Talk:Harold Parker (civil servant)
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Large group of commentary added by Turjaaa
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Update the article with the following info[edit]Historical events[edit]MEMO[edit]In 1956, Sir Harold Parker wrote a memo about how the Central Government should organize its military during a worldwide war. The Chiefs of Staff reviewed this memo on May 1st, 1956. They generally agreed with the guidelines for the Service Ministries outlined in the memo. However, they wanted to make sure they made the right decision, so they asked the Joint Planning Staff to look into the specific tasks and responsibilities that the Chiefs of Staff would have at the Central Government Headquarters. https://www.agda.ae/en/catalogue/tna/defe/6/35/n/322 https://www.agda.ae/en/catalogue/tna/defe/6/35/n/321 https://www.agda.ae/en/catalogue/tna/defe/4/80/n/224 https://www.agda.ae/en/catalogue/tna/defe/5/53/n/333 Sir Harold Parker requested a memorandum from George Catlin in July 1952, acknowledging the growing importance of developing the democratic case and propaganda due to the military stalemate in Korea and the increasing pressure on the Churches stemming from the ideological conflict and the defense of Christian civilization and ideals. https://www.academia.edu/82226945/The_Anglican_Church_in_the_period_of_the_Cold_War_1945_55 Meetings[edit]By January 1951, Montagu was actively engaged in pressuring the authorities to either grant him permission to publish or take legal action against Duff Cooper. Montagu had numerous meetings with Sir Harold Parker, who held the position of Permanent Secretary at the Ministry of Defence. https://wrap.warwick.ac.uk/928/1/WRAP_Aldrich_0672848-240609-aldrich.policing.final.ehr.nov03.pdf ASA (Amateur Swimming Association) Sir Harold Parker was a prominent figure in the field of swimming. Notably, he served as the President of the ASA (Amateur Swimming Association)- -https://www.sussexswimming.org/Rules/ASA_HANDBOOK_2011.pdf ASA Handbook with him listed as president https://history.swimming.org/indexed/ASA_2000_Handbook_1.docx —in 1958, a position of high prestige within the swimming community. Recognized for his significant contributions to the sport, Sir Harold's legacy endures through a seated portrait displayed in the esteemed National Portrait Gallery, a testament to his enduring impact on the swimming world. His passing in 1980 marked a loss for the swimming community, as he was celebrated for his achievements and dedication to the sport. Mentions in eprints CONTAINING THE GERMAN THREAT: THE BRITISH DEBATE OVER WEST GERMAN REARMAMENT 1949-55 SPEN C ER W ILLIAM MAW BY PhD . German Rearmament Reconsidered (Chapter 4, page 175) http://etheses.lse.ac.uk/2231/1/U615178.pdf BRITISH ANTICOMMUNIST POLICY AND THE TRANSFER OF POWER IN NIGERIA FROM THE LATE 1930s TO 1960 BY HAKEEM IBIKUNLE TIJANI.(7.4) ANGLO-NIGERIAN DEFENCE PACT :) Page 355. https://eprints.soas.ac.uk/33974/1/11015718.pdf Circumstances Short of Global War': British Defence, Colonial Internal Security, and Decolonisation in Kenya, 1945-65 by David Antony Percox, BA (Keele), MA (Lancaster). Chapter II British Counter-Insurgency in Kenya, 1952-56. Page 91 https://eprints.nottingham.ac.uk/10927/1/246491.pdf The International Civil Service Advisory Board, established by the United Nations General Assembly, included Sir Harold Parker from the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland as one of its members. The board's report on the salary scales of internationally recruited staff was associated with Mr. Pascal Frochaux, Chairman of the Expert Committee on Post Adjustments. The report was provided to the Executive Board for their reference and consideration. OFFICIAL RECORDS OF THE WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION No. 112. Salaries and Allowances: Internationally Recruited Staff. (ANNEXES 10, page 44)
COMMITTEE OF EXPERTS ON THE REVIEW OF THE ACTIVITIES AND ORGANIZATION OF THE SECRETARIAT. STRUCTURE OF THE UNITED NATIONS, APPENDIX III, Page-720 https://cdn.un.org/unyearbook/yun/chapter_pdf/1960YUN/1960_APPENDICES.pdf The Role of Amphibious Warfare in British Defence Policy, 1945 to 1964. Ian Andrew Speller Thesis submitted for the degree of Ph.D. King's College, London. 1996.( Pages73, 97) https://kclpure.kcl.ac.uk/ws/portalfiles/portal/2925352/244039.pdf UN Roster[edit]Sir Harold Parker served as a member of the Committee of Experts on the Review of the Activities and Organization of the Secretariat in 1960. This committee was responsible for examining the activities and organisation of the United Nations Secretariat. Sir Harold Parker, representing the United Kingdom, collaborated with other experts from different countries to review and provide recommendations on the functioning of the Secretariat. https://docplayer.net/102099133-Roster-of-the-united-nations-as-of-31-december-1960.html Resignation from UN Civil Service Advisory Board https://search.archives.un.org/uploads/r/united-nations-archives/a/f/9/af9e94247c685fef966fbc84809d4df119e69aadbb766c71aabd389e2a4ae4bd/S-0859-0005-06-00001.PDF US document[edit]The MPSB was established by the Defense Committee to address military production and supply. It coordinated with relevant military bodies, promoted standardization, and provided technical advice. Sir Harold Parker represented the United Kingdom on the board. https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-CRECB-1951-pt3/pdf/GPO-CRECB-1951-pt3-3.pdf Not sure about this link. French newspaper and a trip to USA https://numerique.banq.qc.ca/patrimoine/details/52327/4196631 The article "Foreign Relations of the United States, 1952–1954, Africa and South Asia, Volume XI, Part 1" describes the British delegation, led by Sir Harold Parker, attending the conference with hopes of achieving tangible results. Sir Harold expressed impatience with the Portuguese delegation's debates on sovereignty. Despite their technical expertise and persistence, little progress was made in alleviating Portuguese and Belgian concerns about their African territories. https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1952-54v11p1/pg_110
The impacts of the atomic bomb and the Cold War[edit]In July 1949, a working party chaired by Sir Harold Parker was formed to address defense expenditure. Their goal was to keep the total defense burden below £810 million. Despite economic challenges and impending devaluation, efforts were made to retain weapon design and production capacity. The merger of the Ministry of Aircraft Production with the Ministry of Supply resulted in a combined department overseeing the needs of the RAF, army, engineering, and atomic energy. https://epdf.tips/arms-economics-and-british-strategy-from-dreadnoughts-to-hydrogen-bombs-cambridg.html Donation He was a CRANLEIGH SCHOOL MEMORIAL FUND doner. http://cranleigh-ww1.daisy.websds.net/Filename.ashx?systemFileName=CSM1948_018_010.pdf&origFilename=CSM1948_018_010.pdf Interview sound Recordings: https://mrc-catalogue.warwick.ac.uk/records/MSX/3570/15 Nato documents quoting him (might be something important, but don’t know any context, he was mentioned 7 times in the document) Need help or suggestion. https://archives.nato.int/uploads/r/null/3/5/35781/MPSB_50_A_1_ENG.pdf Sir Harold Parker, Permanent Secretary of the Ministry of Defense, accompanied Lord Alexander, the British Minister of Defense, during his visit to discuss administration plans to arm Arab League states. They arrived in Washington alongside Israeli military officials, but it is noted that their simultaneous presence was coincidental. https://www.jta.org/archive/u-s-plans-to-arm-arab-countries-will-be-discussed-with-britain Photos[edit]Photo event During the annual conference in 1953 of the Chief of the Imperial General Staff, Field-Marshal Sir John Harding, Sir Harold Parker was positioned in the 10th seat in the front row for the official photograph. http://media.bufvc.ac.uk/newsonscreen2/BPN/44545/NoS_44545_other.pdf Nation Picture al Gallery https://www.npg.org.uk/collections/search/person/mp79775/sir-harold-parker Field Marshal Earl Alexander with Sir Harold Parker https://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/field-marshal-earl-alexander-the-minister-of-defense-with-news-photo/522789333?adppopup=true Resignation letter (No image is found) https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C6539599 Sir Harold Parker's report on civilian agencies in Singapore that come under the aegis of the Commissioner General (No image is found) https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C11137866 Only for the reference section. British Commonwealth 1956 https://archive.org/stream/in.ernet.dli.2015.85087/2015.85087.The-British-Commonwealth-1956_djvu.txt Video featuring Sir Harold Parker visiting Shape https://www.britishpathe.com/asset/74316/ Ref for the first paragraph in the Wiki article.[edit]London Gazette with him https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/38628/supplement/2795/data.pdf Permanent secretary civil service http://www.gulabin.com/britishcivilservants/pdf/Senior%20Civil%20Servants.pdf |
@Turjaaa: You've apparently done some extensive research on the subject. Unfortunately, it seems that most of what you've found is relatively trivial. As Permanent Secretary of the Ministry of Defense, Parker was doubtless the subject of many news articles and government documents. But they are not truly "historical events" unless they have had historical impact. Merely meeting with various people, or writing various memos, are not truly historic events. WikiDan61ChatMe!ReadMe!! 14:15, 13 February 2024 (UTC)
Extension of this discussion copied from my user talk page
[edit]I am moving a discussion from my own user talk page here for broader participation:
I am only about half way through, you will see there is a lot more to come. I disagree with some of your comments about the additions being trivial, in the UK the Permanent Secretary is the highest rank in the Civil Service and thus a comment from that position is in effect official government commentary, a bit like a Minister of State stating something. In fact anything stated has to be approved, thus comments made are important to pull together as it paints a record of what was going on at the highest echelons of UK government at that time. The biggest challenge i have is a large number of images as they are not online anywhere. DavidPolymath (talk) 22:58, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
- @DavidPolymath: The fact that Parker was Permanent Secretary was already covered in the article. The trivial part was everything else you added (
pictured coming out of the plane with Field Marshal Earl Alexander
,published a report
,involved in commenting on the support of the West Africa Territories
, ...). In other words, he did his job. There is nothing remarkable about any of these deeds other than the fact that someone captured a moment in a photo, or noted the event in a newspaper article. And his involvement in a private swimming club is also trivial. As Parker's grandson, your personal feelings about the subject may cloud your judgement about what is proper to include in the article. WikiDan61ChatMe!ReadMe!! 12:57, 14 November 2024 (UTC)- Okay, fair point but as a master source of data for people looking at history and historical facts the involvement in the west African issue is not important to most people but is those understanding the change in security in that region during that period. Are you saying wiki is only for really important things, as such half of what is there is not that important in my view. The fact he was involved in the Malaysian mutual defence treaty is not important to 99% of readers i agree, but it is part of recording the history of how they agreement came in place. I have put no feelings into this piece just 100% pure facts, the relative importance facts is debatable but as they are all references they are all reasonable. 82.2.190.85 (talk) 14:45, 14 November 2024 (UTC)
- @DavidPolyMath and 82.2.190.85: This material has been disputed: please do not restore it until the dispute is resolved.
- To your point
as a master source of data for people looking at history and historical facts
, that is not Wikipedia's goal. (See WP:NOTINDISCRIMINATE.) Let's examine some of the points that you've added:In 1952 he was pictured coming out of the plane with Field Marshal Earl Alexander
- So what? The mere fact that a photograph exists tells us nothing.
In 1955 he published a report on civilian agencies in Singapore that come under the aegis of the Commissioner General and in 1956 toured the Military Camps there although the main reason for the trip in 1956 was to draw up the defence and mutual assistance treaty between England and Malaysia.
- Again: so what? Did the report have any impact? Did it change any policy? If so, that should be the point of the paragraph. The mere publishing of a report was just a part of Parker's day-to-day work.
Whilst permanent secretary Sir Harold Parker has prepared a memorandums on the Military Organisation required by the Central Government in global war, which was considered by the Chiefs of Staff at their meeting on 1st May, 1956. The Chiefs of Staff broadly approved guidance for the Service Ministries as contained in the Memorandum, but before making a final decision they instructed the Joint Planning Staff to make a more detailed examination of the strategic and operational functions to be carried out by the Chiefs of Staff at the Central Government Head quarters.
- Once again, did the memorandum have any impact? It sounds like the Joint Planning Staff took his recommendations under consideration, but wanted more information before making any decisions. It's not clear from this that any decisions were ever made based on the memorandum.
" "We should hope that the West African territories on achieving independence would agree to undertake some external defence commitment, on the lines of the present commitment to provide a Brigade for use in a major war, as part of the obligations arising from Commonwealth membership."
- This is a quote from Parker taken completely without any context from a paper written by someone else. It tells us that Parker had an opinion on the decolonization of Africa, but not whether anyone (other than this particular author) gave heed to that opinion.
Whilst Permanent Secretary, Sir Harold Parker, complained to the then Defence Minister, Harold Macmillan...
- More facts without context. Stringing together a series of random facts and events that you've happened across in a Google search is not research, and does not make for a valid article.
- I could go on, but I hope you see the point I'm making. WikiDan61ChatMe!ReadMe!! 18:20, 14 November 2024 (UTC)
- Okay, fair point but as a master source of data for people looking at history and historical facts the involvement in the west African issue is not important to most people but is those understanding the change in security in that region during that period. Are you saying wiki is only for really important things, as such half of what is there is not that important in my view. The fact he was involved in the Malaysian mutual defence treaty is not important to 99% of readers i agree, but it is part of recording the history of how they agreement came in place. I have put no feelings into this piece just 100% pure facts, the relative importance facts is debatable but as they are all references they are all reasonable. 82.2.190.85 (talk) 14:45, 14 November 2024 (UTC)