Talk:Sex differences in narcissism

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Mayiafea, Amiraakp.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 03:27, 18 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Article title

I selected a NPOV title for the term "male narcissim" popular among feminists (and used in wikipedia; actually where I saw it for the first time). Any better suggestions are welcome. Staszek Lem (talk) 00:35, 22 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Revert

I recently reverted an edit here because it seemed to be too much of an essay on the topic. I have no issue with content being re-added once it's been checked over and verified. Shalor (Wiki Ed) (talk) 05:57, 3 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Gendered Presentation

This article is subtly biased. Other similar articles (e.g., https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neuroscience_of_sex_differences) talk about the authors of studies in a general way, but this article makes a point of using the the author's name so everyone is knows that she is female and couches the results very carefully in order to minimize them. I would suggest edits to this article so that is it is more along the lines of the example above. That article does sometimes use researchers' names but not in this way. Tlinse (talk) 22:45, 15 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Bullshit. Staszek Lem (talk) 00:12, 16 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Bullshit right back atcha. Tlinse (talk) 03:05, 17 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Various

I don't claim to be unbiased. For this reason and others, I'm not going to directly touch the main article if I can avoid that.

"In gender studies, the analysis of gender differences in narcissism shows that male narcissism and female narcissism differ in a number of aspects."

This would be best followed by vertical list, with each item marked either with a citation, or marked as needing a citation.

"Jeffrey Kluger, in his 2014 book The Narcissist Next Door suggested that our society, still largely patriarchal, is more likely to tolerate male narcissism and aggressiveness than these of females.[1] "

It is unclear from this statement whether the claim that our society is still largely patriarchal is being offered as Kluger's claim, as the claim of the contributing editor, or both. It is a claim that demands support, either way. Failing to attribute the claim could be construed as a means to evade offering support for the claim. We can do better than this.

"This assertion was voiced, although without definite proof, by a number of other researchers."

The statement cites zero researchers. A list of them is warranted, with citations of where the make the assertion. Moreover, people on both sides of the issue should all be eager to see that list here.

"In 2015 a number of media outlets reported[1][2] about a study at the University of Buffalo which analyzed 31 years of data of narcissism research and concluded that men consistently scored higher in the first two of three aspects of the Narcissistic Personality Inventory: leadership/authority, exploitative/entitlement, and grandiose/exhibitionism.[3][4] "

The citation fails to mention which 31 years were part of the study, and whether or not the study addressed changes in narcissism by gender over those 31 years. It also fails to mention which plausible confounding variables were controlled-for and which others were not controlled-for.

"The team leader of the research, Emily Grijalva, commented that on average this difference is slight (a one-quarter of a standard deviation) and there was almost no difference in the exhibitionism dimension (which covers such aspects as vanity, self-absorption and attention-seeking)."

There is enough space left in the article to clarify whether or not the exact same criteria were literally applied to men and women, or whether any behaviors were interpreted as normal gender performance for one gender, but as narcissistic for the other. Yes, I know you probably know why I'm pointing this out. But I do have an important point to consider. So please humor me.

"She notices that a similar degree of difference is observed for other personality traits, e.g., slightly higher neuroticism for women or slightly higher risk-taking for men.[5]"

And how are these behaviors weighted as diagnostic indicators, per gender, per standard deviation? Again, there is plenty of space in the article for such clarification.

"The reasons of reported gender difference were outside the scope of the study, however the authors speculated that it is rooted in historically established social conventions about what is acceptable for a particular gender and what are the traditional social roles for genders.[5]"

If the reasons were outside the scope of the study, then what is one to make of the fact that de facto reasons are nonetheless offered along with the study? It seems like there should probably already be some follow-up to this question. Inasmuch as the Wikipedia article elicits such question, some kind of answer to it would seem pertinent, if offered.

"A number of earlier studies (on smaller scales) reported similar bias.[6]"

Bias, as such, has not been previously stated. For bias to be similar, it must be similar to something.

"A further indication for the trend was a 2008 finding that the lifetime narcissistic personality disorder is more prevalent for men (7.7%) than for women (4.8%).[7]"

And again, the question arises, whether the diagnostic criteria, themselves, may have been weighted in such as way as to inevitably produce such result. Looking at market data for comparative expenditures for grooming between genders, certainly should lead one to wonder what researchers were using to quantify vanity, self-absorption and attention-seeking; certainly not market data.

If the editors are not sympathetic to my particular perspective, that shouldn't be a reason to neglect to improve the article in terms of neutrality and/or in terms of explaining points of controversy from more than one angle.

Thank you.

Joshua Clement Broyles — Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.119.60.74 (talk) 23:21, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]