Talk:Do Hollywood

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Do Hollywood/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Locust member (talk · contribs) 23:11, 6 January 2025 (UTC)

Reviewer: LastJabberwocky (talk · contribs) 14:56, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Hi, I will be reviewing your nomination! - LastJabberwocky (talk) 14:56, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

I'll finish the review tonight or the next morning (European time) - LastJabberwocky (talk) 14:56, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for taking on this review! I will get to your comments today. Locust member (talk) 21:19, 17 January 2025 (UTC)

I addressed most of them; I'll be able to get to the reception part tomorrow. Let me know if you need me to do anything further. Locust member (talk) 03:11, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

I have no further comments. As a sidenote: I hope you like the changes too :). If not we can clash, we can fight a little bit. The manual of style doesn't detail the process of writting a good critical response section (mostly mentions the things that shouldn't be included). Also I started noticing the sound sample includion to provide a taste of an album, but it's seems tedios and again I don't how to add an actually good sample. Best wishes eith other nominations! - LastJabberwocky (talk) 20:59, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

Good Article review progress box

Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed

Lead

Do Hollywood is the debut studio album by the American rock band the Lemon Twigs. It was released by 4AD on October 14, 2016. Two former child actors, brothers Brian D'Addario and Michael D'Addario comprise the band. Their father being a musician, he taught them the basics of instruments, though Brian also took classical guitar lessons. In 2015, they released an album titled What We Know; however, they do not view it as an official album, rather a part of their learning process. → Do Hollywood is the debut studio album by the American rock duo The Lemon Twigs, founded by brothers Brian D'Addario and Michael D'Addario. The album was released by 4AD on October 14, 2016, and promoted with two singles, a tour across North America and Europe, and an appearance on The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon.

• Done, but left the "the" in "the Lemon Twigs" lowercased per MOS:THEBAND

Second paragraph Brian sent the band's demos to the musician Jonathan Rado via Twitter, which Rado subsequently enjoyed. He then invited them to produce and record Do Hollywood at his own Dream Star Studio in Los Angeles during early 2015, while the brothers were on a school break. Though both of the brothers wrote all of the songs, they wrote them separately as they did not want each other to sing each other's songs. After their studio session, they worked on the tracks on and off for 18 months. During this period, they signed with 4AD to release Do Hollywood. The album's sound is inspired by bands such as the Beatles and the Beach Boys, as well as a variety of music from the 1970s. → Brian sent the band's demos to the musician Jonathan Rado via Twitter. Rado enjoyed it and in early 2015 invited them to produce and record Do Hollywood at his own Dream Star Studio in Los Angeles. The duo continued working on their material for the next 18 month. In 2015, they released an album titled What We Know, however, they do not view it as an official album, rather a part of their learning process. The article's body doesn't mention that Brian sent the band's demos to the musician Jonathan Rado specifically via Twitter.

• The body said that Brian sent a tweet to Rado, I feel like it would be redundant to say "Brian tweeted at him via Twitter". However, I changed the body to say "after Brian messaged him via Twitter."

Third paragraph Do Hollywood is inspired by bands such as the Beatles and the Beach Boys, as well as a variety of music from the 1970s. merge with the current third paragraph detailing the band's influences and Do Hollywood genres. Also add mixed/negative impressions.

• Done, let me know if the lead is to your liking or if I missed anything.

Background

I think you should restructure this section starting from the album and its name: Cam Lindsay from Exclaim! proposed that Do Hollywood's title is a joke and an "eye-wink to the fact that they've already done Hollywood", nodding to their acting careers. then the information connects to their child actor careers and musical influences.

•  Done... I think. Let me know if that is what you meant.

You can move Brian D'Addario and Michael D'Addario are two brothers from Long Island that comprise the rock band the Lemon Twigs. They have been playing music together since they were in elementary school, and their father, Ronnie D'Addrio, is also a musician. after ..their father regularly spun records.

•  Partly done Let me know what you think about this setup currently. I think it makes the most sense to introduce the people themselves, and then their acting/music careers. Though, I moved the fact they've been playing together after the sentence you told me to.

• • I like your version! Starting from the quote ("Cam Lindsay from Exclaim! proposed the idea that the title of their debut album..") would've been a tid bit awkward. - LastJabberwocky (talk) 16:22, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

Development → Production (just to be consistent with other album articles)

Rado enjoyed their demos and invited them to record at his house—dubbed Dream Star Studio—in Los Angeles over a 12-day period in early 2015. The band would then work on the tracks on and off over the course of 18 months, such as adding strings and brass instruments. → Rado enjoyed their demos and invited them to record at his Los Angeles house, dubbed Dream Star Studio. They recorded the outline of the album in early 2015 over a 12-day period, and continued working on the tracks on and off over the course of the next 18 months, such as adding strings and brass instruments.

•  Done

Rado liked a drum sound that the band did not want in the record, but they kept it in, and Brian expressed later, "It turned out great in the end, so I was actually quite wrong about that". As a curiosity, do we know where this drum sound appeared on the record? This sentence feels clumsy, and an addition of a particular detail is a way to make it less clumsy.

• Unfortunately we do not know which exact drum sound, Brian was rather vague about it. Would you like me to just remove the sentence altogether?
  • The "drum sound" sentence now reads clearly as day! Don't know if I was delusional the first time I read it, or now I looked at it for so long I don't need additional clarity to understand it. I don't think the ambiguity is a substantial problem. Not that we have too much information about Do Hollywood, we have to trim nice info. LastJabberwocky (talk) 16:22, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

All good, and I agree! Locust member (talk) 22:38, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

While they worked on the songs, they signed with the British record label 4AD. Brian demos songs on an iPad, while Michael likes to demo songs on cassette. → While they worked on the album, they signed with the British record label 4AD.}}

•  Done

I think you should move this sentence into the release section Brian demos songs on an iPad, while Michael likes to demo songs on cassette. And explain how this sentence connects to Do Hollywood. Did they release demos of this album online/on cassettes?

• It was not a release, just saying their process. The sentence isn't saying they released demos, just saying that they would demo their music on these devices.
  • My thinking was: does this info relevant specifically to the Do Hollywoo or should we move it to the Lemon Twigs page. As you can see, as reader I got a somewhat misleading impression that their love of releasing demos/cassettes means they released demos/cassettes for Do Hollywood. If you want to keep the info, I think it could be improved with a clarification. For example, tying it with the band's fondness nostalgic sounds, somehow represented by their love of retro means of listening music (cassettes)?
    • I see what you mean. However, the sentence is not saying they released demos, like demo albums, but instead is saying they demoed music (as in outlining the songs) on these devices.

I think you should separate this two sentences into the second paragraph about the writing Though they both wrote all of the songs on the record, they wrote them separately. Michael commented on how, when writing the album, they had "bigger egos at the time" and "didn't want each other to sing on the other's songs". and In their writing process, Brian does not know what he writes in the moment until he takes a step back, while Michael prefers to write in straightforward storytelling. He also wrote three songs about his ex-girlfriend. Identify "he" in the last sentence

•  Done, I think

Move under this one under the "influence" section as the first paragraph The two were inspired by the music of bands such as the Beatles and the Beach Boys.[10] The last track Brian made for the record was "How Lucky Am I?", and he did not get a chance to demo it. He sent Rado a voice message of him playing the song on the piano, which Rado responded with: "We should just do it that way." He then added the harmonies after, because he always thought of the song to have harmonies. When making the song "Frank", he started with the piano melody that is reminiscent of Frank Sinatra, and then wrote its lyrics afterwards.

•  Partly done I moved the first sentence, but not the rest. The rest describe the actual production of the album. The composition section is describing how the album sounds.
  • You're absolutely right most of these are about production. An accident! LastJabberwocky (talk) 16:22, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

Overview → Influences

•  Done

Reception

I noticed a number of reviewers often highlight the varied array of influences that infuse the album. You can merge them together as a third paragraph.

• Do you think you could tell me which reviews specifically I could put in a new paragraph? Just so I'm sure I'm doing what you would like.

My attempt at clarifying the quote Redfern commented how the record "plays like a bonkers show-reel of a fandom match by ability" when writing about the band's influences. → Redfern described the record as a parade of the band's influences; "bonkers show-reel of a fandom match by ability".

•  Done

The album's simple/lo-fi production seems to be an important characteristic.

• Sendra wrote how though it is only their debut album, the band "sound like they've got it all figured out". He also commented on how is "both breathtakingly refreshing that the brothers don't play anything straight and a puzzling pain in the neck when they do something wacky that they might not have needed to do"
• NME review "Most remarkable is that this album is basically just a demo. Recorded in Rado's front room, you can hear the hiss of the tape and nonsensical chatter as songs come and go. It feels authentic, like The Lemon Twigs aren't hiding anything."
• Cranford thought the album is "stylistically complex", applauding its instrumentation for allowing "lyrics that would normally sound too simplistic to sound just right". She further approved of its "unique blend of styles" and for making their captivating ability to mix an array of genres.[21]

Introduce brief consensus for mixed and negative reviews Some reviewers were more qualified in their praise. → Several reviewers got a mixed or a negative impression, feeling that album comes across excessively ostentatious, messy, insubstantial, and overly reliant on nostalgia.

•  Done

The article has so many reviews, quoted with general positive feeling towards the album. To be really exhaustively thorough, you can mention specific details liked by the reviewer. For example, NME review quoted with "feels authentic, like the Lemon Twigs aren't hiding anything" and "thrilling for the most part". We change it into specific mentions of the demo-like, homely, authentic vibes highlighted by the NME reviewer.

AllMusic review already has a few nice quotes. It has a nice comment about the album's almost overly sentimental aura. The reviewer also selects "Baby, Baby" as their favorite and "Those Days Is Comin' Soon" as the dud. We can have a separate sentence at the end of the first paragraph with ONE song that was chosen as the best and ONE song as the worst.

• "Some of the tracks are so nice and pretty that it's wrenching when they throw in a sped-up circus marching band or a proggy synth diversion." Summarize this part: "Then again, how many more records overloaded with earnest singer/songwriter tropes can the world take before it drowns in a flood of grey-tinted introspective diary entries? No worries of that here; these guys are too nuts to ever be boring or average."
• "The record's best tune, "Baby, Baby," is one of these and it sounds like a cross between the Muppets and vintage Flaming Lips."
• "The few moments on the record when the brothers push it a bit too far, like the annoyingly quirky "Those Days Is Comin' Soon," are outweighed by those when they sound like the best thing to come along since the bands they so clearly idolize. LastJabberwocky (talk) 16:22, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

Outline of my thoughts on the structure. The two last paragraph with one sentence summarizing the contents of the paragraph (~ 3: Several reviews highlight the band's simple production, which endows the album with unparalleled authenticity and freshness 4: critics are impressed by the band's ability to masterfully infuse Do Hollywood with sounds inspired by a variety of influences and genres):

• First paragraph: General score for the album among critics (already done) plus the general score for the album's songs among critics (one best song and one worst/less liked song). The suggestion for the best and worst songs came to me while reading Allmusic review, and would feel need another two reviews to confirm the best and the worst song. Alternatively, if two publications voted one best song and other two publications for another best song, we can include two best songs. The same for the worst. (Or just scratch this idea if there are not enough reviews pointing out that they REALLY love, for example, "Baby, Baby" and "Hi+Lo").
• Second paragraph: The general feelings about the album (includes the rest of the reviews that didn't end up in the paragraphs: 1, 3, 4)
• Third paragraph: Critics saying the album feels fresh, authentic, unexpectedly good for a debut, simple but effective, sounding demo-like (from NME review), etc.
• Fourth paragraph: Critics saying the album draws inspiration from multiple influences and genres. E.g "Redfern described the record as a parade of the band's influences; a "bonkers show-reel of a fandom match by ability"; A reviewer for Uncut called the album's "mix of baroque pop, prog rock and psychedelia is as bewildering as it is entertaining", etc

Would you like me to summarize all of this at the end of the first paragraph, getting rid of the AllMusic mention later in the second paragraph? If so I'm all for it, just asking for clarification. Locust member (talk) 15:34, 19 January 2025 (UTC)

I think you should remove only one quote: "both breathtakingly refreshing that the brothers don't play anything straight and a puzzling pain in the neck when they do something wacky that they might not have needed to do". The quote sounds a bit confusing and we already have several nice quotes from this source. - LastJabberwocky (talk) 16:43, 19 January 2025 (UTC)

Thanks for this outline! I found the AllMusic and Paste are the only reviews that explicitly stated a best/worst track, so I added them in the first paragraph.

I have finished the reception section, I hope I made it how you wanted it to. Locust member (talk) 15:25, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

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I'm going to get to these soon

• I'm starting worrying whether my suggestions are reasonable enough :). We are SPOILED for choice with reviews, which cursing us with a potential to nitpick information, pull out the most specific quotes we can find, and separate them by categories if possible. In addition to providing an impression that critics generally liked the album, but carefully list the reasons. Honesty, I'm mostly edit less popular albums, where it's a blessing to get bare minimum of reviews! So working with these numbers is a new experience for me. - LastJabberwocky (talk) 16:22, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

They are reasonable! It may take me a little to get to these done since it is a lot. I agree - articles are a lot easier to work on when there's less information. Locust member (talk) 22:39, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

Plagiarism

All clear from Earwig. Y

Links

All links are either work or archived

Stability

No edit disputes in the last 14 days. Y

Broadness

Article does not veer off topic and covers all aspects of the album. Y

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Did you know nomination

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• Comment or view
• Article history

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• ... that Jonathan Rado invited the Lemon Twigs to record their debut album at his house while they were on a school break?

• Source: Clash Stereogum

• Reviewed:

Improved to Good Article status by Locust member (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

Locust member (talk) 21:11, 20 January 2025 (UTC).

• A simple, charming hook. No QPQ required due to lack of prior nominations. Spot-check of GAN and article came back good. Fact is split up over a couple sentences but each is appropriately sourced and cited. Hook is short enough. Nice work! ~ Pbritti (talk) 22:10, 20 January 2025 (UTC)