Talk:USR PLUS
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Political position
[edit]2020 USR-PLUS Alliance | |
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| Political position | Centre-right (de jure) Centre (de facto) |
Ok, let's settle this!
- USR-PLUS is a self described "centre-right party" although the only resemblance this party has with the right is economic liberalism (which by the way, is more of a center policy than a right one), every other policy is more or less from the left, being more of a social liberal party then a classical liberal or christian democrat or any other center-right ideology. I wold describe this party as being "Centre to centre-left" but even the party itself doesn't realy know what they are so I propose we keep it safe and go with "Centre". What do you think about the following infobox for this page as well as USR and PLUS individual pages? - Barumbarumba (talk) 07:33, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
This is a an economic-right and social-right party. Their economic policy involves privatization of healthcare and education, defunding social security systems, reducing public spending and eliminating the minimum wage. Social policies have involved support for a religious federation that organized a referendum to ban gay rights. They describe themselves as moderate-right and are openly and observably a moderate-right party by any non-U.S. political definitions (i.e. political systems not based on right-wing media interpretations of political theory). The Biden administration is further left from this party and they're also moderate right (again, according to political theory in the rest of the world, not in the U.S.). Hope this helps with the confusion. Pblimps85 (talk) 08:04, 2 September 2021 (UTC)
- Literally none of the stuff you're saying is factually accurate. USR PLUS was the only party which opposed the anti-LGBT referendum. And the rest is in open contradiction to the party's election platform which can be found here Cscescu (talk) 23:37, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
About the merging of USR and PLUS
[edit]New name
[edit]Hi Barumbarumba, should we call this new party "USR PLUS" without the hyphen instead? This name appears to be the most used by newspapers talking about the merger of both parties and it is now being used in the new party's website [1], although it does look worse without the hyphen. What do you think? Super Ψ Dro 08:44, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
- I don't know, i think it looks more natural with a hyphen because they are initials which don't have meaning as a whole. - Barumbarumba (talk) 9:52, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've searched USR-PLUS (with the hyphen) on Google, clicked on the news section and pretty much every newspaper appears to be using "USR PLUS" and not "USR-PLUS". I'll send the articles that showed up to me: [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] (USR PLUS) [9] [10] (USR-PLUS) [11] (USRPLUS?). That's just the first page of results, but there appears to be a clear use of "USR PLUS" so it isn't necessary to look more in depth. I will notify that I'll move this in some hours, giving some time in case someone would like to oppose. Super Ψ Dro 08:37, 6 May 2021 (UTC)
Leaders
[edit]I think Dan Barna's and Dacian Cioloș's positions as leaders of USR and PLUS respectively from their infoboxes shoul remain regardles of the fact that the two parties do not exist any longer. This is for the sake of not doing a new office where we put "Co-Leader of USR-PLUS" for each of them and instead just wait until August 2021 to know who the leader of the new party will be. - Barumbarumba (talk) 11:11, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
USR-PLUS merger details are factually inaccurate
[edit]This article claims that USR and PLUS merged together to form a new party called USR-PLUS. This is not the case.
According to the merger protocol, which can be found here, PLUS was merged into the Save Romania Union. The merger is effective once PLUS ceases to exist in the Romanian register of political parties, which is yet to take place. In any case, while the visual identity of the new party will adopt the USR-PLUS brand, the name of the party remains the Save Romania Union.
Moreover, this article cites no secondary source backing up the ideological section of the infobox. Cscescu (talk) 14:34, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- Yes, this is true, it is even said on a cited source (reference 15). I have corrected it. However, placing an inaccuracy tag just for that is excessive. Super Ψ Dro 17:07, 26 April 2021 (UTC)
- The two parties said in that same protocol that they have plans to change the legal name of the party into "USR PLUS" after the final decision of the court regarding the merging. What is the point of puting a "Save Romania Union (officially)" everywhere on the page for two or three months or so? Does anyone really care? It's not like it will stay that way, it is going to change to just "USR PLUS". - Barumbarumba (talk) 13:23, 27 April 2021 (UTC)
- The specific provision is not legally binding on the Congress, but it is rather a statement of intention. Wikipedia only concerns itself with providing the facts as they are today, not with future possibilities or intentions. Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. I would kindly remind you that this is an encyclopaedia and there are several rules and procedures that must be followed when editing content. Cscescu (talk) 13:10, 27 April 2021 (UTC)
Restatement of abovementioned issues
[edit]1) The party is still called the Save Romania Union party, and while a protocol on the matter specifies that a future congress should change the name of the party to USR PLUS, this is not set in stone and will only happen once that congress takes place. It may well be the case that the party will adopt a completely different name. 2) USR and PLUS were not merged together. PLUS was merged into USR. It is for this reason that it is factually inaccurate to claim that a new party was founded in April 2021. Moreover, there is still a page bearing the name Save Romania Union claiming that the USR part is defunct and was replaced with this new party, which is not the case at all. 3) There is no available source for the claims that USR is a centrist or progressive party. 4) There is no available source for the claim that the 'merged' party is the legal successor of the alliance (because it isn't, the legal personality still rests with the Save Romania Union, into which PLUS was merged).
Cscescu (talk) 22:33, 11 May 2021 (UTC)
Second restatement of abovementioned issues
[edit]As I have stated numerous times during the past two months, the possibility that the party congress would conserve the USR name and logo became a reality. The party, while merged, never actually changed name to USR PLUS, so this page is providing inaccurate information to Wikipedia's readers.
From a legal point of view, PLUS ceased existing on 16 April 2021 when it was merged into USR. While the party used the USR PLUS logo, the party was never named nor did it function as USR PLUS. This thing was confirmed by today's vote in the party's congress.
I suggest that this page be renamed to Alliance 2020 and present the electoral alliance that existed between the two parties up until April 2021.
A special section should be created on the Save Romania Union page explaining the historical situation between April and October 2021. PLEASE DO NOT REMOVE THE DISPUTED BADGE UNTIL THE ISSUES HAVE BEEN RESOLVED AMICABLYCscescu (talk) 21:03, 3 October 2021 (UTC)