Talk:The Zeitgeist Movement

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the The Zeitgeist Movement article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12: 2 months

The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information.

This page is not a forum for general discussion about The Zeitgeist Movement. Any such comments may be removed or refactored. Please limit discussion to improvement of this article. You may wish to ask factual questions about The Zeitgeist Movement at the Reference desk.

Organizations Mid‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Organizations, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Organizations on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.OrganizationsWikipedia:WikiProject OrganizationsTemplate:WikiProject Organizationsorganization articles
Mid	This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

Sociology: Social Movements Low‑importance

	Society portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Sociology, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of sociology on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SociologyWikipedia:WikiProject SociologyTemplate:WikiProject Sociologysociology articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by the social movements task force.

Environment: Sustainability Low‑importance

	Environment portal This environment-related article is part of the WikiProject Environment to improve Wikipedia's coverage of the environment. The aim is to write neutral and well-referenced articles on environment-related topics, as well as to ensure that environment articles are properly categorized. Read Wikipedia:Contributing FAQ and leave any messages at the project talk page.EnvironmentWikipedia:WikiProject EnvironmentTemplate:WikiProject EnvironmentEnvironment articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by the Sustainability task force.

Alternative views C‑class Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Alternative views, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of significant alternative views in every field, from the sciences to the humanities. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion.Alternative viewsWikipedia:WikiProject Alternative viewsTemplate:WikiProject Alternative viewsAlternative views articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Skepticism C‑class Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Skepticism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of science, pseudoscience, pseudohistory and skepticism related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SkepticismWikipedia:WikiProject SkepticismTemplate:WikiProject SkepticismSkepticism articles
C	This article has been given a rating which conflicts with the project-independent quality rating in the banner shell. Please resolve this conflict if possible.
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

This article was nominated for deletion. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:

delete, 8 November 2008, see discussion.
keep, 6 March 2011 (UTC), see discussion.

If you are a member or affiliate of the Zeitgeist movement, or were called here by one, please read this introduction on how to change the article.

The following Wikipedia contributor has declared a personal or professional connection to the subject of this article. Relevant policies and guidelines may include conflict of interest, autobiography, and neutral point of view.
Their edits to this article were last checked for neutrality on 6 February 2021 by Elizium23. Error: Disclosures that use the |checked= parameter should also use |editedhere=yes for at least one contributor.

Chaos Gentleman (talk · contribs) This user has declared a connection. (declared here)

Wessex Scene article

The Wessex Scene article by Samuel Gilonis used as a source to describe the movement is insufficient to bear much weight. An article by a student journalist for a UK student paper is a weak primary source for fact and not meriting notice as opinion. Martinlc (talk) 08:54, 22 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Changing the Headline of The Zeitgeist Movement Page

The Zeitgeist Movement (TZM) is a global social movement founded in 2008 by Peter Joseph that is described as promoting a critical utopian vision to work towards a global consciousness as a part of the larger alter-globalization movement. The movement places an emphasis on the scientific method to rid the world of ideological divisions to "develop a system of human equality, thriving from the cooperation and balance of technology and nature."^[1]^[2]Chaos Gentleman (talk) 18:43, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

No hyperlinks in wikitext, please. "Peter Joseph" may be a redlink.
scribd.com is not a reliable source.
Passive voice: "is described as" is poor writing - who describes it?

Elizium23 (talk) 19:34, 8 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It appears it was re-added without ever addressing these basic issues. As this paper lacks any indication that it was published by an outlet with a positive reputation for accuracy and fact-checking, I have removed this grad student paper as an unreliable source. If the paper is indeed reliable, support this with an independent source discussing the paper, and ideally use that to summarize why the paper is encyclopedically useful. Grayfell (talk) 06:05, 2 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Any claim that TZM uses 'the scientific method' for anything of consequence would have to be backed up by some very good independent sourcing with the necessary qualifications to make such an assertion. Wikipedia does not repeat simple assertions on such matters as fact. AndyTheGrump (talk) 13:29, 2 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ Donovan, Travis (May 25th, 2011). "The Zeitgeist Movement: Envisioning A Sustainable Future". The Huffington Post. Retrieved 8 February 2021. {{cite news}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)
^ Cooper, Brent. "The Zeitgeist Movement: Alter-globalization, Complexity, and Conspirituality". Scribed. Retrieved 8 February 2021.

This statement is simply wrong. Why does wikipedia take at face value statements like this because a reporter says it?

This statement is simply wrong:

"The first Zeitgeist documentary which predates the organization Zeitgeist movement, borrowed from the works of Eustace Mullins, Lyndon LaRouche, and radio host Alex Jones. Much of its footage was taken directly from Alex Jones documentaries."

Why does wikipedia take at face value statements like this because a "reporter" says it? Where is the evidence?

Peter Joseph has also refuted this statement. Nothing from the film in ideology came from Mullins or LaRouche and there was a tiny minuscule B-roll clip element related to Alex Jones, whom Peter Joseph hates.

The statement is a classic example of propoganda. Wikipedia editors should be ashamed that they includes such a polarizing statement in what is supposed to be an objective article. 2603:6081:8500:CB77:5B0:E289:41D:7791 (talk) 01:18, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

See Wikipedia:Reliable sources, Wikipedia:Independent sources, and Wikipedia:No original research. Considering the WP:FRINGE claims made by the film, at face value, it is not an extraordinary claim to point out that Mullins, LaRouche, and Jones influenced these ideas. That said, if you know of a reliable source which disputes this, please present it here. To prevent a common misconception, for many reasons, the film itself will be of limited use here, we need sources about the film, such as the one already cited. Grayfell (talk) 03:04, 17 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

[1] Donovan, Travis (May 25th, 2011). "The Zeitgeist Movement: Envisioning A Sustainable Future". The Huffington Post. Retrieved 8 February 2021. {{cite news}}: Check date values in: |date= (help)

[2] Cooper, Brent. "The Zeitgeist Movement: Alter-globalization, Complexity, and Conspirituality". Scribed. Retrieved 8 February 2021.

[1]

[2]