User talk:Shibbolethink/Archive 4

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Please comment on Talk:Bitcoin Cash

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Bitcoin Cash. Legobot (talk) 04:26, 15 December 2019 (UTC)

Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

If you check the sources on the article, you'll see that they note: "“The East Precinct will remain staffed,” the announcement concluded." another lists that "a spokesperson for the Seattle Police Department said they are responding to 911 calls to the East Precinct." Are you saying these sources aren't reliable? Jeancey (talk) 18:08, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

I'm saying the wording in the article is unclear. Both you and the article text are, in some sense, right. The police presence in the region has been dramatically reduced, and police officers are cited in Non-RS as no longer responding to calls. I'm just gonna change the article text to reflect the fact that the building itself has been abandoned.--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 18:10, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

I think that works. The way that it was phrased made it sound like the entire area covered by the east precinct (which is a significant portion of the city) was unpoliced, which wasn't supported at all. The building might not have any people in it, but the precinct itself is still being policed (the actual part of the city covered by the precinct that is) Jeancey (talk) 18:14, 10 June 2020 (UTC)

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Discussion at Talk:Anthroposophy

Hi Shibbolethink, you may have some thoughts to add at: Talk:Anthroposophy#Anthroposophy a philosophy ?. Cheers, HopsonRoad (talk) 14:23, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

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Thanks

For your insightful comments and the new face you have brought to the topic. I'm getting tired of arguing with single purpose accounts and am seriously considering pressing the big red button – this kind of thing has been ongoing since at least May last year (this might just be an overreaction, feel free to tell me).

In other, less tense news, there's this post of mine which I've seen no reply to yet. Your expert opinion (is this something which we ought to mention somewhere? are there other papers on this which I've missed?) would be welcome.

Also, on a separate question, could you help give me a summary list of what the most credible journals in the subject-matter are? Besides the obvious (Nature et al.) I've come upon Reviews in Medical Virology, but I'm sure that's not the only or even the best one. Some users are questioning this with dubious claims, and while of course I haven't so far found any paper which credibly supports the fringe theories (if you want a good laugh, there's this, which makes all sorts of laughable claims [bonus: affiliated with places such as "Institute for the Study of Panspermia and Astroeconomics"...]), I'd rather we can cite the best sources on this. Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 00:48, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

haha, definitely happy to help. I know I'm sorry I haven't replied yet! I'm supposed to be studying for phase 1 of my medical licensing exams (I take it on Tuesday, for 6 frickin' hours). In general I do think those arguments about the virus circulating for a few weeks before December (or even months before) are intriguing. We do know that the first part of the influenza season likely covered up the first crop of these influenza-like illnesses, and it was only noticeable when they started to grow in number. But the inverse could also be true, it could be that it was just the beginning of flu season and the virus really did show up in late November early December. I'm not really convinced yet, because we're missing the truly high quality evidence about it... What we really need is a bunch of blood bank samples from October and November and December in Wuhan and the surrounding areas of the province. And then for someone to do a bunch of ELISAs on those samples looking for antibodies against both external (meaning the spike) and internal proteins (all the building blocks of the lil package inside) of SARS-CoV-2. I forget who it was but somebody once called viruses "RNA and protein wrapped in bad news." Or something like that. Anyway, my point is, these tests could tell us whether the virus was circulating in those populations in that time. They'd need to have control samples to show they weren't getting false positives from other coronaviruses as well. If China would share this kind of data/resources, we could actually solve this thing. But alas! And yes! I can also definitely help you out with a list of credible virology journals. Suffice it to say, the weirder the title and the less prominent the word "virology" .... you get the drift. But yes! I will do all of these things next week when I am not studying my brains out! Sorry for not getting back to you sooner but basically every moment I spend on wiki is time I'm stealing away from my future career prospects, and I definitely have a problem with procrastination!--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 01:06, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

No problem. Thanks for the reply, and good luck (or, being a musician, I know there's only a bit of luck in that and it's mostly about preparation). Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 01:09, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

no truly you're right to cite luck, there's only so much preparation you can do when they're asking me to memorize more details than could ever be humanly possible! That's what my pulmonology professor (who used to be a professional bassist) used to tell me. There's a reason the 99th percentile on this test is only like an 80% correct! It's like 40% perspiration, 20% luck, 10% not overworking yourself to death, and the last 20% is unattainable just give up now. They only keep making it harder. But anyway thanks, and I'll be back soon--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 02:37, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

@RandomCanadian: working on that summary list over here! should be ready in a few days to a week. Gonna try and get it added to WP:Viruses as a guideline--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 15:20, 8 June 2021 (UTC)

Additional question (when you have time)

• See this, particularly the bit where I talk about selective pressure but can't remember which paper(s) I'm referring to... It's surely something which you've already heard of? Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 23:19, 31 May 2021 (UTC)

I added two papers there that may be what you were talking about. Not 100% sure. It's definitely under positive selection pressure because it's relatively fixed. The virus is crippled without it!--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 14:28, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

• • Also (excuse me for being annoying), is there anything useful in either of Wu et al. or Zhang et al. (citations in the article) which would allow placing a phylogenetic tree in H10N3? They both have such diagrams, but I'm not sure how to interpret/summarise them when there are so many different strains listed (also, the problem is they're all primary studies, so likely should only be used for rather mundane claims, or statements which are clearly secondary analysis of existing literature). Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 15:44, 2 June 2021 (UTC)

@RandomCanadian: We may be able to find a review paper that places H10N3 in the context of all zoonotic flu viruses, and have more useful phylogenetic trees... I'll keep my eyes/ears open, I do think such a review will exist shortly if it doesn't already! They always pop up in the few weeks following an announcement like this.--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 14:28, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, will look up at the usual places. As for this, WP:AE might be a better venue (clearer structure + word limits, which avoids the usual free-for-all pile-on of the dramaboard) given this. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 14:34, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

Ah thank you, that is very good advice. Still gathering diffs, and waiting for diffs. But yes, I think the lowest amount of drama and headache, the better. :) --Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 14:39, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

Undue?

Why is "Testimony of former Admiral Giroir to the Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis" UNDUE? The guy was a highly placed government official. If you go down that path anything and everything can be arbitrarily deleted as UNDUE just because you don't like that side. JS (talk) 07:22, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

hi Jayanta Sen, the appropriate place for this conversation is the talk page of that article. but I based that assessment on the fact that we have covered this topic in extreme depth there, to the point of having many many voices about it. Not every single voice is due. In this case, due weight is based on the share of coverage in peer reviewed secondary sources. as per WP:RSUW. Please move this to the relevant articles talk page or I am be happy to...--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 12:08, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

Please move this thread to the article talk page.JS (talk) 07:53, 1 July 2021 (UTC)

Okay, I will move it. JS (talk) 18:02, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

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Notice of Arbitration Enforcement noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a report involving you at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement regarding a possible violation of an Arbitration Committee decision. The thread is Shibbolethink. Thank you. Geogene (talk) 21:18, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

BLP violations at Talk:DRASTIC

Contrary to what you appear to believe, [1] BLP does apply to talk pages. It applies throughout the project. Please either source the contentious negative claims, or delete the material. Geogene (talk) 20:38, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

We're literally discussing these claims in the RfC. They are core to the RfC, and hence should not be removed. I get that you disagree with my interpretation of the sources, but that is wholly distinct from saying I've committed a BLP violation. I simply claimed that members of the group referred to themselves as conspiracy-minded. Which is, from my perspective, a factual understanding of the source material. And I provided a quote to back that up. You may disagree with that interpretation, but it doesn't make it a BLP violation. --Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 20:42, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

As I said on the talk page, report me to WP:ANI or WP:ARBE if you want, or bring it up on the BLP Noticeboard. But I'm really quite confident that this is not a BLP violation. I've added a clarifying note to that box as well, to demonstrate what conclusions I'm drawing from each quote. I would encourage you to re-read WP:ASPERSIONS. Not saying that's what you're doing, but saying if you try to use accusations like this as a WP:BLUDGEON to silence people you disagree with, then that would be a matter I would bring up to ANI or ARBE. Have a great day.--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 20:53, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

I will have to, then. Geogene (talk) 20:55, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Accidental transclusions

Hi there. You seem to be transcluding the entire content of article talk pages to Wikipedia:Neutral point of view/Noticeboard. I presume this is a mistake? Cordless Larry (talk) 18:42, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Ah yes, that is a mistake. My mistake, sorry!! I was trying to just transclude the particular section. Is that allowed? Or should I only post notices, not even an RfC transclusion? I couldn't find any policy actually saying that was a bad idea, that's why I did it! --Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 18:45, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Responding here just to keep it in one section (feel free to remove/archive my section above if you'd like). I wouldn't recommend transclusions, even if there were a good way to do it and no policy objections. A short notice is nice, but I'd hate to see the noticeboards clogged up with transcluded talk page sections. Firefangledfeathers (talk) 18:49, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Oh, that's fair. You know I hadn't even considered the Kantian categorical imperative implications of that. I'll just stick to using Template:Rfc notice. Sorry for the trouble, won't happen again! --Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 18:51, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Maybe you'd like the {{la}} template, it's commonly used at the top of new threads at noticeboards as an alternative to including links directly in the title. In the case of a discussion, {{section link}} is also useful for inline links. Examples (thanks to the "random article feature" for the selection):

• Adolf Dethmann (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
• Talk:National innovation system § This article is kind of messy

I hope this helps, —PaleoNeonate – 10:57, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Oh I do love that! Thank you PaleoNeonate! I'll add that to the RfC notifies. That's a big part of what I was missing with the kind of sterile notification templates I could find. --Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 15:11, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Talk template transclusions

Hi Shibbolethink, are you intentionally transcluding RfCs onto multiple noticeboards? When you use the {{Talk}} template, it's transcluding whole talk page sections onto the noticeboards. I am not sure that's the way to do things, and other users seem to be confused as well. Firefangledfeathers (talk) 18:41, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

I was only trying to transclude the RfC section, is that allowed? As far as I can tell, there is no actual WP:PAG about this... I get that it is customary to just post a notice, but why would it be wrong to just transclude the RfC? If it is wrong, or there's some WP:PAG against it, I of course will not do it. But if it's possible to just transclude the RfC, why not? Seems cleaner to me--Shibbolethink ^{(♔ ♕)} 18:46, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

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