Talk:Condition-based maintenance/Archives/2014

Merger Proposal

The articles Condition-based maintenance and Predictive maintenance appear to be about the same topic. The Preventive maintenance article should also be merged, it's no more than a sub-section of the main-topic as for now. I think the texts should be merged into Condition-based maintenance, with the other articles as re-directs. EverGreg (talk) 09:25, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Conditional maintenance and predictive maintenance are two separate, although related, fields and are subdivisions of preventive maintenance. There is no need of a merger, IMHO. A more worthwhile initiative would be to create a page on corrective maintenance--Christian Lassure (talk) 00:39, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

I can't say which is most correct or most pedagogical, but right now, Condition-based maintenance seems to present Preventive maintenance as a fore-runner to itself. Maybe presenting the approaches chronologically or in order of increasing functionality is a good pedagogical approach? My main concern is not really to merge or not, but that we somewhere have a readable introduction to the field with an overview of the subfields and different approaches. As it stands now, the three articles Condition-based maintenance, Predictive maintenance and Preventive maintenance dosn't even have hyperlinks between them. EverGreg (talk) 10:19, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

Having a readable introduction to the field with an overview of the subfields seems to me a fair proposition.--Christian Lassure (talk) 23:26, 6 November 2009 (UTC)

I might recommend looking at the MIMOSA site http://www.mimosa.org/ as they have described from an industry perspective what condition based maintenance is. CBM is not "Preventive maintenance" as the current automotive oil change philosophy is Preventive maintenance with no diagnostics. Predictive maintenance is closer to CBM but in this authors understanding is usually based on component time in use which is based on engineering analysis and hopefully field data. Condition-based maintenance was envisioned to encompass engineering analysis, field data, design goal of the device (why it exists), device specific health status (i.e. embedded sensor), and outside factors affecting it's present and future operation like emergency's, or supply availability. Thus Condition-based maintenance is much more encompassing in it's goal than Predictive maintenance or Preventive maintenance. For some excellent historical insight, Boeing Aircraft was the team lead for the Navy in the development of OSA-CBM back in 1999-2002. Boeing, Rockwell Automation, Penn State, Caterpillar, and MIMOSA all shared in architecture (software) and web development (Ask Rockwell about "grass-cow-milk"). Oceania sensors as part of the team worked mainly on physical interfaces. The Navy referred to this program as "OSA-CBM" as did Army aviation. It was quite successful as far as DoD programs go, under budget and way over delivered! N6641 (talk) 05:42, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

There are four types of Maintenance, Reactive, Preventive, Predictive and Reliability Centered Maintenance. --Therefore I do no suggest merging them. They are there own topics. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.43.65.74 (talk) 00:33, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

Theory of maintenance says following: There are two types of maintenance:

• Reactive or Corrective Maintenance
• Preventive Maintenance

Preventive maintenance is divided into:

• Planned Maintenance
• Condition Based or Predictive Maintenance

Reliability Centered Maintenance is just one point of view to maintenance, other is Cost Centered Maintenance therefore, those are theories of approach to maintenance, not maintenance principles.

Therefore, we can merge CBM and predictive, but we can not merge Preventive with CBM or Predictive.--Lasta 10:45, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

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There is a slight difference between condition based and predictive maintenance. Predictive maintenance consists of the application of predictive technologies (Vibration, theromography, oil analysis, airborn ultrasound, motor current testing...). Condition based also includes such things as operator walkaround observations, work order closure comments ...

Maintenance practices can be grouped into one of two categories; Corrective or Preventive. Preventive can be further classified into Periodic, Predictive or Planned.

The following definitions should be used consistently to maintain a high standard of communication when discussing Equipment Reliability Maintenance Activities. (Reference: Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI), Document AP-913)

SSC = Structure, System or Component

CORRECTIVE MAINTENANCE(CM): Includes actions that restore (by repair, overhaul, or replacement) the capability of a failed SSC to runction within acceptance criteria.

PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE(PM): Includes actions that detect, preclude, or mitigate degradation of functional structures, systems, and components (SSC) to sustain or extend its useful life by controlling degradation and failures to an acceptable level.

There are three types of PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE:

(a)Periodic Maintenance: Consists of servicing, parts replacement, surveillance, or testing according to a predetermined schedule (calendar time, operating time, or number of cycles).

(b)Predictive Maintenance (PdM): Is performed (continuously or at periodic intervals) to monitor, diagnose, or trend SSC condition indicators. Results indicate current and future functional ability and allow for convenient scheduling of corrective maintenance.

(c)Planned Maintenance: Consists of refurbishment or replacement that is scheduled and performed to preclude failure of an SSC. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.183.138.65 (talk) 00:18, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes mate, I will agree that there is slight diff between predictive and CBM, but due to practical reasons it is much better to consider it to be the same. In majority of publications authors consider them to be the same. What I have to point, in your description above it it very clear that Predictive and Planed Maintenance are same. Thanks --Lasta 08:28, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Really? predictive and planned maintenance are the same? You have no idea what you are even talking about have you ever turned a wrench in your life? Here it is as in a mechanical HVAC field:

(a) Periodic Maintenance This would be a typical "P.M." check the unit and piping for deteriation, cleaning, check belts, check sheaves, check filters.

(b) Planned Maintenance Now I could see you gettinging this confussed with Periodic. This is Like replace belts every year. Replace filters every 3 months.(instead of condition based) ie. When dirty.

(c) Predictive Maintenance The use of technolodgies (infrared, vibration, ultrasound) to determine when equipment to needs to be repaired or replaced. Equipment is monitored on a regular bases.

Conditioned based monitoring can use predictive technologies to monitor the equipment. But I don't believe it would be right to call Predictive the same as condition based. It may use predictive but it is NOT the same thing. Condition based can be as simple as a visual inspection. Were predictive cannot. Condition based may use all a. b. and c. to deturmine condition of the equipment. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 136.181.195.13 (talk) 14:33, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Condition based maintenance and predictive maintenance are not the same thing...

I guess, in a objective way, that the simple difference batween then exists while:

1) Predictive maintenance is only the technique of condition monitoring of some compartments, systems, components, etc., with vibration analysis, termography, oil analysis, and so on, and;

2) Condition based maintenance is relationed with those maintenance politics that use the predictive maintenance in order to make decisions, like remove a component, make an intervention, extend a component life, etc. Then, the condition based maintenance is an option about how to manage (plan and execute) decisions in maintenance.

It's important to keep a link in the condition based maintenance page to the Article Predictive Maintenance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.243.57.5 (talk) 13:22, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Condition-Based Maintenance and Predictive Maintenance are fundamentally the same

I would disagree with the previous posts, and argue that regardless of actual implementation, the fundamental definition, goals, methods, and theory behind CBM and PdM are essentially the same.

Examining the PdM textbook written by Mobley (2002), indicates that predictive maintenance theoretically includes all aspects of utilizing sensing equipment for the enhancement of preventative maintenance practices. This includes all actions such as servicing, repair, and replacement whenever sensors such a vibration monitoring or thermography are the reason such actions are performed.

Condition-Based Maintenance does not, as the first commenter contends, include all maintenance actions resulting from the known condition of an item. For example, traditionally, faults detected by a scheduled inspection are classified as scheduled (time-based) maintenance even though technically the resulting maintenance action is in response to the component condition. In most definitions of CBM there is the same prerequisite that some form of sensing technology, usually on-line sensing, is used in the detection or decision making process.

That being said, there are slight implicit differences between CBM and PdM; namely, that CBM implies a stronger emphasis on diagnostics whereas PdM implies prognostics. Most CBM programs attempt to extend their efforts to failure prediction, while in practice, mechanical prognostics as a whole is an unproven science. The end result is that regardless of program name, CBM or PdM typically only focus on the online detection of existing faults, i.e., diagnostics.

The differences in terminologies is many industry-specific. For example, US Army Aviation exclusively uses the term CBM; meanwhile the term PdM is more common in manufacturing contexts. Having attended conferences and specialists meetings on both, I can say that there exists no clear difference between the two.

I would vote in favor of merging the two topics.

Nicholas Goodman, PhD (talk) 18:06, 23 June 2011 (UTC)

Big mess in naming and article logic

This whole maintnance ideology is a big mess. I am trying to understand the differences based on the articles but it is not possible.

Maintnance article includes: Preventive maintenance, Corrective maintenance, Reliability centered maintenance and also refers to scheduled maintenance, which links to Aircraft maintenance.

Preventive maintenance article: descibes the differences between Predictive Maintnance and Preventive Maintnance but Predictive Maintnance article does not.

Articles are badly written and include tautologies.

And last but not least an example quote:

This concept is applicable to mission critical systems that incorporate active redundancy and fault reporting. It is also applicable to non-mission critical systems that lack redundancy and fault reporting.

I remember a joke - a thief is intervied by the police: - did you take any money? - but you mean dollars or euro? - dollars - no, I didn't take any dollars - and euro? - no, I didn' take any euro either

Please, please someone correct all that mess. I am not a native speaker. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.123.193.31 (talk) 13:38, 17 December 2012 (UTC)