Talk:Thrivent

Thrivent was nominated as a Social sciences and society good article, but it did not meet the good article criteria at the time (December 15, 2013). There are suggestions on the review page for improving the article. If you can improve it, please do; it may then be renominated.

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Edits made by the below user(s) were last checked for neutrality on June 29, 2020 by DarthFlappy.

Branka01 (talk · contribs) has been paid by Thrivent on their behalf. [1]

Untitled

Talk

Cleanup

Hello, I just placed two tags at the top of the article; is there any way this can be re-edited or rewritten to sound less like a brochure or a public relations piece? Thanks a lot.Msr69er 01:28, 24 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, I'm with Thrivent Financial for Lutherans. We will be updating the content, but I'm interested to know which parts of the entry you feel relate as advertising. I appreciate your comments. Also, I do have a question on how to edit the logo on the right side of the screen (next to our opening sentences). We have an updated logo that I'd like to add, but can't figure out how to remove the old logo. Any help is appreciated as well. Thank you! TFFL33 17:43, 12 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Please upload the new logo image, and replace the old logo. Contact me (click my talk link), and I will arrange to have the old logo deleted. I uploaded an image of the Thrivent sign from Hwy 41 in Appleton. I didn't know where to start to explain how about how this is a marketing piece, so I did the major cutting myself. References need to be either a website or a periodical (marketing literature would suffice for this purpose). Royalbroil^{Talk Contrib} 04:33, 13 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm wondering if it's ever possible to speak to someone about the parameters around what copy is acceptable or not. I've read all the documentation on the site, but still have questions - mainly about why some feel that our copy was too heavy on what seemed like advertising. Obviously, that's not our perception, but we also don't want to post anything that is not within your framework of rules. we want to do right by the Wikipedia users and it would help tremendously if we could speak to someone over the phone to talk about what is acceptable and what is not, rather than post something we think is fair only to have it altered or removed by someone else. Is that possible? Thank you for your help; I appreciate the clarification! TFFL33 20:44, 31 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I no longer feel that the article is heavy on advertising. Is your question "Why did people feel that they had to edit the article to clean it up?"

I bolded some quotes that were especially bad: Thrivent Financial exists to improve the quality of life of its members, their families, and their communities by providing products, services and resources that focus on financial security, wellness and caring for others, naming a paragraph '"Caring for Others"', "Thrivent Financial for Lutherans builds on its heritage by offering high quality financial products and services and by creating, managing and funding programs and resources that enable its members to demonstrate their care for others" (is extremely POV), no addresses or phone numbers are listed for any company.

Feel free to add referenced statistics that talks about the company's public financials (if you have a book/magazine/website/etc. reference that is available to the public - not internal), number of employees, position in the market, etc.

You can contact me by going to my user page and sending me an email. I commute into the Appleton area, so I could arrange calling you (or vice versa) if you'd like. The main rule is that this is an encyclopedia, so it needs to read like an encyclopedia: Facts and figures. Royalbroil^{Talk Contrib} 22:42, 20 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Images

File:Appleton-Operations.jpg

removed image

I removed this image because I felt that my image of the Appleton location was more flattering. Feel free to switch the two if you disagree.

I have also removed the logo, and replace it with a photograph of the entrance sign which shows the logo. I did this because I think the sign does a fair good job of representing the image, while logos are frowned upon in Wikipedia (if possible don't use one - see WP:LOGO for further explanation). Royalbroil^{Talk Contrib} 23:00, 20 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Clarity needed

What does "largest" mean? Most assets? Most revenue? Most premiums? Largest number of insured?
What programs "foster a sense of community"? 70.134.229.228 (talk) 15:18, 25 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Where's the content?

This is a financial products and services company, right? So where's the description of the financial products and services offered? 70.134.229.228 (talk) 15:38, 25 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Merger proposal

Thrivent Builds with Habitat for Humanity really has no notability apart from its association with Thrivent Financial. The article is an orphan and has considerable overlap with a section in this article. Therefore, it seems appropriate to merge the two articles. 70.134.229.228 (talk) 20:29, 25 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

For The Habitat for Humanity section should be turned into a section on the Thrivent Financial for Lutherans ArticleKDTW Flyer (talk) 03:22, 15 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Done

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Thrivent Financial for Lutherans/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: LT910001 (talk · contribs) 04:32, 6 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

If there are no objections, I'll take this review. I'll note at the outset I've had no role in editing or creating this article. I welcome other editors at any stage to contribute to this review. I will spend a day familiarising myself with the article and then provide an assessment. Kind regards, LT910001 (talk) 04:32, 6 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for waiting. In conducting this review, I will:

Provide an assessment using WP:GARC
If this article does not meet the criteria, explain what areas need improvement.
Provide possible solutions that may (or may not) be used to fix these.

Assessment

Rate	Attribute	Review Comment
1. Well-written:
	1a. the prose is clear, concise, and understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct.	See commentary
	1b. it complies with the Manual of Style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation.
2. Verifiable with no original research:
	2a. it contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline.	See commentary
	2b. reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose).
	2c. it contains no original research.	See commentary
3. Broad in its coverage:
	3a. it addresses the main aspects of the topic.	See commentary
	3b. it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style).
	4. Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each.	See commentary
	5. Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute.
6. Illustrated, if possible, by media such as images, video, or audio:
	6a. media are tagged with their copyright statuses, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content.
	6b. media are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions.	See commentary
	7. Overall assessment.

Commentary

This article has outstanding tags, and an unresolved merge tag. There is an 'expand section' tag indicating this article is not suitably broad.
Several statements in this article are unsourced. Additionally, many sources are from the website of said organisation, which impacts on neutrality (it is the use of these sources, rather than the content from the source itself, which does this). Sources should be secondary sources, meaning that they are are not associated with the thing they are describing.
This article contains a large amount of images of different buildings. I would suggest remove one or two for readability, or place them in a gallery format for readability, but this will not impact on GA promotion.

As it stands, I do not believe this article is ready for GA status. I will be happy to discuss this review and would encourage re-nomination when these issues have been addressed.--LT910001 (talk) 00:36, 7 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Conclusion

It has been a week and no changes have been made to the article or response from the nominee. I would encourage renomination when the above items are addressed. Kind regards, --LT910001 (talk) 06:54, 15 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

More history from "The Fox Heritage"

I found this posted on a forum. Pages 228-229 from the book "The Fox Heritage" (ISBN 9780897810838) which contains more history on Aid Association for Lutherans. [2] Lugevas (talk) 19:23, 29 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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Edit request

This edit request by an editor with a conflict of interest was declined. Some or all of the changes weren't supported by neutral, independent, reliable sources. Consider re-submitting with content based on media, books and scholarly works.

Please change the title of this article from "Thrivent Financial" to "Thrivent" which is the marketing name of Thrivent Financial for Lutherans, source: www.thrivent.com - scroll to the very bottom of the thrivent.com page for verification language.

Please also update the logo on the righthand column to the new logo found here: https://service.thrivent.com/content/faimages/producer/hi/default.jpg Thank you. Branka01 (talk) 02:26, 29 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request

This edit request by an editor with a conflict of interest was declined. Some or all of the changes weren't supported by neutral, independent, reliable sources. Consider re-submitting with content based on media, books and scholarly works.

1. Please update the first mention of "Thrivent Financial" to "Thrivent" in the article's first sentence, as well as in the third sentence starting with "Operating through its local chapters nationwide….", source: https://www.thrivent.com/about-us/our-story/index.html (See disclosure at the very bottom of the page: "Thrivent" is the marketing name for Thrivent Financial for Lutherans…)

2. After this existing sentence: "By the end of 2014, Thrivent made the step toward expanding their target market beyond Lutheran and include United States' 200 million Christians.[6]"

…please add this additional sentence:

In June 2020, the marketing name was again shortened from "Thrivent Financial" to "Thrivent." source: https://www.thrivent.com/about-us/our-story/index.html. (See disclosure at the very bottom of the page: "Thrivent" is the marketing name for Thrivent Financial for Lutherans…)

3. "Outreach" and "Recognition" sections Please update mentions in these sections from "Thrivent Financial" to "Thrivent." source: https://www.thrivent.com/about-us/our-story/index.html. (See disclosure at the very bottom of the page: "Thrivent" is the marketing name for Thrivent Financial for Lutherans…)

Thank you! Branka01 (talk) 20:59, 29 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for requesting edits on the article after declaring your conflict of interest! You have provided link to Primary source. We require information from a reliable secondary source, so please provide a secondary source saying that the marketing name was changed. It could be even by a local newspaper like the Post Crescent, Green Bay Press Gazette, or even better New York Times, Newsweek, etc. This change might require changing the title of the article so it is not made without a reliable source. Please reply by alerting me by starting your edit with the following text: {{ping|Royalbroil}} Royal broil 00:33, 30 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request

@Royalbroil:

This edit request by an editor with a conflict of interest has now been answered.

Thank you, Royalbroil for your response and guidance! There has not yet been coverage of the marketing name change itself in a reliable secondary source. However, Thrivent Financial for Lutherans has commonly been known and trademarked as "Thrivent" for several years. Here are two sources that may be helpful to demonstrate this: 1. The US Patent and Trademark filing: <http://tsdr.uspto.gov/#caseNumber=76324049&caseType=SERIAL_NO&searchType=statusSearch> 2. A recent press release published in MarketWatch. It refers to "Thrivent Financial for Lutherans" at first mention, but then "Thrivent" for the remainder of the article: <https://www.marketwatch.com/press-release/am-best-affirms-credit-ratings-of-thrivent-financial-for-lutherans-2020-06-03>

Please advise on if any additional information would be helpful to make the update from "Thrivent Financial" to "Thrivent" in the title and body of the article, as well as for the request to update the logo. I appreciate your help! Branka01 (talk) 21:40, 8 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Marking as answered... Darth Flappy ^«Talk» 23:00, 18 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Secondary Source for Thrivent Rebrand

@Royalbroil: Here is a secondary source Mentioning the Thrivent rebrand. https://brandactive.com/thrivent-launches-new-brand/

Leafyplant 15:51, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Leafyplant: When I read it, I read that this company is helping Thrivent with rebranding (making them a primary source) "We’re proud to be working with Thrivent and Prophet on implementing the new brand." I would appreciate a third opinion.

What's making the search so difficult is because Thrivent was Thrivent Financial for Lutherans then rebranded as Thrivent Financial then rebranded Thrivent within about 5 years. Royal broil 03:29, 14 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, Here is another one https://www.icmif.org/news/%E2%80%9Cthrive-purpose%E2%80%9D-thrivent-launches-new-brand-reflect-its-fundamental-purpose @Royalbroil: Leafyplant 16:25, 17 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

In my opinion, it is not an independent source. Trivent is a member of this ICMIF organization - "On 1 June 2020, ICMIF member Thrivent (USA)." I have been looking for sources and haven't found anything like an independent newspaper or magazine. A local newspaper in Appleton or Minneapolis would be enough for me. All I see is primary sources. Royal broil 13:35, 18 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Royalbroil: So how we get this Wikipedia article to not be wrong? It is unlikely that any newspaper is going to cover the rebrand, especially now that it is a month old. What is the underlying concern? Is it accuracy? The logo can be easily verified by anyone who looks at website or drives past the buildings. Are we in You don't need to cite that the sky is blue territory? It is hard to see how correcting the logo and brand raises POV or Spam issues. Since you have admitted your conflict of interest, you might be able to designate a license on behalf of Thrivent by following the directions here. Royal broil 23:00, 15 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Here is a Good Article about a financial services firm that mentions a logo and rebranding and does not even have a citation.

Here are two more sources to consider:

(Noting the change of logo) https://www.underconsideration.com/brandnew/archives/new_logo_for_thrivent.php

(Showing the new logo) https://insurancenewsnet.com/oarticle/advisors-seeking-both-independence-and-community-join-thrivent-advisor-network

If none of this is persuasive, can you recommend some other type of source that would work? Thank youLeafyplant 20:19, 27 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Leafyplant: I am satisfied with the second source being of fair reliability but independent. I won't object to moving the article title to Thrivent if you want to move it. Royal broil 01:41, 28 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Royalbroil: @Leafyplant: Adding an additional secondary source from a recent Star Tribune article on 8/8/20 covering the marketing campaign and transformation efforts, and also references the organization as "Thrivent" instead of "Thrivent Financial." https://www.startribune.com/schafer-how-thrivent-is-gently-raising-its-distinctive-profile-in-a-moment-of-change/572045252/?refresh=true

I'm moving forward with the original requests of updating the logo and references to "Thrivent" versus "Thrivent Financial," as well as moving the article title. Thanks to you both for your help. Branka01 (talk) 18:52, 14 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your patience and for continuing to look for sources. That's a reliable source and it talks about rebranding. I do not object anymore. As you finish, please nominate File:Thrivent Financial logo.gif for deletion as it will become a fair use image that is no longer used in an article. Fair use logo images have very picky criteria, so please read Wikipedia:Non-free content. Royal broil 23:00, 15 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I noticed that you didn't have permission to move a page, so I made the move. I didn't know that the target title (Thrivent) page had a history (which causes a problem), so it actually needed an admin action (luckily I'm an admin). Royal broil 23:46, 15 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]