Talk:Andy Whitfield

Where born?

Amlwch, Wales or Bankstown, Sydney? We're saying both places. Neat trick, that, being born in 2 different places simultaneously. -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 06:17, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

OK, that's fixed.

Next question: Andy Whitfield was born in Amlwch, Wales and studied engineering at the University of Western Sydney and worked in Lidcombe as an engineer before moving to Sydney in 1999.

How did a guy from Wales come to be studying engineering at the University of Western Sydney, of all places? The way it's written, it reads as if it's perfectly normal for Welsh men to study in Sydney. -- Jack of Oz ^{[your turn]} 06:29, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Edit request from 222.151.142.15, 12 September 2011

The article states that he was born in 1974, but I don't see that in the sources for his dates of birth/death. The sources all seem to say he was 39 at death, but if he was born in July 1974 he would have been 37.

222.151.142.15 (talk) 15:19, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Done. After reviewing all the sources, it looks to me as though 39 was thrown out there (perhaps originally a math error) and repeated in various new stories. In fact, many of the sources are really mirrors of the original. Of the sources that claim Whitfield died at age 39, none of them show the actor's birth date. Meanwhile, two sources show the same 1974 birthdate, and one of the sources that originally claimed he was 39 has now changed their article to say he was 37 (article). — Bility (talk) 18:33, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

I'm just watching Season 1 of Spartacus now (and so learned of this actor's early death!) I was surprised to (erroneously read he was 39. He looked younger than that.Codenamemary (talk) 18:25, 6 July 2012 (UTC)

Age

Some of the reliable sources are saying 39, some saying 37. Why have we decided to go with 37? Niteshift36 (talk) 15:21, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

IMDb is never a reliable source, not even for exact birthdates or ages. – Neither Wikipedia, as we can see again, right now! – Better sources use reknown News Agencies, and reknown newspapers, articles with reknown author signature (often better after one or more days checking-up and updating).

Writing "age 39" for Andy Whitfield, of Sydney:

• [1]: "According to representatives and family"; no Author name; "By The Associated Press (AP), Los Angeles"; Published (in Boston Herald, Boston): Monday, September 12.
• [2]: "According to representatives and family", Author: Andrew Dalton, with AP, Published (in The Sacramento Bee, Los Angeles): Sunday, Sep. 11, 2011 - 5:49 pm; Last Modified: Monday, Sep. 12, 2011 - 6:23 am.
• [3]: Sources revealed: "Manager Sam Maydew", "Whitfield's wife, Vashti"; no author name; with AP, Published (in news.com.au by News Digital Media, a News Corporation company, Sydney), September 12, - 2:39 PM.

Writing "age 37" or "born in 1974" for Andy Whitfield, of Sydney:

• [4]: Sources: not revealed; no Author name, neither Agency name; Published (in fullissue.com – no street address, no town): no date.
• [5]: Sources: not revealed; no Author name, neither Agency name; Published (in stuff.co.nz "Fairfax New Zealand Limited" – no street address, no town): Last updated 18:54 12/09/2011.
  – Still in URL: "Spartacus-star-Whitfield-dies-aged-39", Now written: "Whitfield's manager Sam Maydew said the 37-year-old actor died of non-Hodgkin Lymphoma in Sydney, Australia"
• [...]

– 66.36.138.224 (talk) 21:55, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

• "IMDb is never a reliable source" Not true. Parts of IMDB can be used as a RS. Niteshift36 (talk) 22:38, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

• This LA Times article says 39 [6], ABC News says 39 [7], NY Times says 39 [8], MTV says 39 [9], Toronto Star says 39 [10], NY Daily News says 39 [11]. Entertainment Weekly says 39 [12] Let's face it, he's 39. Niteshift36 (talk) 22:58, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

The BBC Says 39 too. [13] — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sanguis Sanies (talk • contribs) 23:08, 12 September 2011 (UTC)

Most news sites just carry the news from other sites, his age is not yet confirmed, he is either 37 or 39, the best thing to do is to remove his D.O.B or replace with (born 1972/1974 ) with a citation ...--Stemoc (talk) 02:31, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

• If you look at some of the ones cited, you'll see they aren't just copies of the AP story. Niteshift36 (talk) 03:37, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

the first newsites claimed he was 37 then all of a sudden, the BBC pointed out he was 39 and after that every news article claimed him as 39..google his name and year 1974 and the the year 1972, see which one gets more hits..--Stemoc (talk) 08:24, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

• You honestly think it's the BBC's fault? Niteshift36 (talk) 16:56, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

1974 Gets 282,000 hits and 1972 gets 221,000, not a large enough difference to be definative; plus that's not a particularly reliable way of determining a persons age. Sanguis Sanies (talk) 14:50, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

When i checked, 1972 had about 160,000+ hits, not its not reliable but it shows what i'm saying, now every news sites are picking it as 1972 so b yhte end of the week, 1972 should exceed 1974...--Stemoc (talk) 04:48, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

• It's not an election where we count hits to find a winner. The problem is that we have solid, top-tier sources that say different things.Niteshift36 (talk) 13:00, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

First episode of Spartacus: Vengeance (at 56 minutes) says the year is 1971 so you're all wrong. —Eekerz ^(t) 03:16, 25 January 2012 (UTC)

The Andy Whitfield Tribute page Gives his D.O.B as 17 October 1971 making him 39 when he died - VampRageous (talk) 08:01, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

There's nothing at that website to indicate that it's a reliable source.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:20, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

Career

Not sure how one would prove that Spartacus was 'destined' to lead a rebellion. Can this be rephrased please? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.101.150.15 (talk) 18:52, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Age again

Please look at the earlier discussion on this page about Whitfield's birthdate. Nothing has really changed since then. Some sources say one thing, but many reliable sources say something else. My suspicion is it's just confusion, and different sources are copying from each other. Unfortunately, with this kind of a conflict, we have only two choices. One is to include different dates with citations, and the other is to include no date at all. What we can't do is pick one and say this is it.

My preference is no date at all because it's cleaner, and I don't really see this kind of information as crucial to an encylopedic article. What matters is what a person accomplished in his or her life, not how old they were when they died. In addition, including different dates with citations clutters the article with confusing material, and it's not especially helpful to the reader.--Bbb23 (talk) 14:54, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

• Noticed how most of the bigger name sources (ABC, BBC, NYT, EW), a virtual who's who, say one thing and most of the ones that say the other aren't exactly the first line of media giants says something else. I'm not saying the big ones are always right, but you do have to give it consideration. Niteshift36 (talk) 15:43, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

• Interesting comment, but what is the practical impact? The biggies win? The biggies win but we insert a footnote (lord help me) about the shrimps? I'm sure my sarcasm speaks to my bias against inclusion.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:49, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

• I didn't intend my comment to be sarcastic. I have re-read it and it doesn't sound sarcastic to me. So I'm unsure why you felt the need to respond with sarcasm. In any case, I thought I was pretty clear when I said "I'm not saying the big ones are always right" that I wasn't just saying "biggies win". If we look at this like a civil case in course, the preponderance of the evidence says he was 39. Numerous established, respected news outlets reported it that way and we can show they all didn't copy the same article. Far fewer sources report that 37 age. In this case, this almost looks like the proverbial "carload of nuns" as a witness versus a single guy walking down the street. It doesn't mean he is a bad guy or even wrong in what he says he saw, but the tendency will be to go with the carload of nuns. Niteshift36 (talk) 15:57, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

• Your comment wasn't sarcastic at all. Mine was, and I meant that my sarcastic response reflected my own bias (against reporting his birthdate at all). Sorry for the misunderstanding. Anyway, are you proposing that we simply report his age at 39 without reference to the 37?--Bbb23 (talk) 18:16, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

• Yeah, really I think that is the way to go. The preponderence of the evidence is weighted heavily towards 39. If we really needed to mention the dispute, a single line in the body of the article should suffice. Niteshift36 (talk) 22:14, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

• Do I understand correctly that if there is any contradiction whatsoever, anywhere on the Internet, then a fact cannot be reported as a fact on Wikipedia, even if all the more reliable sources agree? That seems completely absurd to me. Also absurd is this statement: "I don't really see this kind of information as crucial to an encyclopedic article." Dates of birth are exactly the kind of information people expect to find in encyclopedic articles! Krychek (talk) 18:59, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

• Hey, I've been trying to get this resolved all along. The major sources say he was 39 when he died. Why are we not going with that? Niteshift36 (talk) 20:17, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Edit request from wikipedio4, 15 June 2011

date of birth October 17th, 1971

Hi Wiki people, please dont be angry with me and I HOPE I am doing this right, but Andy's wife, Vashti, is on Twitter and in the link I'm giving you, she both confirms his birthdate as October 17, 1971 AND also that he was only ever married once, to her. so I hope that's what you need to fix his page a bit? thanks a lot and if you need confirmation that it is her you can visit her blog at http://maybemcqueen.com and it will link you to her twitter. thanks again

link: https://twitter.com/maybemcqueen/status/210213770587414530

also, Andy was Welsh only, not Australian - here is a link to his interview on Chelsea Lately where he says he is Welsh : http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xc9je7_chelsea-lately-andy-whitfield-inter_shortfilms

We can't use those two sources. The video has copyright issues. Twitter is not the best of sources, but this tweet comes from an unverified account, and we don't even have anything in the article saying that Whitfield was married. As for the Wales issue, it's already in the article, anyway. Thanks for trying to help.--Bbb23 (talk) 23:30, 15 June 2012 (UTC)

In my opinion, that twitter post is the BEST and most VERIFIABLE source to date of his birthdate..Wikipedia should really now use that as his birthdate. I remember being one of the few trying to get his birthdate fixed days after he died. Its a shame that twitter post was made a year ago and since then people here REFUSE to use it as a verified source. This was all caused because news media sites, after his death refused to "source" his birthdate and used the wrong dates...even if that twitter poster is not "officially" verified by twitter, its legit....use it..it has been 20 months since he died and yet Wikipedia refuses to post his birthdate.--Stemoc (talk) 05:12, 28 May 2013 (UTC)

Article Needs Editing.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2163627/Andy-Whitfield-Widow-Spartacus-star-actor-reveals-heartache-death-cancer.html

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/426354716/be-here-now-the-andy-whitfield-story

The video and article provide plenty of material to update this article with. I think it would be appropriate if someone with the skills did so. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.197.137.25 (talk) 08:18, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

Birthdate

Okay here is my opinion on this birthday thing, he was born in 1971, Starz confirms it becuz of the image of him after the first episode of the 2nd season. IMDB is confirming he was born on October 17, 1971, why not just put October 17, 1971 down in the DOB. He was not born in 1972 nor 1974, he was 39 years old for crying out loud. We have this link www.astrotheme.com/astrology/Andy_Whitfield, this link www.imdb.com/name/nm1813878/bio, all saying he was born October 17, 1971. So I'm assuming his birthday is 10/17/71. Put that in the DOB section folks. P.J. (talk) 08:50, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

• astrotheme.com is far from a reliable source. We have actual, reliable sources in the discussion above. BT, astrotheme uses Wikipedia as a main source, so WP:CIRCULAR applies. Niteshift36 (talk) 14:02, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Dead Horse? -- A site which frequently uses alternative sources (Famous Birthdays) says October 17, 1971, and they are often at odds with IMDB and Wikipedia. At least 3 individuals have vetted the IMDB so it seems foolish for Wikipedia to be wringing their hands over "we have to be right." Wikipedia has been wrong before, in fact for several years when the right info was immediately available. 72.200.22.139 (talk) 21:33, 8 September 2015 (UTC) Dfoofnik Note: IGN continues to show July 17, 1972, so I guess there's not going to be a consensus. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.200.22.139 (talk) 21:43, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

News sites are reliable sources and most of them agree on 17 Oct 1971. If you disagree with this date, please request moderation rather than remove perfectly valid information from the article. Krychek (talk) 15:20, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

What would constitute a reliable source for the birthdate then? I'm sure that a high percentage of celebrities birthdates on Wikipedia are taken directly from IMDb. Thief12 (talk) 14:29, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

IMDb is not a reliable source, particularly for biographical data, principally because it can be edited by anyone like a wiki. If there are articles with dobs sourced by IMDb, then it's only because no one has challenged them. In this instance, the key problem is that sources differ as to the subject's birthdate. Given the fact that he died a while ago, it seems unlikely this issue will ever be resolved by reliable sources.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:05, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Image change?

Anyone mind if we use one of the different available images of Whitfield? Because Whitfield is deceased, we don't have to use the WP:Free image image that is currently the lead image. A WP:Non-free image is sufficient in this case, just like it has been in the past with the James Dean article and in articles covering other deceased actors. Hours ago, I began watching Spartacus: Blood and Sand for the first time, and found out earlier this hour that Whitfield is deceased. I'd seen him in The Clinic last year, but, at that time, didn't think to look up the lead male actor starring in it. Anyway, I'm saddened to read of Whitfield's death, and I didn't recognize him in the picture when I clicked on this article. It took a closer look for me to see that the picture is indeed him; that's why I think a different lead picture would perhaps be better in this case. Flyer22 (talk) 08:59, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Reliable Sources Noticeboard

I have posted the issue of the birth date on the Reliable Sources Noticeboard. @Bbb23: (and others), now is your chance to make your case there. Once it has been decided which sources are more reliable, I will be adding the birth date to this artice (again), and any further attempts to remove it will be taken as an edit war. So speak now or forever hold your peace. Krychek (talk) 19:56, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

Absolute nonsense.--Bbb23 (talk) 21:45, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

• If "absolute nonsense" is referring the fact that for 5 years this article has been held hostage because a couple of second rate sources said 37, then I agree, absolute nonsense. Niteshift36 (talk) 01:47, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

• Nah, it has nothing to do with the merits of the birthdate or the sources, it has to do with "any further attempts to remove it will be taken as an edit war. So speak now or forever hold your peace", particularly the first part about an edit war. Regardless of what you think about anything else, isn't that just a bit over-the-top?--Bbb23 (talk) 04:17, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

• Ok, I'm with you there. A little authoritarian sounding. Niteshift36 (talk) 17:52, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

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Be Here Now documentary

Page should include his posthumous documentary filmed while he was alive

BE HERE NOW (THE ANDY WHITFIELD STORY), a Netflix documentary featuring the last year of his battle with cancer. 2016 BE HERE NOW (THE ANDY WHITFIELD STORY) Rotten Tomatoes Be Here Now Netflix page. P37307 (talk) 05:41, 22 May 2018 (UTC)