Talk:Timeline of Croatian history
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Note
[edit]This article is in the middle of an expansion. You are welcome to assist in its construction by editing as well. Please, if/when editing this article, make sure your edits are well referenced (if possible), so we can avoid chaos and edit wars which are usually common to balkan history articles. Thanks. --Kebeta (talk) 18:15, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
Note II
[edit]Added pictures will be sorted to related sections after the article is written to such a degree that they can fit in respectable by the text they present. Now, they are only in chronological presentation, one after the other. --Kebeta (talk) 21:20, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
Tense
[edit]Only now I noticed that the entries I had added were all written in the present tense, while other entries are apparently in the past tense. WP:MOS recommends past tense for describing historical events, but many timelines use present tense, and I find it more natural in this context. I'm not sure which is better, I'll try to find out. GregorB (talk) 16:02, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
Some disputed things presented as fact
[edit]The following lines
- 600 AD In first wave Croats migrated together with Avars from the region that is now (roughly) Galicia and areas of the Pannonian plain, to the province of Dalmatia ruled by the Roman Empire. Croats were led into the Roman province of Dalmatia by a group of five brothers, Klukas, Lobel, Kosenc, Muhlo and Hrvat, and their two sisters, Tuga and Buga.
- 620 In second wave Croats migrated when the they were invited by the Emperor Heraclius to counter the Avar threat on the Byzantine Empire, or Croats weren't actually invited by Heraclius, but instead defeated the Avars and settled on their own, after migrating from an area near today's Silesia. This record is supported by the writings of one Thomas the archdeacon, Historia Salonitana from the 13th century.
present things written by Constantine (several centuries later, = DAI), likely a folk legend, as a fact. DAI tells the things twice but not because they occurred twice, but because chap. 30 was written by someone else, so there are two reports.
Historia Salonitana barely supports this.
- 640 Porga of Croatia was one of the first known princes (Croatian: knez) of Dalmatian Croatia, who had been invited into Dalmatia by Byzantium Emperor Heraclius. At Porga's request to Heraclius for Christian teachers, Pope John IV (640-642) sent Christian teachers and missionaries to the Croatian Provinces. These missionaries had converted Porga and great many of the clan that was under his immediate authority, to the Catholic faith in 640. Porga ruled in what is today Dalmatia, and his region consisted of 11 counties (Croatian: županija) which were: Hlebiana, Tzenzena, Emota, Pleba, Pesenta, Parathalassia, Brebere, Nona, Tnena, Sidraga, Nina.
Now, the year is not accurately known, and one of two accounts in DAI calls him Porin. Again, things Constantine written are taken as fact. If names of brothers and sisters (Muhlo,...) are given in "Croatian" form, why county names are here in Greek form? Can we talk about "Catholic" faith in 640? Shouldn't "Christian" be more appropriate given the age? Also "Porga ruled in what is today Dalmatia" is not accurate, he likely ruled more inland, including some parts of today Bosnia and Herzegovina, he didn't rule the coastal cities and islands, and didn't rule the south of Dalmatia.
- Under Tomislav, a first Croatian king, Kingdom of Croatia became one of the most powerful kingdoms in Medieval Europe. According to Constantine Porphyrogenitus, Tomislav had an army of 160,000 soldiers (60,000 cavalry and 100,000 infantry).
- 925 The first King of Croatia (rex Croatorum), Tomislav (910–928) of the Trpimirović dynasty was crowned.
Again DAI is taken as fact, an army so big is extremely unlikely. If Tomislav was crowned (by whom?) it could happen in 920, or 923. He's just mentioned as a rex in 925 (because a pope sent a letter to him and some others)
Just some thoughts from my side regarding the early part of the timeline, regards dnik ► 12:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
- I have noticed your comments, and will try to integrate some of this into the article at some point soon. Regards. Kebeta (talk) 22:18, 5 November 2009 (UTC)
Overly detailed
[edit]The timeline gets overly detailed from the 1980s on. GregorB (talk) 20:27, 15 October 2014 (UTC)
External links modified
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