Talk:Bashar al-Assad

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Sina Zekavat (11 September 2019). "Persian Wikipedia: an independent source or a tool of the Iranian state?". openDemocracy. Retrieved 12 September 2019. Next, I decided to check the Wikipedia page of Bashar al-Assad. The English version comprehensively outlines the economic and social policies of the Assad dynasty which eventually led to the 2011 revolution.

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is he a politician???

Why is this dictator even called "politician"? Was he elected? Was the election free and fair? Dear wikipedia, why don't you refer hitler, stalin or mao as a "politician"? I mean the "d-word" is so rude... 92.249.214.251 (talk) 13:03, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

his dad was made leader by a military coup and since bashar came to power if you talked ONE WORD bad about him, your children will get poisoned and you will never see their face again, and you would be killed or forced in the army. 2001:1970:55E8:7F00:60F6:D4AD:9672:10DE (talk) 19:41, 14 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

These are the opening sentence of the Wikipedia articles on Hitler, Stalin and Mao:

"Adolf Hitler (German: [ˈaːdɔlf ˈhɪtlɐ] ; 20 April 1889 – 30 April 1945) was an Austrian-born German politician..."

Joseph Vissarionovich Stalin (born Ioseb Besarionis dze Jughashvili; 18 December [O.S. 6 December] 1878 – 5 March 1953) was a Soviet politician..."

Mao Zedong (26 December 1893 – 9 September 1976) was a Chinese politician..."

What's your point? DeCausa (talk) 20:50, 14 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Well, those three were in politics, before becoming dictators and Bashar inhereted presidency from his father. Imperator159 (talk) 10:29, 8 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mao Tse-Tung came to power with a civil war. What's your point? Deus vult fratres! (talk) 13:28, 8 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"was he elected?"

Politician does not mean 'elected.'

"wikipedia why don't you refer to Hitler [et al] as politicians?"

Hitler, Stalin and Mao are called politicians on Wikipedia.

"why is this dictator even called a politician"

All dictators are politicians.

Only a politician can be called a dictator.

It is unnecessary to litter talk pages asking imaginary questions you should have answered by looking up 'politician'

"any person who has participated in governing or making policies or laws, especially holding a position or office in government" Pimprncess (talk) 21:09, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Image update

I feel like the image needs to be updated, and I have some alternatives, but instead of doing it on my volition I am going to let you all decide.

A
B
C
D

And why do we need to change the image? The original one looks fine to me. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 00:05, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose as well. The current image is from 2024. It doesn't need to be updated just because the guy is unemployed now. Cortador (talk) 06:31, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose he looks like herb in all of the photos. No reason to change. --Giacomo1968 (talk) 23:14, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose: I oppose the change, the present image is fine. --TheJoyfulTentmaker (talk) 03:39, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support C : looks best as a portrait. Shadow4dark (talk) 10:14, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
C or D looks best. Setarip (talk) 14:57, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose : the current one is just fine and is recent ProudWatermelon (talk) 21:04, 9 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support C : smiling seems to always be favored on politicians portraits, same rule should apply to dictators as well.

Pronunciation

Why is the pronunciation bə-SHAR AL-ə-SAHD which puts the stress incorrectly on the final syllable depicted in the opening note of this article? The stress should be on the "AH" part per the Arabic pronunciation, approximating the American English pronunciation of "Acid". Colipon+(Talk) 01:21, 10 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Source this please. 2600:100C:A21D:971A:3DFA:A9B2:FCD8:A60 (talk) 06:19, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Mass murderer category

Would the mass murderer category be appropriate for him? Yes his regime was responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands but would it be appropriate to add it for him? 2600:100C:A218:9A7B:F802:7211:6E15:A488 (talk) 12:51, 11 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

While you're probably thinking of mass killing and not mass murder, it's tricky, Assad was considered a dictator and was probably responding for the deaths of many people, but that's guesswork at this point. soetermans. ^{↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK} 14:30, 11 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Presidency of Bashar al-Assad page

The Presidency of Bashar al-Assad page is blank while this BLP covers his presidency in detail. Is there a split in agreement or should that page be deleted? Titan2456 (talk) 05:32, 14 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There was no consensus for a split; an editor was bold and changed it from a redirect to the bones of an article. It should be changed back to a redirect because there is no content. Yue🌙 06:06, 14 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@WikiCleanerMan do you agree? Titan2456 (talk) 15:15, 14 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have begun adding information borrowing from Assad's article. Both articles should not be duplicating information entirely. I think the main Assad article needs to be trimmed down from about his presidency because it contains too much information that can be solely on this article. On a side not, this article contains too many images as well. --WikiCleanerMan (talk) 15:58, 14 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

My suggestion would be to split the current presidency section to that article. Add all of the content under this article's presidency section to that article and you can summarize it here. Titan2456 (talk) 15:35, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

War criminal category

Would a war criminal category be appropriate here since he was accused of war crimes? 2600:100C:A218:9A7B:EC8D:E7CC:DCB:F6A2 (talk) 20:36, 15 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

dictator

Editor @Therealbey removed my addition of the "dictator" label in the opening paragraph with the reasoning "He is not!". Since motivations are insufficient, I've reinstated the addition as "ruled in a dictatorship", which has a nice flow, avoids a too stringent label, and is extremelly precise on what sources are reporting. Cinemaandpolitics (talk) 13:18, 21 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The label "dictator" is sufficiently sourced and described in the article body. It belongs in the lead without euphemism. Yue🌙 06:23, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed. My formulation is not an euphemism though, I have kept the more general term "politician" and described more precisely that he "ruled Syria as a dictator". Sounds good enough for me. Cinemaandpolitics (talk) 16:19, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

which has been removed by @Setarip who has asked editors to refer to this talk page discussion. Could @Setarip please clarify? Theofunny (talk) 14:43, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It is just an undiscussed removal of a well sourced extremelly relevant addition. It was restored in the first sentence dictator form, which I find equivalent to the one I've used. Both are good, the only thing that it is unacceptable is the dictatorship erasure from first paragraph. Cinemaandpolitics (talk) 17:33, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Bashar_al-Assad#Bashar_the_dictator_in_the_first_sentence

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Bashar_al-Assad#The_word_%22dictator%22_in_the_lead Setarip (talk) 14:50, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 22 December 2024

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

In November 2024, a coalition of Syrian rebels succeeded in liberating many cities from the regime forces[7][8] On the morning of 8 December, as rebel troops first entered Damascus, Assad fled to Moscow and was granted political asylum by the Russian government.[9][10] Later that day, Damascus fell to rebel forces, and Assad's regime collapsed. Syrian people filled the streets with joy, celebrating the end of a dictatorship-era.[11][12][13] NourKh86 (talk) 13:34, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Skitash (talk) 15:54, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

allegiance has the new Syrian interim gov flag instead of Ba'athist Syria flag

i dont think assad is or wants to be tied to the interim government, i think his allegiance lies with Ba'athist Syria lol LeonVolturno (talk) 21:52, 22 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

International support

If you are gonna add a sub-head 'Far-right' you might as well add one called 'Far-left' since several radical left leaders and organizations have supported him. Don't show your biasm this clearly. At least pretend to be objective once in a while. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:A212:A583:8C80:A927:9308:5AB4:CC1B (talk) 10:14, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Section title renamed

We should renamed the section of "Exile in Russia" -> "Downfall and Exile" or "Downfall and Exile in Russia" (or any other name) because the section talking about Assad's final month(s) and eventually exile to Russia. Right now, I'm going to change the second to the latter to somewhat make sense. But If someone had reverted (or make a better section title), I want to know in good faith why. SpartanMazda (talk) 09:21, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 26 December 2024

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

This part: On 23 December 2024, it was reported that Asma al-Assad had filed for divorce after being dissatisfied with life in Moscow.[447] However, the reports were denied by the Russian government.[448] should either be removed or reedited with sources refilled. 2003:100:3700:8C00:C49B:48AA:5305:49BF (talk) 02:37, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Not done: Do you have any sources? Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 02:55, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Ivebeenhacked: Have you read what I wrote in the first place? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2003:100:3700:8c00:c49b:48aa:5305:49bf (talk) 03:27, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I misread. I've fixed the citations. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 04:18, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The Giraffe Name

Syrian people used to call him "Giraffe" in reference to his long nick. This name is widely known and used.

reference https://www.irishtimes.com/podcasts/in-the-news/lara-marlowe-on-meeting-bashar-al-assad-he-was-comical-looking-they-called-him-the-giraffe/ Niafandi (talk) 04:14, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Supposed poisoning attempt

I reverted this weakly sourced claim of Assad being poisoned. Newsweek as a source has problems, but for the purposes of this talk page, its analysis that the General SVR Telegram channel run by former and current members of the Russian Foreign Intelligence Service has earlier published strong claims that failed to be confirmed does look credible, i.e. there's little reason to take the poisoning claim seriously. The only possibly newsworthy part of this so far is that a lot of newspapers have broadcast the meme further, including British tabloids; this might be interesting for the topics of misinformation or disinformation, if a WP:RS considered it significant enough as mis/disinformation. As a WP:BLP, stronger sources are needed before publishing a claim like this.

Since I've done my 1RR on this, others will have to do other reverts if the poisoning claim is added again prior to consensus. Boud (talk) 02:24, 3 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

TODO: There's still As of January 2, 2025, Assad may have been poisoned while in Russia. [15] in the lead in in the version 04:33, 3 January 2025 with the WP:NEWSWEEK generally unreliable source as bare URL and non-dmy date. Boud (talk) 06:09, 3 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

And it's in the section Assassination attempts: In 2025, it was reported that Assad was poisoned in Moscow, Russia.[445] also in in the version 04:33, 3 January 2025 per The Economic Times per the General SVR Telegram Russian spies/ex-spies. Boud (talk) 06:20, 3 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

No arguments in favour of reporting the rumour in Wikipedia were presented, so I removed the two sentences propagating the rumour. Boud (talk) 17:10, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@BasselHarfouch, Bri, Richie1509, Geraldshields11, and Nikkimaria: Per WP:SNOPES, Snopes is certified by the International Fact-Checking Network, and is considered generally reliable, and Alex Kasprak says on Snopes: Claims originating from General SVR have been credulously promoted by The Sun and other tabloids numerous times since 2022, despite the account's self-evidently dubious track record. ... The only "evidence" for any of these claims — then and now — was General SVR. ... Jade McGlynn, a researcher on Russian propaganda and media, told Business Insider in January 2023 that the account's propaganda successfully infiltrates Western media because of its outlandish or oversimplified claims. Aric Toler, an open-source investigator who reports on Russian disinformation, has told his followers to discard anything the account claims. The rumour itself is not WP:NOTABLE, because it's from a source with a reputation for disinformation.

After all, Vladimir Putin's death on 26 October 2023 per the same source was somewhat exaggerated, even though he "may have died" on 26 Oct 2023 and "it was reported that he allegedly died" on 26 Oct 2023. Boud (talk) 17:30, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Torturer category

Would the torturer category be appropriate here? 2600:100C:A21D:971A:3DFA:A9B2:FCD8:A60 (talk) 06:01, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]