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Talk:Gustav of Sweden (1568–1607)

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Marriage with Brita - year

[edit]

There is a problem here and in article Brita Persdotter Karth:

  • if he is in Moscow in 1599 for marriage with Ksenia Godunova, he should be unmarried at this time
  • russian sources - and Conrad Bussow - called her "he took in Moscow his lover, some Ekaterina, with her husband German inkeeper Christopher Kather from Danzig, and prince's illegitimate children" - so Gustav was with her, but not by law. Also here is a note, that tsar Boris Godunov separated Gustav with his daugher's rival, and send him in exile alone.
  • he couldn't married with Brita in Kashin in 1594, because he's in Kashin only after Vasili IV of Russia's coronation - 1606. In 1594 he was still in Europe. So if they get married - only in Russia after 1599, and if in Kashin - only after 1606, when all his living conditions were moderated, but not in Uglich and Yaroslavl.

--Shakko (talk) 16:43, 5 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes indeed, there is problem, but this is simply due to the fact that Brita Persdotter Karth is a myth created by wishful thinking (and perhaps even forged documents) in the 18th century. See my posting at Talk:Brita Persdotter Karth.
I have begun correcting the articles on Gustav and Brita in the Swedish version of Wikipedia and will try to fix the English ones as well in due time. /FredrikT (talk) 06:41, 9 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Never called "Vasa"

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Here, again, a "surname" has been added which was never used by the subject nor ever used in any literature of any kind. I will remove it again soon unless someone can source it. SergeWoodzing (talk) 23:42, 17 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

On one hand, I agree that this is not a historic name, in the sense that it was not used during his lifetime. He signed his letters as Gustavus Erici, which is latin for Gustav Eriksson, and the surname Vasa was not invented until later. On the other hand, the name "Gustav Eriksson Vasa" or its variants are used in e.g. NE.se, Kansallisbiografia, the monograph by fi:Henry Biaudet, and seems to be in general usage.
This is a common issue with Swedish surnames before 17th century and we should perhaps think of a general solution on how such names are to be treated. Very often, these are the most recognizable names for the individuals in question (for example, Gustav Vasa or Erik Axelsson Tott), and should not be removed from the articles, even if not used contemporaneously. Swedish scholarship uses the parentheses to distinguish between historical and ahistorical names, but this does not work very well in WP context because the readers do not know the convention, and it often results in two parentheses next to each other [Erik Axelsson (Tott) (c. 1419–1481)]. One solution could be to omit the paretheses and write a standard {{efn}} footnote which could be added next to the ahistoric surnames? Jähmefyysikko (talk) 07:07, 18 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I was not aware that the NE article had begun to use "Vasa". --SergeWoodzing (talk) 12:46, 18 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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