Talk:Regency of Algiers

Map proposal

Carte de la régence d'Alger, de son voisinage et groupes tribaux

Following a reflection on WP:FR I take the opportunity to propose the same map here. It will be translated if the proposal is accepted. Regards. Monsieur Patillo (talk) 20:27, 15 October 2024 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Regency of Algiers/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Nourerrahmane (talk · contribs) 22:08, 1 October 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: Borsoka (talk · contribs) 11:43, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria

1. Is it well written?

   A. The prose is clear and concise, and the spelling and grammar are correct:

   B. It complies with the manual of style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation:

2. Is it verifiable with no original research, as shown by a source spot-check?

   A. It contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline:

   B. Reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose):

   C. It contains no original research:

   D. It contains no copyright violations nor plagiarism:

3. Is it broad in its coverage?

   A. It addresses the main aspects of the topic:

   B. It stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style):

4. Is it neutral?

   It represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each:

5. Is it stable?

   It does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute:

6. Is it illustrated, if possible, by images?

   A. Images are tagged with their copyright status, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content:

   B. Images are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions:

7. Overall:

   Pass or Fail:

Comments

• ...Almohad successor states... Is this relevant in the article's context? I think we should be inform that "the Maghrebi Muslim states" disintegrated Y
• Is the adjectve "vengeful" necessary? Y
• Introduce Moriscos with two or three words. Y
• ...after the end of the Reconquista in late 15th century Delete Y
• ...where they established walled and garrisoned strongpoints they called presidios They? Y
• ... Catholic fervor... Perhaps "Catholic missionary fervor"? Y
• By early 16th century, Spain dominated the coastal areas of the Maghreb. Is this necessary? Y
• ...came to North Africa... From where? Y
• When did the Spanish conquered Béjaia, in 1509 or 1512? Y
• ...after corsairs appeared there... Were these the brothers' men/allies, or independent groups? Y
• Introduce Diego de Vera. Y
• He continued his conquests in central Algeria, but was killed in Tlemcen in 1518. This could be the last sentence of the following paragraph for chronological reason. Y
• ...killed at Tlemcen... Some more details? (Fighting the Ottomans/for the Ottomans?) Y
• The religiously sanctioned authority of Aruj Reis was supported by the military, with the scimitars of Turks and Christian renegades behind him.The religiously sanctioned authority of Aruj Reis was supported by the military, with the scimitars of Turks and Christian renegades behind him.The religiously sanctioned authority of Aruj Reis was supported by the military, with the scimitars of Turks and Christian renegades behind him. Could you quote the text verifying this sentence? reworded Y
  • Link Barbary to Barbary Coast.
• ...wrote Diego de Haedo... I would prefer future-in-the-past. Y
• ...from Sicily... Delete. Y
• Hayreddin succeeded his brother as Sultan of Algiers. He inherited his brother's position unopposed. Consolidate and shorten the two sentences. We were not previously informed that Aruj was sultan. Who awarded him with the title? Y
• A shrewd statesman and a great captain,[34] he designed a strategy for the Algerian state's existence. After repelling another Spanish attack in August 1519, led by Hugo of Moncada, Hayreddin pledged allegiance to the Sublime Porte to obtain its support against the Spanish Empire and the rebellions fomented by his opponents. I would consolidate and radically cut these sentences. The core information is that he accepted Ottoman suzerainty for he needed protecton againss Spain and rebels. Y
• ...supported him with 2,000 janissaries... Sent him? Y
• Introduce Suleiman I as Selim's successor. Y
• Explain eyalet as a province. (It's actually a vassal state and a Regency regarding Algiers) Y
  • Algiers officially became an eyalet; Ottoman vassal state and regency,... Could you quote the text from the cited source that verifies the statement. (My concern is the position of Algiers: eyalet or vassal state?

Merouche (2007) pp.53 (In French): "Cette initiative est capitale pour la suite des événements car elle est à l'origine de la vassalisation de l'État d'Alger, alors en formation, par l'empire ottoman et des massives et successives interventions de la flotte ottomane, sans lesquelles les Régences ottomanes du Maghreb n'auraient certainement pas survécu." More from Merouche: pp.139 " système de gouvernement d'une grande souplesse. Les statuts des parties de l'empire vont de la province, qui paie un tribut annuel, aux États d'empire avec lesquels on se contente d'une allégeance formelle et de l'envoi de présents à certaines occasions bien définies. Sauf exceptions liées à la structure du pays ou à la proximité du centre, chaque pacha- beylerbey était « roi dans son royaume » qu'il gérait, avec l'assistance d'un Divan, en respectant les coutumes locales et les structures traditionnelles des pouvoirs locaux dépendant de son autorité. Dans ce cadre, Alger s'affirmait en tant qu'État d'empire, c'est-à-dire une entité politique ayant tous les attributs de l'État au sens d'alors, mais qui par ailleurs constituait une partie intégrante de l'empire ottoman."

• • • I think this is to be explained in the article: when was the Regency formed, why is it called "Regency", what was its position in the empire? Y
      • From 1519 onward, Algiers formed a Regency; an Ottoman state-province or "Imperial state". Is "Regency" an official name or a term used by modern scholars? I assume the terms "Ottoman state-province" and "Imperial state" are terms used by a specific modern scholar to explain "Regency"; if yes, make it clear in the text. Borsoka (talk) 01:55, 18 November 2024 (UTC)
• Call Aruj Reis consequently as Aruj, and Hayreddin Reis as Hayreddin after first mentioned them. Y
• ...Reis retook Algiers... Had he lost it? There are too many details in the section. Y
  • A link to holy warriors?
• Supported by the Kabyles of Beni Abbas .... after defeating the Kabyle prince of Kuku... Who is who, who supported whom? Are these details highly relevant? Y
  • Introduce the Kuku and Ahmad ibn al-Kadi. Y
• ... that had been threatening the harbour Delete. Y
• Regency? We were previously informed that Algiers became a province. (adressed above) Y
• Delete "infamous" and explain "tai'fa of raïs". Y
• It became the model... When? I would prefer future-in-the-past. Y
• A link to Barbary pirates? Y
• The campaigns ... financed... Did they? Y
• One sentence cannot make a paragraph. Y
  • Who are the "barbarossa brothers"? Y
  • We are still not informed who are the "barbarossa brothers".
    • "Barbarossa brothers" was a nickname for Aruj and Hayreddin Reis, as mentionned in the lead.
      • This should be mentioned in the main text as well. Borsoka (talk)
  • ...a bastion of Islam in its competition with Christendom for control over western Mediterranean. Did Christendom or the Spanish attempted to control the western Mediterranean? For instance, the French were the opponents of the Spanish and allied with the Ottomans against the Habsburgs, and the Moroccaan Saadis were the allies of Spain. Y
• The introductory paragraph under section title "Beylerbeylik period (1519–1587)" is a little bit out of context. I understand Hayredin was the first ruler of the Regency. Y Borsoka (talk) 16:39, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
• Is section title "Beylerbeylik period (1519–1587)" necessary? The previous section ended in 1533. Y
• European powers portrayed it as the "scourge of Christendom" and a 16th-century "rogue state". European powers? Y
• ...in its first few decades... Delete. Y
• Reports of Spanish losses ranged up to 12,000 men, and more than 150 ships. The Algerians salvaged 200 cannons and used them in the fortifications of Algiers. Delete. Y
• Decide Turkish or Ottoman. Y
• ..., who was given the title of pasha from the sultan,... Is this relevant? Y
• ...went eastward and... Delete. Y
• The Spanish disaster in Algiers made it the center of piracy, becoming a bazaar for thousands of captured Christian slaves and attracting pirates from all over the Mediterranean. A similar statement can be read at the end of the previous section. Avoid repetition. Y
• Hayreddin's son Hasan Pasha and Salah Rais consolidated and expanded their territories. Some context? Who succeeded whom? Y
• ...Salah Rais took Touggourt and Ouargla... From whom? Y
• Introduce Mostaganem as an Algerian city, and Count Alcaudete as a Spanish admiral. Y
• The two beylerbeys also led campaigns against Spanish ally Saadian Morocco. Hasan Pasha decisively defeated it twice in 1551 and 1557 in Tlemcen,[82] and Salah Rais advanced as far as Fez in January 1554, placing Abu Hassun as an Ottoman vassal there. Too many details. I guess the core information, that they forced Morocco to accept Ottoman suzerainty. Y
• Beylerbeys often remained in power for several years, exercising authority over Tunis and Tripoli as well, and led Ottoman expansion in the Mediterranean. Is this necessary? If yes, some major edicts are needed because subsequent sentences contain very similar information. Y
• ... captured Tunis... From whom? Y
• ...then recaptured it... Had it been lost? Y
• ...the capture of Fez... By whom and from whom? Y
• Introduce Tuat. Y
• ...temporarily halting Saadian advances there... Last time we met them, the Saadi were Ottoman vassals. Y
• The beylerbeys acted as independent sovereigns despite acknowledging the suzerainty of the sultan. When? Y
• De Haëdo called them "kings of Algiers". Introduce De Haedo. When? What is the relevance of the sentence? Y
• The janissary-elected Hasan Corso openly rebelled in 1556. A Corsican renegade, he refused to submit to the pasha sent from Constantinople. Consolidate the two sentence. Y
• The corsairs helped the pasha murder Hasan Corso, then the janissaries also murdered the pasha. Why and why? Y
• Check dublinks and fix them. Y
• From chronological perspective the section is extremly unclear. Hassan Pasha is introduced twice, and he begins expansion before being appointed pasha by the Sultan. Y
• Consider presenting the system the government in one dedicated paragraph, because now details are scattered randomly all over the section (the beylerbegs are appointed by the sultan, the lack of timar system, corsairs, etc) Y Borsoka (talk) 02:21, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

Hello @Borsoka, thank you for reviewing this article, I hope i have now adressed all the points you listed, I have added short explanations between brackets when needed.

Speaking of the last point, indeed Hayreddin was the first Beylerbey of the Regency, however he's often brought with his brother Aruj per sources. The beylerbey period proper starts from Hasan Agha onward. Nourerrahmane (talk) 23:08, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

• Introduce Figuig. Y
• ...rather than for life We were not previously inform that the beylerbegs were appointed for life. Y
• ...filled Algerian coffers immensely Could numbers be added? Y
• The later pashas... Be more specific. Y
• Introduce Khider Pasha Y
• ...led a revolt in Algiers in an effort to overthrow it... Overthrow? Y
• Introduce the coulouglis. Y
• ...which made them the sole power holder in Algiers Whom? Y
• When the Ottoman expanded French privileges... Who? Y
• From chronological point of view Section 1.2 is unclear. It also contains redundant information (for instance, the taifa was already introduced in a previous section). Y

I think the article needs a comprehensive copy edit to improve the prose. I suggest you seek assistance at Wikipedia:WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors. I put the article on hold. Please ping me when the copyedit is completed. Borsoka (talk) 02:07, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

• Referring to your email, I would not recommend a specific editor. I think you could add the article's name on the list at the Guild of Copy Editors. Borsoka (talk) 01:03, 19 November 2024 (UTC)