Talk:2018 Hamburg stabbing attack

Nomination for speedy deletion

I consider this more as a joke, given the international sources.--Greywin (talk) 18:56, 13 April 2018 (UTC)

No one tried to speedy delete this. It was a proposed deletion. Natureium (talk) 02:12, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

Which doesn't make more sense.--Greywin (talk) 07:25, 14 April 2018 (UTC)

Edit-warring

Deb, would you please stop edit warring and removal of WP:RS? You know WP:BRD?--Greywin (talk) 20:43, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

No edit warring has happened here. I tagged your article for a citation and removed a paragraph that was not written from a neutral point of view. Please ensure that all your edits abide by the neutral point of view policy from now on. Deb (talk) 20:45, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

You are edit-warring - you didn't discuss at all, just repeating your comment. The source is a reputable source, the article is perfectly neutral when it mentions similar cases. I wonder, if WP:JUSTDON'TLIKEIT is a motive. And you are still obviously wikihounding me. Please stop that.--Greywin (talk) 20:53, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

Drop the jargon. It makes no difference to the fact that you have an agenda that conflicts with the neutral point of view policy. Deb (talk) 09:56, 24 June 2018 (UTC)

Obviously you have such an agenda, including deleting material from WP:RS.--Greywin (talk) 11:13, 24 June 2018 (UTC)

Notable?

As per my question on the other article in this walled garden, is there any evidence that this is notable per WP:EVENTCRIT? Also, the section about the "perpetrator" assumes the suspects guilt, has he been convicted? Because per WP:BLPCRIME we can't assume guilt before trial even in an open and shut case.Simonm223 (talk) 13:14, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

I've deleted the passages that claim guilt of the suspect without evidence of a trial and have cut irrelevant details such as the birth nationality of the various parties - which seems completely irrelevant to a garden-variety example of brutal domestic violence. Considering what we're left with I'm of the position this is not a notable crime. Simonm223 (talk) 14:39, 6 November 2018 (UTC)

This crime was far from ordinary. It was a double murder at a very public location, in the centre of a large city. Jim Michael (talk) 17:37, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

Something like this one, I guess. Deb (talk) 18:12, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

That attack in London won't have received international media coverage - unlike this one in Hamburg - because the victims in the London attack were men. Even the national media coverage of the London attack would have been brief, hence it isn't a notable crime by WP standards. The media & society in general doesn't care much about men, unless they're famous. Likewise with missing person cases - imagine if Suzy Lamplugh & Claudia Lawrence had been Steve Lamplugh & Carl Lawrence - their disappearances would have been covered only by the local media, for a very brief period, then quickly forgotten about. Jim Michael (talk) 23:30, 16 December 2018 (UTC)

Seems to me the victims only count for anything if they are white. Deb (talk) 12:18, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

We had an Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/2018 Hamburg stabbing attack (2nd nomination) - closed on 14 November 2018 with a keep. Notability is determined by coverage - I am not sure if outlets are biased in the manner Deb is asserting - however that is a question to raise with the editors of Der Spiegel - and not here. Icewhiz (talk) 12:22, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Gaming the AfD process doesn't make something notable. This whole article is an egregious violation of WP:NOTNEWS. Simonm223 (talk) 14:40, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

You appear not to understand that the standard under which we judge WP:NCRIME is whether WP:SIGCOV exists. A crime can attract the attention of journalists, academics, true crime authors, documentary film makers for a wide range of reasons. We keep crime articles where sources support notability. We do not ask why INDEPTH, and ONGOING coverage exist. We ask whether they exist.E.M.Gregory (talk) 21:11, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

I think your apparent POV with regard to crimes of this nature is making you overestimate the significance of the coverage. Simonm223 (talk) 21:19, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

• There have already been 2 AfDs on this article about a crime committed less than a year ago. Both closed as KEEP.E.M.Gregory (talk) 21:04, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

• off-topic: Deb per <snip> ... the victims only count for anything if they are white if you have WP:RS backing this up, those sources could be used to improve the Media of Germany article. AadaamS (talk) 07:31, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

• I wasn't specifically referring to Germany. The comment from Jim Michael to which I was replying referred to a UK example which I gave. In general I'm doubtful of the likelihood of finding many references in the media stating that the media is biased, because, well... Deb (talk) 20:00, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

• on-topic: The WP:NOTNEWS guideline give the following examples: routine news reporting of announcements, sports, or celebrities is not a sufficient basis for inclusion in the encyclopedia.. This not league football. Per WP:SIGCOV, this incident has received international coverage is therefore presumed to be suitable for a stand-alone article or list. The guideline is quite clear, editors should presume this topic is suitable for a standalone article. AadaamS (talk) 07:31, 18 December 2018 (UTC)

Use of Bild as a source

Bild is clearly not a reliable source. It's the equivalent of the UK tabloid, The Sun, which we would never use as a source in this encyclopedia. Please find an alternative. Deb (talk) 09:26, 15 November 2018 (UTC)