Talk:2023 Prague shootings

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A news item involving 2023 Prague shootings was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on 21 December 2023.

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This article is written in British English, which has its own spelling conventions (colour, travelled, centre, defence, artefact, analyse) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

This article has previously been nominated to be moved. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination.

Discussions:

No consensus, 23 December 2023, to Charles University shooting, see discussion.
Moved, 14 January 2024, from 2023 Prague shooting to 2023 Prague shootings, see discussion.

Birth date of shooter

At the very least, the birth date should be sourced, and if the editor adding it is interested in following the same format a other articles, it should follow the specific manner of presentation (XX month XXXX - XX month XXXX). Simply adding it with no source is not acceptable. Acroterion (talk) 14:05, 30 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

consensus is to merge. closing. Qalb alasid (talk) 03:56, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed merge of David Kozák into 2023 Prague shootings

WP:BLP1E notability tied to the 2023 Prague shootings event Aszx5000 (talk) 10:00, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support as nom. Given that he is dead, his notability will always be tied to this single event, a even stronger case of WP:BLP1E. Aszx5000 (talk) 10:26, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support: Aside from BLP1E, the current length of David Kozák doesn't justify having it as a separate article.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 10:13, 7 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Would be better to have it as a separate article, merging those two articles together might make everything too cramped. Hi.i.am.hanako.XD (talk) 06:27, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Because he is a likely case of WP:BLP1E he will either be merged via this process, or at WP:AFD. Aszx5000 (talk) 09:50, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose: Most of the information in the David Kozák article is trivial and non-important for this article, although relevant in that article. This will be even more true as information about the perpetrator and his life trickles in into the separate article. Also, it seems to be in line with practice to keep separate articles, see e.g. Anders Behring Breivik, Seung-Hui Cho, Usman Khan (terrorist). Move makes sense only if vast majority of information in that article gets deleted.Cimmerian praetor (talk) 12:47, 8 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment If the information in the article about the perpetrator is trivial, why even have a separate article? By debating this as a merger, we avoid debating just deleting his article, instead. Also it isn't a standard practice to have separate articles. The perpetrator of the Christchurch mosque shootings has his biography incorporated into the main article about the shootings. I think WP:CRIMINAL also applies. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 23:09, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Changed to support: I checked the perp's article again and the most pertinent information in it that was now added to it was actually copied from this article. I copied the only extra useful information into this article and now support merger, which in essence means deletion of that article. I strongly oppose adding the perp's picture to this article though.Cimmerian praetor (talk) 17:12, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support merge. A large part of the David Kozák article is unsourced anyway. He is notable only for one event, so I don't see the omission of some trivial and non-important biographical informations as a problem. FromCzech (talk) 08:53, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Support merge. Makes sense to have all the information in one article. Also he is notable for a single crime, so WP:CRIMINAL also applies, and his biography should therefore be included in the article about the crime he committed. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 23:09, 12 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Probably merge. However, although some mass murderers do not have their own page (for example, Patrick Wood Crusius from the 2019 El Paso shooting), some actually do (for example, Elliot Rodger from the 2014 Isla Vista killings), although their notability is tied to the mass shootings. Is there any guideline that would make it clear when it is appropriate to create a separate page in cases like these? —Unloose ^(talk) 13:43, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Guideline WP:CRIMINAL advises against writing a separate biography about the person if there is an existing article. The detailed biography about Elliot Rodger, is a sub-article about the perpetrator of the 2014 Isla Vista killings, is due to his influence on the incel subculture. There is an argument that he is notable for other reasons. - Cameron Dewe (talk) 19:15, 14 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support: For the same reasons as others have stated. This article provides no information that could not be written in the article on the shootings. This page is too short and lacks too many references to justify its existence. This person is known only for this one event and has had no lasting impact on any other occurrence as of yet (WP:BLP1E). Macxcxz (talk) 23:44, 18 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support per WP:BLP1E: nothing else is of note about the person. --Altenmann >talk 21:17, 29 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose Merge; cramming too much information into one page is a reason to allow another page to exist to free up space. Stormm001 (talk) 00:46, 3 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Support merge. While some mass shooters, such as Elliot Rodger, have their own pages on Wikipedia, their inclusion is typically justified by their broader cultural or ideological influence. In Rodger’s case, for example, his manifesto and actions sparked significant discussion about incel-related terrorism and its societal implications. David Kozák, however, lacks such a larger impact. He left no manifesto or material that would provoke broader societal or ideological debate. His notability remains tied exclusively to the 2023 Prague shootings, which makes a standalone article unnecessary under WP:BLP1E and WP:CRIMINAL. --Unloose ^(talk) 11:04, 12 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Klánovice Forest murders

Klánovice Forest murders redirects to this article, but I would expect a list of murders in the location as in the recent history there where more publicly know murders. So I would delete that redirect or I would create a separate article to it. See cs:Klánovický les#Dějiny 3rd paragraph. Juandev (talk) 15:03, 5 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Merge?

Surely this should be merged with 2023 Prague shootings 2023 Prague shootings Jackwagsy (talk) 19:17, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know how significant David Kozak's attack would have to be for him to have his own article since his legacy is thwarted by the large amount of mass shootings in the United States. Nevertheless, there appears to be a recent trend of giving perpetrators who don't kill themselves their own articles. Personally I don't think the articles should merge, the more the merrier. Hopefully this recent trend continues and Adam Lanza gets his own article as well. 2D Is Better Than 3D (talk) 09:30, 5 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

First, I would avoid "surely" in Jackwagsy's comment. Secondly, 2D Is Better Than 3D says "trend of giving perpetrators who don't kill themselves their own articles", but he did kill himself... IMHO, did not he commit the shooting, he would not be "encyclopedically significant"... So I would be in favour of including this page inside the Shooting page; this is also what was done in cs:wiki... There seems to be a trend of no gloryfying these people.. that can be helped by not creating articles about them, unless (my opinion) they are somehow relevant for other reasons. So I would be in favour of merging this article into the article about the shooting (while keeping the wikidata item), but it is just my opinion (of someone who was indirectly affected by this accident...)... I will leave it on en:wiki community, but I am commenting on this because of the fact that the en:wiki is somehow global, not only for native speakers of English... --Pato Yapuq (talk) 23:06, 6 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No, lol I'm was not going to ignore him because I support the so called glorification. I should have specified that David Kozak not killing himself and getting an article is an outlier. Anyways, more articles, woo!!! 2D Is Better Than 3D (talk) 08:27, 8 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Tidy up the grammar

It would be good if a native-English speaker could tidy up the grammar of this page, as there are a lot of missing articles (a/an/the) in the text and some confusing sentence structures. 2A02:8308:9005:DE00:1925:A755:2B6B:96C5 (talk) 15:57, 13 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]