Talk:B54 (New York City bus)

Good Article Nomination Good morning (GMT time); I have reviewed this article on 19:37, Monday November 25 2024 (UTC) in accordance with the Good Article (GA) criteria. I have concluded that, in my opinion, the article has failed one or more categories and is therefore denied GA status. In order to provide constructive criticism, I have below listed one or more of my reasons for failing the article, beside the relevant criteria title; this should be taken as advice for improvement, rather than a list of reasons for failing. Well-written: Failed "...the prose is comprehensible, the grammar is correct, and the structure is clear at first reading..." - the article is set out in a very messy format, and is not at all tidy; this detracts from the quality of the article. Factually accurate: Pass Broad: Pass Neutrally written: Pass Stable: Pass Well-referenced: Pass Images: Fail "..It contains images, where possible, to illustrate the topic..." - there are no images. My condolences to the lead editors - your hard work has been informally recognised; just keep it up, and do not be disheartened! Feel free to renominate the article when the above improvements have been made, or alternatively seek a GA Review or discuss my decision at my talk page if you believe I have been misguided. Sincerest regards, anthonycfc [talk] 05:56, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

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GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:B54 (New York City bus)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Truflip99 (talk · contribs) 23:02, 4 April 2020 (UTC)

Will be starting this review. --Truflip99 (talk) 23:02, 4 April 2020 (UTC)

• @Truflip99: Thanks for taking this up.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 11:10, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

Lead

• The B54 is a bus route that constitutes a surface transit line on Myrtle Avenue in Brooklyn, New York City, United States. -- redundant, I think
  • @Epicgenius: We have been doing this on other bus articles. Do you agree with the comment?--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

    Kew Gardens 613, I think we should move it elsewhere. epicgenius (talk) 19:57, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

• The B54 replaced the Myrtle Avenue Line; it was the first streetcar line in Brooklyn, built by the Brooklyn City Railroad and opened in 1854. -- ce

** References are not typically put in the lead.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

• •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 20:08, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
• The Myrtle Avenue Line had served the entire length of Myrtle Avenue; it initially ran with horse cars until these were replaced with electric trolleys in 1893. The line was then replaced by the two current city-owned bus routes on July 17, 1949. -- ce
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 20:08, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

** References are not typically put in the lead.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

• • • I think "CE" means "copy edit". Nevertheless, WP:CITELEAD recommends that the references not be in the lead, unless it's not also in the body.
      • You are right, I was reading over it too quickly.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 20:05, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
• It is distinct from the BMT Myrtle Avenue Line, a separate subway line that also operates along the portion of Myrtle Avenue in Bushwick, Brooklyn, and used to run above the entire Brooklyn section of Myrtle Avenue. -- this sentence needs to be clarified; the subway line used to run above the Brooklyn section?
  • The subway line did used to extend over the Brooklyn section. What about the sentence makes it unclear?--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
  • @Truflip99: Sorry, this might have been confusion on my part. Myrtle Avenue passes through both Brooklyn and Queens. The elevated line only ran over the Brooklyn section when it was completed, and a small remnant of the elevated line still exists above Myrtle Avenue in Brooklyn. In addition, the Myrtle Avenue travels over other streets in Queens. epicgenius (talk) 20:01, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
    • Both: Sorry, I should have been more specific as well. If I'm understanding correctly, something like this would be a good ce: It is distinct from the BMT Myrtle Avenue Line, a separate subway line that also operates along the portion of Myrtle Avenue in Bushwick, Brooklyn; it this used to run on elevated tracks above the entire Brooklyn section of Myrtle Avenue. --Truflip99 (talk) 20:30, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
      •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 21:55, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

Route

• Good
• 1 and 2 (B54 bus schedule) are duplicates
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 16:04, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• For the ref, indicate page number using rp template. (it's page 14)
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 16:04, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Horsecar service

• The Brooklyn City Railroad was incorporated on December 17, 1853 with capital of $2,500,000... -- I'm not sure of this, but is it not "a capital"?
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
• comma after full date
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
• ref 3-6 -- overkill, omit 1 or 2
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
• Construction to Broadway (then Division Avenue)... -- then known as Division
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)
• At Ridgewood, connections could be made to the Cypress Hills Line, and soon, the Lutheran Line, two steam dummy lines to local cemeteries. -- soon --> later
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 19:54, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

More in a bit. --Truflip99 (talk) 18:45, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

Horsecar service cont.

• ref 3 (The City Railroads): link the publisher for uniformity
  • @Truflip99: Why do you want me to link the publisher?--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 16:04, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
    • @Kew Gardens 613: For references, you need to either have them all linked or just the first instance per MOS:DUPLINK. Not sure which you prefer. --Truflip99 (talk) 16:20, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• ref 5 (Brian J. Cudahy): convert to cite template
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 16:04, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• ref 6 (Jeffrey A Kroessler): convert to cite template
  •  Done This source was not needed.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 16:04, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Trolley service

• Myrtle Avenue horse cars were replaced with electric trolleys in mid-1893. -- just saying July 1893 or summer
  •  Done However, the latter is not recommended per MOS:SEASON. epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• Space after the first sentence
  •  Done epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• The trolley line was one of four extended over the Brooklyn Bridge to Park Row in Lower Manhattan on February 15, 1898; they were preceded only by the Graham Avenue Line trolley service. -- ce; also extended by whomst?
  • I reworded it, but I think "extended" is an intransitive verb, so it does not need a subject. epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• Cars reached the bridge by turning from Myrtle Avenue onto Washington Street via trackage originally built for the DeKalb Avenue Line, and then turning onto Sands Street via trackage from the Graham Avenue Line to the bridge. -- ce
  •  Done epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• The Myrtle Avenue Line was also one of the seven moved to the new structure through the Sands Street elevated station, on the Brooklyn side of the bridge, on September 28, 1908; cars returned to the old route along Myrtle Avenue and Fulton Street to the split for the new structure at Tillary Street. -- sorry, I'm not following this at all. Seven what? What new structure?
  • @Kew Gardens 613: I could not decipher this either. However, from the Brooklyn Bridge article, it appears to be a new approach structure for the lines. See Brooklyn Bridge#Rail traffic. epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• The Myrtle-Culver Line was a summer-only service connecting Ridgewood with Coney Island. -- this sentence is abrupt, comes out of nowhere. Are you trying to say during the summer, a line called Myrtle-Culver Line served a route between Ridegwood and Coney Island?
  • Yes. epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• ref 12 (Brian J. Cudahy): is a duplicate of ref 5. Merge them and use rp template for page numbers
  •  Done epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• After this elevated structure was removed in 1944... -- what elevated structure? this was not established
  •  Fixed epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• ref 14 (Electric Railroaders' Association, Headlights): convert to template
  •  Done epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• The Myrtle Avenue Line was combined with the Court Street Line... -- "The" should be lower case
  •  Done epicgenius (talk) 03:23, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
• In February 1944, service was rerouted via Navy Street, Ashland Place and Willoughby Street instead of Jay Street and Adams Street. On July 27, 1944, service was rerouted in both directions via Adams Street between Willoughby Street and Myrtle Avenue. -- why?

More later. --Truflip99 (talk) 23:16, 5 April 2020 (UTC)

Bus service

• On June 30, 1949, the New York City Board of Estimate approved the full motorization of the line with buses. -- sepcify line
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• "B" the designation for buses based in Brooklyn -- "B" is/was/being...
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• The eastern terminal of the B54 was modified to Myrtle Avenue and Palmetto Street, and it western terminal was changed to Myrtle Avenue and Washington Avenue. -- when you say modified, do you mean renamed or moved?
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• On November 6, 1954, the New York City Transit Authority proposed to eliminate service between 7 p.m. and 5 a.m. to cut costs. -- proposed eliminating
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• Free transfers would have been provided between the B53 and B57. -- random sentence... need to clarify what this is about or omit.
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• The Myrtle Avenue Line, under the Myrtle Avenue Elevated for its entire length since 1889, became more important on October 4, 1969, when the elevated was abandoned west of Broadway. -- confusing. I thought the "Myrtle Avenue Line" ceased to exist in 1949
  • @Truflip99: The streetcar line was replaced by a bus line in 1949; a portion of the elevated line was closed and removed in 1969. How should I make this clearer?--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 11:07, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
    • @Kew Gardens 613: How about: "Street-level transport on Myrtle Avenue, operating underneath the Myrtle Avenue Elevated subway for its entire length since 1889..."
      •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 14:22, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• Following the September 11 attacks, additional security measures were implemented at MetroTech Center, requiring the rerouting of B54 service out of MetroTech. -- requiring --> including
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• On August 20, 2010, service started terminating at the newly-opened Ridgewood Intermodal Terminal, located on Palmetto Street. -- move the date at end of sentence
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 10:28, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
• Palmetto Street was closed to all traffic except for NYC Transit buses and deliveries. -- move this a sentence back
  • @Truflip99: Do you want me to move it before or after where it currently is?--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 11:07, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
    • @Kew Gardens 613: Just one sentence back. Sorry, I really need to work on being more clear. --Truflip99 (talk) 14:15, 7 April 2020 (UTC)
      •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 14:22, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

More later. --Truflip99 (talk) 04:06, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Please ensure you are addressing all of the items above. There are some that were missed; most of them refs. --Truflip99 (talk) 15:02, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Final sweep

I did a fairly substantial copy edit of the lead. Feel free to revert/modify it.

• Construction to Broadway, then known as Division Avenue, at Bushwick was completed in December 1854. -- Construction --> An extension
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 09:06, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
• 3.43 miles (5.52 km)-long line -- use {{convert|3.43|mi|km|adj=mid|-long}}
  •  Done I always forget how to do that. --Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 09:09, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
• , two steam dummy lines to local cemeteries. -- too many commas, replace with em dash
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 09:06, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
• The City Railroad leased the Bushwick Railroad, which included these cemetery lines, on July 27, 1888. -- this would read better as: "The City Railroad acquired these cemetery lines on July 27, 1888, with the lease of the Bushwick Railroad."
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 09:06, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
• The Myrtle-Culver Line, a summer-only service, also ran along the Myrtle Avenue surface line, connecting Ridgewood with Coney Island. -- this would read better as: "A separate summer-only service, called the Myrtle-Culver Line, also ran along the Myrtle Avenue surface line. It connected Ridgewood with Coney Island."
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 09:06, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
• After the Brooklyn Bridge elevated structure was removed in 1944, the Myrtle Avenue Line was combined with the Court Street Line, which had also used this structure, to form the Myrtle Avenue and Court Street Line on April 3, 1938. -- check continuity; it doesn't make sense for the Myrtle-Court Line to be formed in 1938 AFTER the Brooklyn Bridge was removed in 1944.
• On November 6, 1954, the New York City Transit Authority proposed eliminating service between 7 p.m. and 5 a.m. to cut costs. Free transfers would have been provided between the B53 and B57 to make up for the loss of evening and overnight B54 service. -- result of this?
  • @Epicgenius: any word on the two above? --Truflip99 (talk) 23:06, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

    Truflip99, I have fixed the first one. No idea on the second. epicgenius (talk) 23:21, 10 April 2020 (UTC)

    • @Truflip99: After a lot of searching, I found out more information on the proposed 1954 change and added it.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 20:46, 13 April 2020 (UTC)
• Effective April 8, 2012, -- just use On...
  •  Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 09:06, 8 April 2020 (UTC)
• ref 1: need access date as info is subject to change
• ref 28: need to use via for the website source
  •  Done both. epicgenius (talk) 13:58, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

I think we're good after this. --Truflip99 (talk) 03:39, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

@Truflip99: Due to the Jewish holiday of Passover and the Sabbath on Saturday, I won't be editing from tonight until Saturday night at the earliest. I wanted to let you know to make sure that you know that I am still committed to addressing the aforementioned issues.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 21:49, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

Understood. Take care! --Truflip99 (talk) 21:52, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

• Do you have any start and end dates for the summer-only service? I'm under the impression that it no longer runs.
• Omit the cash and fare parameters in the infobox as they are not valid
• You also have more pictures here. Try to use some of them.

--Truflip99 (talk) 21:17, 13 April 2020 (UTC)

I tried looking for more information on the Myrtle–Culver Line myself but there just really isn't any information apart from an almanac and the brochure that's referenced. Everything else checks out. Passing GA. --Truflip99 (talk) 21:51, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

@Truflip99: Thank you for your patience and your thorough review. When I am not swamped with school work and so many GA Noms, I will make sure to review more of your articles.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 23:18, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 23:08, 16 May 2020 (UTC)

(

• Comment or view
• Article history

)

• ... that the Myrtle Avenue Line was the first horsecar line in Brooklyn? Source: Cudahy p. 25
  • ALT1:... that after the demolition of much of the Myrtle Avenue elevated line, B54 bus service was increased by 700%? Source: Brooklyn Daily

• Reviewed: Template:Did you know nominations/stephanie jones-rogers
• Comment: More later

Improved to Good Article status by Kew Gardens 613 (talk). Nominated by Epicgenius (talk) at 16:30, 18 April 2020 (UTC).

General eligibility:

• New enough:
• Long enough:
• Other problems:

Policy compliance:

• Adequate sourcing:
• Neutral:
• Free of copyright violations, plagiarism, and close paraphrasing:
• Other problems:

Hook eligibility:

• Cited:
• Interesting:
• Other problems:

QPQ: Done.

Overall: ALT1 preferred ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 03:50, 20 April 2020 (UTC)