Miti. Hafspajen (talk) 10:43, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Well, Met's looks a little bit pale though? Gauguin used quite strong colours. Hafspajen (talk) 16:53, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Odissi Perfomance
An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status
Your image, File:Odissi Perfomance DS.jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 19:11, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

Bulldog

That Bulldog article has always been a pain in the as. Hafspajen (talk) 18:52, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Frédéric Soulacroix - Spring

Hi Crisco, could you have a look at Bulldog if you get the chance, please? Earlier this morning I asked for Pending Changes to be considered for it as there has been a lot of too-ing and fro-ing. Lengthy discussion on the talk page but it seems IPs are changing it (twice this morning). I have just reverted ... SagaciousPhil - Chat 10:48, 5 October 2014 (UTC) PS: Bulldogs aren't even a breed I have a vast interest in!

And it has just been reverted again ... Materialscientist seems to have had some input in this in the past, maybe s/he can offer some thoughts? SagaciousPhil - Chat 10:58, 5 October 2014 (UTC) Aren't the dog breed articles fun?
  • Added PC, as there appears to be a lengthy history of issues with IP edits. Can't comment on the reversion though, not without seeing where consensus was previously established. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 11:00, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Thanks, Crisco. The relevant discussion on the talk page is a bit of a mess and goes back to July 2012. If I'm reading it correctly (no guarantees on that!) I think Dodo bird and Gregkaye feel both warrant inclusion; Vallonen and IP 82.209.185.43 argue it should only read "English Bulldog" (Vallonen and the IP both reverted it to English in the last few hours). Materialscientist doesn't seem bothered either way and just intervened a long time ago when it was first being discussed. I would also suggest using both, as you know I'm UK based and it is generally referred to as British here. In July 2012, Vallonen did state "Me and a friend of mine are reverting the article back to its state prior to these mass edits." Both the editor and the IP generally don't seem to sign their comments? Among the changes made is an alteration to the life span, which reads 8-10 years in the ref given, so it's wrong in the present version - you have to open life expectancy on the website. SagaciousPhil - Chat 11:26, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure what you are fishing after, having said that, where have I stated "Me and a friend of mine are reverting the article back to its state prior to these mass edits"? It is not something I recognize. Furthermore, you say you are UK based, well, in my experience most people have referred to the dog as "English bulldog", both in England and abroad, not to suggest that personal experience should have the final say. Vallonen (talk) 11:50, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi Crisco 1492, I hope it's OK posting on your page. The Bulldog page is undergoing disruptive editing in the unwarranted removal of references to "British Bulldog" as ONE of the descriptions that IS applied to the breed. Fishing for truth and for validation perhaps. Gregkaye ✍♪ 15:31, 5 October 2014 (UTC)

3RR question

Hi Crisco-

Regarding this, what are your thoughts since no one offered an opinion there...--Godot13 (talk) 00:07, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/The Gleaners
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:Jean-François Millet - Gleaners - Google Art Project 2.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 16:03, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

Going to bed

My eyes are revolting, going on strike. I will send you a message tomorrow to help me understand what others can and can not claim points for... confused, but mainly tired.... Godot13 (talk) 06:53, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Jacobus Anthonie Meessen

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article Jacobus Anthonie Meessen you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of CaroleHenson -- CaroleHenson (talk) 02:22, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

Hi, great job on your article. I just have three short questions, so I didn't put it on hold.--CaroleHenson (talk) 03:13, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Jacobus Anthonie Meessen

The article Jacobus Anthonie Meessen you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Jacobus Anthonie Meessen for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of CaroleHenson -- CaroleHenson (talk) 05:03, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

What's the deal...

with airline food?

I was actually thinking about that joke earlier and decided to look up the airline food article. Was impressed with the main image it had. GamerPro64 20:10, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

Peale

Bonus pic Yorkie project Bonaparte
San Pedro de Teruel Interior, Spain.

Rubens Peale with his geranium, is your fault. Hafspajen (talk) 18:03, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

Bonus pic

  • Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe
.And sad. There is so much evil in this world. Hafspajen (talk) 16:02, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured_picture_candidates/Kufic_script

I'm afraid none of us are quie sure what you mean here. Adam Cuerden (talk) 21:38, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

Violence against men/women categories

This will be tricky. I'm trying to approach this holistically - creating clear guidelines on what can be in these categories. However, there are some editors who don't really care about that - they just don't want any concession that men were victims from a gendered (ie, it was because they were men) view. To me, it's a narrow, somewhat academic view, considering what categories should be used for (cross referencing articles that are topical). Any suggestions? Mattnad (talk) 14:03, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

  • Where to hold the RFC would be a priority, I think. Wikipedia:Categorization/Ethnicity, gender, religion and sexuality would probably be best. Wording of the statement would also have to be vetted, preferably by one or more uninvolved parties, before the RFC went mainstream. This would be to avoid having any accidentally leading or biased language, since even the slightest mistake in wording could (in theory) lead to heated discussion that would stop the RFC from reaching a consensus. As for the wording... its a bit late here for me to think in detail, but I'd expect it to mention referencing standards before a category, the definition of "gendered" as used by the categories, and ways in which consensus can be enforced. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 14:15, 25 September 2014 (UTC)
Will give it some thought myself and draft something, probably this weekend.Mattnad (talk) 15:42, 25 September 2014 (UTC)

First draft:

There has been an ongoing debate about the appropriate use of Against Men category with Wikipedia articles. The locus of the conflict has been 2014 Isla Vista killings, but it has spread to other articles as well.

After extended discussions, there are two camps.

  • Some editors have stated that to permit the use of the Violence Against Men category, it's not enough that men were specifically targeted and harmed, but that a reliable source must specifically state that it was violence due to "misandry" or that they were targeted because of their gender, in that men were targeted because they were of the male gender.
  • Other editors believe that "Violence against men" can be applied more broadly when articles cover an event or issue where men were specifically targetted and harmed, with the exception of situations where the men were combatants. It should not require a reliable source using words like "misandry" or "gendered" violence. Examples could include the 2014 Isla Vista killings, Domestic violence against men, Srebrenica massacre, and Jeffrey Dahmer. These editors further point out that there are many articles relating where variants of the Violence Against Women categoryCategory:Violence_against_women are applied that do not include any reliable source that uses the term "misogyny" or state that the violence covered in the article was "gendered" (in that the women were harmed because of their female gender). Examples include Kendall Francois and the Death of Jennifer Ann Crecente.

We are looking for feedback on the following:

  1. To qualify for use of the Violence Against Men category, must there be a non-fringe reliable source referring to it "misandry" or specific characterizations that the violence was due to the victims male gender?
  2. If we agree that the indeed a reliable source must use the above language for articles relating to men, shouldn't it apply also to similar categories as they apply to women?


--What do you think?Mattnad (talk) 19:16, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

Second draft:

  • Good start, but we want to avoid terms such as "camps" which suggest there is a battlefield mentality. How about

The violence against men category, and its use in Wikipedia articles, has been subject to debate and edit warring. The locus of the conflict has been 2014 Isla Vista killings, but it has spread to other articles as well (including Domestic violence against men, Prison rape in the United States, Srebrenica massacre, and Jeffrey Dahmer).

Two main arguments have been put forth:

  • The first states that the Violence Against Men category should only be used in cases where men were specifically targeted by the perpetrator (without considering the perpetrator's gender) because they were men, and that this gendered violence is explicitly tied by reliable sources to the perpetrator's "misandry" or hatred for men (as a gender). This argument centers on the concern that the inclusion of a category without any supporting reference is original research, and as such should not be allowed.
  • The second argument states that the "Violence against men" category can be applied more broadly, when articles cover an event or issue where men were specifically targeted and harmed (excepting situations where the men were combatants, such as a war). This argument states that, in clear instances of violence being committed against men because of their gender, there should not need to be an RS which uses the terms "misandry" or "gendered violence against men".

A further complication is the concern that the correlative category, violence against women, and its subcategories are sometimes included when the terms "misogyny" are not used in reliable sources, or that the violence is not explicitly stated to be "gendered" (in that the women were harmed because of their female gender). This concern has been noted at such articles as Kendall Francois and the Death of Jennifer Ann Crecente.

This RFC is to determine the following:

  1. To qualify for use of the Violence Against Men category, must there be a non-fringe reliable source referring to an article's subject "misandry" or specific characterizations that the violence was due to the victim's male gender, or is the evidence of misandry / gender-targeted violence sufficient?
  2. If yes, should such limitations also apply to similar categories regarding women?

Discussion of Second Draft

Also, do you think we should note that there are general sanctions in the area? Something like "Please note that similar questions have been controversial before, and that general sanctions apply to all pages related to the men's rights movement."? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:10, 29 September 2014 (UTC)

That's better. On the mention of Domestic Violence Against men article, to my knowledge it has not directly been affected yet, but it would be subject to removing the VAM category (as would nearly every article that is now tagged with the category) if the community opted for option 1. But that's a good illustration of how narrow the requirement is.
I have no opinion on whether or not we should mention the sanctions, except that "men rights movements" is used to dismiss editors who hold that men can be targeted for violence too. My view is that bringing that up is part of a political/polarizing argument that's at the core of the opposition to VAM as a category. I was a women's studies minor in college, and through that lens, men can never be on the receiving end of "gendered" violence because it's a cultural issue (I'm an equality feminist). Mattnad (talk) 16:02, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
  • Well, since the general sanctions have yet to be invoked, I guess we don't have to mention it explicitly. If you're satisfied, and I'm satisfied, we can either 1) start the RFC or 2) see if a third party wants to give an outside opinion. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:18, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
Might not hurt to get an outside opinion. I do have an additional through on wording. The term "gendered violence" is by definition an act of violence by men on women or children according to feminist theory from which it springs. Here's a sample definition, "The term "gender violence" reflects the idea that violence often serves to maintain structural gender inequalities, and includes all types of violence against women, children, adolescents, gay and transgender people. This type of violence in some way influences or is influenced by gender relations." So I've edited out one instance of the word "gendered" from the second POV. Otherwise, we'd be confusing the issues.Mattnad (talk) 16:30, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
  • I've tried to rework it a bit, to emphasize the role of gender in the debate, without using words which have connotations which would confuse the issues. I've got to go to bed now, and tomorrow and the next day I'll be out of town, but you want to ping someone do feel free. I wonder if Keilana would be willing to have a look. Drmies is familiar with issues related to MRM issues as well, but if he prefers to not get involved I understand. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:36, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
So Keilana declined, and Drmies was uncertain about it (being that it was a lot to take in).Mattnad (talk) 22:52, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
  • I'm sorry, I never had the time to finish perusing this and read up and around--been busy elsewhere, on- and off-wiki. (Keep your fingers crossed.) Drmies (talk) 15:53, 1 October 2014 (UTC)
Looks ok to me, as far as it goes. It says what the RfC is, but it doesn't say what it isn't. Do you think it should include tangential areas to be avoided? I'm not knowledgeable enough to say what those might be, but it seems likely there are some. There are always tangents that get in the way, and it would be better to anticipate them than deal with them through moderation. ‑‑Mandruss (talk) 05:36, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
Ok, but my instinct is to define the RfC parameters up front. Do these things ever have moderators, as in experienced and uninvolved people who are empowered to tell people they're straying off topic? ‑‑Mandruss (talk) 05:51, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
I'm pretty confident this will be one of the more contentious. So we'd find a neutral editor who has a relatively good reputation for fairness (stress relatively). If the boundaries of the box have been defined up front, s/he can't be accused of bias when s/he enforces those boundaries. If you're in the discussion, you have implicitly agreed to stay within those boundaries. ‑‑Mandruss (talk) 06:01, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Good idea. Something like "Discussion should be centered around the use of the "Violence against men" and "Violence against women" categories in general. Specific uses are not the focus of this RFC, and should not be argued here." ... or? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 06:03, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
Something like that could be part of it. Like I said, the specifics are above my pay grade. Why are we bulleting? Your bullets are interfering with my indents lol. ‑‑Mandruss (talk) 06:08, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
Force of habit, sorry. Hmm, Mattnad, what do you think? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 06:21, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
Probably needless to say, but the idea is worthless unless the boundaries have teeth. The moderator should be an admin who can impose an RfC ban if necessary, and this should be stated up front. If there's no such thing as an RfC ban, one would need to be invented. All this will seem overly rigid and legalistic to many, and that's unavoidable. Many others will see the importance, I think. ‑‑Mandruss (talk) 06:44, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
I agree. As I've observed some editors, they bring up broader Wikipedia policy (ie, WP:OR) but are really only interested in the single article. Should an RFC come to a conclusion they don't agree with, they will still push for exclusion of the VAM category. Both Spectre and Bobomeowcat seem only to care about policy as it relates to this article should it serve their purposes. If it does not, they may not agree with it and continue the edit warring.Mattnad (talk) 13:09, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
In my naive view, if a strong moderator could keep the following things under control, the RfC could be completed successfully in far less time than the debate at Talk:2014 Isla Vista killings, which began over four months ago and has shown no signs of reaching a resolution during our lifetimes. (That is to say, far less than four months, not far less than our remaining lifetimes. Sorry.)
So in the discussion in the isla vista page, there was a single editor who dissented on the approach we've outlined here. Sound like a small minority relative to others on scope. Crisco 1492, where would you recommend we post the RFC? Mattnad (talk) 22:05, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Works for me. Shall I open it or you?Mattnad (talk) 11:20, 7 October 2014 (UTC)
Please rejoin discussion to talk Isla Vista Killings page. Moving discussion to user talk page minimizes input. Please note the uninvolved admin you consulted for input also voiced disagreement. --BoboMeowCat (talk) 20:31, 7 October 2014 (UTC)
if you decide to do an RFC for the Violence against men category instead, it's probably best discussed on Category talk: Violence against men, so others watching that page can join in.--BoboMeowCat (talk) 01:07, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

*Thanks for the suggestion. I'll be sure we leave a notification there (and at Category talk:Violence against women) — Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:09, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/The Submission of Prince Dipo Negoro to General De Kock
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:Nicolaas Pieneman - The Submission of Prince Dipo Negoro to General De Kock.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 02:36, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

Quick (?) references question

I'm using a New York Times ProQuest database and need to cite articles over the last century. Each article is copyrighted (problem archiving mass numbers of them) and the url is membership access. The standard newspaper citation template does not come with a page number option. Can I add one? It seems there is some degree of AGF involved with this...--Godot13 (talk) 00:21, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Perhaps something like Smith, Jane (9 October 2014). "253 FPs in a Year? Yes!". The New York Times. p. 2 – via ProQuest. {{cite news}}: Unknown parameter |subscription= ignored (|url-access= suggested) (help) (i.e. {{cite news |title=253 FPs in a Year? Yes! |work=The New York Times |last=Smith |first=Jane |page=2 | date=9 October 2014|url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Watchlist|via=[[ProQuest]] |subscription=yes}}. {{Cite news}} has a lot of parameters that aren't often used, and some that are but only for offline sources.. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:28, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/Heath Town

Crisco, I don't feel I can do anything more trying to move this nomination along: I tried pinging Andy on his talk page and ran into a brick wall (see User talk:Pigsonthewing#DYK nomination of Heath Town for the details). RTG says there are copyvios and close paraphrasing, and I can confirm that the first two paragraphs of History are indeed copyvios, and introduced during the expansion. While I can't get FN1 to work myself (I get a 404 error), it does show up with the identical phrases on Google, and the requisite phrases also show up at other sites including this one, and an archive dates April 30 of this year, well before the expansion started. I'll let you decide what the next step is here. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:06, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

Indonesian post-nominal "S.H."

Hi Crisco 1492. I'm currently working on the Jimly Asshiddiqie article, and I noticed that he and an number of other eminent Indonesian people have the post-nominal "S.H." and variants like "SH" and so on. I don't have a clue what this stands for, but I've looked it up in Wikipedia, that so-called "online encyclopedia about the sum of human knowledge", and it has nothing at all that helps me about what "S.H." might mean in this context. Your thoughts? Pete AU aka --Shirt58 (talk) 11:16, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Jimly! Last time I heard that name I was in my Pancasila course, first year of university. S.H. / SH is "Sarjana Hukum", or (essentially) an LLB, though Indonesians differentiate between (say) a B.A. and a "S.S." (Sarjana Sastra; bachelor of literature). — Crisco 1492 (talk) 11:36, 8 October 2014 (UTC)
Wow, the things you learn on Wikipedia! Terima kasih, as Merridew was wont to say. Pete AU (SS (hons), SH) aka --Shirt58 (talk) 09:06, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

Advice on photography term

Chris—the downcasers normally have it, but here, Dicklyon is suggesting disambiguation too, presumably with an analogue to the Dutch WP (fotografie). Would that be your take, too?

Adoration of the Empty Cross

Photoplay February 1921
Bonus pic
Bonus pic ..4000px
This

The adoration of the Empty Cross is a rather unusual topic. Don't think we have it - is it free? from MET. Hafspajen (talk) 14:28, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

Guerin

..Ahem .. well, yes. Is a rather unusual. Category Nicolas Froment or so. Hafspajen (talk) 14:48, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

YippIIEE!! Hafspajen (talk) 16:09, 8 October 2014 (UTC)
Bonus bird

File:Guerin Jeune fille en buste.jpgHafspajen (talk) 22:01, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

What's the thing with the frames? Hafspajen (talk) 12:21, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

Dr Hill

OH, look how modern everything is!!!

File:François Barraud - La Toilette.jpg Could you please help me move Dr Hill into mainspace as Jonathan Hill (theologian)? Don't know how ... We have now picture and it is fairly OK - refs and everyrthing. User:Hafspajen/Jonathan Hill (theologian) - Don't know if he is prepared for a DYK - that nasty place... though. What do you think? Hafspajen (talk) 12:28, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

  • A?
    A?
  • B?
    B?
  • C? Wich one is right?
    C? Wich one is right?
  • Other
    Other
  • Flatiron Building
    Flatiron Building

The Happy Yorkshireman writes...

After a long absence, he's back begging. Jhall1 and I have been working for what seems like years on Jack Crawford (cricketer). All I can say is that Crawford isn't a Yorkshireman, I'd appreciate any comments on the talk page (no formal PR here) and favours gratefully returned if wanted. It feels choppy to me, so feel free to tear into it. (And as you probably aren't aware, the above section title refers to this) Sarastro1 (talk) 19:04, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

Do you know how to Whistler? You just put your clicks together and go.

http://www.loc.gov/search/?fa=contributor%3Awhistler%2C+james+mcneill

Lots of good stuff there. Adam Cuerden (talk) 20:27, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

Also, if'n you weren't goign to nominate that Remington, I had to. Halfspajen suggested it a bit ago; I gave you time to bag it. =) Adam Cuerden (talk) 01:04, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Bugs and food

Went out with my wife today to hunt bugs. Haven't uploaded any of those yet, but they're on the way. Here's some food and a temple to wait. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:44, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Tuna Steak
    Tuna Steak
  • Chicken cordon bleu
    Chicken cordon bleu
  • Panoramic view of the Palgading Temple complex (discovered in 2011)
    Panoramic view of the Palgading Temple complex (discovered in 2011)
  • Wall there
    Wall there
  • The base
    The base
  • Unidentified brown grasshopper, marching
    Unidentified brown grasshopper, marching
  • Unidentified brown grasshopper, portrait
    Unidentified brown grasshopper, portrait
  • Unidentified brown grasshopper
    Unidentified brown grasshopper
  • Our friend the grasshopper, again
  • Beetle on a curtain
  • Atractomorpha similis
    Atractomorpha similis
  • Defecating grasshopper
    Defecating grasshopper
  • Another grasshopper, a chubby one. Nymph? Moulting?
    Another grasshopper, a chubby one. Nymph? Moulting?
  • Cute spider, with white fur
    Cute spider, with white fur
  • Bananas
    Bananas
  • Another spider... not so cute.
    Another spider... not so cute.
  • Another spider... not so cute.
    Another spider... not so cute.
  • Another grasshopper
    Another grasshopper
  • A fly
    A fly
  • Water on a leaf, for Haffy
    Water on a leaf, for Haffy
  • A big yellow flower
    A big yellow flower
  • And an... orchid?
    And an... orchid?
Nice pictures! Beetle on a curtain is probably a Tenebrionid- maybe subfamily Alleculinae. Shyamal (talk) 16:06, 28 September 2014 (UTC)
Wow, great! I too was in my wife's home. Collected an owlfly; will try to photograph if possible. The two spiders after the bananas are Oxyopidae; probably Oxyopes sp. The yellow flower looks like Sphagneticola calendulacea if it is not so big. Will look into them tomorrow. Jee 14:08, 29 September 2014 (UTC)
  • They were live; but nearly dead in the small box while I traveled back to home. I usually shoot live specimens from a long focal length. Here I made a few quick shots at 81 mm and released them soon. I don't think they survived though. :( Jee 08:29, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

Bugs as food

‑‑Mandruss (talk) 07:11, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Small help

Hi Crisco,

I have nominated one more photograph related to Indian classical dance, I hope you will notice it soon. Expecting your ususal help, if needed to the photograph, because, am a bit worried about the sharpness of the photograph.

Hope you will help me out.

Regards Bellus Delphina talk 10:40, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

For you

And some extra flowers
A Basket of Berries by Sarah Miriam Peale Award
A Basket of Berries by Sarah Miriam Peale for you as a thank you. Hafspajen (talk) 16:22, 9 October 2014 (UTC)
They were 17 children... Hafspajen (talk) 13:34, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Healy and Pealy

George Peter Alexander Healy
George Peter Alexander Healy, how about a Vice President? Hafspajen (talk) 13:31, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Work it , it's yours. Hafspajen (talk) 13:39, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Heavy drinking is bad for you ... or anyone

Rosa Bonheur with Bull

Glorious, like Europa's rape

Hafspajen (talk) 16:49, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Babysitter

Greetings! If you have a moment, would you mind looking in at Wikipedia:Graphics Lab/Photography workshop#Pierre Bernac photograph and giving us your expert opinion one way or the other? Tim riley talk 20:46, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK for The Submission of Prince Dipo Negoro to General De Kock

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:02, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK for The Arrest of Pangeran Diponegoro

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:03, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 08 October 2014

McKinsey & Company

Hey Crisco. I just thought I would check-in and see if you wanted to keep working on this with me over the weekend. It still has the obviously POV (and now redundant) "Criticisms of Management Advice" section. I think the information is all on the page and I'm just culling through it to get it GA ready. I also need to write a Lede eventually. If I'm being a bother and you're not interested, just let me know! I feel like this one has been hard to find editors that will engage long-term, because it is not the kind of topic that appeals to a lot of people. North8000 would probably have taken an interest if he wasn't banned for a year. CorporateM (Talk) 16:21, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Nah, it'll still have a ways to go. Needs a new Lede. Some of the controversies look really over-sized now that they are merged into regular sections. Once the bit about the memo is back in I'll need to keep culling through it for quality control. But it's getting close. That's just the most obvious and easy POV type thing, whereas the rest is just fine-tuning. CorporateM (Talk) 02:13, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Herman Willem Daendels
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:Posthumous Portrait of Herman Willem Daendels, Governor-General of the Dutch East Indies - Rd Saleh.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 06:28, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

File:Florence Nagle.jpg

hi, can you remove the small watermark on it?♦ Dr. Blofeld 08:56, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

Added copyright info per "fair-use" policy. Please change it, if you have more background info. GermanJoe (talk) 09:23, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

it is alive...

Silver certificate (Cuba) --Godot13 (talk) 04:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2014-10-15/Featured content

Hey, Crisco. I don't suppose you could help with the five paintings? Trying to get this done ASAP, so I can start ignoring it until next weekend. =) Adam Cuerden (talk) 03:12, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Return of the Inuit Woman
An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status
Your image, File:Inuit Woman 1907 Crisco edit 2.jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 10:40, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Beauty Revealed

The article Beauty Revealed you nominated as a good article has passed ; see Talk:Beauty Revealed for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of J Milburn -- J Milburn (talk) 15:22, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Userfication Requests

Hi, I see that you have a category on your userpage stating that you are willing to userfy certain deleted Wikipedia articles. If that's the case, can you please userfy Manky Kong and the latest deleted 2005 revision of Tiny Kong? 2005-Fan (talk) 16:29, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK preps to queues

Crisco, for the first time in a long time, none of the queues are filled, but for perhaps the first time ever, all six preps are filled. If you're around in the next few hours, it would be great if you could promote a queue or two, and even better if you can do so before the bot posts that a queue is desperately needed. Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 05:25, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Many thanks. No one else has done any additional ones, so there are about three hours before a now-empty queue will need to be filled for the next promotion. If you stop in before midnight UTC (as is not unusual), can you please see whether another prep to queue move can be done? (The bot would have posted by then, but it's gotten lazy over the last little while.) Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 20:57, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/Tootie Perry

Crisco, I was wondering if I could ask you to please check the appropriateness of the sourcing for the hook fact in this seven-article hook. Specifically, it's the list of names here of "Gator Greats"—just names and sport(s), with nothing indicating year of induction. At the moment, Tony's awaiting a verdict on whether the source is reliable before continuing with the review, and I've never run into anything like this before, so I don't feel I can say yea or nay. (Is this kind of award often given not by the University, but by an external group? Does it matter who gives it?) BlueMoonset (talk) 22:42, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

More bugs and stuff

Some results from my trip to Bandungan. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:07, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

  • A feeding yellow butterfly. I know Jee's told me what this is, but I forget.
    A feeding yellow butterfly. I know Jee's told me what this is, but I forget.
  • And a fly. I'm sure we've identified this fella to the genus before...
    And a fly. I'm sure we've identified this fella to the genus before...
  • A moth
    A moth
  • And another grasshopper, which I'm sure we've identified the genus of... on another specimen
    And another grasshopper, which I'm sure we've identified the genus of... on another specimen
  • Unidentified mantis, portrait
    Unidentified mantis, portrait
  • Unidentified mantis, whole body
    Unidentified mantis, whole body
  • Doesn't really have encyclopedic value; the effect is just cool
    Doesn't really have encyclopedic value; the effect is just cool
  • Silhouette of a landscape, with the city of Ambarawa below
    Silhouette of a landscape, with the city of Ambarawa below
  • The moon!
    The moon!
  • Panoramic view of the hillside near my hotel
    Panoramic view of the hillside near my hotel
  • Pretty flowers (and more below) Verbenaceae
    Pretty flowers (and more below) Verbenaceae
  • PF Verbenaceae
    PF Verbenaceae
  • PF Verbenaceae
    PF Verbenaceae
  • PF Verbenaceae
    PF Verbenaceae
  • PF Hibiscus
    PF Hibiscus
  • PFSunflower
    PFSunflower
  • PFCalceolaria a type of?
    PFCalceolaria a type of?
  • PF
    PF
  • PF Allium
    PF Allium
  • PF Verbenaceae
    PF Verbenaceae
  • PF
    PF
  • Sunrise and a silhouette
    Sunrise and a silhouette
  • And without obstructions
    And without obstructions
  • Rope bridge across the valley
    Rope bridge across the valley
  • Man paddling near Kampoeng Rawa
    Man paddling near Kampoeng Rawa
  • My hotel
    My hotel

That butterfly is some sort of grass yellow (look at me, the butterfly expert; I can also identify about five other types, including a white one and a brown one). Belle (talk) 10:03, 2 October 2014 (UTC)

Tibouchina (Hafs asked me to look at these). Sminthopsis84 (talk) 21:06, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Teamwork Barnstar
Bonshō finally made it to FA - wouldn't have done so if your image review hadn't gotten things started. Thank you tremendously for your help. Yunshui 雲水 09:19, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Lord Fildes or Viscount Millais (when they come) we'll welcome sweetly

...In short this happy country has been Anglicized completely.

So, Luke Fildes, friend of W. S. Gilbert - hence the reference to him being a nobleman in the song about the idealized England being claimed as real to foreigners - was actually quite a good painter. We don't have a lot on him of quality. one portraits of him by Philip Alexius de László:

And two portraits by him:

I note Paul Fildes was unillustrated, so I've added the painting in. I say that'd be a good nomination, no? Adam Cuerden (talk) 23:07, 12 October 2014 (UTC) Like Frederick. Hafspajen (talk) 23:53, 12 October 2014 (UTC)

Darkened Skye

Decided to make a new thread about this. Since we were discussing sourcing for the page, good man JimmyBlackwing put some sources in the articles talk page. The mans a saint in that department. GamerPro64 19:34, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Beauty Revealed
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:Sarah Goodridge Beauty Revealed The Metropolitan Museum of Art.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 02:56, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Blurbs

Hey, Crisco! I see you undid my revision of the blurb for the HAM— fair enough, the revision was very late in the game, but it is not on the main page yet (not for another few hours still!). I don't know if you will be up and checking things there in Indonesia before it DOES hit the main page— will I be in trouble if I undo your undoing and put the revised text back in before that happens? I had been reading over the blurbs for other PotDs and felt like the one for the mollusc sounded less friendly than them and wanted it to read more as part of the set. So I am going to switch the blurb back quick before the image hits the main page, and hope that this doesn't get me in any trouble— please, please switch it back (again) if I am violating any kind of protocol (social or organizational) by doing so. And thank you again for your support and help and ability to pay attention to all this stuff (how do you DO it??). KDS4444Talk 18:29, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Switched back to your version. The short blurb that was there was my writing, actually, as you never replied to my question if you wanted to write the blurb or not. As for "How I do it": probably devoting more time here than I should . Oh well, at least I publish elsewhere occasionally. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:53, 13 October 2014 (UTC)
When I read over the edit history (after making my edit), I noticed that the text if the blurb was, in fact, your writing and not mine... which then struck me as odd, because it was written more than a little in the way that I would have written it— so much so that it had not occurred to me that it was not mine, and so I offer you my apology and tell you that we appear to have an unusual amount of English language writing style in common! Marry me now! In any case, the image is now up on the main page, to my delight, even as I write this. I think the next diagram I worked on is also likely to pass candidacy soon, and I will be contacting again once/ if that happens to ask you if you can find a place for it on the queue for PotD. In a few days. Something to look forward to (?). KDS4444Talk 10:32, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Jean Etienne Liotard - Portrait of a Young Woman

Washington Crossing the Delaware
Portrait of a Young Woman

Wish we could find something like this - but this is too small. Hafspajen (talk) 11:13, 12 October 2014 (UTC) PS Did you crop Butters pup? Where is it? At Phils.

Ah. That explains it. Hafspajen (talk) 11:28, 12 October 2014 (UTC)


  • Selected works

Any good? You can have them.

And you? Hafspajen (talk) 23:52, 12 October 2014 (UTC) Not happy? these are very fine elephants, almost FP... Hafspajen (talk) 19:07, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

By the way...

found some - how about these

Hear the news about the cave paintings in Sulawesi? Adam Cuerden (talk) 00:46, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Ok. Crisco, somebody made a mistake on sheeps, it is mm not cm. Hafspajen (talk) 00:39, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Useful links; future articles?

Java Industrial Film needs something.

Queue 5 gutted

Crisco, Fram just pulled two hooks from Queue 5, but did not replace them—worse, he left the entries there with just an ellipsis, so there are effectively two blank lines. I'm way past my bedtime, so I'm going to hope that you log on before noon UTC, or that someone else finds and fixes the queue. Thanks if you see this and can fix it before it's too late. BlueMoonset (talk) 07:36, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Scanner settings

If I scanned yesterday in 48-bit color, would that be the reason a file I've been trying to upload won't go through? Should the number be dialed down in photoshop? Thanks.--Godot13 (talk) 13:44, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

This is to inform you that Ruma Maida, which you nominated at WP:FAC, will appear on the Wikipedia Main Page as Today's Featured Article on 28 October 2014. The proposed main page blurb is here; you may amend if necessary. Please check for dead links and other possible faults before the appearance date. Brianboulton (talk) 16:55, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Grace Hopper portrait
An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status
Your image, File:Commodore Grace M. Hopper, USN (covered).jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 18:37, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Charles Hodge
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:PORTRAIT OF CHARLES HODGE, Rembrandt Peale.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 12:31, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

New FPC nomination

Hey Crisco, just wanted a second opinion on a nomination. I wanted to nominate either a single image or a set from a church during my trip to Lithuania. It was either going to be the 'lead interior image', or all four interior images as a set. I haven't had much luck with sets recently though, and I think they're probably a bit polarising for voters. People don't necessarily want to support all the images (particularly if there are some weaker images in the set) but can't justify an oppose vote either, so it ends up with less than the required 5 votes instead. So it seems that generally speaking, single images are more successful. But in the case of this subject, I feel all four images are pretty high quality and work fairly well as a set, so it's difficult to say any one is better or worse than another. However, the article just barely has enough content to support the images (took a bit of expansion and creative placements to make them fit) in the main body, and it's proven difficult to find more info in English on the church, so I could see an argument that four images is excessive. Your thoughts? Ðiliff «» (Talk) 10:32, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

  • The whiteness... wow. I don't think most FP voters have been looking at content, and the balance in the article looks acceptable to me. I'd try a set, at the very least to break up the constant flow of paintings. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 13:30, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Help!

Hi Crisco! I don't know if you remember me (I was Jagadhatri when I first met you) but I need a help (a big help) from you. Actually I'm working on Bade Achhe Lagte Hain so that it becomes a GA. And there are also some non-free media issues. Could you please help me?? Please don't say no! By the way I love (I literally love it) your page notice...aaha! It made my day..it touched my heart. Love you Crisco...thank you for making my day..I have similar quotes and pictures on my userpage. I love such images and quotes. Thank you for making my day! Love you Crisco! --Tamravidhir (talk!) 14:11, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Sorry but I will use a similar one! :P --Tamravidhir (talk!) 14:13, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Going to bed soon, but I strongly recommend getting rid of every non-free image but the title card (you can use free images of Ram Kapoor and Sakshi Tanwar; I'm sure we have some). That infobox could also use some trimming. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:52, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
Okay! Thank you Crisco! ^_^ --Tamravidhir (talk!) 17:03, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Otto I (take 2)

Hello Crisco, after some soul-searching I have replaced the lead image in Otto I. I am fairly sure, I can get used to the pillar :) (atleast the statue is neatly centered). If you have any additional ideas for tweaking, I'd greatly appreciate it. Thanks for your help with this image. GermanJoe (talk) 22:19, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

File:Bain News Service - Franz Lehár.jpg

What do you think of this? (If you want to make changes, please do them from the PNG) Adam Cuerden (talk) 06:59, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 15 October 2014

A Party in the Open Air. Allegory on Conjugal Love (very bad article)

Template:Did you know nominations/Tootie Perry redux

Crisco, I posted to your talk page earlier in the week, hoping I could ask you to please check the appropriateness of the sourcing for the hook fact in this seven-article hook. Specifically, it's the list of names here of "Gator Greats"—just names and sport(s), with nothing indicating year of induction. Reviewer TonyTheTiger is awaiting a verdict from me on whether the source is reliable before continuing with the review, and I've never run into anything like this before, so I don't feel I can say yea or nay. (Is this kind of award often given not by the University, but by an external/alumni group? Does it matter who gives it?) Is this something you can handle, or should I try Nikkimaria? Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:52, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

Progress...

on the Japanese invasion currency (may have filled up Burma and Malaya, still nothing on Indonesia). Found guilder card money on St. Martin and a few other things that aren't in the standard reference books...--Godot13 (talk) 02:03, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Confusing file

George Hamilton (South Australian police)

I think George Hamilton (South Australian police) might be in the picture - but who is the painter? Hafspajen (talk) 14:21, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Well, indeed. What a phony title George Hamilton (South Australian police). Should he be called George Hamilton (South Australian police, poet and painter)? That sounds silly too. (It's a google, but who knows) Hafspajen (talk) 15:04, 16 October 2014 (UTC)
nah - (policeman) - surely is the sensible qualifier - all the rest reads like non english speaker drivel. satusuro 01:07, 17 October 2014 (UTC)
getting better... satusuro 01:42, 17 October 2014 (UTC)
It's South Australian Mounted Police. I suppose the Aborigines in the painting are trackers. I'm trying to track down a painting I saw in Dulwich Picture Gallery, showing an autopsy- just browsed through the entire online catalogue without finding it- any ideas? Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 09:30, 17 October 2014 (UTC)
  • It was a European artist, 17th century, dead man semi-nude surrounded by burghers. The Sanctuary Wood Museum Hill 62 has 3D viewers, and one of them has a photo of a dead German soldier sitting surrounded by Tommies. The flies on the soldier spaced themselves out equidistantly- this painting also has the flies spaced out across the body, which is a really acute piece of observation on the part of the artist. It is in Dulwich. I'm having Spotted dick for pudding (must have jogged my memory). Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 13:59, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

A cheeseburger for you!

A staple of diners and fast-food restaurants, cheeseburgers were first popularized in the United States during the 1920s and 30s, but they existed long before.

Hafspajen (talk) 22:10, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

I want this

A news kiosk Paris (Bonus picture)
  • Amedeo 's paintings
  • in the MET, but nood goods on her
    in the MET, but nood goods on her
  • or this
    or this
  • From the Met
    From the Met

.find File:1917 Modigliani Reclining nude anagoria.JPG - big and badHafspajen (talk) 15:14, 17 October 2014 (UTC) Eh, maybe THIS or this. Hafspajen (talk) 15:14, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

AAAAHHHH!!! Hafspajen (talk) 00:02, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/On the Island of Dr Moreau
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:Oedipus and the Sphinx 1864.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 02:18, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Very early Indonesian note...

First issue of Dutch government paper money in the Netherlands Indies (1815)

P.S. I found the Japanese invasion money for the Netherlands Indies...--Godot13 (talk) 03:34, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Saw that note. Was drooling over it, but said drool attenuated when I realized I could download full resolution scans of registration cards (will be at FPC soon). — Crisco 1492 (talk) 03:35, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Original Barnstar
What great work at Japanese occupation of the Dutch East Indies. Thanks. Drmies (talk) 03:21, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Now appearing at FAC...

Jack Crawford is now at FAC here. Any further comments more than welcome! Sarastro1 (talk) 12:13, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK overdue

Crisco, we're almost three hours past the time the next queue should have been promoted, and while there are two preps ready, the queues are empty. Can you please promote one? Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 14:52, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK query

Hi Crisco! I just wanted to ask that how many sets of DYK are selected for each day? Is it like this that set one will be featured on the main page from "so and so" time to "so and so" time and then set two and set three during another time period? I mean that how many sets are there? And who decides and how do they decide that when which one will show up? Could you please tell me? Tamravidhir (talk!) 15:26, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Thank you! ^_^ Tamravidhir (talk!) 17:00, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Black Sunday

Is your ping not working or something? Have you seen Black Sunday (1960 film)? Perhaps Giano has seen it?♦ Dr. Blofeld 17:12, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

No, Giano has not seen it because Giano hates hates the cinema, not as an art form, but as a viewing platform. Giano hates people he doesn't know (or does know), eating junk food in intimately close proximity. I (I can't maintain the third person) wait until they come on TV, and as that normally happens when I have better things to do - I see very few films. Giano (talk) 18:32, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Empty queues

We still have over nine hours before the next DYK promotion is scheduled, but there aren't any filled queues, though plenty of filled preps. If you have the time, it would be great to have a queue or two ready to go. Thank you. BlueMoonset (talk) 05:16, 19 October 2014 (UTC)

Another request of help

Crisco, thanks for your previous help for me to promote the Chinese version of the article The Jakarta Post as a good article. This time I have to counter with another problem concerning the article Ouw Peh Tjoa. I have translate the article into Chinese, and now it is a candidate of good article in zhwp. A specialist in literature, history and philosophy has reviewed the article, and one of his comment is like that:

...the content is insubstantial and a expansion is needed; what is the difference between the film's plot and the original Chinese folklore? Who are the actors? Are they Chinese? How successful the film is (in terms of profit) (in Indonesia and Singapore)? How do the critics comment on it? What is the feature of its action scene? ...

Also, he stated that this two sentence is irrelevant to the topic:

... a year after Albert Balink's Pareh changed domestic perceptions of profitable film storylines. The's later films adapted stories closer to the native populace of the Indies and focussing on events that could happen in day-to-day life.[5] Through 1940 and 1941 Java Industrial Films was the most productive studio in the Indies, until it was shut down during the Japanese occupation which began in March 1942.[10]

... Biran writes that several Japanese propaganda films have survived at the Netherlands Government Information Service.[14]

I initially cited from the article that the cast is not recorded, but not sure that is it a concrete statement. Also, I promised him to seek advice from you, as you are an expert on Indonesian films. Could you please help for dealing these issues? Much thanks and sorry for inconvenience, --Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 15:37, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

  • The first request is a clear request for WP:OR, as there are no references any of that (that I have seen, at least... maybe in some archive, somewhere, or buried in an attic, or... you know what they say about proving a negative), and if we were to say "most ethnic Chinese directors used Chinese actors in the mid-1930s". Your "expert" needs to get a bit better versed in folklore; there is no "original" version for oral literature, especially a legend as old as White Snake, but the oldest version(s) we've been able to trace. Back to film, very little primary documentation survived, and what is archived online is mostly Dutch newspapers; the Dutch were, to say the least, not interested in the myths the ethnic Chinese propagated through film, and didn't review this film. Sinematek has some Indonesian documents, but not many, and not from this period. Several of The's oeuvre are just known from his (fading, as he was interviewed a few years before he died) memory. I can see trimming the NGIS, but The's shift to native-oriented stories is important for contextualizing the film in his oeuvre. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 16:10, 18 October 2014 (UTC)
    • Thanks, but one more thing. The specialist claims that if we can't provide the information he requested, then it will simultaneously fall short of one of the GA standards - "Broad coverage and introduction on main aspects on the topic". I need to be assured that it can fulfill this criteria - the fact that zhwp's GA criteria is borrowed from its English counterpart should be reminded. --Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 03:06, 19 October 2014 (UTC)
      • The "specialist" would do to remember that comprehensiveness is not, at least in the English Wikipedia, having information on everything you'd like to have, but covering what is available in sources. When we get into lost films, often times what we have and what we'd like to have are worlds apart. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 04:15, 19 October 2014 (UTC)
        • OK, though in zhwp they have a (maybe erroneous) perception that besides good reference and content, a good article should be sizeable, not too short. But sorry, I have to ask for one last question - In the Chinese version, the sentence corresponding to "The titular snake came from a personal zoo kept by The Teng Chun at his home" can be translated as "The snake mentioned in the film's name came from a personal zoo in The's home." The specialist is doubted at this point - he point out that "The snake mentioned in the film's name" is a mythical snake that can be transformed into a woman, and it could only came into being by one's imagination; it's not logical that such a thing was kept in a zoo. You know, in that time no special effects can be deployed in a film. So it would be better if you can clarify the sentence and solve his doubt. Thanks, --Spring Roll Conan ( Talk · Contributions ) 08:15, 19 October 2014 (UTC)

So, mid November, then?

Crisco! Scallops in November? Can you make it so?? KDS4444Talk 07:26, 19 October 2014 (UTC)

no ping?

Hello, Crisco 1492. You have new messages at Fylbecatulous's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.
purring...
Hi Crisco. I just want you to know that although this talkback message is to my page, I did not send it. Hafspajen, did. [1] I really wish it had been signed or something put in the edit summary. Or it had been a talkback to Hafs page with a new request, or whatever. Thanks for moving the article for Hafs. Please forgive the inconvenience. Sorry. Fylbecatulous talk 12:51, 19 October 2014 (UTC)
Please let me know that you see this message, Crisco. I will have a sad day until I know this is okay. Thanks again. Fylbecatulous talk 12:54, 19 October 2014 (UTC)
Thank you muchly. ツ Fylbecatulous talk 13:00, 19 October 2014 (UTC)
Yes, cats...thanks, peacefully yours, Fylbecatulous talk 14:28, 19 October 2014 (UTC)

Feedback requested

Hi Crisco- When you have a chance, could you take a look at this. Probably my last nom for the Cup...--Godot13 (talk) 00:17, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

  • Oh that's sexy. Any reason why they're not both in the same image? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:48, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
    • This has been a nightmare to figure out how to present this (both in the article and as a nom). Putting the front and back in the same image file suggests they are the front and back of the same object, which is not the case. While that was tempting to do for the certified proofs, the artist/progress proofs are entirely separate objects (created at different times), that happen to be related to each other. I also experimented with the css crop format in the typical gallery style set format for FPC and it is not possible to achieve structure without keeping it in a table format. While in DC I scanned the entire run of certified proofs (all series/denomination) which will eventually be added to the article (but anything more than what's in this nom would be overkill)...--Godot13 (talk) 01:24, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
      • Ah, I see. They're not the same objects. What if you split the row into two sub-rows, so that they are not at different levels to each other?
Value Art/progress proofs Certified proofs Portrait
1 peso
US-BEP-República de Cuba (progress proof) one silver peso, 1936 (CUB-69b).jpg
 José Martí
US-BEP-República de Cuba (progress proof) one silver peso, 1930s (CUB-69-reverse).jpg

Also, if we're focusing on the banknote, why not a hard crop? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:33, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

        • Tweaked the table as you suggested. Hard crop (versus css crop) would omit some of the best EV of the object (e.g., dates, hand-signed by the Cuban rep), things that make the object truly unique...--Godot13 (talk) 02:47, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

File:Christus carthusian.jpg

Isn't this a lovely copy? Adam Cuerden (talk) 03:15, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Mohiniyattam
An image created by you has been promoted to featured picture status
Your image, File:Rekha Raju DS 2.jpg, was nominated on Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate an image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Thank you for your contribution! Armbrust The Homunculus 12:31, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Pah Wongso

The DYK project (nominate) 14:14, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

Sculpture sortage

Well, have a cup of tea instead

Maybe this? [2]... Looks like a good picture. Hafspajen (talk) 17:23, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

1 GB on commons

Hi Crisco,

How will I be able to upload a file that big? Do you know the procedure? Étienne Dolet (talk) 06:40, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

@EtienneDolet: The easiest way is to use the Upload Wizard. Failing that, there's a chunked upload add-on. Adam Cuerden (talk) 09:26, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Great! So I got the Chunked Uploads thing down...but now I am debating which video format to choose from (see here). Do you think it be better to choose the MPEG2 or MPEG4? The MPEG2 file appears to be over the chunked upload limit. Crisco, I would really appreciate your opinion here. Thanks! Étienne Dolet (talk) 17:49, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

Signpost

I have a bad cold. Is there any chance I could beg some help this week? Adam Cuerden (talk) 18:24, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

It's just going through and writing descriptions at Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2014-10-22/Featured_content. There's quite a few, and the list only closes on Sunday morning. Adam Cuerden (talk) 18:35, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Oh, I know what to do. I've just got a heck of a week coming up myself. Seminars, translation, language editing, teaching... there's a reason I'm still answering things at 1:30 am my time. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 18:39, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK preps to queues again?

Crisco, we're again in a position where we have five preps filled (minus one quirky spot), but no queues. In about four hours, the bot will go looking for something to promote; if you're around before then and no one else has done any promoting, can you please take care of one? Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 22:03, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

Gough Whitlam at TFAR

Hi Chris, you (and your talk page stalkers) may be interested in a thread I've started about Wikipedia talk:Today's featured article/requests#Gough_Whitlam, where possibilities for marking the death (aged 98) of this former prime minister of Australia include re-running a TFA. I'm interested in getting lots of views so I'll be leaving this note on various pages (and apologies, TPS-ers, if your talk page is not one of them!) Thanks, BencherliteTalk 08:48, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Europe

I'm your bull, Hafspajen

This would be a good picture for the Doctors new article, but we don't have it.. http://www.nga.gov/content/ngaweb/Collection/art-object-page.154233.html ?is it snachable? Hafspajen (talk) 13:53, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

That is one sexy bull. Hafspajen (talk) 14:55, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
Distributed it. Hafspajen (talk) 21:46, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
OOps. Hafspajen (talk) 21:59, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Congrats on 100,000!

Edits
...now that’s a lot of edits...

But don't worry, with this series of BEP proofs I've got your milestones covered through 500,000,000...--Godot13 (talk) 18:56, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, congratulations on 100,000 errors edits! ‑‑Mandruss (t) 20:28, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Yes, congratulation!!! Great job. Hafspajen (talk) 21:41, 21 October 2014 (UTC).

Congratulations

100000 Edits
Congratulations on reaching 100000 edits. You have achieved a milestone that very few editors have been able to accomplish. The Wikipedia Community thanks you for your continuing efforts. Keep up the good work!

If you like you can add this userbox to your collection.

This user has been awarded with the 100000 Edits award.

```Buster Seven Talk 17:18, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Robert E. Lee

Lots and lots of photos, many of them really quite terribly reproduced. Feel like talking things through and figuring out what to keep and what to lose/put into a gallery? Adam Cuerden (talk) 06:35, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Commons:Administrators%27_noticeboard/User_problems#File:Chadwick.jpg

It is unfortunate if an image is deleted from the front page. I know images in POTDs are protected earlier; but no idea how images in FA are handled. Any suggestion for improvement? Jee 03:05, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

It was unfortunate - the problem appeared to have been solved, then evidence was found of not only who the photographer was, but that they were from the UK, which does not recognise the simple photograph doctrine. Honestly, if things had been better documented and checked when I raised the point about the photograph not documenting the PD-status at the featured article candidacy, we could have avoided this. I even said I was worried it could lead to copyvio on the main page. Adam Cuerden (talk) 04:29, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
I agree; it is not good a copyvio appear in main page. But I wonder why the FA team neglected the fact that the lead image in the article was facing a DR? I don't remember whether the file page had the DR notice when it was deleted. Jee 05:41, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
@Jkadavoor: I can explain that. Long story short is, I was a little too polite in FAC, so they didn't realise when I said something like "that will need documented to show that" that that was a literal "need", so closed it without the issues resolved. In order to deal with the misunderstanding easily, now that the eyes were off the article, I put the images up for deletion.
Unfortunately, Commons admins can be a little too willing to accept "It's probably okay" so closed the deletion as keep - then, just around the time it went up on the main page (possibly because of) proof it was copyvio was submitted, the DR was reopened, and it was deleted. Adam Cuerden (talk) 06:49, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
Thanks Adam Cuerden; I found it. So more of a problem here than in Commons? I still don't know whether people here are aware of the second DR; but it should be if it was opened properly. (Chances that Stefan4 forgot to add the DR notice on file page while reopening the DR (?).) Jee 07:06, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
In theory, yes, but challenges to a DR closure are... very ad hoc.
Anyway, I'm going to get breakfast. Will respond here/Commons when back, then work on the Signpost/pulling apart Robert E. Lee's images. Adam Cuerden (talk) 07:58, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Morning all. Much as I'd love to excuse myself from any blame by saying that there wasn't a deletion notice on the file page when I checked before scheduling, I rather suspect I just took the filename from the wikitext of the lead and copied it into the blurb, without specifically checking the file page. When I'm looking at an article, I have a handy script that shows me (by adding a coloured border) if an image is marked as non-free or nominated for deletion locally; it doesn't pick up Commons deletion nominations, alas. I'd just point out, for the avoidance of doubt, that the image was not deleted when it was on the main page - the issue was raised at WP:ERRORS at 11:37, I saw the report and removed the image at 12:10 and it was deleted at 12:11. Close, but not quite... Oh, and popping over to Commons, I see that I'm being accused of negligence behind my back. That's nice, Jkadavoor. Thanks for that. BencherliteTalk 08:27, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
@Bencherlite: In all honesty, this was an exceptional situation. I would hope noone wants to blame anyone, just to figure out how to avoid it in future. There were quite a few errors that led to this point. Had I made my concerns clearer at FAC, had the closing of the FAC spotted the problem... For that matter, due to anniversaries it had a very short period from FAC to TFA, without which this wouldn't have happened, so this is an exceptional circumstance anyway. Adam Cuerden (talk) 08:57, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
I have left a long reply at Commons agreeing that this was an unusual set of circumstances leading to the rare event of an image quite literally being on en's main page one minute and deleted the next. I think lessons can be learned all-round without attributing blame, but Jkadvoor's question to the deleting admin – BTW, could you confirm whether there was an active DR notice on the top of the file page when you deleted it? Or there was no such notice after first DR was closed? It will help as to find whether it was a negligence from the TFA team at EN – isn't exactly friendly. BencherliteTalk 09:06, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

[Edit conflict, leaving this in, but it's partially irrelevant now] If you mean my comment (not Jkadevor's) "I think TFA has started checking new images, but not things that were there when it passed FAC. But I don't think the TFA people know image copyright that well, they depend on others to some extent." - this was a particularly finicky copyright issue. I work with image copyright all the time, and it's a situation I hadn't seen; I was perfectly happy to have it proven in copyright, but I also knew the documentation hadn't yet proven the status claimed for it, and had a couple funny issues (1949 date given for an award that, while backdated to 1949, was only announced and awarded in 1950, for instance). Wikipedia depends, to some extent, on trust. Unfortunately, the trust in this case was being hinged on a long accumulation of precedent, with no firm proof it was wrong, but a lot of reasons to doubt if you dug into it a lot. Does anyone seriously think you should spend hours on every TFA checking copyright minutiæ? Now, TFA's checks aren't perfect - you may remember the mislicenced image a bit ago that (while out of copyright) used a US-only tag for a European work, or vice-versa? It came up because ERRORS dropped the ball on it a bit when I reported the minor issue. [It got deleted from ERRORS without the problem being fixed.] But I don't see how they could be perfect, given the constant, never-ending TFA cycle. Adam Cuerden (talk) 09:10, 22 October 2014 (UTC) [Close edit conflict] I think that it was useful to find out where the checks that would have identified the problem should have been: Should Commons have been more careful about the DR notice, or should we see about getting TFA better checks for DRs on Commons? Or both? "Negligence", however, was a very poor choice of words. Adam Cuerden (talk) 09:10, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

@Bencherlite: Sorry; nowhere I intend to blame you, and my intention to discuss this topic with other colleagues is not bad. I'm from Commons (and not a native English speaker), and I know little about FA ot TFA. That's why I posted here, as I know Crisco in POTDs. It is a usual practice to postpone a POTD if the picture is in a DR. That's why I asked Crisco whether any such practice exists for TFA. If there is no DR notice on file page, no other way for a coordinator to find it; that's why we re check it. (And Natuur12 confirmed that there was a notice. You can see someone opened a thread at COM:AN/U without notifying the accused party. I just completed the formality; otherwise he need not respond to it.)
So the solution (if needed) is to ask Commons to lock the image before appearing in front page (as in case of POTD). Thanks Crisco, Adam and Bencherlite for your opinions. Jee 09:49, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
Well... if the file is copyvio, we want it off the mainpage ASAP, of course. But some pre-planning from Commons would probably not hurt, and help spot problems so that things can be switched. Adam Cuerden (talk) 10:05, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Pre-planning from Commons being... what, exactly? I'm not too sure that there are many Commons editors who are not English Wikipedia editors and would care enough to double-check our TFAs regularly. Those who are English Wikipedia editors (and admins, to remove a file if the page is protected) would be... who, exactly? It was a series of unfortunate events which lead to this being on the MP when we weren't sure of the copyright, but I should think it's not unprecedented. FOP has probably caused a couple problems in the past. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 10:13, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
(e/c x 2) Actually, Jkadavoor, locking the image is not a solution to this particular issue. That's a system that's already in place (as long as the Commons-based bot doing it works, which it does, most of the time). The image was protected at Commons in advance of its appearance on the main page, but that won't stop a copyvio image appearing if it's slipped through all the holes. Change any one thing here - the FAC discussion, the image remaining in the article throughout, the lack of notification to en-wp that an image is up for deletion, the apparently erroneous closure of the first deletion discussion, me not checking the file description page, no-one noticing that the debated image was in the TFA queue (and there may be other steps) - and this doesn't happen. Protection is irrelevant. BencherliteTalk 10:16, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
  • Bencherlite, if you like I can try and have a look at the MP images in the queue every week or so. I can't guarantee I'll be able to do it every day, but at least we'll have an extra pair of eyes... I mean, it's not like many people look at the TFA queue.... — Crisco 1492 (talk) 10:22, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/John C. Calhoun
Your Featured picture candidate has been promoted
Your nomination for featured picture status, File:George Peter Alexander Healy - John C. Calhoun - Google Art Project.jpg, gained a consensus of support, and has been promoted. If you would like to nominate another image, please do so at Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates. Armbrust The Homunculus 12:37, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

Talk:Salesforce Marketing Cloud/GA1

Crisco, the Talk:ExactTarget/GA1 page had gotten stranded when the ExactTarget article and talk pages were moved to Salesforce Marketing Cloud the other day, so I've just moved the GA review page to the new article name as well. BlueMoonset (talk) 21:30, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

So I need to become a decent photographer and my upcoming task is to host a little Beneful photo-shoot, but anytime I take photos of something that is wet or has plastic, I get a lot of that shine from light reflection. Any tips on what I need to do to get a better shot? It seems like anything that uses the flash tends to be too bright, so I need good day-time lighting. CorporateM (Talk) 23:44, 22 October 2014 (UTC)
Yup - dog food. Each time I take a picture of the wet food in my dog's food bowl, the image comes out with lots of little shiny spots. CorporateM (Talk) 05:30, 23 October 2014 (UTC)
  • What equipment are you using? I'd set the camera on a tripod, focus, and shoot with a long exposure and no flash (i.e. use only natural light). Another choice would be to use something to diffuse the flash, like a think piece of fabric or something. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:59, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Helping

Ii want your help regarding Krimuk90 and I know he is far more experienced, intelligent, respected and supported here. But, his main problem is favouritism. He had revereted all my edits from the article, whom I am one of the main contributor. I want to challenge all his articles as all his articles show favouritism and I can't say more. Please help.—Prashant 14:55, 23 October 2014 (UTC)K

Your GA nomination of September Morn

Hi there, I'm pleased to inform you that I've begun reviewing the article September Morn you nominated for GA-status according to the criteria. This process may take up to 7 days. Feel free to contact me with any questions or comments you might have during this period. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Wilhelmina Will -- Wilhelmina Will (talk) 18:20, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

One-two cup of tea for you!

Corn on the cob - bonus

After water, tea is the most widely consumed beverage in the world. It can be enjoyed hot or cold, with milk or sugar. Hafspajen (talk) 17:31, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Better? Hafspajen (talk) 23:24, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Template:Did you know nominations/Jonas Wood

Crisco, this nomination is stalled, and I was hoping you could get it moving again. Thanks for anything you can do. Also, if you'd like to take a look at Template:Did you know nominations/Assassination of Gabriel Narutowicz to see whether the neutrality issue I found in the original hook is also a problem in the article (I don't have faith that the original reviewer would have found it given the failure in the hook), that would be great. Many thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 02:04, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

The grammar in the Polish article is rough in places, but otherwise the article seems neutral. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 02:38, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

The Signpost: 22 October 2014

Bonus girl

This ... scan?

No snachin, she's Crisco's. Hafspajen (talk) 07:22, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Surprised Nymph is a painting by Edouard Manet from the early 1860s. Acquired by the Argentine State to Witcomb Gallery in Buenos Aires in 1914, belongs now to the National Museum of Fine Arts in Argentina. The model is the companion of the painter Suzanne Leenhoff / (posed as a model for the nymph ). The work was part of a more ambitious composition, ultimately abandoned, and whose purpose was to represent Moses saved from the waters. http://www.lanacion.com.ar/1091005-la-ninfa-sorprendida -For the director of the main museum institution in the country, Guillermo Alonso, the work of French artist Edouard Manet, 1861, is a cornerstone of the museum's collection. This is an oil painting in which "the beginning of innovative search Manet, defying the rules of academic art is appreciated," said Alonso. Hafspajen (talk) 07:27, 24 October 2014 (UTC)
Bonus pic - wikipedia is full of editors willing to write about girls

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Nymphe_surprise - article in French. Hafspajen (talk) 07:30, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Preved! Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 07:33, 24 October 2014 (UTC)
Preved? Hafspajen (talk) 09:01, 24 October 2014 (UTC)
Bear surprise. Xanthomelanoussprog (talk) 09:18, 24 October 2014 (UTC)
Gug. That's his wife - Suzanne Manet. (that explains why the Russian didn't liked when the Swedes gave them teddy-bears).Hafspajen (talk) 11:03, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Roosevelt

If you were going to replace File:Theodore_Rooseveltnewtry.jpg, would you go with the identical (but higher-resolution and quality) http://www.loc.gov/pictures/resource/ppmsca.36054/ or the slightly different angle, http://www.loc.gov/pictures/resource/ppmsca.36051/ ? Or would you go for a more radical departure, such as http://www.loc.gov/pictures/item/2013651052/resource/ or http://www.loc.gov/pictures/item/92520593/resource/ ?

RM notification

Since you have participated in at least one Requested Move or Move Review discussion, either as participant or closer, regarding the title of the article currently at Sarah Jane Brown, you are being notified that there is another discussion about that going on now, at Talk:Sarah Jane Brown#Requested move #10. We hope we can finally achieve consensus among all participating about which title best meets policy and guidelines, and is not too objectionable. --В²C ☎ 17:03, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

File:Sir Luke Fildes - The widower - Google Art Project.jpg

Think I've found one last, really good copy of a Luke Fildes work. As it's probably the best of the three, I think that, once it's been in the article a week, we should nominate? Unless you want to join me in trying to make an article for it? Adam Cuerden (talk) 02:45, 25 October 2014 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Coat of Many Colours

CU confirmed. Drmies (talk) 23:28, 24 October 2014 (UTC)

Should have known. Adam Cuerden (talk) 02:45, 25 October 2014 (UTC)

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