User talk:John Hill/Archive05

Happy New Year

Dear John, let's make of Wikipedia a swan in stead of an Ugly Duckling.
I wish you a very happy New Year and all good for your family, yourself and of course for the quality on Wikipedia.
Finest regards of Davin (talk) 16:34, 1 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Your welcome :-) Davin (talk) 18:29, 23 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nerva

Replied on Talk:Gan Ying. If you find it necessary to be silent, that would be regrettable; I was replacing a claim that he was describing "Roman democracy", which seems most unlikely. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 17:27, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! I am not sure what you mean to imply with your statement, "If you find it necessary to be silent, that would be regrettable" - I have never said anything about remaining silent and, at least on this subject, I certainly don't intend to. The point of discussion here is, I believe, about Gan Ying's account in which he says that: "Their kings are not permanent. They select and appoint the most worthy man. If there are unexpected calamities in the kingdom, such as frequent extraordinary winds or rains, he is unceremoniously rejected and replaced. The one who has been dismissed quietly accepts his demotion, and is not angry."

I have always assumed that this was probably a fantastic tale Gan Ying was told (possibly by sailors) when he was in Parthia. As we know, he never managed to reach Roman territory, so all the information he gathered was, at best, second-hand. I have never thought that his account of some sort of democratic process of choosing leaders in Rome was believable.

You added a statement to the article saying that, "Gan Ying also described the adoptive monarchy of Nerva." This might be so - the timing is right - but there is no other evidence that I know of to support this assertion. That is why I put a "citation needed" tag on the claim and wrote to you to inform you i had done so. I still think Gan Ying was probably just repeating a fabulous tale. Unless there is some real evidence relating his account to Nerva's accession I think you should remove this statement. It wouldn't hurt, of course, to make it plain that Gan Ying's description of the process of choosing Rome's leaders was idealistic in the extreme, and certainly not factual. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 03:00, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, let me be clearer: If you find it necessary that the article to be silent on this subject, then make it so, unfortunate as that would be.... Septentrionalis PMAnderson 03:20, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No, I don't find it necessary at all for the article to be silent on the subject. I think it would be fine to point out that the account is hardly an accurate or believable account of political processes in Rome at the time and, if you wish, you might like to add something saying that it may have been a distorted account based on Nerva's accession - but that this is not certain (unless you have some further information to support this assertion). Cheers, John Hill (talk)

PS I have just noticed for the first time that you were replacing an earlier claim in the article that: "He also describes the Roman practise of democracy, their physical appearance and riches:". I have no idea who added this to the article - and it is clearly misleading. However, I still think your claim that Gan Ying was referring to Nerva's accession is also misleading and needs either to be removed or qualified. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 03:34, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fine. Let me think about phrasing. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 04:25, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Great! Thanks for your help. Good luck with it. Cheers,John Hill (talk) 04:27, 8 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Tangton Gyelpo

On January 16, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Tangton Gyelpo, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Gatoclass (talk) 11:13, 16 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wonderful work John, thanks. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 12:49, 16 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Heheh I can understand how annoying "The Higher Power" can be sometimes. Strange things happen, how on earth did a plane on fire with no engines land on water and still have every single one of them saved beats me. Your reference to it though as Mr. Arthur Rightus I thought was amusing!! IThere are just too many things that happen in everyday life to consider that we are somehow an accident and that there is nothing watching over us. Sometimes I think the good Lord is laughing his head off at us. I can see though how frustrating it must be to have these physical problems which affect your writing. Take care!!

Anyway of late I've been concentrating on making flickr agreements and uploading "copyrighted" images to the commons. I have made a few friends too on flickr including one lady of about 50 called Grete Howard who has visited 122 countries even Nepal and Tibet and as you can imagine has a huge amount to tell. See articles like Parakou, Cové and Bassar as an example for those I've added. I've even managed to start a few articles based on them like Attitogon etc.

I thought you could do with some cheering up so here are some images I uploaded of Norfolk Island my friend!

Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 10:28, 17 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi

Hi,

I have reverted the Genectics section to what it has been for a long time. Removing the info from the following links

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~gallgaedhil/haplo_r1a_two.htm

because the above link does not quote where its information is souced from directly (e.g. which Peer reviewed study or which named expert) and so it is unreliable.

You say that I added,

"The association with Indo-Scythian descent is so strong the British have often used haplotype matches with Jatt Sikhs as evidence of Scythian link." Now, first of all, this is a reference to one genealogical website of rather doubtful scholarship in which I cannot find any evidence that they claim (as he states) that "the British" (which British, one might well wonder) "have often used haplotype matches with Jatt Sikhs as evidence of Scythian link."

If you go through to the version before my edit you will see that it was already there before me [1]. I did not add it. I am not happy with the above section either because it looks like someone just added POV so am happy to remove it. I am happy to leave the Genetic section to what is below. This is roughly what it has been for long time (over 2 years plus) on the article.

"A recent Genetic study of the Jat people of the Indian States of Haryana and Punjab (Punjab region), where about 40% or more of the population are Jat people. The study involved a genealogical DNA test which examined single nucleotide polymorphisms (mutations in a single DNA "letter") on the Y chromosome (which occurs only in males). Jat people share many common haplotypes with German, Slavic, Baltic, Iranian, and Central Asian groups.[62] It found Jat people share only two haplotypes, one of which is also shared with the population of present-day Turkey, and have few matches with neighbouring Pakistani populations.[62] This haplotype shared between the two Jat groups may be part of an Indo-Aryan (or Indo-European) genetic contribution to these populations[62], where as the haplotypes shared with other Eurasian populations may be due to the contribution of Indo-European Scythian (Saka, Massagetae) or White Huns.[62]"

Moreover, I cleaned up a few other sections so do not revert my edits here. Thank you and stay well.

Best regards.

--James smith2 (talk) 06:19, 20 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Positive Advice

Hi, this is ment to be helpful positive advice. I noticed on the talk page of the article you seem to be in a dispute with another editor User:LRBurdak. Please try and keep the exchanges to each other talk pages as it disrupts the article talk page. Having a dispute with him is Ok but please Wikipedia:Assume good faith from other editors who work hard here to improve it, it really harms wikipedia when good editors leave wikipedia because of negative outlook of someone because they have a dispute with someone else e.g. User:LRBurdak. So please keep wikipedia positive and Wikipedia:Assume good faith from other editors. :-)

Best regards.

--James smith2 (talk) 06:55, 20 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Butting in here (sorry if it's not welcome), I agree with what's said above with one exception. I find that it helps to keep all discussion relating to an article on the article's talk page. Going to user talk pages can make it more personal, and results in fragmented conversations! Best wishes, Martin 18:12, 20 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Apologies and thanks

First of all, I would like to make an unqualified and wholehearted apology to James smith2. I wrongly accused him of making changes to this article which were, in fact, as he points out, made earlier by someone else. They seem to have been made by a person using the IP address: 58.27.166.36 (apparently from Lahore, Pakistan) on 17th January. This was an inexcusable mistake on my part - I should have checked more carefully before I wrote and will endeavour to do so in the future.

Secondly, I would like to thank James smith2 for his kind and tolerant advice to me to assume good faith - something I admit I find hard to do when I feel I am being faced by people promoting racist agendas.

Finally, I would like to thank him for his sensitive improvements to the article on Jat people. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 09:43, 20 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Don't mention it. Apology accepted. :-) Best regards.--James smith2 (talk) 19:17, 28 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Zangbeto

Check out this rather strange creature in Yoruba religion. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 20:37, 21 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wow thats some experience, so sad. That sort of thing is usually too much for me to venture into, but I have a book on Benin and voodoo just happens to be engrained deeply in its culture. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 11:04, 22 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thankyou my great friend. That has to be one of the funkiest awards I've seen!! Sorry I haven't been doing loads of work on Tibet and former Tibet but I wish I had some books like yourself to enable me to write more about things! Over the next few months though I will be creating some articles related to Amdo and north-west China as I've spotted a great deal missing from the web alone! Take care and keep in contact and thanks again Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 12:23, 25 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

At present I'm working on French West Africa and building content as well as Latin American municipalities. This of course is fused with getting a lot of missing LOC material onto here, my most recent today is Agriculture in Bolivia. Given time I hope to find more sources and update it into "my own" but I had to scout for virtually all of the images in the article and upload them myself as countries like this have a shocking redundancy in content both in the encyclopedia and in imagery. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 16:47, 25 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tangton Gyelpo and Thang Tong Gyalpo

Hi. Thang Tong Gyalpo is probably closer to the Tibetan since the second syllable ends with a nga not na. Perhaps take the material from your article Tangton Gyelpo and add it to / or merge it with the one I started earlier Thang Tong Gyalpo then simply make the Tangton Gyelpo page a re direct to Thang Tong Gyalpo. This might be a useful source: Chakzampa Thangtong Gyalpo - Architect, Philosopher and Iron Chain Bridge Builder. best regards Chris Fynn (talk) 14:57, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've just done it myself. You might want to go through it. Chris Fynn (talk) 16:13, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

May I ?

Hi John, I’d like to ask you if I may copy your picture ‘Maroon village, Suriname River, 1955’ (Dugouts {canoes} at the Suriname River) and post it to my user profile on myspace.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=449599303

I’ve translated a short story that takes place in Surinam, I want to let see a few pages of it on my profile and I really would be very glad if I could use your picture as illustration (of course, with mention of your name). The original text of this story was in Dutch and I translated it into French. The French title is ‘Les bananes lumineuses’ and the author’s name is Oscar van den Boogaard. Could you please contact me on my profile? Thanks for your reply and greetings from France, Marian 86.66.224.119 (talk) 17:23, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

REPLY: Hi Marian! You are, of course, most welcome to use the photo. My father, who has now passed away, took it years ago and he would have been thrilled to know it is being used and others are enjoying it. I hope you find this reply - I tried to reply on your MySpace page but could not find out how to do it, and you don't have a Wikipedia Talk page yet. Please let me know if you get this message - if I don't hear from you in a while I will try to contact you again through MySpace. Cheers and all best wishes, John Hill (talk) 11:28, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dear John, a lot of thanks for your kind reply! If you go to my MySpace page, you can see the photo now. By clicking on it, you will get a few pages with text. I would be honoured if you would accept to add a comment there, I mean about the photo and about your father, just the same as you wrote here… Or if it’s not possible (if you're not registered on myspace) maybe I can copy something from this page. Anyway, I thank you very much again! Best wishes to you too, Marian 86.66.224.119 (talk) 22:09, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Marian: Thank you for posting the photo. But please credit it to Dr. "Ted" Hill - not me! I am sorry I cannot add a comment because I am not a member of MySpace (and I don't have time to get involved with more on-line activities), but I would be pleased if you would like to make a comment about my father based on what I have written here. He was a doctor - a specialist in Tropical Medicine in private practice in Trinidad and, as there were so few doctors qualified in Tropical Medicine in the region in those days (late 1940s - 1960), he was often asked to go to remote regions to check on various diseases, epidemics, etc., for both local governments and companies who had workers in those areas. As a result, he visited many remote areas in the Guyanas (British, French and Dutch colonies at that time). He was very adventurous and travelled widely and loved to explore unusual places. He got on well with all sorts of people and was fluent in several languages including French (Parisian, French Canadian and West Indian Creole), Dutch, German, and Spanish, and could carry on conversations in many others. He was also an adventurous pilot and a fine photographer. He was endlessly curious about just almost everything and spent his life trying to help others. As you can tell I am very proud of my father! Hope this gives you something to work with. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 23:35, 4 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dear John, I’ve posted your comment on myspace, with an introduction from myself (based on the informations you gave me) and I credited the photo to Dr. Ted HILL. I hope you’ll be pleased with the result. Many thanks again! Cheers, Marian 86.66.224.119 (talk) 16:30, 7 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

PS : I work with a publisher. I think your father’s life could be a great subject for a novel. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.66.224.119 (talk) 21:13, 7 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/PHG

The above-linked Arbitration case has been closed and the final decision published.

PHG's mentorship and sourcing arrangement is both revised and extended; the full list of new conditions are available by clicking this link. Furthermore, the original topic ban on editing articles related to medieval or ancient history has been rescinded. PHG is prohibited from editing articles relating to the Mongol Empire, the Crusades, intersections between Crusader states and the Mongol Empire, and Hellenistic India—all broadly defined. This topic ban will last for a period of one year. He is permitted to make suggestions on talk pages, provided that he interacts with other editors in a civil fashion.

Any particular article may be added or removed from PHG's editing restriction at the discretion of his mentor; publicly logged to prevent confusion of the restriction's coverage. The mentor is encouraged to be responsive to feedback from editors in making and reconsidering such actions. Furthermore, the Committee noted that PHG has complied with the Committee's restrictions over the past ten months, and that PHG is encouraged to continue contributing to Wikipedia and Wikimedia projects. PHG should be permitted and encouraged by other editors to write well-sourced suggestions on talkpages, to contribute free-content images to Wikimedia Commons, and to build trust with the community.

For the Arbitration Committee,
Daniel (talk) 22:32, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Zhang Zhung

Should be Zhang Zhung I think... Hey we've had a ton of snow here at the moment, pretty rare on the mild south coast. However at present the sun is shining intensively and the snow has stopped, its gonna melt preyyy quickly! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 12:17, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

LOL perhaps this fella has spent too long on the sunbed or tanning salon. Thats quite a tan!! Great image! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 15:07, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Great news. Have you checked out the 1773 new images of Tibet from the 1930s 1940s etc from the German archives in the commons Amazing, images of the Potala etc. Might have some images of some interesting people from this period. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 15:40, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hey buddy I've started Tsarong Dzasa using our wonderful German images. I wonder if he is mentioned in one of your works. Quite important figure by the looks of it Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 16:53, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Just looking through the German archives the potential for coverage just gets mind boggling if we go back into a different time and space. Undoubtedly there are potentially thousands of biographies and articles that could be written on people from a hundreds of different eras that are unkown to "the west" but were important cabinet members or people during their time and place. For instance go back to 18th century Tibet I am willing to bet there are tens of articles that could be written on important monks or abbots which would make fascinating articles. I know we have the main lineage successors started but if you try to get into the time period or place which I think is what wikipedia should strive to do it is astounding what we could do eventually. Thats what makes wikipedia that little more special I think, it is up to us to make these topics notable and present them to "the west". It really affects me when I think how many volumes of books were burned during the Chinese invasion in thousands of monasteries. Monasteries were the centers for information in Tibet weren't they. Luckily the Tibetan Museum in India has salvaged some information but in relation to what undounbtedly existed in all the ancient Tibetan manuscriupts and archives it is nothing at all. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 20:07, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

REPLY WOW! I am speechless! Looks like we could spend weeks just adding images to current articles and providing captions before we get onto any new articles. Will do what I can when I can. Thanks so much for pointing out this amazing treasure box to me. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 02:47, 4 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I know, the images mean a lot to me also because it pictures Tibet as Tibet not after it was brutally robbed of its independence. Did you by the way have any info on Tsarong Dzasa in your books to add? Have you heard of him? I started Trimon too a while back,which I'd like to expand in due course if possible; I'd like to see more biographies started on Tibetan cabinet leaders from earlier times indeed from today too but I am particularly fascinated by the older material. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 10:07, 4 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fantastic article on Tsarong Dzasa, Dr. Blofeld! I haven't found anything about him or Timon yet - but I have a lot of old books and papers to go through - will try to do this some time soon. I had lots of fun yesterday just adding photos from the collection to various articles (and making English captions for them and a few changes to the articles where I thought they were needed). Cheers, John Hill (talk) 23:41, 4 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I know I'm loving these photos! I'm not sure whether to stub the Gayokang article, theres probably notable information in German at least. Thanks for those finds anyway! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 09:13, 5 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hey John. An asteroid named after Lhasa. Cool!! 7859 Lhasa Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 23:18, 7 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Pie

File:Pie.jpeg

Great to meet you here has given you a fresh pie! Pies promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a piping hot pie, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Bon appetit!

Spread the tastiness of pies by adding {{subst:GivePie}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 17:32, 7 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No mention. Take care! Cheers! :-)-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 11:33, 10 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Speaking of the Silk Route, I just love Henry Yule's translation of Marco Polo. That's one fine book I've read again and again.-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 15:11, 10 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks a lot!I don't think I'm knowledgeable enough to make suggestions or criticisms. Anyway, the paper does appear to be interesting.

As far as the Pandyas are concerned, I believe that Pandyas were often confounded with the Pandavas, as in Arrian's Indica. However, the kingdom of Panyue mentioned in the Weilue, appears in most probability, to be the kingdom of the Pandyas. However, as there is little evidence of any commerce between the ancient South Indians and China prior to the 10th and 11th centuries AD when the Medieval Cholas were at the zenith of their power, the interactions in the 3rd century CE must've been limited to occasional diplomatic missions or voyages of exploration.-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 06:01, 11 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi again, Ravi! Thanks for your comments. In fact there is indeed some evidence for trade between southern and eastern India and China in the late centuries BCE to the early centuries CE. Although it is not extensive, it seems to me quite unequivocal. There are Chinese records of merchants from the Roman Empire reaching China by sea (and I am sure you are already well aware of the extensive trade between the Roman Empire and southeastern India and Sri Lanka around (and after) the turn of the Common Era). It would be strange if "Roman" merchants were visiting both southern India and China at the same period without any commercial contact between the latter two countries. However, I am too sore and tired to go into all this in detail tonight. If you wish, I could send you info later. All best wishes, John Hill (talk) 11:19, 11 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There is extensive evidence to prove that trade was conducted between Rome and South India. There were Roman coins, etc.; however, there hasn't been any significant discovery in South India, of artifacts from 3rd century China. Yeah, if at all there was sea trade between Rome and China, then sailors ought to have stopped in S. India on their way.-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 12:28, 11 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Indian contacts with China by sea in the 2nd century

Dear Ravi. I have just found my note on Indian contact with China by sea during the 2nd century CE and I thought it might be of some interest to you. Although all the contacts are mentioned as "embassies," it seems probable that they would have come on merchant ships and that there would have been far more visits by merchant ships without embassies which would, therefore, not have been recorded in the Chinese records. Anyway, here is the quote from my notes: "There are records of envoys from 'India' in 159 and 161 CE travelling by sea via the Han prefecture of Rinan (on the central Vietnamese coast) to China. Others from “beyond the barrier” arrived in 173 CE and 183 CE. See The Roman Empire in Chinese Sources. (1996). D.D. Leslie and K. H. J. Gardiner , p. 153, and n. 50. There are some indications that these embassies may have been sent by Saka satraps in Gujarat rather than from the Kushans, see ibid. p. 137." I should add that if ships were travelling from the northwest coast of India to China, it is very likely indeed that ships would also have been sailing to China from southeastern India, and the product lists in the 3rd century Weilüe would seem to indicate this as well. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 23:07, 14 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This is truly interesting. Well, let me search some Indian sources if there is any mention of trade with China. Well, do keep me updated. I would like to know more-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 06:32, 15 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wusun

Hi John. I saw your edits in the article Wusun and I suppose that you are quite educated in that field. I corrected a few poorly sourced claims in the article and tried to write a more neutral version, especially regarding the Wusun language. It would be great if you could have a look at it. I am still convinced that many parts are POV, OR, or simply wrong. Thank you. Tājik (talk) 05:22, 15 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Contacts between Ancient South India and China

I came across some related stuff in the 1939 book "Foreign Notices of South India" by K. A. Nilakanta Sastri. One of the chapters is titled "Kanchi and China in the second cnetury B.C.". I shall reproduce the contents of the chapter here:

II. KANCI AND CHINA IN THE SECOND CENTURY B.C
Pan Kou, a Chinese writer who lived not later than the end of the first century A.D. says in his Ts'ien han chou:
"From the gates of Je-nan, from Siu-Wen and Ho-p'ou travelling by boat for five months we reached the kingdom of Ton-Yuan. After a further journey of about four months by sea is reached the kingdom of Yi-lou-mo. By sailing still further for a period of over twenty days the kingdom of Chen-li is reached. From there you travel more than ten days by land to the kingdom of Fou-kan-tou-lou, going by boat for more than two months you reach the kingdom of Houang-tche. The habits of the people there generally resemble those of the people of Tchou-yai. These are extensive and populous lands, full of strange products. From the time of Emperor Wou (140-86 B.C.) all of them have been sending tribute. There are official interpreters who belong to the (administration of the) palace houangmen(yellow-gate); with the recruits they go to sea to buy shinning pearls, glass, rare stones and strange products, giving gold and silks in exchange. In the lands to which they go, the people supply them with food and join them in their repast. The merchant ships of the foreigners take them to their destination by turns. These foreigners also profit by trade; (besides) they also plunder and kill people. Moreover (the passengers) have to be afraid of tempests which drown them. If nothing happens, they take many years to go and come back. The large pearls measure upto seven inches. In the period of Yuan-che (1-6 A.D.) of the emperor P'ing, Wang Mang desired to transform the government and manifest stately power. He sent rich presents to the king of Houang-tche and asked him to send an embassy bringing a live rhinoceros as tribute. From the kingdom of Houang-tche, going by boat for about eight months, we reach P'i-tsong. Travelling again by sea for about two months, we get to the frontier of Siang-lin in Je-nan. They say that to the south of Houang-tche lies the kingdom of Ssen-tch'eng-pou, whence the interpreter envoys of the Han return."
It is seen, observes Pelliot, that Pan-Kou has joined two series of data, one going back to the period of the emperor Wou (140-86 B.C.) and the other coming from the envoys of Wang Mang in the initial years of the Christian era. He also points out that in this passage, in spite of its obscurities, we are in the realm of history, not legend. Now the country which is reached after a year's voyage from the coasts of Indo-China, and from which pearls and glass are procured, must have been in the midst of the Indian Ocean, possibly even at its western end. Herrmann locates Houang-tche in Abyssinia and B.Laufer in Malaya; Ferrand rejects these identifications with good reason, and says: "Phonetically, the equivalence Houang-tche < Kanci is satisfactory for the epoch of Han; historically it is possible that China had relations with Kanchi in the second century B.C. Let us also note this. A Chola embassy of the eleventh century from Coromandel to Canton took eight months to complete the journey; Pan Kou gives ten months to one year for the same voyage nearly a dozen centuries earlier. Chinese vessels, it should be noted finally, had not yet begun to sail to India; they began to do so only much later. And the Chinese are distinctly stated by Pan Kou to have depended for their transport on foreign ships. But he makes it no less clear that from the first century B.C. the products of Southern India had begun to reach China by sea, and that at the beginning of the Christian era, under orders of the Court, a Chinese mission traversed the entire Indian Ocean

Hope you might find this useful. :-)-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 04:30, 19 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting coincidence! I logged in today to message you something which I had found and I found a message from you on my talk page.:-) I'll have a look at it now-Ravichandar _{My coffee shop} 04:47, 19 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Qashqai

Calm down. The anonymous user was the one who changed Persia with Iran. I did not have time to revert all his changes. Earlier on I had made some editions to this article. The reason was it was premature to speak of the Kashkuli tribe out of blue, when one is still introducing the whole Qashqai ethnic group in general. I indeed do not agree with the things written in Enc. Iranica. But still I quoted lierary from enc. Iranica. I hope next time you are more respectful and see the edit histoy before blaming others.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 09:13, 28 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

BTW I DEMAND THAT YOU APPOLOGIZE ON THAT TALKPAGE FOR YOUR ACCUSATION!--Babakexorramdin (talk) 09:14, 28 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Since you put a comment on my talk page withouth appology!

I find your discourse very arrogant. For your nfo the quote was not mine. It was there. I only changed the into. and removed the Kashkuli part leaving the rest of the quote intact. In addition I do remember I checked it with Iranica and that was Ok. I might have forgotten to put a link or something I do not remember but what I did is not what you are accusing me of, for example changing Persian Gulf to A... Gulf has had nothing to do with me. Anyone who knows my edits sees that that was unimaginble..--Babakexorramdin (talk) 11:35, 28 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

APOLOGY TO Babakexorramdin

I apologise to Babakexorramdin for the accusation I made against him of misrepresenting a quote. It is clear now that he just gave the wrong reference (the one I checked) and he has now corrected it.

In other words he made the simple mistake of giving this reference [2] for [3] and I did not, as the Wikipedia advises, "assume good faith" and accused him ujustly. I guess because of some of misleading changes by another user at about the same time I was upset about this site being misused - which it was - but NOT by Babakexorramdin who seems to have just made an honest mistake, which is now corrected.

I unreservedly apologise and am very sorry for the misrepresentation and any other hurt I have caused. Sincerely yours, John Hill (talk) 12:38, 28 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

thank you very much. It shows your class John. I am also sorry that I reacted bitterly. --Babakexorramdin (talk) 01:52, 1 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

And thank you so much for your kind note. I look forward to working with you to help make this article on the Qashqai and others where we have a common interest more accurate and informative for all. I send you my very warmest wishes, John Hill (talk) 03:02, 1 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

yes as you see the Iranian articles are subject to serious vandalism by anonymous IPs. This is something which is going on now for years. It indeed needs continuous efforts to undo them. I hope you, other editors and I can do a lot in that regard.--Babakexorramdin (talk) 10:33, 1 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello John

Hi John, I was editing on Dzungar people and I came across with the editing history where I saw you insisted on calling this area ruled by the Dzungars East Turkestan. I don't think that's the right name to use. I have listed some reasons on Talk:Dzungar people. Please check it out if you are still interested in the topic. --Chadsnook (talk) 10:40, 18 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I totally agree with the changes. Thanks, Chadsnook for picking this up, and apologies for my original mistake. I think "East Turkestan" was a somewhat fluid name in regards to what territory it covered - but it certainly does not seem to be appropriate here. I can't remember where I took it from - but it looks like I just repeated the statement from something I was reading at the time. Best wishes, John Hill (talk) 22:47, 18 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No problem John. Best wishes to you too. --Chadsnook (talk) 23:38, 25 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Wild silk

For every category you create, you should specify parent categories to which it belongs. You can do this by listing the parents near the bottom of the page, each enclosed in double brackets like so:

[[Category:Silk]]
[[Category:Hypothetical second category]]

I am a human being, not a bot, so you can contact me if you have questions about this. Best regards, --Stepheng3 (talk) 21:01, 25 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi John

Hey John! Amit here. So did you have any luck in dealing with vandals on the Jat people page? What are you working on these days? Sorry if you mind such use of your talk page, I just was curious what you were up to after all this time :P. Cheers! :) ReluctantPhilosopher (talk) 14:42, 11 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Talkback

Hello, John Hill. You have new messages at Omarcheeseboro's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Omarcheeseboro (talk) 23:27, 13 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Sumpa

On April 16, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Sumpa, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Dravecky (talk) 08:31, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi

Hi! How are you doing? :-) -The Enforcer _{Office of the secret service} 05:55, 27 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Oh! I am sorry to hear that! I know little about medicine and the human body. I chanced upon your work on Khotanese History in the Indo-Iranian journal. You've done a great work with it! I am a history enthusiast and am interested in South Asian and Iranian history in particular. I'm compiling a small paper on the impact of non-Aryan influences on the history of Old Persia. I would like to publish my own book sometime in my life. But unfortunately, I'm busy with my job now and it is due to the fact that life gets busy that I am compelled to leave Wikipedia. I cannot speak much now. I'm leaving for Bengaluru this night. Take care of your health. Sorry, I cannot speak for long.-The Enforcer _{Office of the secret service} 13:52, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good luck for your work with the book. :-)-The Enforcer _{Office of the secret service} 13:53, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi again Ravi - and thanks so much for your kind thoughts. Please don't apologise for the lack of time - I know how life and work can take up one's life - why else would I have spent 30 years writing one book? I just wish you all the very best in your endeavors - and hope life brings happiness and fulfillment to you - whatever you do - and that you don't lose your interest in history because of the demands of the rat race of life. I send you my very best wishes and thanks again for your encouragement (and, by the way, it was wonderful to hear that you happened upon me through my 1988 article on the history of Khotan in the Indo-Iranian Journal - I've often wondered whether anyone had ever taken any notice of it - it is most gratifying to hear you found it). Cheers, John Hill (talk) 14:10, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hey John!!!

Hello John. My sincere apologies for not replying for so long, I was at my parents' place which is more of a village and somehow the internet access here shut down for several days.

Sorry to hear about your back trouble - have you met the neurosurgeon yet? I wish you a speedy recovery with the minimum of pain. Who are you living with? Any family/friend to take care of you? Just take it easy okay?

Nice to know things are settling down on the Jat pages. You really helped maintain normalcy in the face of people who derive all their sense of self worth from their caste and the exaggerated notions of self-importance that come with it, heh.

As for me, I'm glad to report that I have got admission into one of the top B-schools of the country. I am taking the Human Resources specialisation. So after nearly 3 years of working, it's back to studying for me. And I am bracing myself as I have been told they make you put in immense amounts of effort. Hopefully I will be able to measure up to it.

Once again, wishing you a speedy recovery. Take care of yourself, and let me know how the surgery went. Best wishes - Amit :) ReluctantPhilosopher (talk) 11:46, 27 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dear John Hill

Hi, Mr Hill, I try to write in english my answer. I hope you understand me.

I'm very surprise and proud, that you notice my picture (actually two pictures from me and a friend, put together to form a panoramic view). I take those beautiful sand dunes in 2006 during a trip in the Gobi desert, a very nice trip in a tremendous country.

I put it in Commons in order people from everywhere can use it, so no problem for me if you want to put it on the cover of your book. I just ask to my friend if there is no problem on his side.

I give my name later (and the friend name) by mail, tomorow or in a few days if you can wait, just for keep my anonymity on the web ;-)).

Good luck for your nice project, and send me a copy one day... Bouette (talk) 12:19, 4 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Vesak

A meaningful Vesak to you my friend. YellowMonkey (cricket calendar poll!) 05:58, 8 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tuyuhun

Dear John, couldn't one just copy something from the history of Tibet article, or the Srong brtsan sgam po article, where I think this issue is handled more carefully. I don't think the Tuyuhun are actually a component of the traditional story. I have never seen any source or academic article that claims the Tibetans were jealous of the Tuyuhuns. I have always just thought the reason for invading the Tuyuhun was geographic. It stood between Tibet and China. Tibetologist (talk) 11:06, 10 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello my dear friend

Hello John! How are you? Sorry to hear you have to take medication like that!! My father will be 61 in June and is still as fit as I am! All the luck you need huh? May I ask what your book is about? SOunds interesting look forward to seein it on Amazon. Someday I'll get around to writing books, I want somebody to pay me! All the best!!Dr. Blofeld (talk) 13:38, 10 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This book sounds amazing, and you;ve been working on it 30 years? Wow!! As this is written from a Chinese perspective towards other parts of Europe rather than the usual Anglo-centric view of looking at the world in western society this book looks like a gem. I've also always shared your interest in the silk road and trade routes. I'm particularly fascinated by some of the lesser known sites and area sin modern day Tajikistan, Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan, even northern Iran. Something to feel proud of I'm sure! Well done!Dr. Blofeld (talk) 08:14, 11 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK nomination of Sir Galba

Hello! Your submission of Sir Galba at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Paxse (talk) 14:58, 14 May 2009 (UTC) You're welcome. I did check him out actually. I love a bit of Caribbean music every now and then. Didn't you live in Trinidad for some time?Dr. Blofeld (talk) 10:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Interesting. You know strangely thats how I had pictured you (as a young man of course!)! Yes my cousin used to spend six months in Peru and six months in Canada and now he has left Peru to live in Aus he really misses the country! Dr. Blofeld (talk) 11:34, 15 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hey I was wondering if you have anything on Poykent?Dr. Blofeld (talk) 17:25, 15 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Khotan

I know very little about Khotan. I have some vague idea about pre-Islamic Khotan other than the fact that Western China was the home of the Kushanas and it was a part of Kanishka's kingdom. I guess Manichaeism and Nestorian Christianity were the predominant religions during the few centuries prior to the conversion to Islam. Am I right? Was the script related to Pahlavi? Or am I confusing Khotan with Sogdiana?

Well, by the way, I am interested quote a bit in pre-Islamic Iranian history. I am a computer programmer as of now but would like to move to history. Would like some help and good advice on the same. Would you mind if I contact you through mail?-The Enforcer _{Office of the secret service} 13:45, 18 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Biography category

No worries...you're far from the first person ever to do it, and I'm pretty sure you won't be the last, either :-) Bearcat (talk) 22:25, 20 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cooktownia

Hi John, Cooktownia is currently 874 b of readable prose size. You should expand it to 1500 b to be eligible. Here is the DYK rule. Good look!--Chanaka L (talk) 04:27, 2 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks a lot John, for the kind words! I found many overseas Wikipedians are Just, Impartial, very understanding of Sri Lanka's current situations. I think this is due to our NPOV policy. I will help you with any wikignome edits on Cooktownia. Regards!--Chanaka L (talk) 06:46, 2 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sanju Pass

In the Article Sanju Pass which you created, you had not either implicitly or explicitly stated that the Sanju La was situate in a particular country. I appreciated your stance since the entire northern border of Kashmir is disputed by the Chinese holding East Turkistan and the stance of even the Chinese is that the northern border of Kashmir has neither been delineated or demarcated. Western cartographers running berserk both prior to 1947 and post 1947 have been depicting the northern border of Kashmir arbitrarily and in accordance with their whims and fancies[4] and even never consistently. In accordance with the spirit of the Article, I did not either implicitly or explicitly state in my edit, though the Sanju pass is on the northern border of Kashmir, that the Sanju is a part of Kashmir. Like your source , viz. "Report of a Mission to Yarkund in 1873 : vol.1, p. 245. (1875). T. D. Forsyth. Calcutta", I had also provided further sources.My edit is there for all to see. Res ipsa loquitur. This user:Fowler&fowler, indulging in foul play had no use of the article till I myself edited the article . The moment I edited the article, she reverts it and defying the spirit of the article, unilaterally and arbitrarily states that the Sanju Pass is allegedly in the so-called “Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region”, and then in the Discussion page of the article goes to blatantly make misrepresentations that I “seek to claim the region of this pass for the Republic of India” , when as a matter of fact, I had deliberately abstained from stating that the Sanju pass is in Kashmir. As a matter of fact, I had suggested to user:Fowler&fowler that in the article, Hindutash, a consensus can be arrived at on the model of the Sanju Pass article, i.e. abstaining from stating that the pass is situate in a particular country. He/she never gave a proper reply. Infact, she/he has never given a proper reply in my entire correspondence with her/him in the entire Discussion Page for Hindutash. You or anyone else can see for yourself! What angers me is that she /he, unable to refute or disprove my assertions, references and corroboration provided, seeks the help of her/his friends and coterie to protect her/his POV version, and she/he makes false allegations against me like the one in the Talk page of Sanju Pass. I would like to know how you feel about her/ his nefarious actions, and how to deal with her/him vis-ã –vis inter alia the articles on Hindutash and Sanju Pass. Regards.Hindutashravi (talk) 04:58, 6 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, John Hill, to "drive by" on your talk page, but Hindutashravi is a known irredentist vandal who has been waging a lonely battle on Wikipedia on behalf of two historical passes that today lie in Xinjiang, People's Republic of China. The latter nation's sovereignty over that region is disputed by no country (including all the countries of the region). The passes, moreover, are closed; they are no longer referred to by those names. I talked to someone who rode his motorcycle along the Karakash river highway and he said that he saw no signs for any passes, indeed, he saw no settlements, except for a truck stop of two. The Sanju Pass, in any case, lies some 70 miles north of Xaidulla (formerly Shahidulla), (lat:36.3 N; long: 78.02 E). See for examples the map: Map of W. H. Johnson that I uploaded on Wikipedia. Sanju is clearly outside by boundaries of Kashmir. Similarly none of the maps from Joe Schwartzberg's Historical Atlas of South Asia at DSAL in Chicago, show the Sanju Pass in any of the various boundaries of the British Indian Empire. As you can see in section C, Xaidulla (lat:36.3 N; long: 78.02 E), which lies on the second sharp bend of the Karakash River is at best on the boundary of the most expansive of these historical maps. How can a pass, some 70 miles north of Xiadulla (Shahidula) lie anywhere but in Chinese Turkestan? The maps in section D are even more conservative, the entire stretch of the Karakash river between Sumpal and Xaidulla lies outside the boundaries of these maps. Only one of the dozen maps in C and D, the Times Atlas (1900), shows the Hindutash pass in Kashmir; the later Times Atlas Map doesn't. It is time for sane editors on Wikipedia to put an end to Hindutashravi's obsessive edits. Fowler&fowler «Talk» 16:05, 8 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have replied to his allegations and accusations in the Talk Page of the Sanju Pass and Hindutash Articles and I have again thoroughly exposed him. It remains to be seen if he will atleast now give an appropriate reply refuting my reply point by point if he can some how do it! He has never done it in the past and has always evaded the issue. You can see that I have added more details in the Sanju Pass article, including more references and corroboratory evidence specifically pertaining to the Sanju Pass. Can you do me a favour? Can you up load on Wikipedia, the map pertaining to the mission to Kashgar in 1873-74, of Sir Douglas Forsyth as shown accompanying the mission report’ which I have referred to in the article on Sanju Pass in toto. The maps up loaded by User:Fowler&fowler are piecemeal and incomplete! Regards. Hindutashravi (talk) 13:57, 10 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello friend

Hello John! Thanks for your support, it was only because a lot of people feel the same way unlike some of those nasties that I decided to return and partly because so much needs doing and few editors around who seem to want to wprk on the sort of articles I'm interested. I bought a book on the History of Nepal a while back, a book that was translated from Parbatiya. It was originally written in 1877 and the book is published in India but thanks to the Internet I got hold of a cheap copy. It covers subjects like the Gupta and Rajput dynasties in Nepal. It is quite heavy reading though and would be difficult to write encyclopedia articles based upon it but it does contain info on some 20 or so festivals in Nepal. Later I will create List of festivals in Nepal. Howeer serious computer difficulties means my firefox has crashed five times since writing this message alone so it may be while before it can be started. Regards!. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 10:58, 6 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dan McLeod

In reference to User talk:Closeapple#Dan McLeod: Thanks for the compliment. I think the nofootnotes on the "References" section was because I wasn't sure if the entry you have in that section is just "for further reading" or an actual citation reference for facts above that hadn't gotten a proper <ref> tag yet. --Closeapple (talk) 11:39, 7 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Oh for the love of Tibet

Characene / Charax Spasinou

Why are they considered to be "on the silk road"? This area was the terminus for the sea route from Mesopotamia through the Persian Gulf to the western coast of India, but its rather doubtful that it was a significant hub for land-based trade from China or Central Asia to the Levant... AnonMoos (talk) 13:05, 10 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Reply - Hi, thanks for your interest. The term "Silk Road", which has caught on in English, is a rather loose term which has come to refer to all the routes used to transport goods between China and the "West", including the maritime routes. I much prefer the term "Silk Routes", which is what I have used in my books, though even this is somewhat of a misnomer because it tends to imply that silk was the only item of trade. There were certainly many routes, and few of them deserve the title "road". The land-based routes were mostly just caravan tracks which were constantly changing depending on political, climactic, economic, and other factors.

But, to return to your question about Characene and Spasinou Charax - which was, in the first few centuries CE, the major port in the Persian Gulf, and had direct maritime connections to Roman Egypt, India and, presumably, the Far East. It was also a key point on an overland caravan route to Petra and beyond, and had land connections to Central Asia (and beyond) through Herat, and to India via Stakhr (near the ruins of Persepolis) and Kandahar, as well as the maritime routes. In 97 CE the Chinese envoy, Gan Ying, who had been sent to contact (and scout out) the Roman Empire, managed to reach Spasinou Charax. While he was in the region, although he was prevented from proceeding further, he was able to glean quite a lot of information on the Roman Empire - presumably from sailors and merchants in the port.

For details on all these matters (and much more) please see the notes to the draft versions of my annotated translations of the 'Chapter on the Western Regions' from the Hou Hanshu and the 3rd century Weilüe on the Silk Road Seattle website at: http://depts.washington.edu/silkroad/texts/texts.html . Better yet, check out the more up-to-date notes in the much-revised and expanded version of the former book which should be available on Amazon.com and through other booksellers within a few weeks. It's title will be: Through the Jade Gate to Rome: A Study of the Silk Routes during the Later Han Dynasty, 1st to 2nd Centuries CE)

I hope this answers your questions, but if you have any further queries, please don't hesitate to contact me again. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 00:24, 11 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Cooktownia

On June 12, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Cooktownia, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Royal broil 11:28, 12 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry - but you seem to have the wrong person - I haven't been working on Chelsea Bridge. John Hill (talk) 11:48, 12 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. Time you archived your talk page! Gatoclass (talk) 12:41, 12 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Chanyu vs. Shanyu

No problem! There are still some mistakes and inconsistencies left in the Latin-based system for sounding out 漢字 pronunciations. Since "chan" is used in the Hanyu Pinyin system as often as "shan", I suppose that the mistake is a believable one. You could argue that it's similar to calling Beijing as "Peking" and Jinzhou as "Chinchow" (i.e. the variation in Latin letters to indicate the sound). And no! Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

Later John! --Pericles of Athens^Talk 08:40, 14 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dockrillia wassellii Question

You recently moved Dendrobium wassellii to Dockrillia wassellii and I was wondering if you could explain why for me. I attempted to confirm that the accepted name was Dockrillia wassellii, but I was unable to do so. In the Kew checklist they list Dendrobium wassellii as the accepted name and Dockrillia wassellii as the synonym. I then went and searched under google scholar to see if I could find scholarly articles for Dendrobium wassellii and Dockrillia wassellii. There was only one for the Dockrillia search, but many for the Dendrobium article. This seems to indicate that Dendrobium would be the accepted name. So could you explain which source you used that shows that Dockrillia is the correct genus.Chhe (talk) 17:53, 15 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Isn't Dendrobium the correct usage?

Sanju Pass

Ah sorry for the mixup in Sanju Pass, just went through the text once more and noted the India / China notation in infobox, added category blindly based on that. It's probably leftover by User:Hindutashravi.

My mistake, shouldn't have edited with half a brain. --Rayshade (talk) 13:38, 24 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Book

Great! How are you? Sad news about Michael Jackson and Farrah Fawcett isn't it. Would you be interested in improving the Leh article? Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 07:32, 26 June 2009 (UTC) I take it you aren't interested in improving Leh? Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 11:06, 26 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

An invitation

Hello John. Eric here (or, as you know me by my Wiki handle, Pericles). I am very impressed with your work here at Wiki, but even more so with your work elsewhere. I would like to cordially invite you to become a member of an exclusive online forum dedicated to all aspects of Chinese history. It is a place where academics, history buffs, professors, and language experts can congregate and share scholarly material. I believe you would fit in quite well, seeing as how our members are busy on almost a daily basis translating Chinese history sources into English. It was just launched recently and is still hidden to public view, but our (truly global) membership is growing steadily through private invitations.

I hope you will accept this invitation and join our small but growing community. You can contact me at either IAmEricConnor@yahoo.com or guitargod7_5@hotmail.com and I will provide you with the necessary links. Regards.--Pericles of Athens^Talk 12:28, 27 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I have sent you a reply email with links to the forum. Cheers!--Pericles of Athens^Talk 16:51, 28 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi John. Everything ok? I noticed that you joined the forum already and I have already shot you a private message. See you in the discussions! Cheers.--Pericles of Athens^Talk 18:32, 1 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello? Did you happen to get my private message yet at the forum? I'd like to invite you to join a reading group at the forum which will discuss a book on Silk Road history recently published by Beckwith. Regards.--Pericles of Athens^Talk 01:23, 3 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Gandhara

Hi John Hill

I thought that secondary sources were preferred on Wikipeddia , now you suggest primary sources are preferred .?
Since I don’t delete (by and large) specially not referenced information , I don’t have any objection to your quote .
Have you replaced the content in the capacity of a wikipedia admin...or as just another wikipedian ..because if your edit is in the capacity of an editor then I respect your choice ...otherwise your quote made by Alberuni while true ...I wonder if it was made in the context specifically of Gandhara .

Intothefire (talk) 07:08, 28 June 2009 (UTC)Intothefire (talk) 07:09, 28 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Reply to User Intothefire

Hi again!

I don't know whether there is a policy that primary or secondary sources are preferred in the Wikipedia, but, in very general terms, I believe it is preferable to go to the original source to be sure the information is accurate.

The quote you gave was:

"According to Al Beruni , the armies of Ghazni carried fire and sword in Gandhara . The persecution of Gandhara caused irrepairable damage to Indian religions in this region . The ruins of cities ,temples , manastries , etc bear witness to these acts of vandalism . After its conquest by the Ghaznavids , Gandhara , an overwhelming majority of its population embraced Islam."

This quoted text is badly punctuated and difficult to follow and contains many grammatical and spelling errors, while the final sentence does not make sense. Further, in the previous sentence, the word monasteries is so badly misspelled ("manastries ") that a reader without a very good command of English might not even know what it was meant to represent (and would not be able to check it in a dictionary).

It was partly for these reasons that I replaced that quote with a much clearer quote from Al Biruni himself. While he does not mention Gandhara specifically, the statement was was made referring to Mahmud's invasion and conquest of northwestern India which, as we know, included Gandhara. I can see no difficulty here.

Finally, seeing as you ask, I am "just another wikipedian", not an editor - but if I were an editor why would you, on that basis alone, accept my changes if you thought they were wrong? Are we not trying to make this article as factual and clear as we can? Please let me know if you still disagree and, if so, why. Yours sincerely, John Hill (talk) 11:49, 28 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi John Hill
I have aggregated our discussion on the Gandhara talk page and responded to your last post ,in response to your posts to me which you have put on both your your talk page and mine .
Intothefire (talk) 18:03, 30 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Aye, I don't know whether it is customary to thank when receiving a Barnstar, but as people so seldom express gratitude I do sincerely want thank for the appreciation. Didn't actually expect one, mind you!

Another surprise was to make a certain mental connection after User:PericlesofAthens pointed out the same translation to be a work of yours—which I've used as a reference on a few articles. --Rayshade (talk) 08:40, 29 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You earned it

	The Working Wikipedian's Barnstar
	I, PericlesofAthens, award John Hill with this Working Man's Barnstar for his diligent efforts in changing "shanyu" to "chanyu" across multiple articles on Wikipedia in an extensive "seek and destroy" mission. Well done, sir! Pericles of Athens^Talk 00:31, 4 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello John! Thanks buddy! At present I'm starting about 1000 new castle articles all across central Europe! Hope you are well!

If you have time check out the Ancient Egyptian mediation music 1-9 series on Youtube. See this and its related articles. Really takes you back to early civilization. Great stuff/ Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 18:15, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 18:12, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Haha! No way! You've listened to that meditation stuff too? Awesome! My favorite is the third video for some reason. Can't explain why. I'm working on a draft for Ancient Egyptian literature at the moment; perhaps you'll be interested in the part that explains the musical hymns of ancient Egypt (both religious and secular).--Pericles of Athens^Talk 18:48, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Credit where credit is due

[5] I think you meant thank User:Euryalus, not Moondyne. Moondyne did nothing in the article space. Would you mind fixing your comment? –Moondyne 01:15, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you, Moondyne, for your correction - I do appreciate it, and will fix the note as you suggest. Please put it down to memory loss due to old age, fast living, and not drinking enough coffee. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 01:23, 7 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Santiago Mariño biography

Hello user John Hill, first and foremost my most sincere apologies for this kind of edit war, it was not my intention. In most of the books and works about Venezuelan history (I can give references) describes the attempt of Mariño to take power as failed, and although for a few days had a certain control, he never took the head of the executive.

Caracas 2000 (talk) 13:37, 14 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks my friend

Thanks, you know that there are some problems about the order of the list of presidents of Venezuela, here in wikipedia we have in the list, persons that in other investigations and books, are not considered presidents of Venezuela.

Caracas 2000 (talk) 14:23, 16 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Email

I've emailed you. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 11:08, 24 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Do you like classical music at all? I am a huge fan of Frédéric Chopin! Have a listen to this. His range of compostions mark a true genius I think. I think he was one of the greatest pianists of all time too, quite outstanding technical ability. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 14:16, 26 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

WikiProject TRANSWIKI

Hi. In light of recent events and community concerns about the way in which content is transferred I have proposed a new wikiproject which would attempt to address any of the concerns and done in an environment where a major group of editors work together to transfer articles from other wikipedias in the most effective way possible without BLP or referencing problems. Please offer your thoughts at the proposal and whether or not you support or oppose the idea of a wikiproject dedicated to organizing a more efficient process of getting articles in different languages translated into English. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 12:54, 27 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well so far me have 16 people supporting which is enough to start a new project see Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals/TRANSWIKI. If you could copy your message you left me and post your thoughts about translation classes and task I urge that you to do so on that page. I think that is an excellent suggestion and Ithink this project should be widely publicised and teachers of translation classes/schools should be urged to encourage their pupils to translate wikipedia articles. Same goes for english articles into other languages. The key to this will be a big team of translators. Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 11:01, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Glad you like Chopin!! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 08:26, 30 July 2009 (UTC) Some ideas on how to get it running[reply]

There is a massive number of schools and universities and tutors teaching languages in the world - and I think if we can get some good early success stories, it may just pick up enough momentum to keep spreading on its own. This is a really important idea - I really believe in it. I think the potential is endless. I think as soon as people see what a powerful (and free!) teaching tool it could be - it could catch on in a big way. The Wikipedia is the perfect tool for this sort of international and interlingual collaboration. Wow! Wouldn't it, couldn't it be great!

Getting it up and started, on a firm grounding and reaching critical mass is the trick. Surely we have some educators amongst the editors who would run with the idea with enthusiasm? I'm too old and sore myself to do much running these days ;^) but, hopefully some of you energetic younger sparks can provide the energy and direction needed????? Here's hoping! John Hill (talk) 05:43, 30 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good idea. Here is another Chopin piece by the great Vladimir Horowitz. The first 1:30 is superb but the low part in the middle spoils it somewhat. Also Liszt. I love browsing through Horowitz's recitals! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 11:59, 30 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hey I found my old piano teacher on the web!! Here. I can't believe!!! how much she has aged in 15 years!!! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 12:45, 30 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Given time I expect us to have decent pin maps for each chinese province so it will be a better map. P.S. did you listen to the other piano pieces afterwards? Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 09:54, 3 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Image of Endeavour replica in Cooktown

Hi. There's been a recent discussion about an image of yours - File:Endeavour replica in Cooktown harbour.jpg, which you uploaded in February 2005 and which was transferred to Commons in July of that year.

The image was in the HM Bark Endeavour article which is currently a featured article candidate, but there were some queries in the discussion about the release of the image under GFDL. Your original permission was in the Wikipedia version but is less evident in the Commons one as it was transferred there by someone else.

To address the issue, your image has been (temporarily) replaced with this one. However, yours is visually superior and better captures the spirit of the text.

So the image can go back into the article, could I ask a favour and get you to edit its Commons page here, by cutting then re-pasting the "Permissions" text, or doing any similar edit to demonstrate that this is in fact the image you originally took and you're happy to release it into the public domain? Euryalus (talk) 23:14, 2 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's a great photo, and looks good in the article. Hope you don't mind - I moved it to the replica section as I think it better represents the replica than the brass plaque. If you think it would look better in the shipwreck part feel free to move it back and restore the plaque photo.

Like all good articles, its a collaborative work - you'd be the second or third most frequent contributor to it so its as much yours as mine. A fair few of my edits were just idle tinkering. We'll see if the article passes FAC.

And in hindsight I don't really care what the article title is :) Euryalus (talk) 03:51, 3 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cooktowners, HM Bark Endeavour, and Lieutenant James Cook

Thanks a lot for all the work - I am really happy to see the photo on the page where it is. I, also, in hindsight don't really care what name is used for the article - both names are there and properly cross-referenced with redirects - so there should be no problem - except maybe from some Cooktown residents who tend to feel quite strongly about it. An even worse sin here is to refer to James Cook, when he was here on his first voyage, as "Captain Cook". You can say "the captain of the Endeavour, James Cook" - but NEVER use "captain" as his title here or you will be written off as an ignoramus. I am just warning you in case you ever visit Cooktown. Otherwise the locals tend to be quite friendly - so don't be put off - I'd love to meet you and show you around our beautiful slice of paradise! Cheers, John Hill (talk) 04:52, 3 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds good,and thanks for the advice on how to avoid a Cooktown pub fight. Queenslanders are always friendly but there's minefields in local topics we southerners never quite understand. :) Cooktown looks great - if I'm ever up your way I'll certainly stop by to say hi. And especially if the fishing stays good. -- Euryalus (talk) 05:50, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Kuchi people

In the article lead, "Kuchi refers to robbers" was added in the last version, which breaches the formal tone in an encyclopedia, was it to show pure racist hatred? Since it was not sourced, I removed it, and I added sources from nps and UNHCR etc. I think the article can be further expanded, and sections regarding land, carpets and rugs etc. can be added using this source and other similar sources (some can be found here) in citations - it will be great for the article. -119.152.247.198 (talk) 16:37, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi John!

We haven't talked in a while. That forum discussion about Charles Beckwith's book Empires of the Silk Road (2009) at GHF is underway. In the meantime I'd like to share with you my latest project here at Wiki which I have submitted for Featured status:

Ancient Egyptian literature. Enjoy that. ;)--Pericles of Athens^Talk 18:36, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

NowCommons: File:13 th Dalai Lama Nechung retreat.JPG

File:13 th Dalai Lama Nechung retreat.JPG is now available on Wikimedia Commons as Commons:File:13 th Dalai Lama Nechung retreat.JPG. This is a repository of free media that can be used on all Wikimedia wikis. The image will be deleted from Wikipedia, but this doesn't mean it can't be used anymore. You can embed an image uploaded to Commons like you would an image uploaded to Wikipedia, in this case: [[File:13 th Dalai Lama Nechung retreat.JPG]]. Note that this is an automated message to inform you about the move. This bot did not copy the image itself. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 18:38, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File:Tara, Gyantse Kumbum.JPG is now available as Commons:File:Tara, Gyantse Kumbum.JPG. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 21:48, 9 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File:Tara, Gyantse Kumbum.JPG is now available as Commons:File:Tara, Gyantse Kumbum.JPG. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 21:49, 9 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Your edit at 13th Dalai Lama

Are you saying that Qing is China? 98.119.158.59 (talk) 02:29, 7 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No, I never substituted Qing for China, only for Manchu. I was implying the true situation, that by the 19th century the Qing could no longer be fairly described simply as Manchus - they had become highly assimilated and had been the rulers of China for over 250 years. The Qing rulers had not only intermarried with Chinese people but they had taken on Chinese language and culture. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 05:37, 7 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Oop, I didn't point out my real question. Because you wrote that dynasty ruling China at the time, and there're countless people who would say this. I wonder why. Because Qing didn't only ruled China but also Manchuria, Tibet, Taiwan, Mongolia, and Uyghur. Qing is NOT China but a Manchu Empire, same as Yuan, which is a Mongol Empire. People say Qing is China is nothing but a history distortion. China was just one of the colonies of Qing. Cheer. 98.119.158.59 (talk) 06:11, 7 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi again! You are quite correct - too often the other parts of the Qing Empire are referred to as parts of the "Chinese" Empire - and this view has been often used to justify Chinese control of those regions. But, on the other hand, it is important to not forget that the influences certainly went both ways and the later Qing rulers were highly sinicized, if not sinophiles and sinocentric (if you will excuse the last term which I have just made up). ;^) Cheers, John Hill (talk) 06:30, 7 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Got it. One last thing, if you haven't watch these video, I would like you to watch all of them. Cheer. 98.119.158.59 (talk) 06:51, 7 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In fact, the Qing simply referred to itself as China in international treaties, including those regarding Tibet, etc. The official title of the treaty signed between Britain and Qing dynasty regarding Tibet in 1906 is Convention Between Great Britain and China Respecting Tibet[6]. And Article II of this Sino-Britain treaty stated "The Government of Great Britain engages not to annex Tibetan territory or to interfere in the administration of Tibet. The Government of China also undertakes not to permit any other foreign State to interfere with the territory or internal administration of Tibet.". Qing was officially China, as seen in treaty text, and it was certainly not that "China was just one of the colonies of Qing" as User 98.119.158.59 suggested. User 98.119.158.59, please don't push your biased view.--207.112.90.79 (talk) 00:35, 8 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tibetan Buddhism

Finally I have become skilled enough to do it. I've changed the template to the way I desired all along saffron writing inscribed on the burgundy. Now it has been properly Tibetanized! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 21:11, 13 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thankyou buddy!! I love the barnstar. Awesome!! I wish I had more time to spend solely on Tibet and Central Asian topics but there is so much to do!! I'll definately me trying to expand the coverage of monasteries there in modern day Qinghai and Sichuan!! There is stacks missing!! Yes I'm happy with the colours now it just looks right doesn't it!! My very best regards! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 09:22, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You may not have noticed but thanks to your cabin stoway article I expanded the article on Saint-Gilles-Croix-de-Vie and it is currently on the main page! Dr. Blofeld ^{White cat} 15:12, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Congratulations on getting the article to the main page! Thanks for pointing it out. I am amazed at how our paths cross on so many seemingly abstruse subjects!

I was just having look at it all and realised I must expand the very brief article on Narcisse Pelletier. I have been following his fascinating story for several years now and have all the main sources in English and French available here. It is just a matter of time and energy. Will try to get to it soon. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 22:50, 14 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Kushan Empire

Note: I have just moved this whole section begun by User:Dewan357 on 17th August from the top of the page to the bottom, where it belongs, as it is the most recent exchange here. John Hill (talk) 07:45, 20 August 2009 (UTC) .............................................................[reply]

Why have you erased the texts in the Kushan Empire. I gave good reference and it was well researched.(Dewan 23:12, 17 August 2009 (UTC))

Ok my bad! That makes sense. I thought you were a vandal so I undid it!(Dewan 23:28, 17 August 2009 (UTC))

No problem bro! I think it is good how it is right now. (Dewan 01:27, 18 August 2009 (UTC))

What up man! I did some reasearch and see if these claims are good enough for the beginning of the article:

The Kushan Empire (c. 1st–3rd centuries) of Ancient India^[1] originally formed in Bactria on either side of the middle course of the Oxus River or Syr Darya in what is now northern Afghanistan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan. The people were nomadic and slowly took over the Scythian lands and founded their own kingdom based from Afghanistan before considerably expanding into the gangetic plains. The Kushan warriors were assimilated into Indian society as Kshatriyas.

The Kushans controlled a critical part of the legendary Silk Road and was the crucible in trade between India, Persia, China, and Rome. The Kushanas were patrons of Gandharan art as well as Sanskrit literature. They initiated a new era called Shaka in 78 AD, and their calendar was formally recognized by India for civil purposes starting on March 22, 1957. They lost considerable amount of lands in central Asia in conflict with the Sassanid Empire who set up the Kushanshahs, and then in the gangetic plain to the rising Gupta Empire. (Dewan 02:14, 20 August 2009 (UTC))

Reply to User:Dewan357

Dear Dewan: I am sorry, but I hardly know where to begin discussing all the matters you have raised. I will do my best here and then add copies of this correspondence to the Discussion page for the article on the Kushan Empire where I think it belongs, as it may be of interest to others contributing to that article.

Now, you have given above a proposed revision of the first two paragraphs of the article and asked me to "see if these claims are good enough for the beginning of the article".

Unfortunately, I am not at all happy with either the existing opening paragraphs of the article, or your suggested changes. I believe the opening should be brief, factual and provide a concise overview of the subject.

Now, first of all, the Kushan Empire at its height not only controlled large areas of the northern regions of the Indian subcontinent, but also much of what is now Afghanistan, southern Uzbekistan, Tajikistan and, perhaps at times, even parts of the southern and western portions of the Tarim Basin. It should, therefore, NOT be referred to as "The Kushan Empire (c. 1st–3rd centuries) of Ancient India. . ." This is misleading and implies that it was an Indian empire rather than an empire that included part of the Indian subcontinent.

Next, you state that the Kushans were nomadic - this is not at all certain. The Da Yuezhi of the Chinese histories are said to have been originally nomadic, one must remember that by the time of the rise of the Kushans in the early 1st century CE, they had spent well over a century living in the highly urbanised area of ancient Bactria and were likely to no longer have been mainly nomadic. Moreover, as I believe I pointed out earlier, the nature of the connection between the Da Yuezhi and the Kushans is still hotly disputed between scholars.

Dewan, I have been studying the history of the Kushan Empire since 1979 and I still cannot say with any confidence who the Kushans really were. They MAY have been descendants of the Da Yuezhi, but equally they could have been a local tribe or group already present in the region before the arrival of the Da Yuezhi, or they could have been a remnant of the Greeks and Da Yuezhi mixed with local populations, or, indeed, some other group - we just don't know. I am about to publish a book soon, Through the Jade Gate to Rome which translates and examines the chapter in the Hou Hanshu dealing with the so-called "Western Regions" which included the Kushan Empire. It contains the most detailed historical account still extant on this subject. I originally had a long appendix in it on the possible origins, language(s) and connections of the Da Yuezhi and the Kushans, but removed it all at the last moment as, really, it was impossible to come to any definite conclusions, and new theories are being proposed all the time. So, in a general article such as this I think one should be very careful to not jump to (poorly founded) conclusions. Rather, I think it is important to point out the uncertainty that exists amongst scholars and, perhaps, to briefly outline one or two of the main theories (with proper qualifications and references, of course).

Next, you claim: "The Kushan warriors were assimilated into Indian society as Kshatriyas." As far as I know this is pure speculation. Of course, it is very possible, even likely, that some Kushan warriors were so assimilated - but we have no evidence for it. Also, we must remember that some of them probably stayed in the region of ancient Bactria, and were never accepted into Hindu society, while others again probably became Buddhist (and, therefore, did not join any caste). It is also likely that Kushan "warriors" mixed with women of various tribes and castes (as did later conquerors such as the British), and so their descendants would not have retained their initial acceptance as Kshatriayas. Moreover, you give three footnotes for this statement: 1. http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Kshatriya which only makes one very brief reference to the Kushans with no evidence provided and, therefore, cannot be accepted as a reliable reference, 2. http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Kshatriya - which is really just slightly edited "mirror" of the Wikipedia article on Kshatriyas, and therefore not accepted as a valid reference in Wikipedia, and 3. http://www.docstoc.com/docs/6282655/Kshatriya which lists a downloadable pdf file but I cannot seem to register (every Username I enter is refused as "invalid"), so I cannot tell whether this file has any worthwhile information. These cannot be accepted as valid, authoritative references and, therefore, should be removed.

Dewan, I have already discussed at length why the Shaka era cannot be confidently attributed to the Kushans - I do not wish to repeat myself here. Also, the second paragraph of the article is hardly the place to discuss such a contentious subject and the Kushans' patronage of art and literature is briefly discussed later in the article and hardly needs repeating here. This section should probably be expanded and references to articles on Gandharan art, etc. made

Finally, the sentence: "The Kushans controlled a critical part of the legendary Silk Road and was the crucible in trade between India, Persia, China, and Rome" brings up a valid and important point - that the Kushan Empire sat astride the main overland trade routes, thus giving the Kushans considerable control (and, one assumes, the ability to enrich themselves by taxing the caravans). However, it is grammatically very poor and, I think, deserves to discussed more fully and clearly in a separate section of the article.

I am sorry to sound so negative, but that is how I feel about your suggestions and so I thought it better to speak plainly rather than to try just to be polite. In fact, I think this article needs major revision - particularly the opening paragraphs, and all the references should be checked to make sure they refer to reliable sources - not just websites containing dubious, secondhand information. Yours sincerely, John Hill (talk) 09:23, 20 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello!!

Hello there John!! Himalayan Explorer 12:44, 23 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, it would seem some people might think otherwise... Anyway, much happier with my new name. I will still be starting new content but not enmasse at once like before. I will try to make new articles good stubs or start class if possible. Well we've hit 3 million and it suddenly seems a lot of important articles are still very poor, my energy would probably be best targetted at improving them or starting decent new content. Himalayan Explorer 13:00, 23 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good! There are myriads of articles crying for help. Anyway, I for one am glad all those stubs are there now - they are a reminder of what needs to be done and give one a start - and I come across one every now and again by surprise which really gets me out of my shell. Biggest thanks from me (forget the rest - they will probably withdraw back into their lairs now and wait for some new innocent soul to wander along within biting range. You did it - but now is a good time for contemplation and reconstruction. To tell the truth - I prefer the research to anything - writing it all up is sometimes a bit of a chore when I'm climbing out along some slender branch of my imagination and eager to see just that little bit further.John Hill (talk) 13:38, 23 August 2009 (UTC) PS Tashilhunpo still needs a hand - my poor rushing monks are going to lose the tops of their funky yellow hats soon to the printed word unless you can help them out.[reply]

Jetsunma Ahkon Lhamo article from last year

John, I'm going through and cleaning up the mess I made of Jetsunma's article. I wasn't straight with you guys, though my spin-doctoring against Jetsunma was pretty obvious to the Wiki community I'm sure. I did not have scholarly integrity in how I wrote the article about Jetsunma, cherry-picking negative information to put together as negative a picture as possible -- even more negative than the most critical materials out there. I knew what to use because I was one of the main sources on the book, The Buddha From Brooklyn, which is major conflict of interest as well (especially since I didn't admit my involvement and presented myself as an outside party and then used that book extensively for the article). In fact, my real name is Michelle Grissom, formerly known as Ani Dechen, and am actually a student who broke with Jetsunma in 1996. I was one of the main reasons the book was so slanted against Jetsunma. I was not honest in that book either, slanting information exactly the same way I did here on Wikipedia: I used things that weren't really a problem for me because I knew they would upset non-Buddhists. Describing a confrontation where -- after 8 years of my rebelling against the monastic community and my breaking my monastic vows -- she yelled at me and swatted me once, I called it a "beating," simply because the police term for any kind physical contact is battery. I swept my own behavior that led to this under the rug. Jetsunma has been divorced several times, to men who either were or later became her students, and I used that in the article to make her look like she was sleeping her way through her students. I also used the generosity of her students as a way to paint her as being very greedy, even though she's never even asked for a salary, and blamed her for the ongoing struggle to build a monastery, even though the main reason the monastery hasn't been built is that the land bought for it doesn't perk. I've taken all the spin-doctoring out of the article and I am very, very sorry I abused Wiki for my own personal vendetta. Longchenpa (talk) 16:39, 23 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lewis Roberts

Hello John Hill, some days ago I answered to your notice on my page in commons with a little request.

Another theme:

Can you complete the 81 plates by Lewis Roberts?

File:LR053 72dpi Malaxis xanthochila.jpg (licence)

LR039_Grastidium cancroides (missing)

LR040_Grastidium tozerense (missing)

LR075_Taeniophyllum malianum (missing)

It would be nice, if the work is complete. Thanks and greetings. Orchi (talk) 13:55, 29 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi again! Thank you so much for pointing out that the license information for the Malaxis xanthochila image was missing and also that I had somehow missed uploading three more images. It is most kind of you. I have just tried to fix the licensing and uploaded the other three images. I wonder if you could please, when you can spare the time, check them to see if I have done them correctly (I am not as confident on Wikimedia Commons as I am on Wikipedia). Thank you once again for spotting these deficiencies and letting me know about them - I really appreciate the help. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 22:15, 29 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello John Hill, thanks for the quick uploading of the missing pictures. So the gallery and the category in commons is complete in the moment. Thanks and regards to the artist and botanist also. Greetings. Orchi (talk) 20:42, 30 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protection

The IPs being used are from a college, so blocking them would cause significant collateral damage, which we would like to avoid. I have semi-protected the article for the week. -- Avi (talk) 23:13, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, he hasn't edited the article since he was blocked, nor an as IP, so I do not think there will be an edit war, at least for a week. -- Avi (talk) 01:18, 1 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File permission problem with File:Zheng He's tomb, Nanjing.jpg

File Copyright problem

Thanks for uploading File:Zheng He's tomb, Nanjing.jpg. I noticed that while you provided a valid copyright licensing tag, there is no proof that the creator of the file agreed to license it under the given license.

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make a note permitting reuse under the CC-BY-SA or another acceptable free license (see this list) at the site of the original publication; or
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Talkback

Hello, John Hill. You have new messages at Talk:Kushan Empire.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

119.152.247.183 (talk) 17:11, 1 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello!

Yes everything is fine, I've settled into my new account well and I like it. You may be interested in a recent article I wrote about the "Black Chopin", check out Ludovic Lamothe. Himalayan 11:33, 2 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK that according to ancient Tibetan annals, the founder of the Tibetan Empire, Songtsän Gampo, is believed to buried at the Valley of the Kings in modern day Qonggyai County?

Hey know anything about this? Any photos? I thought he interred at Jokhang? not according to the Tibetan annals.. Himalayan 14:56, 8 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I also discovered 867 new Tibet/western China images on flickr. All of them can be uploaded. Himalayan 18:15, 8 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please help me upload these AWESOME images from here into the commons. All of them have the same licensing as the photo given on the right, so can be copied and uploaded. Himalayan 18:24, 8 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Another request! I've recently started an article on Pabonka Hermitage. Can you help expand perhaps we can go for a DYK together? Himalayan 19:32, 8 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Eat and sleep? Funnily enough between the 1st and 5th of September I barely edited and some days only here about 10 minutes! Some days, especially if the weather is particularly bad though I can get a lot done!

Right, uploading is very easy although at first a little irritating. All you have to do is copy and paste this. Make sure you click on edit on this page to you can copy the parameters. For source just copy and paste the url in of the actual photo on flickr and add a relevant category and tweak the date of original picture taken. The best way is to copy and paste the parameters and when you come to upload to skirt having to do it individually just quickly add a letter in the reuired parameters then quickly upload and over paste the following into the image description. By this I mean see this. Where the fields are on the uploading form skirt it by very quickly adding a letter to each of them and quickly upload. Then copy and paste the parameters above the initial upload form. Obviously all you have to do is find the image saved on your pictures and destination file name should show up naturally when you save the pic on flickr into your computer and upload to the commons. Then when you upload the next pic copy and paste the url of the flickr image again and add it to the source, copy and paste the whole parameters again and upload another one etc. Understand?

Summary

File information
Description	English: Wherever or what the picture is briefly, e.g Kumbum Monastery, Dechuan County, Qinghai, China
Source	Flickr
Date	September 13, 2008
Author	Reurinkjan
Permission (Reusing this file)	See below.

Licensing

This work is licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution 2.0 License.

This template should only be used on file pages.

Hello?

Hi John. Are you there? I have a question.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 07:01, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Don't worry about it.--^{The Legendary}_{Sky Attacker} 07:11, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dewan?

Hi I think hes back evading a block with sock ips [7] 86.156.208.95 (talk) 12:22, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Tawang Monastery

On September 10, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Tawang Monastery, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page _{(here's how)} and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Wikiproject: Did you know? 11:21, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Sri Lankan buddhists in Austrailia

Hi John how are you doing? After a while, isn't it? I came across an interesting piece of information in Buddhism in Australia article reading,

The first Sinhalese Buddhists from Sri Lanka arrived in 1870 to work in sugarcane plantations. A community was believed to exist on Thursday Island in 1876. In 1882, a group of 500 left Colombo for Queensland, mostly in Mackay.

I didn't knew people from Sri Lanka migrated there as early as 1870. It is the popular belief that Sinhalese people didn't migrate overseas (unlike Non-resident Indian and Person of Indian Origin) for work except a little number of people going to Singapore to work in railway construction, if I recollect correctly. I was amused to hear that there were some Sri Lankan migrants in Mackay. Can you possibly say what has happened to them? Are there any information about them now? However nice talk to you again. Regards!--Chanaka L (talk) 03:48, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks John for the quick response. Your reference explains it all. Only few of the descendants of original settlers still live. Keep your nice Tibetan Buddhism work up. Catcha later--Chanaka L (talk) 04:26, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please do visit our little island. I will keep in touch. Regards!--Chanaka L (talk) 04:36, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hello!

Thanks, yes it is definately good to see such interesting articles on the main page! I just wish it would encourage more people to edit wikipedia and help us. You may also be interested in seeing Culture of Tunisia which I transwikied from French wikipedia but probably needs copyediting and Naqa, an ancient city in Sudan which I expanded from a one line stub this morning! you know I had always intended to focus on quality but so much work needed doing just starting stubs on article we should have it left me with less time to actually write proper articles on them! Himalayan 14:09, 14 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Your help is much appreciated. Himalayan 15:52, 14 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tibetan Annals!! Well done!! Finally it has been started!! Himalayan 11:30, 16 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Mediation Cabal Case

Hello! Thank you for your fine editing. I have recently offered to mediate the discussion regarding Donghu, as listed on WP:MEDCAB by User:John Hill. I would appreciate your opinions if you have the time, as it is a subject you are obviously well-versed in. —Matheuler 17:29, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Image detail missing

Can you please fill out the missing details in the information box of File:Zheng He's tomb, Nanjing.jpg? Thanks ww2censor (talk) 18:10, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for adding but the description should be a description of the image. Otherwise it looks ok. ww2censor (talk) 23:57, 17 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I refined your description edit. Cheers ww2censor (talk) 02:16, 18 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much for your kind assistance. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 03:05, 18 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

B S Dhillon

Hi John, I noticed you mentioned Nijjars book. Have you seen "History and Study of the Jats by BS Dhillon", which is in the same vein. A lot of unsubstantiated claims, and half quotes. Best Wishes.--Sikh-History 14:28, 18 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File:Milarepa, Pango Chorten, Gyantse .JPG

Hi, there's an OTRS ticket, #2009091910010001, about your Commons:File:Milarepa, Pango Chorten, Gyantse .JPG. It says: "please note the first photo of Milarepa painting is reversed. The hand should be to the right ear..not left. The painting I am sure is correct, but reversed on your internet presentation. Please note other presentations which are correct, same page. It is an insult to this famous Saint of Tibet. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milarepa".

Could you check whether the image is indeed mirror-reversed? Thanks, Sandstein 09:45, 19 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! Yes, it does seem a bit strange at first that he has his left hand up - the usual portrayal is with the right hand to his right ear. Anyway, I had a look through my old photos tonight and all the other ones that I can check from that roll seem to be correctly orientated, so I assume this one is too. My wife says she remembers remarking on the unusual portrayal at the time - but this was many yearsa ago now and I must admit I cannot remember.

I have also been looking through numerous other portrayals of Milarepa in my library and on the internet tonight and have so far only found two others portraying him with his left hand up. They may be rare, but at least they do seem to exist. These two images may be accessed at: http://www.kagyu-asia.com/lineage/milarepa_life/milarepa_m1_2.jpg and http://images.google.com.au/imgres?imgurl=http://www.tengyeling.ca/images/milarepa.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.tengyeling.ca/links.htm&usg=__reCXBXc9bn3vvhLoQb4ZOUc-z8U=&h=133&w=131&sz=7&hl=en&start=441&sig2=cUKZpCowZwfiKcA67dlyFQ&um=1&tbnid=eGRZ2TLUXsdMrM:&tbnh=92&tbnw=91&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dmilarepa%2Bimages%26ndsp%3D18%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26start%3D432%26um%3D1&ei=e7-0SpT9FIqKtAP2t_HRDA

I think it is a bit much to suggest it is an insult to show him with his hand up to his left ear (it certainly was not deliberate on my part and I doubt, from what I have read of Milarepa, that he would have been offended) and, aside from returning to Gyantse to check, I don't really know what to do. If I can contact a friend of mine who is a very well-known Tibetan painter, I will ask him his opinion about the iconographic implications (if any). Hope this is of some help. Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 11:45, 19 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you very much for checking! I guess that's it, then; I'll direct the submitter of that ticket to your response if he follows up. Best, Sandstein 13:45, 19 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Buddhist monasteries in Ladakh

Hi. Just to let you know I've created this template, if we could aim to get them all onto here osmetime, probably many are missing but those are the ones I know of. Most of them are called ... Gompa on the web... I started three of them a while back and noticed you had started one or two too.. Takthok looks stunning!

P.S. I've come across a place in Lhasa in my guidebook called "Chomoling". It is supposed to be one of the four ling royal monasteries of Lhasa, including Muru Ningba Monastery which I started a while back and you fleshed out! Do you have any info on this. The guide says it is west of the tent factory and is "the tallest building in Old Lhasa". However a google search only turns up a nunnery which is part of Rizong Monastery in Ladakh! Himalayan 09:42, 20 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Oi! Do you have any info about Trimön. I'm nominating for a DYK. Himalayan 11:39, 21 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

OK, start Chomoling then!! I only have a brief few lines. Himalayan 11:15, 22 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your kind words. I've started Tromzikhang on Barkhor Street. Heard of it? Really long building... Himalayan 11:14, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Grrr, I'm struggling to find enough info for a DYK. I've tried to find a picture there are tons of images of markets in Barkhor on flickr but not one of this building! I have a 670 page book on China I'm borrowing from my sister at the moment but it is only a travel guide... Himalayan 11:54, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I worked out the coordinates see this, you'll see the long building jsut above the cross. Himalayan 12:57, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

110 AD earthquake

Hi John,

I was interested by the earthquake that you added to the Historical earthquakes page. I can't seem to get hold of the original Times report. I know its title, 'City that sank sheds light on a lost empire' and I even found a link to the timesonline page, but unfortunately that no longer works. There is also apparently a report in the Shenzhen Daily from earlier that year, but the online availability of that paper starts in October 2001 and links on other sites to earlier issues no longer work. I was wondering if you had access to the original times report and can confirm that it matches the section in this source [8] (Section 13.6). If it does, that gives me a reason to add the link to the page. Thanks, Mikenorton (talk) 09:08, 26 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Mike! Yes, those are direct quotes from the articles which I included in my draft annotated translation of the Weilüe at [9]. Unfortunately, it seems that both links I gave there have gone dead in the meantime - thanks for pointing this out. Would you mind making the link? It would be nice if someone else did it. Many thanks, John Hill (talk) 10:40, 26 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wow, I had no idea that you were responsible for the annotated translation. I'm very happy to add a link to it. Maybe an academic publication will appear on this one day, must have been one hell of an earthquake. Cheers, Mikenorton (talk) 10:59, 26 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No problem, I like digging out stuff on old earthquakes. I'll keep my eyes open as well, Cheers, Mikenorton (talk) 10:46, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Donghu

You're busy on Donghu and I don't want to get in the way. In one of your edits could you fix the broken [[Yuezhi] link? (That's the way it appears now - missing the second ']') Shenme (talk) 05:38, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for pointing this out - I may well have missed it. I removed all the brackets around that occurrence of Yuezhi as the name appears above properly linked. Thanks and cheers, John Hill (talk) 06:13, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Tibetan Annals

On September 27, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Tibetan Annals, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page _{(here's how)} and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Gatoclass (talk) 08:28, 27 September 2009 (UTC) 12:42, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Congratulations!!! Himalayan 12:43, 27 September 2009 (UTC) I'll be brewing an article about Tibetan beer next... which is quite uniqie given that it is supposed to be forbidden amongst Tibetan Buddhists.... Himalayan 14:46, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is really quite a sad article actually as it shows the corrupting influence the Chinese and western society is having on the Tibetans. Personally I;d rather see them retain their prohibitive beliefs, really makes me sad to think what the Chinese are doing to this beautiful country. The article nonetheless is relevant but it is a sad indicator of the modern changes in Tibet.. Himalayan 16:52, 27 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Urgh, Could you correct the article then, the background section particularly, it is supposed to be prohibited yet the monks widely consume chhaang, that's confusing!! You have a better knowledge about it than I do, I don't want the article to be inaccurate, I can imagine light beers being sold in some towns but I couldn't find any evidence that beer was being massed produced in Tibet itself before the 80s. I am aware of Chhaang but I wouldn't call that factory beer consumption" as such, it is made domestically I believe? Himalayan 09:58, 28 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. thanks for uploading those photos! Himalayan 10:06, 28 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nyalam sign. LOL!! Himalayan 12:12, 29 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Some new requests. Can you check Likir Monastery. I believe the volumes mentioned in it mean the Kanjur and Tengjur but I need you to verify it. Also, I think we should have articles about the kings of Ladakh.. Himalayan 20:18, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! I stubbed Takthok Monastery yesterday, have you any mentioning of it? Thanks for your great help with the Likir Monastery article, looks really good now! Thanks! Himalayan 09:07, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your help, I've sent out some image requests on flickr. I've also started Template:Infobox Tibetan Buddhist monastery. I've made a proposal, if you have any further ideas please let me know on the template talk page. Once made we can merge the translation boxes and cleanup the articles by having a single box for tibetan buddhist monastery! Himalayan 16:40, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

And more for us to feast on, Diskit Monastery, Phyang Monastery and Matho Monastery. Wow what a spectacle! That'll do for a few days.. Himalayan 17:21, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wow!! Now you have been busy too! Excellent work my dear friend! Hopefully I can find some images... Himalayan 14:29, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've also started a series on the kings of the Malla Dynasty of Nepal. I started Jitamitra Malla yesterday using the 1877 book I have but it is hard to read!! In due course I will get these rulers started on here... Himalayan 15:03, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'm fascinated with Ladakh at the moment and its connections with the Silk Road. I've just started Sengge Namgyal, much needed article but as yet we have no articles about the Ladakhi kings either!! Once there monasteries are started I will be trying to start articles on all of the Ladahki and Nepalese kings. We should have articles about them don't you think? Next on the agenda is Shey Palace and Basgo Monastery. Can you expand the Sengge article? Do you know where we can find all of the kings of Ladakh like we have for Nepal? Himalayan 20:23, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've made a rather poor attempt to start listing the Ladakhi kings from the 7th century to present!! Template:Rulers of Ladakh. I've listed so far what I found in the Ladakhi Chronicles not sure if transliterations are correct... What we need is a comprehensive list of rulers from ancient to present and dates or approximate dates of rule... Can you document any more? I've found Ladakhi Chronicles, maybe this will help? Himalayan 21:03, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sooo happyyyyy. I found an A-Z index of the Ladakhi chronicles from pages 283 to 309. It lists a wealth of topics related to the history and that. Awesome! This means I can get several hundred missing articles related to Ladakh and Indian Tibet onto here. There also seems to be much talk of a kingdom of Tibet called Kulu. Kulu (Tibet) I'll see if I can conjure something up, the chronicles mentions several of its kings.. Himalayan 21:24, 9 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wow that's interesting about the Kullu Valley. There is a lot of mention in that book you have including rulers of the area, the article is very lacking at the moment!! My best wishes to the family... Himalayan 08:55, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

One thing, sources for Lhachen Gyalpo says he was the fifth king of Ladakh not Utpala.... Himalayan 10:11, 11 October 2009 (UTC) Good idea.... Perhaps though you could also make a list of kings on that page?? Himalayan 10:00, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wonderful, I love having somebody like you on here who feels the same way as I do about Central Asia! Himalayan 11:36, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Halloween reply

There are some suggestions on the DYK Halloween page. When does Trinidad celebrate horror? If you add the word "horror" or "dracula" etc to your favourite subjects and fire them into google then do you find an unwritten article? Just ideas... surprise us Victuallers (talk) 22:14, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

More on Barkhor

Hey I just saw your bar image from Lhasa, I love that model of the Potala! Wouldn't it be great to have a model of the Potala in your home!! More on Barkhor. Where Tromzhikang was nearer Jokhang there is a small chapel called Jamkhang which has a 30 foot statue of Maitreya. It was built in the 15th century. That is all I have. Do you think it is worth starting the article? There is some pictures on flickr but they are copyrighted. Himalayan 22:45, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent. Hey check out Tashilhunpo. Finally we have the monastery infobox I desired!! I'll be adding this to out Tibetan Buddhist monasteries over the next few days. Should help clean them up. Himalayan 11:37, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wow that's old! What do you think of Template:Infobox Tibetan Buddhist monastery? Himalayan 11:57, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

HI. I wondered if you could list the colleges of Sera in the new infobox here. Himalayan 15:45, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

New infobox looks good on Mongolian monasteries like Gandantegchinlen Monastery and Amarbayasgalant Monastery too! Himalayan 17:18, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The infoboxes look absolutely fabulous, my friend. Wonderful work once again! I will try to deal with your request re the colleges of Sera (which should not be too difficult) tomorrow if I can (I have been up almost all night with pain) and here, at 4.15 in the morning I am trying to settle a dispute on the Donghu. I may be too tired later - but, if so will get back to it soon I hope. Now I better try to finish what I was doing before I fall asleep. All best from me, John Hill (talk) 18:17, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

OK, there is just so much to do!! Sheesh! I've managed to fix us a Tibet locator map but its only works for area sin the centre, luckily it works for Lhasa so the Potala Palace and the othershas a Tibet locator, I also created a gold temple stupa for the locator marker instead of a big red blob!!.... Sorry to hear you are still in pain. May you feel at peace. Himalayan 19:54, 13 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

File:Mesney stamps 1992 lo-res.jpg listed for deletion

An image or media file that you uploaded or altered, File:Mesney stamps 1992 lo-res.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for deletion. Please see the discussion to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. ww2censor (talk) 16:32, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Takthok Monastery

On October 14, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Takthok Monastery, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page _{(here's how)} and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Thank you - have a rest! Lots of time to get a Halloween hook Victuallers (talk) 21:28, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Portals

Hi John. Can you please not add these templates at the bottom of less generic articles like you did to Bardan Monastery. It is unnecessary I think. If people want to know about all of the main concepts they can click the Buddhism article - the templates are linked. Even the use of the Tibetan Buddhism template in some articles is inappropriate. It is good to connect articles together but I think 3 or 4 footer templates at the bottom of pages doesn't look good, why for instance would I want to read about Bardan Monastery and then about Indian atheism. I mean I might but I don't see a need for adding them to non main articles. Himalayan 11:29, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, if you feel that the templates are all necessary, you can reduce the clutter for them by adding a cluster group template as shown below. My personal feeling though is that unless the footer template connects actual articles to that given subject and doesn't exclude any that that is the best way to have them. I feel the same way about the aviation template which is by far the worst culprit of generic template usage on wiki. For instance if I'm reading about a Soviet plane of the 1930s I would rather have a template linking together other Soviet aircraft of that period not a generic template on all topic related to Aviation, some of them annoyingly generic.... I'm sure you know what I mean.... Best regards.

Himalayan 12:00, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've responded to your email.. Himalayan 12:18, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I look forward to getting it in the morning (it hasn't arrived yet). And thanks for all your sensible suggestions and help. I have already reduced some of my over-prolific use of portal boxes - will try to get more tomorrow. For now, goodnight from Down Under. Best, John Hill (talk) 12:23, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tibet

Your input is needed in the conflict a the bottom of Talk:Tibet. Please set the record straight... Thanks. Himalayan 18:24, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Monastery templates

Right... I've been busy this evening sorting out templates, I find that many often get exluded from templates and are difficult to find. I want them all easily found in a given area and eventually brought up to good status,. One would dream of having over 3000 articles about Tibetan Buddhist monasteries including those which were destroyed eventually!!

Anyway if you know of any missing please add them:

‎

They look a bit horrid together but OK individually! What we can do about Ladakh is maybe create a template for Buddhist monasteries in Jammu Kashmir, and include those which lay just outside in Zanskar etc. Sound good? Himalayan 21:34, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Book looks promising, very exciting indeed. I was going to create a template for Gansu too for Labrang Monastery but I couldn't find any others. Is it worth creating one? I've added Nepal and Mongolia... We have Template:Buddhist monasteries in Himachal Pradesh although intuition tells me there are likely many more... P.S. fantastic work on Tawang Monastery! Sometime we'll have to start the gompas/hermitages of this monastery is is fabulous! I'd say Rigyalling and Taktsang are maybe part of it... I'll continue with the Jammu monasteries and link them all together and start a few. I also wanted to start Urgelling Monastery, the birth place of course of the naughty 6th Dalai Lama! Himalayan 21:58, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for clarifying on the Tibet talk page. I've added an infobox to Sakya Monastery amongst others but I am unsure if it is still Sakya as it says Gelug in the article but I'm pretty sure it is the seat of the Sakya lineage which continues in exile today. Aside from Sakya, I can't believe we are missing Rakya Monastery, both Frenh and German wiki have an article on it... I've made a templae for monasteries in Tibet, I think I will order by prefecture, I did consider by sect but I think it will probably be easier to think of them in terms of location. Himalayan 10:44, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for that. I've finished ordering the monasteries by prefecture. The confusing thing I find is the contradictions between past and present, that a monastery was in former Tibean territory but is in present day Sichuan or Qinghai and do we categorize and template it as Tibet or not.. Especially if the article (like a lot of the stubs we have) don't actually say where it is it involves detective work to find out where it is. One confusing one is Tsozong Gongba Monastery which by location appears to be in the Ngari Prefecture yet the Assam Himalaya as location makes this confusing.. Himalayan 11:49, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Another error.. Bangxing is obviously not in the Shigatse prefecture. Google search and location indicates it is in Mêdog County, Nyingtri Prefecture. I wonder why this was placed in the Shigatse prefecture and referenced...? Himalayan 12:10, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ah I figured out what you meant about Stongde. I've started Stongdey Monastery, Namgyal Tsemo Monastery , Stok Monastery, Stakna Monastery, Spituk Monastery ‎and Shanti Stupa‎ ready for expansion! Check out the thankgka I found on flickr of Stakna! Should Tonde Monastery be included in the Stongdey article? Himalayan 15:08, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Congrats

Congratulations on the publication of your new book. I checked Amazon (US) for Through the Jade Gate to Rome, but the only listing is a bibliography reference in Beckwith 2009. I look forward to reading your work. Best wishes, Keahapana (talk) 19:17, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks so much! It certainly is a great feeling finally getting it out there into the world! It should be available on Amazon in 2 weeks at the latest. Retail price is to be $39.99 in the U.S. All best wishes, John Hill (talk)

Congratulations!!! Himalayan 11:44, 22 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

		The Book writer's Barnstar
		Congratulations John for being able to combine fantastic work on Wikipedia with real-world publishing! I will be one of the first to purchase your new book Through the Jade Gate to Rome on Amazon!! PHG ^{Per Honor et Gloria} 20:20, 22 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am truly honoured!

Thank you so very much for the "Book writer's Barnstar". I am truly honoured - especially as it comes from you, PHG - one of the true giants and heros of the Wikipedia! What a welcome and wonderful surprise to find on my Talk page!

I am so excited to have the book out in print after all these (30) years - I can hardly believe it has happened. It is already listed on www.Abebooks.com but I expect it will be on Amazon.com sometime next week (and they usually have cheaper shipping rates). The retail price is US$ 39.99.

May I take this opportunity of thanking you once again for your innumerable superb contributions to the common pool of knowledge that is the Wikipedia. You are truly a great inspiration to us all. All my very best wishes, John Hill (talk) 16:23, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you so much for your message John, and congratulations again!!! PHG ^{Per Honor et Gloria} 18:53, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Lhasa Zhol Pillar

On October 21, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Lhasa Zhol Pillar, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page _{(here's how)} and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Bencherlite ^Talk 05:42, 21 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Sani Monastery

On October 25, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Sani Monastery, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page _{(here's how)} and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Royal broil 07:07, 25 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

the last words of Dalai Lama XIII

Hi, I happen to find a speech of Dalai Lama XIII in 1932[10] and I don't know if it is the same as your quotation in the article "Tibet". I suppose not because they almost have nothing in commun. Regards--LaGrandefr (talk) 16:36, 25 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! Both these statements come from the same document which is usually referred to as The Prophecies of the Great Thirteenth, but from different parts of it. The passage I quoted is a statement of what he had done in regards to declaring Tibet to be independant. The more prophetic portions of the statement come later in the piece. An excellent translation into English of the whole document can be found in Glenn H. Mullin's book, The Fourteen Dalai Lamas: A Sacred Legacy of Reincarnation (2001). Clear Light Publishers, Santa Fe, New Mexico, pp. 435-440. I suggest you try to find a copy and read the whole thing which is, indeed, of great interest. All best wishes, John Hill (talk) 22:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Portal:Tibet

Oh, I forgot about this. Care to update it with a change of article/fact/pictures? Himalayan 18:24, 27 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I wondered if you could recommend the best book on Ladakh. FOr Christmas, what would be the most detailed book (with lots of beautiful photographs) of Ladakh? Himalayan 18:17, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Probably the best single modern and reasonably priced book on Ladakh in terms of text is: Rizvi, Janet. 1998. Ladakh, Crossroads of High Asia. Oxford University Press. 1st edition 1963. 2nd revised edition 1996. 3rd impression 2001. ISBN 019 564546 4. But, in terms of pictures - I really don't know what to recommend - there are so many - and they are all lovely. Some of the best work has been done by Japanese photographers. I suggest you do a bit of searching at Amazon.com. Sorry I can't be of more help. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 10:45, 30 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

suspicious statement at Tibetan sovereignty debate

Hi, since you asked everybody to maintain vigilance, I have found a somewhat strange statement at Tibetan sovereignty debate. It reads

According to historian Zahiruddin Ahmad, since at least the 18th century, when the Qing Government was setting up its local government structure and promulgated laws for the governing, Beijing has, in the words of a foreign missionary who witnessed, had "absolute dominion over Tibet".

The source given is Zahiruddin Ahmad, Tibet and China 1708-1959.

The problem I have is that it sounds a bit like a paraphrase from Tom Grunfeld's "Making of Modern Tibet", p. 45, i.e. I suspect whoever added this sentence might not have consulted Zahiruddin Ahmad, but only Grunfeld. Additionally, the context given by Grunfeld is quite different, only the time just after 1720 rather than the whole time from the 18th century to 1911. I don't think Zahiruddin Ahmad would claim that there were missionaries who witnessed a representative part of that period from the 18th century to 1911. Also the word "absolute dominion" seems a bit odd when used for the full period. Last not least if the quote is used correctly, it would of course be nice if someone could find out who said this in the first place. The choice should be rather narrow: Ippolito Desideri or some capuchin.

So, should you have access to Zahiruddin Ahmad's original article, it would be cool if you could check out the quote. Regards, Yaan (talk) 16:51, 29 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry - I have never heard of Zahiruddin Ahmad before so I can't really help you, but the quote from him that you give above is demonstrably wrong - Chinese control over Tibet was very tenuous at times, as I have pointed out in many place,. The Tibetans even stationed troops along the borders of China in the late 19th century to prevent incursions and Qing had little influence in Lhasa. Chinese influence tended to wax and wane. "Absolute control" is really stretching things much too far. Have a look at the section on "History and Strategic importance" in the article on Batang Town for starters. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 10:40, 30 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I see. My question was specifically about the quote, since I suspected you might have a better access to literature than I do. My suspicion was someone read the quote in Grunfeld, saw that Grunfeld attributed it to Zahiruddin Ahmad and added it to WP under that other name (plus extrapolated a bit). Zahiruddin Ahmad seems to have written a few books about Tibet which were quite well-received by the academia, so I suspect he wouldn't claim western missionaries witnessed much of what the Qing did in Tibet. Yaan (talk) 19:05, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ordered!

Hi John! I ordered your book online today! Cheers! PHG ^{Per Honor et Gloria} 06:25, 30 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am honoured - I hope you really find things that interest you in it. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 10:35, 30 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please don't give up!

Hello there! I wanted to apologize for the problems that have developed at the Donghu people mediation. User:Alexjhu has started to behave in a counterproductive manner. He has been blocked from editing Wikipedia for legal threats and general incivilities. If he returns, hopefully he will stop acting in such a confrontational manner. I appreciate your contributions to the article, and hope you don't give up on it! Thanks! —Finn Casey * * * 02:28, 31 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

manuscripts of Dunhuang

Dear John,

Could you please help me in understanding the difference and subdivision of three articles concerning Dunhuang? If I state: "two of the Dunhuang manuscripts are 1) Old Tibetan Chronicle and 2) Tibetan Annals", have I made a correct subdivision in this way? I hope you can help; thank you in advance. Best regards, Davin (talk) 17:39, 31 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sure, that would be fine - but do you need to number them? I would be inclined to say something like, "The Old Tibetan Chronicle and the Tibetan Annals were among the vast number of Dunhuang manuscripts recovered by Paul Pelliot and Aurel Stein in the early 20th Century".

The numbers were just to give an accurate example and aren't necessary indeed. It's clear for me now. The matter of fact is that I would like to make a translation of them in Dutch. Thank you for your answer (and for the articles of course). Davin (talk) 08:21, 1 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Turkmenistan

Hi. I've started some articles Tolkuchka Bazaar and M37 highway. I did wonder if any of these had anything to do historically with the silk road trading routes? The m37 of course is the main road running out of Bukhara leading to the Caspian Sea.. Himalayan 15:14, 1 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You may also be interested in Ulug Depe and Ulugh Beg Observatory! Himalayan 21:15, 1 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Explorer! Sorry I have been so uncommunicative. I am sending out thousands (literally) of E-brochures advertising my new book and hardly have time to brush my teeth. As the book is self-published no one else is going to do much advertising for me and anyway, I am trying to target people with a particular interest in Asian history or anything to do with the Silk routes. I had no idea there were so many academics in the world interested in Asia and the Silk routes! It quite boggles the mind and makes the back and fingers very tender. I have had a look at the articles you have been working on above - and I do have quite a lot I could add to them. Its just a matter of time and the frailities of the flesh. Will see what I can do, when I can. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 10:38, 2 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

History Tags

Hi John. Which one of these tags "History of Afghanistan" or "History of Greater Iran" is more relevant and should be added to topics like Drangiana, Balkh, Bactria and Greco-Bactrian Kingdom? You added "History of Afghanistan" tags to all these articles but another user continuously replacing them with "History of Greater Iran" tags. I know this topic was discussed before by other Wikipedians + admins and this is what they came up with Talk:History_of_Afghanistan#History_Template however the user is ignoring that. Any suggestions? Thank you (Ketabtoon (talk) 00:01, 2 November 2009 (UTC))[reply]

Unfortunately, this is one of those arguments which tends to split along nationalist lines on many Wikipedia pages leading often to protracted bitter debates and edit wars, wasting everyone's time and putting everyon in a very negative space. I have no easy answer to these problems except to beg everyone to try to be fair and balanced. It is true that culturally these places can be considered part of the wider sphere of "Greater Iran". But,, equally most of these regions fall under the political entity we call Afghanistan today - and they do have a separte history to Iran as such as well as characteristics and influences from far beyond the Iranic world. Can we not include both views - without one dominating, and discuss the issues in both articles? John Hill (talk) 10:32, 2 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It won't be a problem if we add both of those tags. However, we all know that the most recent tag is the most relevant one. For example once upon a time the British Empire covered half of the world, but we cannot add British History tags. That is the reason why I have asked neutral Wikipedians' (like you and Bejnar) opinion in this case. I am not very old in this Wikipedia, however, user Bejnar mentioned that "by a consensus of neutral editors and administrators that the articles under the various countries listed on the Template:History of Greater Iran should receive templates specific to those countries, and NOT the History of Greater Iran template." [11] Thank you for your time. (Ketabtoon (talk) 13:57, 2 November 2009 (UTC))[reply]

IP 159.91.20.65, 159.91.16.82 and so on

Thanks for noticing the "contributions" of this editor. He is an indefinitley blocked user known as User:Dewan357 (see also User talk:159.91.20.43). Just to let you know. --Neutralpointofyou (talk) 17:04, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi

Hi John! I just received today you book Through the Jade Gate to Rome through Amazon. Quite an amazing and hefty piece of work! Congratulations again! PHG ^{Per Honor et Gloria} 18:49, 13 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi John! How funny! But also how irritating it must have been to discover this right on the cover page! I'm also quite irritated that I hadn't found it myself: 漢 and 漠 do look quite similar when incorporated into a line where the other characters match. I was actually wondering how you managed to compile such complicated and antiquated text as the Hou Hanshu. How did you find all the character sets? Do you own a Chinese computer that has all the ideograms? I'll be glad to keep the copy as it is: the more history a book has, the better! Wonderful reading by the way... Best regards PHG ^{Per Honor et Gloria} 18:28, 16 November 2009 (UTC)　[reply]

Thanks so much for all the kind comments. I really hope you find it a worthwhile addition to your library. Do let me know please if you have any criticisms, suggestions or comments. Cheers, John Hill (talk) 06:04, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lukhangwa

Hello John. Hope book sales are doing well! I was wondering if you knew of Lukhangwa . He has an article on French wiki and I believe he was prime minister of Tibet around the time of the signing of thr 17 point agreement in 1951. Can you check this out? Also I've been cleaning up the counties and beginning to try to fill out some of the place articles. Perhaps you know of Pagri (Phari)? Himalayan 21:00, 16 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Somebody keeps moving the Shannan Prefecture to Lhoka Prefecture. What is your view on this? Himalayan 19:13, 17 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ha ha, now that is a rare occurence! I've finished now anyway all yours. You might also be interested to know that I've expanded the articles on Lhorong County · Lhünzhub County · Damxung County · Nyêmo County · Qüxü County. You may have historical sources which would greatly benefit them as I couldn't make sense of the history in chinese. For some reason economy, geography and demographic info always seems to translate well but history at times is typically illegible! I've also been creating or cleaning up some of the town articles like Qüxü. Perhaps you also have info about Nyêmo Town but I understand you have limited time what with promoting your book and all. Its gonna take a long time though to sort out all the stubs on Tibetan villages and organize them by county and prefecture! At least now google maps have developed so you can actually see the villages rather than the 2007 era maps which only showed the plateau and made you wonder if the settlement was real or not! Himalayan 12:16, 21 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hehe I've been busy today new monastery articles Zangla Monastery, and those in Template:Buddhist monasteries in Himachal Pradesh and Template:Buddhist monasteries in Sikkim! Himalayan 16:12, 21 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How are book sales? Himalayan 17:36, 21 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

GRRR why don't those darned people say WHERE IT ACTUALLY IS. It is getting very frustrating finding image slike this and it just called "Tibet". You know I had to work out which county photos which had point locations on them earlier so I could upload it to the right article. Check out Doilungdêqên County, Haixi Mongol and Tibetan Autonomous Prefecture etc. The source didn't have a single label in them! Himalayan 21:23, 22 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Half the time the photographers would not know where they are - you are lucky they got Tibet right - that's a start - you have to admit! ;^)). The rest of the frustration is probably due to your karmic history which is presenting you with the wonderful opportunity to learn how to practice patience, an important, if not essential, step on the path to Liberation. Patience, humility, dogged perseverance and an openness to to whatever the universe presents you with will undoubtedly help you progress quickly. I also find a little swearing useful at times. :^)) Good luck with it all - you are doing a sterling job which will undoubtedly help bring innumerable beings closer to enlightenment - we do appreciate it. Thanks, my friend.John Hill (talk) 00:00, 23 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Need some help. Doilungdêqên County. Is the main town Doilungdêqên Town (does this exist?) or is it Donggar? Himalayan 21:06, 29 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

DYK for Kursha Monastery

On November 28, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Kursha Monastery, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page _{(here's how)} and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Mifter (talk) 08:36, 28 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

^ http://www.kushan.org/

[1] ttp://www.kushan.org/

[1]

v t e Buddhist monasteries in Tibet
Lhasa	Ani Tsankhung Nunnery Drepung Monastery Drigung Monastery Ganden Monastery Jokhang Kundeling Monastery Muru Nyingba Monastery Namgyal Monastery Nechung Nyethang Drolma Lhakhang Temple Ramoche Temple Reting Monastery Sanga Monastery Taklung Monastery Tsomon Ling Tsurphu Monastery Yangpachen Monastery Yerpa Zhuowaqudeng Monastery Sera Monastery: Chupzang Nunnery Drakri Hermitage Garu Nunnery Keutsang Hermitage Keutsang East Hermitage Khardo Hermitage Negodong Nunnery Nenang Nunnery Pabonka Hermitage Panglung Hermitage Purbuchok Hermitage Rakhadrak Hermitage Sera Chöding Hermitage Sera Gönpasar Hermitage Sera Utsé Hermitage Takten Hermitage Trashi Chöling Hermitage
Lhoka Prefecture	Gongkar Chö Monastery Mindrolling Monastery Samye Tradruk Temple Yungbulakang Palace
Shigatse	Changmoche and Lhatse Chokorgyel Monastery Daklha Gampo Dorje Pakmo Drongtse Monastery Donggar Monastery Garju Monastery Manmogang Monastery Menri Monastery Milarepa's Cave Narthang Monastery Ngor Palcho Monastery Ralung Monastery Rongbuk Monastery Samding Monastery Sakya Monastery Shalu Monastery Shelkar Tashilhunpo Tsi Nesar Tsechen Monastery and Dzong
Ngari Prefecture	Khorzhak Monastery Mangnang Monastery Simbiling Monastery
Chamdo Prefecture and former Kham	Galden Jampaling Monastery Karma Gon Monastery Benchen Monastery Dorje Drak Dzogchen Monastery Dzongsar Monastery Kandze Monastery Katok Monastery Nanwu Si Monastery Palyul Monastery Riwoche Monastery Shechen Monastery Surmang Tongkor Monastery
Nyingchi Prefecture	Buchu Monastery Lamaling Monastery Tsozong Gongba Monastery