User talk:Barts1a/OldArchives/Archive 4

This is an archive of past discussions with User:Barts1a. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Archive 4

Archive 5

Archive 6

Blocked again

You had the following warning just the other day, during your latest block, from admin Floquenbeam:

In spite of a lot of advice, and many warnings from many people, you continue to wander from conflict to conflict, like a bull in a china shop, showing a significant lack of clue, giving bad advice to people about things you don't understand. Since lots of people's polite warnings have failed to register, let me be blunt: if you continue to screw around on here when your block expires, I will block you indefinitely. [1]

With your clumsy interventions at AIV [2] and especially your disruptive and unjustified messing with another editor's legitimate talk posting here [3], you did it again. I cannot really state the problem any more clearly than Floq did. In keeping with that prior warning, I am therefore now blocking you again, although I won't be quite as harsh and leave it at only one week. But consider this a final warning that you really, really must change your attitude. Fut.Perf. ☼ 12:40, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Did you forget to assume good faith? Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 12:44, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Actually, no, I did not. I am fully aware you have been acting in good faith. The problem with your editing, as many people have pointed out to you, is not a lack of good will, but a lack of clue, and an unwillingness to take a step back and listen before jumping into situations you don't properly understand. Fut.Perf. ☼ 12:46, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

(ec) By the way Barts, spam is vandalism, it's in the policy. I do think you've been far too quick to leap onto project pages (and worse) without understanding the policies here. Gwen Gale (talk) 12:47, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

This user's unblock request has been reviewed by an administrator, who declined the request. Other administrators may also review this block, but should not override the decision without good reason (see the blocking policy).

Barts1a/OldArchives (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))

Request reason:

I accept that my edits were rather foolish; but I was merely pointing out fact and trying to heal the bitemarks left on a newcomer. I do not think that a week is warranted for this, I may be wrong (And feel free to point out if I am; everyone except Future Perfect at Sunrise due to their application of this block) but I honestly think that my edits did much more good than harm. Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 12:49, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Decline reason:

First, this block is valid - see WP:POINT, WP:COMPETENCE and others. In terms of length, we have a concept of escalating blocks - this is not your first during this week alone! Second, you CLEARLY have a lot of reading about policies to do - you'll need the full week. Finally, take the advice of the people who have visited this page. Calm down, slow down, become a trusted editor before barging into places you have no need to be in. We don't need gunslingers. (talk→ BWilkins ←track) 13:10, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.

"Don't need gunslingers"? I can name at least two editors here off the top of my head which fit the "gunslinger" description rather accuratly; Big Brother at the Party being one of them. Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 13:13, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

It's like the userbox on your userpage, which says you behave like an administrator. But you don't behave like an administrator. Rather, you often do behave like a "gunslinger" and moreover, you don't understand the policies. This has stirred up more harm than help (and much wasted volunteer time), which is why you've been blocked again. Gwen Gale (talk) 13:22, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

You guys really need to start giving me some breathing space again

It's hard to find the right way to go when directions are always being shouted into your ear.

It's also hard to stay calm when things like this are happening without a clear explanation why. Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 06:57, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Ryulong has been here quite awhile, and probably did not like getting a message that would more typically be directed at a newbie. It's kind of like the rule called "Don't template the regulars." ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 07:53, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

I assume you are referring to this message in which I clearly state that the editor has had plenty of experience editing Wikipedia to know one of the core guidelines of Wikipedia. If not then feel free to point me to the one you are referring to. Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 07:57, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

I'm talking about this,[4] where his response suggests that he felt like he was being patronized or lectured ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:34, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

If he responds to friendly messages that way i'd really hate to see what he does to templated messages. In all serosness though; I see this response as demeaning to me, it's not like I gave them a lvl 3 warning for edit warring, If I did then calling it garbage would be justified, but it was merely a friendly harmless message which might have had some impact, while overall it didn't do a great deal; it did appear to make the IP stop and think for a bit; see the long pause here, do you think that the IP would have continued their editing pattern sooner had the message not been left? Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 08:45, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

I don't think he saw it as friendly, he saw it as patronizing - as if he were the newbie and you were the seasoned veteran. I wouldn't have reacted quite so aggressively as he did, but I wouldn't much like it either. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 08:59, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

BTW: why does that guideline not have some form of protection on it? Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 07:58, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Because any wholesale changes would get reverted instantly. I'd also suggest you listen to your advice from this weekend and take an actual Wikibreak, they can do wonders (trust me, I know from experience). DC T•C 08:16, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

You mean stuff like this? Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:12, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

I guess it all really comes back to the underlying issue behind all of this of admins taking issue with non-admin's genuine attempts to help. Signed by Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints and constructive criticism? 09:05, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Personally, I have no problem with a non-admin helping - how else does one learn the skills to become an admin? However, you need to understand policies before trying to help in these areas. You're breaking policy after policy, all in the name of helping - you do not yet possess the WP:COMPETENCE to be providing advice or acting on the things that you are. Your replies on this page alone show that you don't have the personality to handle performing admin-type actions, because you cannot accept a single piece of constructive criticism. (talk→ BWilkins ←track) 09:35, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Accidental revert

Sorry Barts - I was scrolling through my watchlist on the iPad, and accidentally hit revert. You were quicker than me in undoing my mistake. :) - Bilby (talk) 23:26, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

It's OK. That's why I don't use a touchscreen on Wikipedia; fingers are simply too fat and not nearly as precise or quick as a mouse and keyboard. Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:31, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

I don't normally, either - my laptop was left at home by mistake, so I'm stuck with an iPad at work today. :) - Bilby (talk) 23:36, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

It happens. I myself have left things at home sometimes (Including my wallet on about 2 occasions so far!) Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:38, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

A quick message to Sven Manguard

I strongly support your statement made at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Arbitration_Committee_Elections_December_2010/Feedback

"Asking, telling, or demanding people not to be coordinators is completely and utterly unacceptable. Let me repeat this, because I was absolutely disgusted by this. Asking, telling, or demanding people not to be coordinators is completely and utterly unacceptable. Period."

and hope that you don't have to put up with that kind of bulls**t next year. (This message is assuming that you have my talkpage watchlisted; which hopefully you do!). Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 11:18, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

You are not the only person who was asked to remove himself from the list. I can confirm one other and have heard whispers of a third being asked. People seem to forget that this is a self-appointed volunteer position.

As for the block, let me say this. You're a person that clearly wants to help. That's a good thing. However most people cannot be of help everywhere. I limit my actives to a small number of fields that I am good with, and most every other editor I know does the same. My advice is that you spend a few days looking around for one or two things that interest you, then find out who already does them and ask them to show you the ropes. That's the process I went through, four times in fact, with positive results. I'm not sure what you're interests and skills are, but there are lots of things that need doing, not the least of which is writing and improving articles. Good luck, Sven Manguard Wha? 17:47, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Edit review

I have asked at that page, whether it's appropriate for me to post your request "by proxy", or if it should wait until your block is over. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 02:32, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Good move. Thanks for that! :D Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 02:34, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

They had advised waiting till you're unblocked, which you now are, so go for it. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:31, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

I already have! See here Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:49, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Humour bypass?

It must have been obvious to you that RexxS was making humorous additions to a humorous page [5]. To revert him and issue a civility template shows that you haven't learned any lessons from any of your blocks. Will you pause and READ things occasionally, rather than blundering on. --Elen of the Roads (talk) 11:19, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

I did read it and I thought that RfA was not the platform to be making jokes on, but apparently I was wrong, we can joke anywhere and everywhere we like... Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all!

You're not getting it are you. The page was a joke to start with, and if you had read it you would either have realised the whole thing is a joke (which Bishonen will probably move to userspace in a few days), or objected to the whole thing. Rolling back RexxS and templating him just shows that you hadn't looked at what he was editing, or thought 'gosh, why is this long term and normally serious editor vandalising someone's RFA? --Elen of the Roads (talk) 11:31, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Templating? How does the message I left to them even remotely resemble a template in any way, shape or form? Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 11:33, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

I forgot, they took away all the automated tools, didn't they. So you have to type in the text of the templates manually. It can't be a personal message, if it was a personal message, you'd have had to have actually worked out what was going on first. --Elen of the Roads (talk) 11:42, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Merry Bishmas

RexxS has given you a cookie! Cookies promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. You can Spread the "WikiLove" by giving someone else a cookie, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend.

To spread the goodness of cookies, you can add {{subst:Cookie}} to someone's talk page with a friendly message, or eat this cookie on the giver's talk page with {{subst:munch}}!

Hey Bart, this isn't the time of year to get discouraged, so cheer up. I didn't take any offence at your note to me, and I thought you were just playing along with the joke RfA. Relax and enjoy your virtual snack. Wikipedia is still a better place with you here. Cheers --RexxS (talk) 18:15, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

That's nice to hear you didn't take offence... even though Elen of the Roads did. Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 22:29, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

I know, but Elen was just being protective of me. She's one of the good guys, honest. Why not send her a cookie? I promise it will make you feel better as well :) --RexxS (talk) 23:07, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

It was more a cookie d'oh moment. Sort of "Zomg, he just found the big h

o

l

e

More watching. Less jumping in feet first and you'll be fine.--Elen of the Roads (talk) 23:40, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

At any rate I just found motivation. Photo requests in Perth that need doing. Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:48, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Excellent. Get out there with that camera. Elen of the Roads (talk) 23:51, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

I fully intend to! See my userpage for locations I intend to snap today. Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:52, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Also: This is where Perth's public transport comes in handy. (And yes; I will be shortening my sig...) Barts1a Suggestions/compliments? Complaints/constructive criticism? Merry Christmas to all! 23:53, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Would you be able to take photos of the England cricket team destroying Ponting's crew as well? I think that'd be marvellous... Obviously, if the Poms start to lose, you should delete your memory card.... The Rambling Man (talk) 00:07, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

LOL! I might be able to get down to the WACA... but tickets ain't cheap! Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:09, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

The cheapest tickets I can get are $250... WAY above my affordability range! Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:11, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Lundgren has given you a cookie! Cookies promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. You can Spread the "WikiLove" by giving someone else a cookie, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend.

To spread the goodness of cookies, you can add {{subst:Cookie}} to someone's talk page with a friendly message, or eat this cookie on the giver's talk page with {{subst:munch}}!

Dixon, Dickson, etc.

I was once suspended for 5 days for calling other editors idiots... but I gotta tell ya, that one is certainly in the neighborhood. He's also been given a week's vacation just a minute or two ago. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 07:47, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

I noticed that... and they've just posted an unblock request which is heading for the fastest decline in wikipedia history. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 07:52, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Polite request.

I am requesting that you not edit my talk page. Dylan Flaherty 08:15, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

I shall abide by this request. Thanks for being nice about it! :D Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 08:15, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Your "NOTICE"

... needs to go, please. Being honest, I think it is more of an enemies list, there more to bait people and shore up your own position as the "victim" in this whole dispute. We try to separate users in conflict and encourage them to grow beyond the debate into productive users, there is no way your baiting list will facilitate that. I think this would be a good opportunity for you to show such maturity by removing it yourself, but if you refuse I can tell you I will be petitioning at the ANI thread for it to be removed by another admin. Regards, S.G.^(GH) _ping! 11:46, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

While This guy and many others are having the same lists I shall have one. This is also a warning that if ANYONE removes it I WILL revert on sight. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 11:48, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Well if it's removal becomes one supported by the admins then that will lead to trouble, and I've asked Dylan to remove his as well. S.G.^(GH) _ping! 11:51, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

If an uninvolved admin asks me to remove it I will gladly do so. However I haven't noticed any yet... Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 11:53, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

OK, I shake my mop and say unto thee: please remove those lines! One could be construed as an attack on another editor, one looks like a tit for tat, and the last is at best a statement of the obvious, at worst a feeding of a regrettably not endangered species. Favonian (talk) 12:16, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Done Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 12:17, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Thank you so much. You've saved me asking you the same thing. Elen of the Roads (talk) 12:30, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

ANI

The thread you started at ANI has taken a turn, and if you have anything to say in your defense, now is the time. I'm sorry, but I really don't feel that you and Wikipedia are a good fit; it's not only the constant mistakes, it's the unwillingness to learn from them. If I don't hear a few people support your continuing here, or a really good reason not to, I am going to block your account indefinitely. --Floquenbeam (talk) 17:14, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

I have made a comment at the thread in question. Thanks for notifying me of this! Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 22:55, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

You keep talking about "policy" at AIV. What policy? I looked at the AIV guidelines and didn't see anything that resembled "non-admins are free to remove reports they consider to be stale." ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 23:16, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Maybe that's part of the problem; there isn't one. When I say "policy" I mean the sum of the various policies as a whole. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 23:43, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Tell me where you got the idea it was appropriate to remove someone else's entry from AIV. ←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 00:25, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Just see this diff posted at ANI which shows there were 16 revisions and 2 hours between the report being filed and my removal of it. During that time nobody acted or commented on it, considering reports have been removed as stale in a much shorter period of time; I decided to remove it as stale and honestly thought I was doing the right thing about it. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:36, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I voluntarily hand in my rollback and reviewer rights

I would like someone to remove these rights ASAP as clearly I do not deserve them for forcing the community to put up with my bulls**t over the past few months. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 23:47, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

OK. Done. Fainites ^barleyscribs 23:51, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for that. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 23:51, 18 December 2010 (UTC)

Good luck Barts. If in doubt - don't hit that save button. Wikipedia will still be there in the morning. Fainites ^barleyscribs 12:29, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Question

I just don't get this, Barts1a. I would have thought that either you want to edit here, or you don't. If you do, I just can't comprehend why you intentional wander from conflict to conflict, and why you insist on doing things you don't understand, in the face of united opinion that it is disruptive. If you don't want to edit here, I just can't comprehend why you would upload some useful photos, and whack some vandals, knowing you're trying to get blocked. The disruption has to stop, it just has to; there are a lot of person-hours tied up in trying to advise you, but it's as if you're intentionally going against this advice. I hate to block someone who is trying to help the project, and it's almost never necessary, because people who want to help usually listen to constructive feedback, and alter their behavior to work better in this environment.
So I guess question #1 is, do you want to edit here, or not? Not a rhetorical question, I hope for an answer. --Floquenbeam (talk) 00:10, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I will admit that my recent history has been... colorful to say the least. I do have a wish to continue editing here. I think maybe a more appropriate solution would be page bans from the various noticeboards, this way I can still make helpful contributions while having the threat of a block looming overhead if I revisit my problem areas. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:18, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I am reminded of another user who, maybe 1/2 year ago, was probably almost as close to being blocked indefinitely as you are now. I thought at the time he should have been. He was actually much the same as you, seeming to want to help but just going from argument to argument, screw-up to screw-up (pardon my bluntness, it's necessary), constantly complaining everyone was out to get him. Somewhat miraculously, he made a decision, stuck to it, and he's now a productive editor with some solid articles under his belt. So it isn't impossible. But you simply, absolutely must agree to stop participating in a lot of activities you don't understand until you get more accustomed to the place.

How would you feel about the following:

a topic ban from all noticeboards (I think it a good sign that you thought of this independently)
not using Huggle (I've gone back and seen several times you've reverted something as vandalism when it wasn't)
avoiding contentious articles and their talk pages
accepting a 1RR limit (ie you can only revert someone once in any dispute)

What I have in mind is that these restrictions would be (a) in effect until an admin thinks they're no longer necessary, and (b) subject to expansion if you seem to run into trouble in an area I haven't thought of.

This is really pretty draconian, and you would be essentially allowing other people to decide things for you, which seems to annoy you. I don't know if you're willing to do this or not. But you've dug a fairly deep hole, and you aren't going to able to just hop out of it. At least stop digging. --Floquenbeam (talk) 00:31, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I will humbly accept all of the above. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:34, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Good. I'll note this at ANI, and suggest that blocking be put on hold. You might also consider looking for a mentor, although I won't require it. I'm logging off for the night, but I'll look in in the morning and see if this is OK with everyone. --Floquenbeam (talk) 00:38, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Editing Restrictions

Looks like the mob at ANI is putting the tar and feathers away (that's a joke people). I think these restrictions will help you develop successfully as an editor, and I'm glad to see you've voluntarily agreed to them before ANI could impose them on you. In additon to these restrictions, I'd like to strongly encourage you to seek out a mentor. Having one will help guide you along and keep you away from trouble. A good mentor won't however shield you from trouble should you get into it. Basically all they'll do is give you advice. Getting a mentor needs to be your decision however. Having a mentor imposed on you won't be a good thing. Read up on the concept at WP:MENTOR and if you're interested let me know. I'm here to help. N419 BH 09:55, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I am interested in this occurring... the million dollar question is: Who is willing to take on such a role? Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 10:29, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Barts1a, first, cheers to you, that you're willing to take on these restrictions for awhile. Second, you already have lots of "mentors" watching this page, who would much rather see you find your way here, if editing Wikipedia is how you like spending some of your time. Gwen Gale (talk) 10:34, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

What Gwen said. If you want a formal, declared mentor, I'll take on that role if you wish. You've already got several informal people watching your talk page. N419 BH 10:37, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I would like a formal, declared mentor and I thank you in advance for willing to take on this role. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 10:42, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Alright. Sounds good. N419 BH 10:52, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I already have your first question... What should be done about this file? It clearly has a watermark from a commercial (non-free) website with no evidence of permission. My first choice would be to flag it for sppedy deletion as a copyvio. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 10:58, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Done - tagged for deletion ~~and links removed~~ or not... Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 11:08, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

It's been deleted already, so moot point if the link is still there. And I tagged another one by the same guy that's also a copyvio. That article's gonna need some work...dunno if we have any images for it. N419 BH 11:18, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

I noticed that myself, unsure if there is a free image available... I'll see if I can find one... Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 11:20, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

It doesn't look like there is one... The article may have to remain image-less until one can be found. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 11:29, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Question...

Should this blocked user have talk page access revoked and/or block extended for clear misuse of talk page while blocked? (Removing a block notice while they are still blocked with the edit summary "Goodbye loser! (Punches Cirt into jail) Yes, i will continue editing. (laughs)" Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 23:33, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

Why are you reverting more than once? --Floquenbeam (talk) 00:09, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

According to WP:3RR there is an exception to 1RR restrictions for "Reverting obvious vandalism". How is the action taken by this user not obvious vandalism? Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:38, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Just as a general rule, you should never enter into an edit war on another user's talk page. If you think they're abusing the page, just inform an admin. Good luck! Dayewalker (talk) 00:42, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

More to the point, yesterday you agreed to a 1RR restriction in order to avoid an indef block. --Floquenbeam (talk) 00:44, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Even more to the point; nobody has denied that the IP's edits were obvious vandalism; which is exempt from ALL editing restrictions. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 00:51, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Wrong attitude. There were plenty of people watching that talk page, your revert was not needed. ~~Your assertion that this was exempt from ALL editing restrictions is incorrect, and is one more example of you saying things when you don't have a clue what you're talking about.~~ I see I made an error yesterday, going against a clear consensus in order to give you a final chance. If you break your agreement again, I will fix that mistake. --Floquenbeam (talk) 01:01, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Mea culpa, I see the WP:1RR section of WP:3RR actually says what you say it says. Particularly since you've been asked before to pay closer attention to what policies actually say, it's pretty unfair to come down on you for following the letter of the law (as Elen says below, you can make a good argument that it wasn't technically vandalism, but I won't pick that nit). I've stricken the part above that was bone-headed wrong, and apologize. However, that was not my intent when I drew up those restrictions yesterday. My intent is that you avoid the thrill of the battle, that you stop picking fights, even with vandals, that you dial things back several notches. So, as we agreed yesterday, I am extending your editing restrictions to include reverting anything more than once, including all the exceptions at WP:3RR. Someone else will come along and do it if it's important. I'm sorry I didn't make this clearer yesterday. --Floquenbeam (talk) 01:29, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Hold on a minute... You never even mentioned anything like this in the agreement we came to! If you had wanted this to be different from other 1RR restrictions you would have mentioned it in the agreement we came to. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 01:35, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

That's what I'm saying; I thought I said that yesterday, but now realize I wasn't clear, so I apologized. Now I'm fixing that. As we agreed, "subject to expansion if you seem to run into trouble in an area I haven't thought of". Now, if I said you were restricted from using the letter "e", that wouldn't be fair. But it seems pretty reasonable to make this change/clarification. Reading your edit summary for the second revert, it seems clear that you are approaching the vandal with exactly the attitude I was trying to guide you away from. --Floquenbeam (talk) 01:54, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough. Barts1a | Talk to me | Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 01:59, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Final piece of advice. Have a chat with your mentor before you type another word. --Floquenbeam (talk) 01:04, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Barts1a, you can't vandalise your own userpage. Think about it. You can remove items that should have remained, or you can add rude items that shouldn't be there, but you can't vandalise it. So you can never win an edit war with someone on the basis that they are vandalising their own userpage. Elen of the Roads (talk) 01:11, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

IP's

I see you've archived the discussion, but I'll bring this up anyway: I may be wrong, but I have a vague recollection the IP's in general are not supposed to "manage" their user pages the way registered users do. In particular, they shouldn't remove block notices, because if someone else happens to land on that IP, they would wonder why they're blocked. Maybe an admin can clarify. ←Baseball Bugs^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 06:29, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

As far as I know this is the case. Maybe things have changed? Barts1a | Talk to me |Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 07:15, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

I wish you were right, but the only restrictions are those imposed by WP:BLANKING. Favonian (talk) 08:54, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

What can sometimes happen, is that an active IP can indeed blank more or less anything other than declined unblock requests from their own talk page, but if the IP stops editing for a time someone might restore/unblank the page, to show what had been going on. Gwen Gale (talk) 09:13, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Putting out fires

Thanks for the note (you forgot to sign it btw). I was at work, hence the delay in replying. You are correct in that reverting obvious vandalism is an exception to WP:1RR. However, this was the wrong attitude in this case. Let me make it perfectly clear: YOU ARE ON VERY THIN ICE. You need to step away from conflicts and controversy (see where it says "avoiding contentious pages" in your restrictions). If you see something like this again, don't even revert it. Notify the administrator of your choice, who can then take appropriate action. I agree with the other editors that your WP:1RR restriction applies to everything without exceptions. If you revert something once, Hugglers will get it if it's reposted. You don't need to utilize exceptions to rules here (see the thin ice comment above). I would interpret all your restrictions in very strict terms; that is, if you have to consider whether or not an edit would violate your restrictions, don't make the edit. Ask me if you have any questions.

We should probably make a couple changes to your userpage. I shouldn't have to go to your archives to find a problem that's only a few hours old. Consider an archive bot. We also need to put a notice at the top of this page and your "complaints" page letting people know I'm your mentor. I would have liked to have been notified of this issue sooner. I'll write one up and place it in a new section here. If it's to your liking you can put it at the top of your userpage under the headers that are already there. N419 BH 07:40, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Header for your talk pages

I am under a few editing restrictions for the time being; namely:

I am not editing any noticeboards
I am not using Huggle
I am avoiding contentious articles and their talk pages
I am adhering to the one revert rule

If you have concerns about my editing, please let my mentor, N419 BH, know on his talk page

Consider adding this to the top of your talk pages to make other users aware of the situation. If you'd like to change the wording or use different colors feel free. N419 BH08:50, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

This looks good. I've put it onto this page and my complaints page. Barts1a | Talk to me |Yell at me | Merry Christmas to all! 09:10, 21 December 2010 (UTC)