Talk:Jilava massacre

The connection between the Jilava Massacre and the WW II

Dear Biruitorul,

1.- The official name of the famous Romanian prison is "Penitenciarul Bucuresti", the "Jilava prison" is the usual nickname.

2.- The crossing of the Prut by the Romanian troops as the beginning of the WW II („Războiul sfânt, anticomunist, drept şi naţional”) was in 1941, June 22, 7 months after the Jilava Massacre. There is no connection between those two events. The introduction in the article of the [Category:Romania during World War II] and the [Category:World War II massacres] is inadequate.

3.- The formulation of the Background capitol is problematic. The sentence: "The court ordered the arrest of those to be investigated, had them imprisoned at Jilava, and entrusted them to the custody of special Legionary formations..." is inexact: the arrest of Moruzov in Sept. 6 (in Gara de Nord) and his deputy was not ordered by a court or a judge, it was a personal order of Antonescu (and for many others, by a personal order of Horia Sima), because of the personal ranqune of the General (existence of a heavy and unpleasant dossier about Antonescu in the hands of Moruzov) and the dark background as a spy of Horia Sima. Finally, the Legionars used the killing of Zelea Codreanu as a pretext for the massacre of the incommod adversaries. Alex F. (talk) 10:03, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

• 1. Sure, it's called Bucureşti - Jilava, but the most common name is Penitenciarul Jilava, and we'll eventually have an article separate from the commune article.
• 2. Yes, I know that's when that genocidal war started, but where else should we categorise the article? After all, war was raging in the rest of Europe.
• 3. Any source for that? What the article says is what Cretzianu writes. - Biruitorul ^Talk 17:32, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

For suplimentary sources for # 3, please go to the articles "Masacrul de la Jilava" & "Horia Sima" in Ro:Wikipedia. Alex F. (talk) 12:34, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

At a glance, it seems those sources are either used already or highly dubious. - Biruitorul ^Talk 15:24, 9 March 2009 (UTC)

Please, speak up, you must mention clearly those "highly dubious" sources, because of the incompatibility with Wikipedia in general, and especially in Ro:Wikipedia. Alex F. (talk) 10:50, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

My job here isn't to fix ro.wiki's many problems, but here are a couple of examples. Google Video is not a reliable source. Neither are blog posts (Mihai Pelin's). Or, unless used in proper context, Legionary works like Ce este comunismul?. - Biruitorul ^Talk 15:47, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

If I may intrude. I can't comment on the main issues for now (though I am willing to contribute to the article in the future), but I will allow myself to side with Biruitorul on Point 2: the WWII massacres category is apparently designed (and should best be designed) to cover all such incidents between 1939 and 1945, at least those in countries who participated somehow. I would picture this maybe being an issue if we were talking about Switzerland or Sweden (maybe - even such countries are arguably connected somehow). But for some reason the Swiss and the Swedes solved more of their problems the human and the sane way, so they don't really count here. Dahn (talk) 18:55, 8 March 2009 (UTC)